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"The thought of having to expend my creative energy on things that make practical everyday life more refined, with a bleak capital gain as the goal, was unbeara

"The thought of having to expend my creative energy on things that make practical everyday life more refined, with a bleak capital gain as the goal, was unbearable to me. - Einstein I think most people on HN could relate to this quote. Like it or not, as professional developers, we rarely create, but simply refine. It was fun at the start of my career, but now my professional life seems rather unimaginative.

bprater 18y ago
Wow, I've never heard that quote! I love it!
nihilocrat 18y ago
I think we could learn a lot by interacting with people completely outside of our industry who you know are not doing the work for the money.
kqr2 18y ago
Great quote. http://books.google.com/books?id=dJMpQagbz_gC&pg=PA31&lpg=PA31 http://books.google.com/books?id=dJMpQagbz_gC&pg=PA31&#3... The pre and postamble to that quote is particularly apropos: I was originally supposed to become an engineer but the thought of having to expend...was unbearable to me. Thinking for its own sake, like music!
illumen 18y ago
"Instead I decided to work on weapons that can kill LOTS of people... fuck those guys who didn't get me in school." -- Bert.
- nuclear_eclipse 18y ago
  The fact that his work was applied to the creation of nuclear weapons was one of Eintstein's great regrets in life. The fact that those weapons were used on cities full of civilians was his greatest.
  - illumen 18y ago
    Albert signed a letter urging for the creation of an atomic bomb. If you think someone that intelligent could not have realized that an atomic bomb would be used to actually kill people -- then you are sorely mistaken.
    - prospero 18y ago
      I think the idea of a German atomic bomb was an even greater concern for Einstein, and for others. The years leading up to WWII were very, very complicated. It's unrealistic to claim that your hindsight (or anyone's) is 20/20 with respect to what should have been done.
      - electromagnetic 18y ago
        Agreed, the only reason there even was a US atomic bomb so early was because the US military intercepted multiple uranium shipments bound for Japan. When Germany fell they tried to get enough refined material for the Japanese to get the bomb first so the war would be won by their allies and not their enemies. Fortunately the US Navy had recovered enough by that point in the war to hunt down the U-Boats. If the US Navy hadn't recovered so quickly after Pearl Harbor, and if the Enigma Code hadn't been cracked then we'd all be hailing the Emperor of Japan right now. I mean the first nuclear test wouldn't have been in the middle of a desert, it would have been over mainland China. The USSR would likely have never invaded Japan, keeping their neutrality pact alive would have meant the Japanese would have had free reign to attack anywhere they saw fit. The whole of WWII is extremely complicated. I mean the reason for the whole delay in the Japanese surrender to the US after the atomic bombings was because they didn't plan to, until the USSR invaded Japanese territory, breaking a neutrality pact and covering almost as much land in days as the US had managed in months. The Japanese were afraid of being conquered by the USSR because of the atrocities they committed against Russians at the start of the war. So Japan didn't surrender to the allies, they surrendered ONLY to the USA so they would have to be protected from the Russians, incidentally because they knew the US had the A-Bomb they knew it would have to be used in their protection if Russia kept invading. So just the simple 'the A-Bomb won the war' theory is a billion times more complicated than the lay person understands. Hindsight is 20/20, but you're still as blind as the point of view you're looking from. The American POV for the war is very blind of what truly happened during the war compared to the British POV; I'm British and when studying history we were taught that because the US was so late coming into the war it was solely the British Navy and RAF keeping the German Navy from expanding out into the Atlantic. If it wasn't for the British then it wouldn't have been Pearl Harbor, it would have been a full-out invasion by the Germans long before anyone even dreamed of D-Day.
GrandMasterBirt 18y ago
At some point though we start to create problems for ourselves. It depends on the job. Some jobs let your creativity go wild by pushing your limits and mental capabilities. Sometimes they don't and they feel stale and not moving anywhere. The stale jobs (and I see this) cause good thinkers to start thinking up big problems to solve. They don't like to be bored with monkey work (coding where no amazing creativity is necessary). My last job pushed my capabilities to their limits. However my current one does not. And right now I feel like I am not learning anything, not getting better (getting worse if anything), but I try to learn from anything I can. Eventually if this job does not pick up I will be forced to leave not due to bad people, but due to boredom. Last job I went on google news, hacker news, the daily wtf when I had down time. Here I do it because its the only way to keep sane. Damn you economic recession! In any case next interview ask the question: "I like a challenge and chance to improve myself in things I am good or bad at and feel that my job should be something that forces me to become better than I am today. Do you think this position will challenge my abilities to their limit, and I don't mean can I do a 10 day project in 5?"
- a10 18y ago
  You can ask this question, but I doubt you will get a truthful answer, sorry to say. In multiple instances, I had been excited b/c the interview had challenging technical questions, only to be disappointed when I actually get into the work. Remember: the relationship is you work for your employer, your employer pays you. Don't expect any more or less than that.
  - aaronblohowiak 18y ago
    Sometimes, I actually ask to see the task tracker and ask which kinds of things I'd get to work on. That at least lets you know if there is interesting work that management has requested.
    - ConradHex 18y ago
      I always ask "if I started this position today, what tasks would you assign me?" It's a really informative question.

