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I don't see any discussion of their deprecation strategy. What's killing GCP is not that they don't have the latest toys, it's that NO ONE TRUSTS THEM ANYMORE

I don't see any discussion of their deprecation strategy. What's killing GCP is not that they don't have the latest toys, it's that *NO ONE TRUSTS THEM ANYMORE* [1]. Why would you build anything on GCP when there's no guarantee the GCP thing you're using won't be the next Stadia in 18 months? Otherwise, you'll just use them like you'd use DigitalOcean, in which case they'd be commodified. For the CEO not to be laser focused on this issue shows they're entirely missing the point. 1. https://steve-yegge.medium.com/dear-google-cloud-your-deprecation-policy-is-killing-you-ee7525dc05dc https://steve-yegge.medium.com/dear-google-cloud-your-deprec...

gentleman11 3y ago
I actually heard somebody say gcp was going to be shuttered, didn’t verify, and just assumed it wasn’t going to be around for long. Now I assume what I read was nonsense, but it’s worth noting how non-suspicious of it I was when I read it
- refulgentis 3y ago
  The @killedbygoogle account is funny and also a complete menace sometimes. I wish they'd drop the sarcastic tweets, they've won thoroughly, no need to be an infohazard
baidifnaoxi 3y ago
Not to mention they were out in their Paris availability zone for a month last year.
theevilsharpie 3y ago
Google Cloud DOES have a deprecation "strategy". They publish it in Google Cloud Terms of Service.[1] In short, any service that is listed as "Generally Available" (i.e., not alpha/beta) is guaranteed to have at least 12 months of notice prior to deprecation. And services that are in alpha/beta are clearly marked as such in the documentation and UI, and require explicit steps to use via the command-line or API. Additionally, if you literally Google "Google Cloud Deprecation strategy", a statement on Google Cloud's deprecation policy and links to the Terms of Service and Google Cloud's service lifecycle is the very first result.[2] I've been a user of Google Cloud for a long time, and the company I'm with has a yearly GCP bill in the millions. While Google Cloud does have its frustrations (e.g., their various price hikes, and the architecture of their network infrastructure that makes them more vulnerable to cross-region outages), Google Cloud being "deprecated" is not a thing that I worry about. Can this tired meme please die already? [1] https://cloud.google.com/terms#:~:text=(d)%C2%A0Discontinuation%20of%20Services https://cloud.google.com/terms#:~:text=(d)%C2%A0Discontinuat... [2] https://www.google.com/search?q=Google+Cloud+Deprecation+strategy https://www.google.com/search?q=Google+Cloud+Deprecation+str...
- VHRanger 3y ago
  I didn't say they don't have a deprecation strategy. My problem is that they do have one, and they're very happy to use it. 12 months of notice is laughable for enterprise customers. From planning to getting something rolled out at scale, an enterprise will have eaten 2 quarters of time. More than full deprecation, we often have API deprecation from google services, increasing our maintenance burden. Say what you will about AWS or Microsoft products, if you build something on those platforms you know it'll be supported for a long time. Google fundamentally values their own code above the code of people using their platform. But good platforms do the opposite - they keep the technical debt on their side of the fence to make sure you don't have to think about anything if your code runs on their stack.
  - theevilsharpie 3y ago
    > Say what you will about AWS or Microsoft products, if you build something on those platforms you know it'll be supported for a long time. AWS literally has the same terms.[1] Azure claims that "certain" Azure services have up to three years of notice; otherwise, it similarly offers a one-year notice period like GCP and AWS.[2] [1] https://aws.amazon.com/agreement/#:~:text=Notice%20of%20Changes%20to%20the%20Services https://aws.amazon.com/agreement/#:~:text=Notice%20of%20Chan... [2] https://learn.microsoft.com/en-us/lifecycle/policies/modern#continuity-and-migration https://learn.microsoft.com/en-us/lifecycle/policies/modern#...
    - VHRanger 3y ago
      Again, you're not getting the point. It's about behaviour. How often have you seen AWS deprecate stuff? The BOTO API for S3 is an ugly mess, but you can still run BOTO2 code from a long time ago. With Google I guarantee you they'd have killed off the old API in a similar situation. Similarly, how often did you see Windows deprecate core Win32 API calls? There's no SLA that says Windows 11 should run XP era programs. It just does, because they don't want to piss off people who depend on them. As a user, I'm happy with deprecation happy products (hi Apple!). As an enterprise customer? Nope. We're paying you to ease our problems, not the other way around. As long as GCP doesn't take this concern seriously, they'll be relegated to being a commodity provider, along with digitalocean and friends. We'll use them when they're the cheapest, and only for stuff we can migrate in 24h. Guess what? If I'm looking for the cheapest cloud for VMs and storage, there's much better than GCP out there. And as long as their freaking CEO doesn't get this they won't come out of the hole they dug themselves.

