10 ms·
You take the good with the bad. The same brain that is so pig-headed as to believe whatever $Conspiracy today, is also the brain that was pig-headed enough to
by ryzvonusef 3y ago
You take the good with the bad.
The same brain that is so pig-headed as to believe whatever $Conspiracy today, is also the brain that was pig-headed enough to think he could fund an EV and a Rocket company at the same time, when he had experience of none, during a recession.
If he was reasonable minded, he would have realised the whole EV and Rocket thing is a stupid risk not worth taking and he would have invested his paypal money into something safe like all his fellow paypal mafia members who started VCs, and today we would never had heard of him except in esoteric terms, and he would have been sipping mai tai or whatever it is that VCs do when they are lazing around in their 3rd yatch.
Like acc to his bio (mentioned somewhere in his 1st bio by ashlee vance) the man literally had an intervention with fellow rich white buddies that he's gonna go bankrupt, that's how stupid the idea was.
to speak in explicit 4chan terms, that autist brain of his what created/funded this, and his stupid tweets are frankly a cheap price to pay for it (at least for me, I'm not american ;p)
- mrpopo 3y agoSo, if at some point he starts funding military spaceships that can shoot illegal migrants from space, do we still take the good with the bad, or do we denounce his behaviour?
- rizky05 3y ago[dead]
- zpeti 3y agoFirstly, that would be illegal, and government(s) could step in. Secondly, there are quite a few steps between having enough of woke twitter and buying it, which I'm pretty sure 20-30%, maybe even 40% of the population agrees with, and shooting illegal immigrants. I know the media try their best to portray these two as equivalents, but they're just not. Also keep in mind the biggest loser from the twitter acquisition is probably the establishment journalists, so they do have an axe to grind. Their views are not going to be objective on musk.
- mrpopo 3y agoElon Musk isn't just "denouncing woke twitter". He is actively, politically involved in Mexico border crossing debates, meeting with politicians and border patrols, etc.
- nicky0 3y agoAnd somehow you extrapolate from "meeting with politicians and border patrols" to shooting migrants from space?
- mrpopo 3y agoNo. OP was suggesting we shouldn't denounce the bad things he's doing, because of the good things he's doing. My point is, should we wait for the bad to outweigh the good, and who will be the judge of that?
- deleted 3y ago[deleted]
- ryzvonusef 3y agowe can cross that hypothetical bridge, if it ever exists and gets crossed, no use in raising hypotheticals. right now it's just stupid tweets, I ignore them and live my life, after all, my life has never been in danger from any of his tweets, but it HAS been from actual american drones doing actual bombing. I survived that, I will survive his tweets.
- Zardoz84 3y agoI'm sure that someone said something similar about the first public speeches of Hitler
- ViewTrick1002 3y agoElon Musk literally is Hitler! Like, what?!
- hef19898 3y agoIn deed they did. After the elections in 1933, free and fair elections prior to the Nazis taking power in the staged elections later that year during which the Nazis used their party apparatus as a shafow administration and blunt and brutal force and violence, the conservative establishment picked Hitler and the NSDAP for exactly that rwason: The needed someone to lead a coalition government against the left, they choose Hitler because they didn't take him really serious and thought they could easily manipulate him. We all know well that turned out.
- ryzvonusef 3y agoI am not from your part of the world; application of Godwin's law in online discourse always amuses me, since I damn care about hitler or what he and his ilk did, my part of the world had other boogie men. Regardless, I standby my remark.
- thejackgoode 3y agoTrying to have a balanced view as well, but I have a strong intuition it will get much worse with Elon
- concordDance 3y agoAs far as I can tell he hasn't personally done much worse than say things on twitter that at least a third of people agree with, broken SEC rules and run companies his way. As far as evil goes he isn't even going to be the evillest person in a room of 10 random people. That said, the echo chamber effects will continue to get worse as the media continues to pile on him.
- hef19898 3y agoYour statement hugely underestimates the influence someone like Elon has.
- gary_0 3y agoDemagoguery and personality cultism never ends well. You'd think humanity would have learned by now.
