5 ms·

You can find many cases where in humans prolonged water fasting (30 days) or a low carb diet with cyclical ~5 to 7 day water fasting eradicated or halted some c

You can find many cases where in humans prolonged water fasting (30 days) or a low carb diet with cyclical ~5 to 7 day water fasting eradicated or halted some cancers. Some links, you can find more on google/youtube (do note that youtube is heavily censoring low carb stuff since "it's not mainstream approved" lol despite people healing conditions on it that no modern medicine could). https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=Rhs1BB7MbHo https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=Rhs1BB7MbHo (at 1:03:20) Another one: How my Immune System beat cancer: Fasting, Juicing, Ketogenic diet, Breathing, Exercise, Meditation and other non-toxic therapies Paperback – January 12, 2021 by Fred Evrard https://www.youtube.com/@CancerTherapy/videos https://www.youtube.com/@CancerTherapy/videos https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=WJQn6WZGAQ0 https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=WJQn6WZGAQ0 https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=jK0BkTPUGQY https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=jK0BkTPUGQY

niemandhier 3y ago
Yes intermittent fasting sometimes is efficient against certain types of cancers since those have a different sugar metabolism , BUT nutrient deprivation in cancers can lead to a signalling cascade that triggers metastasis. So far we only know in a few pretty stable occurring cancer types if the tradeoff is worth it. This paper is the first step towards a possible trial in humans.
- DoesntMatter22 3y ago
  The thing about cancer is how insanely adaptable most are. You do one thing it does another. Cut off food supply it migrates its metabolism. It's pretty wild. Terrible of course but it explains why it's been so hard to erradicate
oisdk 3y ago
> do note that youtube is heavily censoring low carb stuff since "it's not mainstream approved" lol By "not mainstream approved" you mean it's largely discredited and confined to quacks and charlatans online. Outside of its one legitimate use—very specific cases of epilepsy—no serious medical organisation endorses keto for the general population or cancer patients. The third video you link is of a person who thinks that they cured their cancer with, among other things, juicing, breathwork, "positive mindset", and keto. This is nonsense. > despite people healing conditions on it that no modern medicine could If it worked, it would become "modern medicine". The reason it's not accepted in the mainstream is that it has failed every basic test of efficacy. The reason that you will find it promoted primarily on youtube and not in major medical journals is that the youtube audience is less well-equipped to spot it as snake-oil.
- NotGMan 3y ago
  >> If it worked, it would become "modern medicine". This is why you fail to get it: if you ever read the cases of people being harmed by their doctors advice and getting healed by going opposite to their doctors advice you would never have said such a thing. Modern medicine is NOT patient focused: it's pharma focused. Look up statin marketing budgets. And who do you think sponsors most of those "medicine journal" studies? >> no serious medical organisation endorses keto for the general population or cancer patients. Which further proves my point: if thousands of people healed their diseases which the "modern medicine" completely fails to heal using the keto diet and if, by your own admission, modern medicine disregards keto as uselss, what does this tell you about modern medicine other than that it's completely backwards?
  - oisdk 3y ago
    > if you ever read the cases of people being harmed by their doctors advice and getting healed by going opposite to their doctors advice you would never have said such a thing. There are countless cases of shoddy care from doctors. The existence of crappy doctors does not mean keto is effective. > Modern medicine is NOT patient focused: it's pharma focused. Again, the existence of bad incentives in medicine/corruption is not evidence of keto working. > And who do you think sponsors most of those "medicine journal" studies? There are serious, good-faith criticisms of modern medicine to be made. Blindly saying it's all nonsense, and instead you should do a juice cleanse with keto instead of chemo, is not a serious good-faith criticism. > if thousands of people healed their diseases which the "modern medicine" completely fails to heal using the keto diet This has not happened. Keto has not healed thousands of peoples' cancer. There is no evidence (and I mean real evidence, not a youtube video or podcast recounting an anecdote) of keto being effective at curing cancer.
    - tootie 3y ago
      When did keto become a religion?
      - qbrass 3y ago
akudha 3y ago
This shouldn’t be a surprise, no? When we temporarily free our body from digestion activities, it has time to “house clean”, aka push toxins out, which helps the body heal.
- raincole 3y ago
  Typical "pseudoscience speak".
  - electrondood 3y ago
    [flagged]
    - InSteady 3y ago
      Calorie restriction (not necessarily fasting) has also shown some remarkable benefits to health and longevity. It seems our bodies can perhaps do some housecleaning, perhaps relearn how to function efficiently, during periods of calorie restriction. The effect of caloric restriction on genetical pathways https://www.sciencedirect.com/science/article/pii/S2213453023000071 https://www.sciencedirect.com/science/article/pii/S221345302... Impact of Dietary Restriction Regimens on Mitochondria, Heart, and Endothelial Function: A Brief Overview, https://www.frontiersin.org/articles/10.3389/fphys.2021.768383/full https://www.frontiersin.org/articles/10.3389/fphys.2021.7683... Calorie restriction modulates the transcription of genes related to stress response and longevity in human muscle: The CALERIE study https://onlinelibrary.wiley.com/doi/10.1111/acel.13963 https://onlinelibrary.wiley.com/doi/10.1111/acel.13963
    - dang 3y ago
      "Please don't sneer, including at the rest of the community." It's reliably a marker of bad comments and worse threads. https://news.ycombinator.com/newsguidelines.html https://news.ycombinator.com/newsguidelines.html
  - dang 3y ago
    "Edit out swipes." "When disagreeing, please reply to the argument instead of calling names." https://news.ycombinator.com/newsguidelines.html https://news.ycombinator.com/newsguidelines.html
tootie 3y ago
Eliminates cancer? This is highly dubious. And your cites are all YouTube? This reeks of the pseudoscience that Steve Jobs killed himself with.
- jokethrowaway 3y ago
  Steve Jobs did the opposite of a keto / low carb diet. https://www.reddit.com/r/exvegans/comments/10wromx/veganism_killed_steve_jobs/ https://www.reddit.com/r/exvegans/comments/10wromx/veganism_... Cancer as a metabolic disease is catching on, but we branded those scientists as heretics for years https://www.ncbi.nlm.nih.gov/pmc/articles/PMC8835572/ https://www.ncbi.nlm.nih.gov/pmc/articles/PMC8835572/ It just proves how corrupt the food industry is
  - electrondood 3y ago
    Yeah, he basically started consuming only fruit juice.
    - InSteady 3y ago
      Just about the most taxing thing you can do for the pancreas (both exocrine and endocrine function), short of becoming an alcoholic.
  - henearkr 3y ago
    Although you can eat vegan but low-carb or even keto, so the title of this Reddit post is misleading (no, "veganism" didn't kill Steve Jobs, only the way he decided to implement it). Source: I do that.
- electrondood 3y ago
  Skepticism isn't the knee-jerk reaction that everything you hear is false, it's the willingness to explore in good faith the possibility that those things are true.
hinkley 3y ago
One of the studies I saw was with respect to chemotherapy. The mechanism they were crediting is that in fasting situations, healthy tissues lock down and try to conserve existing resources, while tumors did not. Thus the tumor cells absorb a higher load of the treatment than healthy tissues.
simple10 3y ago
My simple layman's understanding of the science is that cancer cells need glucose to function while normal cells can run on ketones and glucose. The more you cut off glucose, the less opportunity the cancers cells have to grow.
- rusticpenn 3y ago
  Cancer cells are just mutated normal cells which focus on replicating themselves instead of following the rules of the system.
- voisin 3y ago
  This is the Warburg Effect and covered well in “Tripping over the Truth: The Metabolic Theory of Cancer”[0] [0] https://www.goodreads.com/book/show/23496164 https://www.goodreads.com/book/show/23496164
- thebigspacefuck 3y ago
  IIRC some cancers do better with ketones so it’s important to check that the type of cancer you’re targeting is one that responds to this.

