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I would like to take this moment to thank https://diamondssuck.com/ https://diamondssuck.com/ for preventing me from buying my wife a diamond, and getting her a

• jamiek88 3y ago
  I would like to have done this. Maybe we’ll get it reset with a proper, clean, nice man made one instead!
  • Loughla 3y ago
    What? I'm confused. Why would you burn more resources to replace an existing diamond?
    • deleted 3y ago
      [deleted]
• hiAndrewQuinn 3y ago
  This was written by the same guy who wrote The Personal MBA, one of the best books I read as a teenager. Small world!
• Horffupolde 3y ago
  I understand what he’s saying, but he doesn’t get it.
  • squigz 3y ago
    Get what?
    • vkou 3y ago
      He doesn't get that a cartel manufactured a social ritual of conspicuous consumption (and a fairy tale to go with it).
      • Spivak 3y ago
        I mean it is, but you can break it trivially as an individual. There's no network effect, actually there's an anti-network effect. My partner and I were patient zero for non-diamond rings in our social sphere. I got alexandrite and she got a green sapphire. The rings are stunningly gorgeous, unique, nothing at all like you would find at at Zales or whatever and less than half the price (which is good since we needed two :P) Our friends and family were obsessed and not six months later I got a text from a now engaged friend who wanted to know how we found them. He also opted for a green sapphire because it matched her eyes. Non-diamond rings sell themselves, someone (and it can be you) just needs to break the seal.
    • SamBam 3y ago
      That the diamond industry has convinced people that the amount of money you spend show the worth of your love? Tell you what, I can set up a website that sells moissanite for 10x their retail price if you like. Give me a day to set up a Square account and you can buy from me.
      • eru 3y ago
        Buying from your website might burn the requisite amount of money, but it wouldn't be conformist enough. Signalling conformity with social norms is also important to some people.
        • fyokdrigd 3y ago
          that guy selling glass with a Russian royalty like name in every mall around the world beat him to it anyway
          • xp84 3y ago
            That place always confused me. I was like, "So what's this stuff made of? Uh huh, okay, and why exactly are these tchotchkes and brooches and stuff worth this much?"
            • eru 3y ago
              What is the Mona Lisa made of, and how much is it worth?
              • Dylan16807 3y ago
                It wouldn't be worth much if there were a million of them and none had a credible claim on being original.
    • Horffupolde 3y ago
      The diamond ring has no utility, so there’s no calculation to make. It’s an irrational proof of commitment.
      • eru 3y ago
        Proof of commitment can have utility. And status symbols can have utility. (Going on a tangent: compare Bitcoin's proof-of-work, which also has utility. Of course, that doesn't mean diamonds nor proof-of-work are the best bang-for-buck. For the latter, you can use proof-of-stake or avoid cryptocurrencies altogether. For the former, there are plenty of other social arrangements that avoid diamond rings.)
        • friend_and_foe 3y ago
          Yes, but giving something worthless but expensive is not a real tangible proof of commitment. "Here is something I paid too much for" is less meaningful than "here is something very valuable." Something valuable says if you are bad to her you'll lose out and she will have something to show for the commitment she reciprocated, something expensive that isn't valuable says I'll behave how you want to keep you around. In India they give gold jewelry, that makes a lot of sense. Their cultural reasoning about it is very different (it's a financial investment that ties families together) but the act is better IMO.
          • eru 3y ago
            Yes, gold (or gold jewelry) holds its resale value better than diamond rings.
        • xp84 3y ago
          Just realized: A big fat diamond is a literal Proof of Work.
          • eru 3y ago
            Especially since it has so little resale value.
• dariusj18 3y ago
  I was in the market, but I came to find moissanite to be too sparkly. Still looking but thinking white sapphire is going to be the eventual purchase.
  • nerdponx 3y ago
    Look for antique diamonds using older cuts, they're much less sparkly than the modern "brilliant" diamond cut. Plus being antique you're just supporting the antique jewelry business, the cartel already took their cut.
  • Loughla 3y ago
    Check out lab grown diamonds. Ethically way better than dirt diamonds, and the price is like 1/5 as well. They also don't have the (solely in my opinion) chintzy sparkle of moissanite. Shout out to Friendly Diamonds for a recent purchase. My spouse knocked the center stone out of her wedding ring. Ordered a much larger, much (much much much) higher quality in terms of cut color and clarity, and WAY cheaper lab diamond from them.
  • xp84 3y ago
    In my humble opinion, sapphires are a great choice, and they also come in a range of beautiful colors. We went with a pinkish-orangish one.
• xivzgrev 3y ago
  Guys, buying diamonds, can complain all day about what a rip off it is (it is). But if you apprise your fiancé of the alternatives / opp costs (moissanite, man made, second hand, etc) and she still wants a new diamond, just get her a new diamond. It will make her happy for years. My wife had her heart set on a pink diamond, so that’s what I got her. I made it clear though that if I got this, she is not getting a new one for a long time (she has a tendency to want to rent / sample / change things up). So to her credit she did her homework and spent a few months picking the best one. Now everytime we go out and she wears it, I can see how she’s happy. It’s worth it to me to see a gift keep giving.
