7 ms·

Minimum six months severance pay + healthcare + cash bonus. That is incredibly generous all things considered.

jarsin 3y ago
I still remember the eye-roll my manager gave me when I asked if there was severance when laid off in 2009. I feel bad for all these layoffs, but it seems the support system has improved drastically since then.
ocdtrekkie 3y ago
Yeah to be honest, a half-year sabbatical with time to job hunt non-frantically is a luxury I've never had. I love my current job, but I would probably look at a half year severance like a vacation.
- hipadev23 3y ago
  > non-frantically It appears to be very heavily biased toward artists, so even if they start that job hunt today, it’s still going to be frantic.
  - johnnyanmac 3y ago
    6 months for an artist with Riot on their resume? I can't imagine that not at least opening doors for them.
  - ocdtrekkie 3y ago
    That is indeed a fair point.
  - deleted 3y ago
    [deleted]
- 0xjmp 3y ago
  In this current job market 6 months to next job is a very quick turnaround...
  - mlhpdx 3y ago
    Can you explain? Unemployment is still very, very low and there are hundreds of thousand of open positions out there. Not sure about game companies, hence my asking.
    - bragr 3y ago
      Not just gaming. Tech companies have been shedding jobs like crazy and slashing hiring. Pretty much every day there is news of some company slashing hundreds or thousand of jobs. Anecdotally, its not unusual to take 6 months to find a new job at only 2/3rd the previous salary.
      - whateveracct 3y ago
        Tech companies are definitely still hiring too though. My company is and I have no shortage of recruiter LinkedIn mail with leads should I need or want to find another job.
    - jachee 3y ago
      I read an article about this recently, but can’t find it to officially cite it. However, the thrust was something like this: Despite unemployment being low, the reality is that many of those “thousands of positions” are either geographically-distributed duplicates of the same position, eternally-open cattle calls, or open-but-basically-a-formality for either getting a visa or an internal move. This makes the number of actual openings quite opaque, yet much smaller than it appears.
      - johnnyanmac 3y ago
        Yeah, that's my feeling. I see plenty of positions and still get maybe 5 calls a week for work. But it really does feel like most aren't even looking at my resume, nor do recruiters get much farther through a hiring manager. Of course I could simply be unlucky and swamped by other more attractive candidates. Apparently seniors are swamping Junior roles, so maybe I'm just competing with a bunch of staff/principals now in mid/senior roles.
- compiler-guy 3y ago
  Six months is long enough to spend two months on the beach, two months looking for a job, and two months getting double paid.
- goalonetwo 3y ago
  Sorry for the intrusive question but if you make software engineer level salary how is it that you don't have multiple months/years saved to mitigate for those possible layoffs? Or did we all fall for the lifestyle inflation trap that comes with high salaries? I'm probably a pessimist/realist but I have always lived way below my income and saved as much as possible because it really feels like the cash cow that software engineering is is eventually going to end. Layoffs are always looming. When that day comes, I want to relax as much as possible and not have a deadline to find a job,
  - thenewwazoo 3y ago
    The difference between multiple months/years of emergency savings and retirement savings is intent (and timeline). I could afford to take months or years off, but I’d rather let that money grow in an interest-bearing account for decades and spend it later.
    - goalonetwo 3y ago
      Sure, but in any case having savings (even retirement savings) allows you to not "frantically" look for a job and be slightly more selective.
      - johnnyanmac 3y ago
        It's relative, but having to dig into your 401k isn't an attractive alternative, one I'd only consider in truly dire straits. You are capped in how much you can put in a year so it's not like a savings account you can aggressively make up for after getting hired. I'd much rather resort to temp work than dig deeply into my future if I had a choice. If I could help it I'd rather invest in
      - blackoil 3y ago
        It is primarily psychological difference. I have 10 years of expense as savings. But that is tied in my retirement/emergency/child education plans. If I stop earning for 1 year, I'll be dipping in them which will create a pressure.
nccnm 3y ago
Just in case you're Riot employee. I'm working on LoR game as external partner. If I can have minimum six months, I'll be very happy.
Imz4di 3y ago
Pretty decent. When I was laid off last year from a company that supposedly has a reputation for taking care of their employees, I got 1 week per year of service, which was 8 weeks.
- atlas_hugged 3y ago
  Name and shame please.
  - goosejuice 3y ago
    Curious, what would be a severance package HN would be satisfied with? I suspect the average US employee would be stunned to hear an offer of 6 months. So much negativity around these statistical outliers. The majority of companies in the US don't offer severance and it's very rare in some industries. Not saying that it's fair, but name and shame? Maybe we're living in different worlds.
    - johnnyanmac 3y ago
      Given the gauntlet that is modern tech interviews, 3 months. 1 month severance isn't an issue in a market where you can grab a new gig in 2-3 weeks. But all these places want 5 rounds of interviews.
  - d4mi3n 3y ago
    Shopify is my guess; I was part of that layoff and the timing lines up. They had those exact terms and paid them out in addition to WARN act minimums contingent on signing of a severance agreement. I had the same offer but declined due to issues I had with the severance agreement.
    - dabber 3y ago
      > I had the same offer but declined due to issues I had with the severance agreement. Is it too prying to ask what that means in terms of your outcome? Idk what the WARN act is, and I understand that my question may be neive or too personal to post an answer to publicly, but I'm curious what the alternative to signing is/was and if the answer is generally applicable or specific to the company/agreement.
BadHumans 3y ago
I got laid off from a gaming company and my severance was pitiful and amounted to 1 month of rent. I think this is a fantastic severance
- nox101 3y ago
  Did you look into unemployment benefits? I've never done this but I had acquaintances who looked forward to getting laid off because they'd get unemployment payments from the government for up to 6 months so they saw it as vacation. All they had to do was lie about looking for a job. This was quite a while ago so things might have changed. PS: not saying you shouldn't have gotten a better severance package.
  - advael 3y ago
    Unemployment never pays your full salary, and how much it even scales with your salary caps at a number much lower than is relevant for about the top 75% of software engineers in most states. Assuming you're not straight up lying, then the people you talked to likely derived considerable security from their savings and future job prospects, or possibly even other exogenous factors such as supportive families or income-earning partners rather than unemployment benefits alone
    - rcbdev 3y ago
      Or they were unmortgaged home owners already - You really don't need that much money to just keep on living for a few months at that point.
      - firesteelrain 3y ago
        And how many are really at that point if they are not much older?
        advael 3y ago
        Only takes one to make an anecdote
biotopia 3y ago
The layoff announcement mentioned that the 11% staff laid off is global. It's possible a lot of people laid off are actually in China, since Tencent owns 100% of Riot Games. There is a trend for Chinese companies to not hire workers that are over 35 years old, so some of these employees might be unemployed for a long time. Also, Chinese economy is in the crapper right now.
- jascha_eng 3y ago
  Riot is an american company though, I'm pretty sure they have most of their employees in the US and not China.
  - slurpyb 3y ago
    Yeah they kinda just invest and stand back (with west investments at least?), maybe they are conflating tencent with netease. Are they the same parent organization…? Am i a tencent subsidiary?
- araes 3y ago
  Their offices around the world can be found here: https://www.riotgames.com/en/work-with-us/offices https://www.riotgames.com/en/work-with-us/offices Out of 20, only 1 in China, Shanghai. Most are fairly high cost living locations outside the US (ex: Sydney, Tokyo, Seoul, Paris, Dubai). Mumbai and Sao Paulo are not cheap for India and Brazil.

