4 ms·

Larry Summers? He has no technical experience, torpedoed the stimulus plan in 2008, and had to resign the Harvard presidency following a messy set of statement

Larry Summers? He has no technical experience, torpedoed the stimulus plan in 2008, and had to resign the Harvard presidency following a messy set of statements about ‘differences’ between the sexes and their mental abilities. Kind of a shocking choice.

the-memory-hole 3y ago
a huge player in preventing derivatives regulation leading up to 2008 now helps steer the ship of AI oversight. I'm speechless.
nonethewiser 3y ago
> “There is relatively clear evidence that whatever the difference in means—which can be debated—there is a difference in the standard deviation and variability of a male and female population,” he said. Thus, even if the average abilities of men and women were the same, there would be more men than women at the elite levels of mathematical ability Isn’t this true though? Says more about Harvard than Summers to be honest. https://www.swarthmore.edu/bulletin/archive/wp/january-2009_what-larry-summers-said-and-didnt-say.html https://www.swarthmore.edu/bulletin/archive/wp/january-2009_...
- alex_young 3y ago
  A control group is kind of unimaginable right? And even if you could be sure of this conclusion, is it helpful or beneficial to promote it in public discourse?
  - logicchains 3y ago
    >And even if you could be sure of this conclusion, is it helpful or beneficial to promote it in public discourse? It's absolutely helpful for mental health, to show people that there's not some conspiracy out to disenfranchise and oppress them, rather the distribution of outcomes is a natural result of the distribution of genetic characteristics.
    - astrange 3y ago
      This is not an accurate description of causation and can't be, because there are more steps after "genetics" in the causal chain. It's also unimaginative; having a variety of traits is itself good for society, which means you don't need variation in genetics to cause it. It's adaptive behavior for the same genes to simply lead to random outcomes. But people who say "genes cause X" probably wouldn't like this because they want to also say "and some people have the best genes".
  - TMWNN 3y ago
    Sorry, you don't get to decide which thoughts are wrongthink and verboten.
    - alex_young 3y ago
      I’m not suggesting that I get to decide or whatever, and I am absolutely happy there is reasoned discussion of cognition. I do however expect the boards of directors of important companies to avoid publicly supporting obviously regressive ideas such as this gem.
      - mvdtnz 3y ago
        You're happy there is reasoned discussion, but the idea is, in your view, "regressive" whether it's true or not?
        alex_young 3y ago
        True is a bit of a stretch here right?
- Auracle 3y ago
  Shh. Only some truths should be spoken aloud. You clearly deserve to lose your job if you speak one of the other truths that offends people.
  - alex_young 3y ago
    One should also be careful to claim that the dominant group is inherently superior. There are a lot of, uh, counter examples. Calling this a truth is pretty silly. There is a lot of evidence that human cognition is highly dependent on environment.
    - jadamson 3y ago
      He didn't claim they were superior. He said they deviate more from the mean, in both directions. For example, there are a lot more boys than girls who struggle with basic reading comprehension. Sound familiar?
    - Auracle 3y ago
      There's a lot of evidence that not having two X chromosomes is less stable, leading to...irregularities. That sword cuts both ways. I don't like ignorance being promoted under the cloak of not causing offense. It causes more harm than good. If there's a societal problem, you can't tackle it without knowing the actual cause. Sometimes the issue isn't an actual problem caused an 'ism,' it's just biology, and it's a complete waste of resources trying to change it.
- MVissers 3y ago
  This is the scientific consensus btw. There are also more intellectually challenged men btw, but somehow that rarely gets discussed. But the effects are quite small, and should not dissuade anyone to do anything IMO.
  - alex_young 3y ago
    The consensus appears to be somewhat less than a consensus. Here is a meta analysis on the subject: https://www.ncbi.nlm.nih.gov/pmc/articles/PMC3057475/ https://www.ncbi.nlm.nih.gov/pmc/articles/PMC3057475/
arduanika 3y ago
The faculty got him out because he riled them, e.g. by insisting they ought to actually put effort into teaching undergrads. They looked for a pretext, and they found it. Just like in that Oppenheimer movie. A sanctimonious witch hunt serving as pretext for a personal vendetta. (Note that Summers is, I'm told, on a personal level, a dick. The popular depiction is not that wrong on that point. But he's the right pick for this job -- see my other comments in this thread.)
0xDEAFBEAD 3y ago
To be honest, one reason I like Summers as a choice is I have the impression he is willing to be unpopular when necessary, e.g. I remember him getting dragged extremely heavily on Twitter a few years back, for some takes on inflation which turned out to be fairly accurate.
- astrange 3y ago
  No, his predictions in 2021 were not accurate. He gave 33% chance of three different things happening, and then none of them happened!
- midasuni 3y ago
  This Summers? https://nymag.com/intelligencer/2023/06/larry-summers-was-wrong-about-inflation.html https://nymag.com/intelligencer/2023/06/larry-summers-was-wr... https://prospect.org/environment/2023-11-20-larry-summers-inflation-prediction-climate-change/ https://prospect.org/environment/2023-11-20-larry-summers-in...
logicchains 3y ago
Could have been worse, they could have picked Larry David, would fit the clown-show of the past weekend.
- ric2b 3y ago
  Larry David is never wrong on these things, you can trust him.
Racing0461 3y ago
If Larry correctly said that men and women are different, i see nothing wrong here.
- notfed 3y ago
  It looks like he said, specifically: > "...[there] is relatively clear evidence that whatever the difference in means—which can be debated—there is a difference in the standard deviation and variability of a male and female population..." Sheesh, of all the things to be cancelled for...