  • tuatoru 3y ago
    I have no idea why you're being downvoted for sharing a personal story. And your opinion is as valid as anyone else's in matters of taste. De gustibus non est disputandum.
    • makeitdouble 3y ago
      Didn't downvote, but online forums are rarely a good place for relationship advice. In particular, if you're marrying someone, getting a grip on what she might appreciate for years is a good first step, especially as the premise is the discussion has already been started in the couple and she voices her own opinions. How it goes down from there is probably a microcosm of how they'll deal with their future decisions.
    • throwaway2037 3y ago
      De gustibus non est disputandum. I had to look it up: <<Of taste, there is no disputing.>> There is a whole Wiki page about it! [1] [1] https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/De_gustibus_non_est_disputandum https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/De_gustibus_non_est_disputandu...
  • bombcar 3y ago
    And make sure you appraise her of it - shenanigans like buying something else and passing it off as a diamond could result in her being absolutely embarrassed in front of her friends, which should not be a position you want to put her in.
• nerdponx 3y ago
  I ended up buying a ~90 year old diamond ring from an estate jewelry store. Diamonds don't exactly have a shelf life.
  • eru 3y ago
    You can set them on fire, though.
  • deleted 3y ago
    [deleted]
• dublinben 3y ago
  It’s pretty clear how existential of a threat lab-grown diamonds have become to the traditional diamond industry. Today you can buy a lab-grown diamond for ~$550 that’s equivalent to the $4500 natural diamond or $400 moissanite mentioned in that article.
  • BlueTemplar 3y ago
    You can see some of that impact on this chart : https://www.pricescope.com/diamond-prices/diamond-prices-chart/# https://www.pricescope.com/diamond-prices/diamond-prices-cha... That (crappy) $4.6k diamond would be from $3.3k on now : https://www.bluenile.com/diamond-search/?CaratFrom=0.9&CaratTo=1.1&Color=J,I,H&Clarity=VS2,VS1,VVS2&Cut=Very+Good https://www.bluenile.com/diamond-search/?CaratFrom=0.9&Carat... So that's a -28%, and assuming no change between 2006 and 2008, this does seem to fit the recent drop in 0.5 to 1 carat prices seen on the chart ? (Note that all of the drops happened since early 2022.) Meanwhile, the lab grown equivalent is around $1.6 k : https://www.bluenile.com/diamond-search/?CaratFrom=0.95&CaratTo=1.05&Color=J,I,H,G,F,E,D&Clarity=VS2,VS1,VVS2&Cut=Very+Good&IsLabDiamond=True https://www.bluenile.com/diamond-search/?CaratFrom=0.95&Cara... (Where did you get the $550 figure from ?) ---- More interestingly, looking at diamonds that aren't crap (why would you settle for that when it's their optical properties that you are after ?), you have in the same size of 6.5 mm : From $3.5k-3.9k for natural ones : https://www.whiteflash.com/loose-diamonds/round-cut?carat=0.9,1.1&color=D,L&t=inhouse&advanced=yes&polish=Ideal,Excellent&lwratio=0,3&symmetry=Ideal,Excellent https://www.whiteflash.com/loose-diamonds/round-cut?carat=0.... (Clarity doesn't seem to matter that much, because it has not much effect as long as it can't be seen to the naked eye, which in these except the worst one it probably won't be ? https://beyond4cs.com/clarity/ https://beyond4cs.com/clarity/ ) From $1.3k for the lab-grown ones : https://www.whiteflash.com/loose-diamonds/lab-created-diamonds/round-cut?carat=0.9,1.1&clarity=IF,SI2&cut=Ideal,Excellent&t=inhouse&advanced=yes&polish=Ideal,Excellent&lwratio=0,3&symmetry=Ideal,Excellent https://www.whiteflash.com/loose-diamonds/lab-created-diamon...
    • dublinben 3y ago
      The $550 figure came from the first search result (www.cleanorigin.com) for lab grown diamonds. No clue if this is a reputable site.
• subpixel 3y ago
  My wife thinks little of diamonds. So when we got engaged I gave her a ring set with an emerald my grandfather got in Colombia in the 50s and that my grandmother and mother wore. Turns out all those warm fuzzies are generally cancelled out by the likelihood that our emerald is as bloody as any diamond. The story of emerald trafficking in Colombia is dark.
  • ThrowawayTestr 3y ago
    On the other hand, not wearing the gem means those people slaved away in the mines for nothing.
    • kibwen 3y ago
      > for nothing Rather, I suspect they slaved away in the mines so that they wouldn't be whipped and have their hands cut off.