I still remember the eye-roll my manager gave me when I asked if there was severance when laid off in 2009. I feel bad for all these layoffs, but it seems the support system has improved drastically since then.

ocdtrekkie 3y ago

Yeah to be honest, a half-year sabbatical with time to job hunt non-frantically is a luxury I've never had. I love my current job, but I would probably look at a half year severance like a vacation.

hipadev23 3y ago
> non-frantically It appears to be very heavily biased toward artists, so even if they start that job hunt today, it’s still going to be frantic.
- johnnyanmac 3y ago
  6 months for an artist with Riot on their resume? I can't imagine that not at least opening doors for them.
- ocdtrekkie 3y ago
  That is indeed a fair point.
- deleted 3y ago
  [deleted]
0xjmp 3y ago
In this current job market 6 months to next job is a very quick turnaround...
- mlhpdx 3y ago
  Can you explain? Unemployment is still very, very low and there are hundreds of thousand of open positions out there. Not sure about game companies, hence my asking.
  - bragr 3y ago
    Not just gaming. Tech companies have been shedding jobs like crazy and slashing hiring. Pretty much every day there is news of some company slashing hundreds or thousand of jobs. Anecdotally, its not unusual to take 6 months to find a new job at only 2/3rd the previous salary.
    - whateveracct 3y ago
      Tech companies are definitely still hiring too though. My company is and I have no shortage of recruiter LinkedIn mail with leads should I need or want to find another job.
  - jachee 3y ago
    I read an article about this recently, but can’t find it to officially cite it. However, the thrust was something like this: Despite unemployment being low, the reality is that many of those “thousands of positions” are either geographically-distributed duplicates of the same position, eternally-open cattle calls, or open-but-basically-a-formality for either getting a visa or an internal move. This makes the number of actual openings quite opaque, yet much smaller than it appears.
    - johnnyanmac 3y ago
      Yeah, that's my feeling. I see plenty of positions and still get maybe 5 calls a week for work. But it really does feel like most aren't even looking at my resume, nor do recruiters get much farther through a hiring manager. Of course I could simply be unlucky and swamped by other more attractive candidates. Apparently seniors are swamping Junior roles, so maybe I'm just competing with a bunch of staff/principals now in mid/senior roles.
compiler-guy 3y ago
Six months is long enough to spend two months on the beach, two months looking for a job, and two months getting double paid.
goalonetwo 3y ago
Sorry for the intrusive question but if you make software engineer level salary how is it that you don't have multiple months/years saved to mitigate for those possible layoffs? Or did we all fall for the lifestyle inflation trap that comes with high salaries? I'm probably a pessimist/realist but I have always lived way below my income and saved as much as possible because it really feels like the cash cow that software engineering is is eventually going to end. Layoffs are always looming. When that day comes, I want to relax as much as possible and not have a deadline to find a job,
- thenewwazoo 3y ago
  The difference between multiple months/years of emergency savings and retirement savings is intent (and timeline). I could afford to take months or years off, but I’d rather let that money grow in an interest-bearing account for decades and spend it later.
  - goalonetwo 3y ago
    Sure, but in any case having savings (even retirement savings) allows you to not "frantically" look for a job and be slightly more selective.
    - johnnyanmac 3y ago
      It's relative, but having to dig into your 401k isn't an attractive alternative, one I'd only consider in truly dire straits. You are capped in how much you can put in a year so it's not like a savings account you can aggressively make up for after getting hired. I'd much rather resort to temp work than dig deeply into my future if I had a choice. If I could help it I'd rather invest in
    - blackoil 3y ago
      It is primarily psychological difference. I have 10 years of expense as savings. But that is tied in my retirement/emergency/child education plans. If I stop earning for 1 year, I'll be dipping in them which will create a pressure.