niemandhier 3y ago

Yes intermittent fasting sometimes is efficient against certain types of cancers since those have a different sugar metabolism , BUT nutrient deprivation in cancers can lead to a signalling cascade that triggers metastasis. So far we only know in a few pretty stable occurring cancer types if the tradeoff is worth it. This paper is the first step towards a possible trial in humans.

DoesntMatter22 3y ago
The thing about cancer is how insanely adaptable most are. You do one thing it does another. Cut off food supply it migrates its metabolism. It's pretty wild. Terrible of course but it explains why it's been so hard to erradicate

oisdk 3y ago

> do note that youtube is heavily censoring low carb stuff since "it's not mainstream approved" lol By "not mainstream approved" you mean it's largely discredited and confined to quacks and charlatans online. Outside of its one legitimate use—very specific cases of epilepsy—no serious medical organisation endorses keto for the general population or cancer patients. The third video you link is of a person who thinks that they cured their cancer with, among other things, juicing, breathwork, "positive mindset", and keto. This is nonsense. > despite people healing conditions on it that no modern medicine could If it worked, it would become "modern medicine". The reason it's not accepted in the mainstream is that it has failed every basic test of efficacy. The reason that you will find it promoted primarily on youtube and not in major medical journals is that the youtube audience is less well-equipped to spot it as snake-oil.