- s1artibartfast 3y agoNobody is harmed by people thinking Einstein or Mother Teresa were great and not worthy people. Same for Gandi and MLK, if you choose which aspects to value and respect. It is useful to have examples of people who made a positive impact on the world.
- 0xDEAFBEAD 3y agoI'd respect Elon critics more if they frequently noted that they grade Elon more harshly due to his high level of influence, but I rarely see them do that. Ultimately in a democracy, everyone is entitled to their opinion. There are lots of people who think the way Elon does, but most of them aren't as prominent about it as Elon is. Seems to me that in a healthy democracy, we shouldn't be particularly upset if an opinion that's common among the general population also has some representation among the elites. https://today.yougov.com/topics/economy/explore/public_figure/Elon_Musk https://today.yougov.com/topics/economy/explore/public_figur... Indeed, if this weren't the case, and elites had wildly different opinions than common people (and also more influence), you could make the case that we were living in a plutocracy or an oligarchy, not a democracy. So Elon's willingness to say aloud what many common people think privately is pushing us away from that plutocracy/oligarchy failure mode. I think Elon has made major mistakes -- funding of OpenAI being the biggest, from the point of view of humanity's survival. But the hate he gets rarely seems well-justified or rational. Here's my theory for what's going on: https://news.ycombinator.com/item?id=38046411 https://news.ycombinator.com/item?id=38046411
- danjc 3y agoPlot twist: he actually is the bad guy in the end
- danjc 3y agolol, downvoted for comedy or because it wasn't considered good comedy? Bonus downvote for observing downvotes.
- ryzvonusef 3y agoApologies, I always upvote every reply to a comment of mine, I like when people engage with me.
- ryzvonusef 3y agoPlot twist, the story is still running, we are yet to see how the plot ends. after all, a few years ago every one was saying Bezos was the bad guy, there still time for some one else to pop up. Have faith, reality is weirder than fiction :)
- dukeyukey 3y ago> a few years ago every one was saying Bezos was the bad guy Maybe I hang with a different crowd, but there's still a lot of anti-Bezos sentiment out there.
- wheelerof4te 3y ago"the man literally had an intervention with fellow rich white buddies that he's gonna go bankrupt" You lost me there. No need to racist, you know? It goes both ways.
- ryzvonusef 3y agoApologies, I didn't mean to target any race, I was simply sharing an observation of mine. I have past the HN editing time limit or I would have removed the offending remark, no offense was meant.
- darkwater 3y ago(will be downvoted to death, I don't care) Nope, it doesn't go both way. Racism and classism only go one way, which is towards the poorer or more vulnerable part. Pick on the weaker is a sign of cowardice. Do the same on the stronger is well-accepted, and rightfully so. Always punch upwards.
- zpeti 3y agoCan we please get some "vulnerable" people into the NBA? You know, the ones who aren't represented there? Definitely seems like the stronger people seem to dominate there, and it's really unfair to the weak.
- darkwater 3y agoNBA like in the National Basketball Association? You mean like the many European players that rock the NBA that are totally not Afro-American? Maybe the issue is in how the selection is done in American colleges. But I'm pretty sure the Afro-American population would gladly swap 50% of black NBA players to have 50% of them in the middle-class.
- sgu999 3y ago> Always punch upwards. A couple famous chilled dudes prescribed to not punch at all. The ones I'm thinking of were referring to Romans and British colonisers, but I suspect they'd have applied it to white rich buddies as well. (Please note that I didn't write what I think of it, I'm only fuelling the debate)
- Angostura 3y ago> The same brain that is so pig-headed as to believe whatever $Conspiracy today, is also the brain that was pig-headed enough to think he could fund an EV and a Rocket company at the same time, when he had experience of none, during a recession. A lot of the innovation that went into Tesla and SpaceX occurred before he decided to transform himself into a complete tit. I'll take the good, please.
- ryzvonusef 3y agoBefore? or did we just not know it then? Because I believe he was always like this, we either didn't know or didn't care about it, or worse, just assumed that because he liked/disliked X, Y, Z, then must also like/dislike A, B, C. You can definitely pick and choose, mind you, you don't have to accept a personality whole, you can like some parts while disliking others, but you can't just eliminate parts of him, and his stupid tweets are a part of his mentality, whether we like it or not.