nccnm 3y ago

Just in case you're Riot employee. I'm working on LoR game as external partner. If I can have minimum six months, I'll be very happy.

Imz4di 3y ago

Pretty decent. When I was laid off last year from a company that supposedly has a reputation for taking care of their employees, I got 1 week per year of service, which was 8 weeks.

atlas_hugged 3y ago
Name and shame please.
- goosejuice 3y ago
  Curious, what would be a severance package HN would be satisfied with? I suspect the average US employee would be stunned to hear an offer of 6 months. So much negativity around these statistical outliers. The majority of companies in the US don't offer severance and it's very rare in some industries. Not saying that it's fair, but name and shame? Maybe we're living in different worlds.
  - johnnyanmac 3y ago
    Given the gauntlet that is modern tech interviews, 3 months. 1 month severance isn't an issue in a market where you can grab a new gig in 2-3 weeks. But all these places want 5 rounds of interviews.
- d4mi3n 3y ago
  Shopify is my guess; I was part of that layoff and the timing lines up. They had those exact terms and paid them out in addition to WARN act minimums contingent on signing of a severance agreement. I had the same offer but declined due to issues I had with the severance agreement.
  - dabber 3y ago
    > I had the same offer but declined due to issues I had with the severance agreement. Is it too prying to ask what that means in terms of your outcome? Idk what the WARN act is, and I understand that my question may be neive or too personal to post an answer to publicly, but I'm curious what the alternative to signing is/was and if the answer is generally applicable or specific to the company/agreement.

BadHumans 3y ago

I got laid off from a gaming company and my severance was pitiful and amounted to 1 month of rent. I think this is a fantastic severance

nox101 3y ago
Did you look into unemployment benefits? I've never done this but I had acquaintances who looked forward to getting laid off because they'd get unemployment payments from the government for up to 6 months so they saw it as vacation. All they had to do was lie about looking for a job. This was quite a while ago so things might have changed. PS: not saying you shouldn't have gotten a better severance package.
- advael 3y ago
  Unemployment never pays your full salary, and how much it even scales with your salary caps at a number much lower than is relevant for about the top 75% of software engineers in most states. Assuming you're not straight up lying, then the people you talked to likely derived considerable security from their savings and future job prospects, or possibly even other exogenous factors such as supportive families or income-earning partners rather than unemployment benefits alone
  - rcbdev 3y ago
    Or they were unmortgaged home owners already - You really don't need that much money to just keep on living for a few months at that point.
    - firesteelrain 3y ago
      And how many are really at that point if they are not much older?
      - advael 3y ago
        Only takes one to make an anecdote

biotopia 3y ago

The layoff announcement mentioned that the 11% staff laid off is global. It's possible a lot of people laid off are actually in China, since Tencent owns 100% of Riot Games. There is a trend for Chinese companies to not hire workers that are over 35 years old, so some of these employees might be unemployed for a long time. Also, Chinese economy is in the crapper right now.

jascha_eng 3y ago
Riot is an american company though, I'm pretty sure they have most of their employees in the US and not China.
- slurpyb 3y ago
  Yeah they kinda just invest and stand back (with west investments at least?), maybe they are conflating tencent with netease. Are they the same parent organization…? Am i a tencent subsidiary?
araes 3y ago
Their offices around the world can be found here: https://www.riotgames.com/en/work-with-us/offices https://www.riotgames.com/en/work-with-us/offices Out of 20, only 1 in China, Shanghai. Most are fairly high cost living locations outside the US (ex: Sydney, Tokyo, Seoul, Paris, Dubai). Mumbai and Sao Paulo are not cheap for India and Brazil.