the-memory-hole 3y ago

a huge player in preventing derivatives regulation leading up to 2008 now helps steer the ship of AI oversight. I'm speechless.

nonethewiser 3y ago

> “There is relatively clear evidence that whatever the difference in means—which can be debated—there is a difference in the standard deviation and variability of a male and female population,” he said. Thus, even if the average abilities of men and women were the same, there would be more men than women at the elite levels of mathematical ability Isn’t this true though? Says more about Harvard than Summers to be honest. https://www.swarthmore.edu/bulletin/archive/wp/january-2009_what-larry-summers-said-and-didnt-say.html https://www.swarthmore.edu/bulletin/archive/wp/january-2009_...

alex_young 3y ago
A control group is kind of unimaginable right? And even if you could be sure of this conclusion, is it helpful or beneficial to promote it in public discourse?
- logicchains 3y ago
  >And even if you could be sure of this conclusion, is it helpful or beneficial to promote it in public discourse? It's absolutely helpful for mental health, to show people that there's not some conspiracy out to disenfranchise and oppress them, rather the distribution of outcomes is a natural result of the distribution of genetic characteristics.
  - astrange 3y ago
    This is not an accurate description of causation and can't be, because there are more steps after "genetics" in the causal chain. It's also unimaginative; having a variety of traits is itself good for society, which means you don't need variation in genetics to cause it. It's adaptive behavior for the same genes to simply lead to random outcomes. But people who say "genes cause X" probably wouldn't like this because they want to also say "and some people have the best genes".
- TMWNN 3y ago
  Sorry, you don't get to decide which thoughts are wrongthink and verboten.
  - alex_young 3y ago
    I’m not suggesting that I get to decide or whatever, and I am absolutely happy there is reasoned discussion of cognition. I do however expect the boards of directors of important companies to avoid publicly supporting obviously regressive ideas such as this gem.
    - mvdtnz 3y ago
      You're happy there is reasoned discussion, but the idea is, in your view, "regressive" whether it's true or not?
      - alex_young 3y ago
        True is a bit of a stretch here right?
Auracle 3y ago
Shh. Only some truths should be spoken aloud. You clearly deserve to lose your job if you speak one of the other truths that offends people.
- alex_young 3y ago
  One should also be careful to claim that the dominant group is inherently superior. There are a lot of, uh, counter examples. Calling this a truth is pretty silly. There is a lot of evidence that human cognition is highly dependent on environment.
  - jadamson 3y ago
    He didn't claim they were superior. He said they deviate more from the mean, in both directions. For example, there are a lot more boys than girls who struggle with basic reading comprehension. Sound familiar?
  - Auracle 3y ago
    There's a lot of evidence that not having two X chromosomes is less stable, leading to...irregularities. That sword cuts both ways. I don't like ignorance being promoted under the cloak of not causing offense. It causes more harm than good. If there's a societal problem, you can't tackle it without knowing the actual cause. Sometimes the issue isn't an actual problem caused an 'ism,' it's just biology, and it's a complete waste of resources trying to change it.
MVissers 3y ago
This is the scientific consensus btw. There are also more intellectually challenged men btw, but somehow that rarely gets discussed. But the effects are quite small, and should not dissuade anyone to do anything IMO.
- alex_young 3y ago
  The consensus appears to be somewhat less than a consensus. Here is a meta analysis on the subject: https://www.ncbi.nlm.nih.gov/pmc/articles/PMC3057475/ https://www.ncbi.nlm.nih.gov/pmc/articles/PMC3057475/

arduanika 3y ago

The faculty got him out because he riled them, e.g. by insisting they ought to actually put effort into teaching undergrads. They looked for a pretext, and they found it. Just like in that Oppenheimer movie. A sanctimonious witch hunt serving as pretext for a personal vendetta. (Note that Summers is, I'm told, on a personal level, a dick. The popular depiction is not that wrong on that point. But he's the right pick for this job -- see my other comments in this thread.)

0xDEAFBEAD 3y ago

To be honest, one reason I like Summers as a choice is I have the impression he is willing to be unpopular when necessary, e.g. I remember him getting dragged extremely heavily on Twitter a few years back, for some takes on inflation which turned out to be fairly accurate.

astrange 3y ago
No, his predictions in 2021 were not accurate. He gave 33% chance of three different things happening, and then none of them happened!
midasuni 3y ago
This Summers? https://nymag.com/intelligencer/2023/06/larry-summers-was-wrong-about-inflation.html https://nymag.com/intelligencer/2023/06/larry-summers-was-wr... https://prospect.org/environment/2023-11-20-larry-summers-inflation-prediction-climate-change/ https://prospect.org/environment/2023-11-20-larry-summers-in...

logicchains 3y ago

Could have been worse, they could have picked Larry David, would fit the clown-show of the past weekend.

ric2b 3y ago
Larry David is never wrong on these things, you can trust him.

Racing0461 3y ago

If Larry correctly said that men and women are different, i see nothing wrong here.

notfed 3y ago
It looks like he said, specifically: > "...[there] is relatively clear evidence that whatever the difference in means—which can be debated—there is a difference in the standard deviation and variability of a male and female population..." Sheesh, of all the things to be cancelled for...