      • Spooky23 3y ago
        Don’t buy silver or gold either. The genocide of entire peoples was committed to extract them from Latin American mines.
        • xp84 3y ago
          And... not buying a gold chain today will reanimate how many fallen Aztec warriors? (I'd never question your own choice to not buy it on those grounds, but proselytizing it seems to imply there are some stakes here that make it worth encouraging "everybody" to take up the same cause, and I just don't see how it matters.)
          • Spooky23 3y ago
            I’m being sarcastic! Unfortunately human suffering is all too common, so virtue signaling about everything has limited import. In areas where value is more tradition than intrinsic (ie rhino horns, whalebone) it’s probably effective, but at a certain point it’s navel gazing.
• biglyburrito 3y ago
  I just did some cursory searching, and moissanite still seems pretty expensive. Am I missing something?
  • yial 3y ago
    On Etsy, I see some 2 ct equivalent rings in sterling for as low as $40. Loose cut stones for as low as $7.50. However, being in the market myself, I do think for a nice setting and stone you will pay $500-$1,500 for them if looking or certain cuts (kite cut as an example), sets, or styles.
• ciconia 3y ago
  Fun fact: when my wife and me got married, we went to the flea market and got ourselves two simple silver rings that cost us about $5 each and that was it (we were both kinda broke at the time). 15 years later, we're still wearing the same rings.
  • javaunsafe2019 3y ago
    This is the way
• penguin_booze 3y ago
  The link to Atlantic article seems broken. But I found this: https://www.theatlantic.com/magazine/archive/1982/02/have-you-ever-tried-to-sell-a-diamond/304575/ https://www.theatlantic.com/magazine/archive/1982/02/have-yo....
• tromp 3y ago
  An extensive comparison of diamond alternatives Moissanite and the much cheaper Cubic Zirconia: https://www.thepeachbox.com/blogs/diamonds/moissanite-vs-cubic-zirconia https://www.thepeachbox.com/blogs/diamonds/moissanite-vs-cub...
• nojvek 3y ago
  I love diamondssuck.com, but it seems the article they link https://www.theatlantic.com/doc/print/198202/diamond/ https://www.theatlantic.com/doc/print/198202/diamond/ is 404-ing (not available). Likely De Beers did what cartels do and threw their lawyers to take it down? diamondssuck should instead link to https://web.archive.org/web/20130522104756/http://www.theatlantic.com/magazine/archive/1982/02/have-you-ever-tried-to-sell-a-diamond/304575/?single_page=true https://web.archive.org/web/20130522104756/http://www.theatl... which is a working link. The long article is truly worth a read.
  • BlueTemplar 3y ago
    What I don't understand is how De Beers hasn't gone bankrupt yet : > According to industry estimates, the average one-carat flawless diamond had fallen in value by 50 percent since January of 1980. In March of 1980, for example, the benchmark value for such a diamond was $63,000; in September of 1981, it was only $23,000. https://diamondssuck.com/ https://diamondssuck.com/ > Diamond: Via Blue Nile: 1.00-Carat Round, Very Good-cut, I-color, and VS1-clarity diamond comes accompanied by a diamond grading report from the GIA. Price: $4,565 https://news.ycombinator.com/item?id=38252743 https://news.ycombinator.com/item?id=38252743 So, converting to today's dollars, that's : 1980 : $235.3k/1ct 1981 : $ 77.9k/1ct 2006 : $ 7.0k/1ct 2023 : $ 3.5k/1ct (and 1.3k/1ct for lab-grown) Also, why the HELL would investors think that's a store of value, like here ?!? https://news.ycombinator.com/item?id=37508058 https://news.ycombinator.com/item?id=37508058 I guess it's more «investors» + speculators instead, which only looked at recent values ??
• pfdietz 3y ago
  I think it's much more loving to get your spouse a big, beautiful, shiny mutual fund.
• travisporter 3y ago
  I'm totally onboard - this is nonsense! What's annoying though is because moissanite is cheaper, you can't get a premade platinum ring with a moissanite stone.
• vGPU 3y ago
  I bought my wife an absolutely beautiful moissanite handmade ring on Etsy for a fraction of the price a real diamond would cost, and she’s been very happy with it. Not only does it look great, she has a tendency to leave rings lying around the house and forget where they are, so it’s not a panic-inducing event if she should happen to lose it.
• nataliste 3y ago
  I have never understood the obsession with even having rings or a ceremony to begin with. My wife was my wife prior to a judge legally marrying us (and only because my mother-in-law didn't want our children to be bastards). If for whatever reason the government "dissolves" our marriage, it doesn't change anything between us. It's a token formality. Fortunately, my wife agreed wholeheartedly and we used the obligate ceremony to invite our two favorite people and leveraged the "it's our wedding" card to force them away from their jobs so we could eat Chinese food and play board games with them. Is there anything more to it than social jockeying and prestige?