NotGMan 3y ago
>> If it worked, it would become "modern medicine". This is why you fail to get it: if you ever read the cases of people being harmed by their doctors advice and getting healed by going opposite to their doctors advice you would never have said such a thing. Modern medicine is NOT patient focused: it's pharma focused. Look up statin marketing budgets. And who do you think sponsors most of those "medicine journal" studies? >> no serious medical organisation endorses keto for the general population or cancer patients. Which further proves my point: if thousands of people healed their diseases which the "modern medicine" completely fails to heal using the keto diet and if, by your own admission, modern medicine disregards keto as uselss, what does this tell you about modern medicine other than that it's completely backwards?
- oisdk 3y ago
  > if you ever read the cases of people being harmed by their doctors advice and getting healed by going opposite to their doctors advice you would never have said such a thing. There are countless cases of shoddy care from doctors. The existence of crappy doctors does not mean keto is effective. > Modern medicine is NOT patient focused: it's pharma focused. Again, the existence of bad incentives in medicine/corruption is not evidence of keto working. > And who do you think sponsors most of those "medicine journal" studies? There are serious, good-faith criticisms of modern medicine to be made. Blindly saying it's all nonsense, and instead you should do a juice cleanse with keto instead of chemo, is not a serious good-faith criticism. > if thousands of people healed their diseases which the "modern medicine" completely fails to heal using the keto diet This has not happened. Keto has not healed thousands of peoples' cancer. There is no evidence (and I mean real evidence, not a youtube video or podcast recounting an anecdote) of keto being effective at curing cancer.
  - tootie 3y ago
    When did keto become a religion?
    - qbrass 3y ago

akudha 3y ago

This shouldn’t be a surprise, no? When we temporarily free our body from digestion activities, it has time to “house clean”, aka push toxins out, which helps the body heal.

raincole 3y ago
Typical "pseudoscience speak".
- electrondood 3y ago
  [flagged]
  - InSteady 3y ago
    Calorie restriction (not necessarily fasting) has also shown some remarkable benefits to health and longevity. It seems our bodies can perhaps do some housecleaning, perhaps relearn how to function efficiently, during periods of calorie restriction. The effect of caloric restriction on genetical pathways https://www.sciencedirect.com/science/article/pii/S2213453023000071 https://www.sciencedirect.com/science/article/pii/S221345302... Impact of Dietary Restriction Regimens on Mitochondria, Heart, and Endothelial Function: A Brief Overview, https://www.frontiersin.org/articles/10.3389/fphys.2021.768383/full https://www.frontiersin.org/articles/10.3389/fphys.2021.7683... Calorie restriction modulates the transcription of genes related to stress response and longevity in human muscle: The CALERIE study https://onlinelibrary.wiley.com/doi/10.1111/acel.13963 https://onlinelibrary.wiley.com/doi/10.1111/acel.13963
  - dang 3y ago
    "Please don't sneer, including at the rest of the community." It's reliably a marker of bad comments and worse threads. https://news.ycombinator.com/newsguidelines.html https://news.ycombinator.com/newsguidelines.html
- dang 3y ago
  "Edit out swipes." "When disagreeing, please reply to the argument instead of calling names." https://news.ycombinator.com/newsguidelines.html https://news.ycombinator.com/newsguidelines.html

tootie 3y ago

Eliminates cancer? This is highly dubious. And your cites are all YouTube? This reeks of the pseudoscience that Steve Jobs killed himself with.

jokethrowaway 3y ago
Steve Jobs did the opposite of a keto / low carb diet. https://www.reddit.com/r/exvegans/comments/10wromx/veganism_killed_steve_jobs/ https://www.reddit.com/r/exvegans/comments/10wromx/veganism_... Cancer as a metabolic disease is catching on, but we branded those scientists as heretics for years https://www.ncbi.nlm.nih.gov/pmc/articles/PMC8835572/ https://www.ncbi.nlm.nih.gov/pmc/articles/PMC8835572/ It just proves how corrupt the food industry is
- electrondood 3y ago
  Yeah, he basically started consuming only fruit juice.
  - InSteady 3y ago
    Just about the most taxing thing you can do for the pancreas (both exocrine and endocrine function), short of becoming an alcoholic.
- henearkr 3y ago
  Although you can eat vegan but low-carb or even keto, so the title of this Reddit post is misleading (no, "veganism" didn't kill Steve Jobs, only the way he decided to implement it). Source: I do that.
electrondood 3y ago
Skepticism isn't the knee-jerk reaction that everything you hear is false, it's the willingness to explore in good faith the possibility that those things are true.

hinkley 3y ago

One of the studies I saw was with respect to chemotherapy. The mechanism they were crediting is that in fasting situations, healthy tissues lock down and try to conserve existing resources, while tumors did not. Thus the tumor cells absorb a higher load of the treatment than healthy tissues.

simple10 3y ago

My simple layman's understanding of the science is that cancer cells need glucose to function while normal cells can run on ketones and glucose. The more you cut off glucose, the less opportunity the cancers cells have to grow.

rusticpenn 3y ago
Cancer cells are just mutated normal cells which focus on replicating themselves instead of following the rules of the system.
voisin 3y ago
This is the Warburg Effect and covered well in “Tripping over the Truth: The Metabolic Theory of Cancer”[0] [0] https://www.goodreads.com/book/show/23496164 https://www.goodreads.com/book/show/23496164
thebigspacefuck 3y ago
IIRC some cancers do better with ketones so it’s important to check that the type of cancer you’re targeting is one that responds to this.