- huytersd 3y agoHe does seem like he’s a little lost and coasting on what he built before now that I think about it.
- deleted 3y ago[deleted]
- fsloth 3y agoYou take the good with the bad. A thousand times this. All humans are fallible. If you presume someone isn’t you just don’t know them very well. Unforgivable offences should not be forgiven. Beyond that - celebrate wins, cherish humanity, embrace humility and tolerance. Don’t have to like anyone, but need to tolerate and respect.
- frob 3y agoThe dude plays footsie with white supremacists. https://www.mediaite.com/tech/elon-musk-skewered-for-posting-they-want-your-extinction-after-robert-e-lee-statue-melted-down/ https://www.mediaite.com/tech/elon-musk-skewered-for-posting.... One of his first act upon taking over Twitter was to reinstate white supremacists. I don't know if he is a full white supremacist, but he really seems to like them. And that type of person is getting none of my respect or money.
- fsloth 3y agoAfaik the linked case of the melting of statue of Lee is more complicated than that. After US civil war north attempted to demolish and rebuild the institutions in the secenniost southern states https://en.m.wikipedia.org/wiki/Reconstruction_era https://en.m.wikipedia.org/wiki/Reconstruction_era In a way the melting of the statue can be viewed as a continuation of the northern purges of southern institutions. Twitter/X is crap for nuanced discussion, but a facet of the US history is the tendency of the east coast to crusade over the sensibilities of the other states in a form perceived (rightly or not) as puritan zeal. And as I understand it, not all of the cases are hardly as obvious as the abolishment of slavery. I’m not from US so I might be completely off base though! I don’t follow the white supremacist scene so this might very well be a dog whistle from all I know.
- lettergram 3y ago+1 for it being nuanced, after moving to the south it really was not clear how much this is true. The statue was the embodiment of a heritage / culture. There were bad parts of that culture, but so is there in every culture. However, rarely do we support obliterating other cultures. I'm going to walk through the logic of the people I've met in the south (not necessarily my own opinions). The south was under military occupation for years after the civil war. The north sent teachers from the north to "re-educate" the south. Many of the farms were destroyed and unmaintainable due to the war, deaths, famines, and removal of slaves. Many southerners were not allowed to hold office until there was a pardon issued. They almost had a second civil war in 1877 due to a disputed election - https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Compromise_of_1877 https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Compromise_of_1877 Part of the compromise on the 1877 disputed election was that they removed "reconstruction". In many ways, the south felt a genocide was committed. Their culture, society, wealth, etc was taken from them. We can argue it was justice due to them holding slaves or rebelling, but they left the union peacefully in their minds and wanted to be left alone. Fast forward to today -- the US government has consistently regulated every primary export of the south (intentionally or otherwise). Cotton, alcohol, tobacco, coal, oil, etc have all been systematically regulated. I've witnessed first hand the large swaths of the south that had their communities destroyed by these regulations (most of them). Further, their state governments constantly derided for the last 150 years. Opioids and obesity are also much more impactful (imo unrelated to the government) in the south the opioid epidemic (which is still raging) completely decimated the communities. The dispensary rates are also WAY higher in former confederate states than anywhere else. https://www.cdc.gov/drugoverdose/rxrate-maps/index.html https://www.cdc.gov/drugoverdose/rxrate-maps/index.html When you combine massive regulation, loss of jobs, obesity, etc it's clear why many southerners look to their heritage when they once had pride in their community, state, country, etc. At the end of the day, the people of the south have slowly seen their culture collapse over the decades and the melting of the statue was kind of the death of it. The burning of their institutions, melting of their statues, and erasure from the history books.
- throw310822 3y ago> brain that is so pig-headed as to believe whatever $Conspiracy today I see the risk that someone who has been consistently so stubborn and capable of making reality match his absurd aspirations, might even succeed in making $Conspiracy come true before he changes his mind :)
- deleted 3y ago[deleted]
- Symmetry 3y agoProgress depends on unreasonable people who refuse to adapt themselves to the world.
- huytersd 3y agoBad is fine. But supporting white supremacists bad is too far across the line for me.