bprater 18y ago

Wow, I've never heard that quote! I love it!

nihilocrat 18y ago

I think we could learn a lot by interacting with people completely outside of our industry who you know are not doing the work for the money.

kqr2 18y ago

Great quote. http://books.google.com/books?id=dJMpQagbz_gC&pg=PA31&lpg=PA31 http://books.google.com/books?id=dJMpQagbz_gC&pg=PA31&#3... The pre and postamble to that quote is particularly apropos: I was originally supposed to become an engineer but the thought of having to expend...was unbearable to me. Thinking for its own sake, like music!

illumen 18y ago

"Instead I decided to work on weapons that can kill LOTS of people... fuck those guys who didn't get me in school." -- Bert.

nuclear_eclipse 18y ago
The fact that his work was applied to the creation of nuclear weapons was one of Eintstein's great regrets in life. The fact that those weapons were used on cities full of civilians was his greatest.
- illumen 18y ago
  Albert signed a letter urging for the creation of an atomic bomb. If you think someone that intelligent could not have realized that an atomic bomb would be used to actually kill people -- then you are sorely mistaken.
  - prospero 18y ago
    I think the idea of a German atomic bomb was an even greater concern for Einstein, and for others. The years leading up to WWII were very, very complicated. It's unrealistic to claim that your hindsight (or anyone's) is 20/20 with respect to what should have been done.
    - electromagnetic 18y ago
      Agreed, the only reason there even was a US atomic bomb so early was because the US military intercepted multiple uranium shipments bound for Japan. When Germany fell they tried to get enough refined material for the Japanese to get the bomb first so the war would be won by their allies and not their enemies. Fortunately the US Navy had recovered enough by that point in the war to hunt down the U-Boats. If the US Navy hadn't recovered so quickly after Pearl Harbor, and if the Enigma Code hadn't been cracked then we'd all be hailing the Emperor of Japan right now. I mean the first nuclear test wouldn't have been in the middle of a desert, it would have been over mainland China. The USSR would likely have never invaded Japan, keeping their neutrality pact alive would have meant the Japanese would have had free reign to attack anywhere they saw fit. The whole of WWII is extremely complicated. I mean the reason for the whole delay in the Japanese surrender to the US after the atomic bombings was because they didn't plan to, until the USSR invaded Japanese territory, breaking a neutrality pact and covering almost as much land in days as the US had managed in months. The Japanese were afraid of being conquered by the USSR because of the atrocities they committed against Russians at the start of the war. So Japan didn't surrender to the allies, they surrendered ONLY to the USA so they would have to be protected from the Russians, incidentally because they knew the US had the A-Bomb they knew it would have to be used in their protection if Russia kept invading. So just the simple 'the A-Bomb won the war' theory is a billion times more complicated than the lay person understands. Hindsight is 20/20, but you're still as blind as the point of view you're looking from. The American POV for the war is very blind of what truly happened during the war compared to the British POV; I'm British and when studying history we were taught that because the US was so late coming into the war it was solely the British Navy and RAF keeping the German Navy from expanding out into the Atlantic. If it wasn't for the British then it wouldn't have been Pearl Harbor, it would have been a full-out invasion by the Germans long before anyone even dreamed of D-Day.

GrandMasterBirt 18y ago

At some point though we start to create problems for ourselves. It depends on the job. Some jobs let your creativity go wild by pushing your limits and mental capabilities. Sometimes they don't and they feel stale and not moving anywhere. The stale jobs (and I see this) cause good thinkers to start thinking up big problems to solve. They don't like to be bored with monkey work (coding where no amazing creativity is necessary). My last job pushed my capabilities to their limits. However my current one does not. And right now I feel like I am not learning anything, not getting better (getting worse if anything), but I try to learn from anything I can. Eventually if this job does not pick up I will be forced to leave not due to bad people, but due to boredom. Last job I went on google news, hacker news, the daily wtf when I had down time. Here I do it because its the only way to keep sane. Damn you economic recession! In any case next interview ask the question: "I like a challenge and chance to improve myself in things I am good or bad at and feel that my job should be something that forces me to become better than I am today. Do you think this position will challenge my abilities to their limit, and I don't mean can I do a 10 day project in 5?"

a10 18y ago
You can ask this question, but I doubt you will get a truthful answer, sorry to say. In multiple instances, I had been excited b/c the interview had challenging technical questions, only to be disappointed when I actually get into the work. Remember: the relationship is you work for your employer, your employer pays you. Don't expect any more or less than that.
- aaronblohowiak 18y ago
  Sometimes, I actually ask to see the task tracker and ask which kinds of things I'd get to work on. That at least lets you know if there is interesting work that management has requested.
  - ConradHex 18y ago
    I always ask "if I started this position today, what tasks would you assign me?" It's a really informative question.