I don't see any discussion of their deprecation strategy. What's killing GCP is not that they don't have the latest toys, it's that *NO ONE TRUSTS THEM ANYMORE*

gentleman11 3y ago

I actually heard somebody say gcp was going to be shuttered, didn’t verify, and just assumed it wasn’t going to be around for long. Now I assume what I read was nonsense, but it’s worth noting how non-suspicious of it I was when I read it

refulgentis 3y ago
The @killedbygoogle account is funny and also a complete menace sometimes. I wish they'd drop the sarcastic tweets, they've won thoroughly, no need to be an infohazard

baidifnaoxi 3y ago

Not to mention they were out in their Paris availability zone for a month last year.

theevilsharpie 3y ago

Google Cloud DOES have a deprecation "strategy". They publish it in Google Cloud Terms of Service.[1] In short, any service that is listed as "Generally Available" (i.e., not alpha/beta) is guaranteed to have at least 12 months of notice prior to deprecation. And services that are in alpha/beta are clearly marked as such in the documentation and UI, and require explicit steps to use via the command-line or API. Additionally, if you literally Google "Google Cloud Deprecation strategy", a statement on Google Cloud's deprecation policy and links to the Terms of Service and Google Cloud's service lifecycle is the very first result.[2] I've been a user of Google Cloud for a long time, and the company I'm with has a yearly GCP bill in the millions. While Google Cloud does have its frustrations (e.g., their various price hikes, and the architecture of their network infrastructure that makes them more vulnerable to cross-region outages), Google Cloud being "deprecated" is not a thing that I worry about. Can this tired meme please die already? [1] https://cloud.google.com/terms#:~:text=(d)%C2%A0Discontinuation%20of%20Services https://cloud.google.com/terms#:~:text=(d)%C2%A0Discontinuat... [2] https://www.google.com/search?q=Google+Cloud+Deprecation+strategy https://www.google.com/search?q=Google+Cloud+Deprecation+str...

VHRanger 3y ago
I didn't say they don't have a deprecation strategy. My problem is that they do have one, and they're very happy to use it. 12 months of notice is laughable for enterprise customers. From planning to getting something rolled out at scale, an enterprise will have eaten 2 quarters of time. More than full deprecation, we often have API deprecation from google services, increasing our maintenance burden. Say what you will about AWS or Microsoft products, if you build something on those platforms you know it'll be supported for a long time. Google fundamentally values their own code above the code of people using their platform. But good platforms do the opposite - they keep the technical debt on their side of the fence to make sure you don't have to think about anything if your code runs on their stack.
- theevilsharpie 3y ago
  > Say what you will about AWS or Microsoft products, if you build something on those platforms you know it'll be supported for a long time. AWS literally has the same terms.[1] Azure claims that "certain" Azure services have up to three years of notice; otherwise, it similarly offers a one-year notice period like GCP and AWS.[2] [1] https://aws.amazon.com/agreement/#:~:text=Notice%20of%20Changes%20to%20the%20Services https://aws.amazon.com/agreement/#:~:text=Notice%20of%20Chan... [2] https://learn.microsoft.com/en-us/lifecycle/policies/modern#continuity-and-migration https://learn.microsoft.com/en-us/lifecycle/policies/modern#...
  - VHRanger 3y ago
    Again, you're not getting the point. It's about behaviour. How often have you seen AWS deprecate stuff? The BOTO API for S3 is an ugly mess, but you can still run BOTO2 code from a long time ago. With Google I guarantee you they'd have killed off the old API in a similar situation. Similarly, how often did you see Windows deprecate core Win32 API calls? There's no SLA that says Windows 11 should run XP era programs. It just does, because they don't want to piss off people who depend on them. As a user, I'm happy with deprecation happy products (hi Apple!). As an enterprise customer? Nope. We're paying you to ease our problems, not the other way around. As long as GCP doesn't take this concern seriously, they'll be relegated to being a commodity provider, along with digitalocean and friends. We'll use them when they're the cheapest, and only for stuff we can migrate in 24h. Guess what? If I'm looking for the cheapest cloud for VMs and storage, there's much better than GCP out there. And as long as their freaking CEO doesn't get this they won't come out of the hole they dug themselves.