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Public transit is no good. I don’t want to walk to a station and then share the space with other people. I don’t want to lug grocery bags around. I want to make

Public transit is no good. I don’t want to walk to a station and then share the space with other people. I don’t want to lug grocery bags around. I want to make pit stops. I want to go off road. I want to live in the suburbs or semi rural areas so I can have a lot of land.

Mawr 3y ago
> Public transit is no good. It's easy and convenient: • https://youtu.be/SDXB0CY2tSQ?t=43 https://youtu.be/SDXB0CY2tSQ?t=43 • https://youtu.be/muPcHs-E4qc?t=65 https://youtu.be/muPcHs-E4qc?t=65 > I don’t want to walk to a station and then share the space with other people. I don’t want to lug grocery bags around. Alright, use a bicycle then. I hear ebikes are pretty good these days. Or use a micro car if you must: https://youtu.be/B9ly7JjqEb0?t=101 https://youtu.be/B9ly7JjqEb0?t=101. > I want to make pit stops. A bicycle is better than a car for this. > I want to go off road. Bicycle again, but if you really wanna use a car the few times a year you may wanna go off road, go ahead. > Want to live in the suburbs or semi rural areas so I can have a lot of land. By all means, go ahead. Just as long as you pay in full for all the negative externalities you inflict on everyone else by doing so.
- huytersd 3y ago
  A bicycle is trash (fun to ride, not that useful). What are you going to carry on your bike? Five bags? That’s not even going to get your family through 3 days. I don’t want to go 5 miles away, I want to go 200. With bikes and walking, your world is small. Electric cars powered by renewable energy get rid of most of the negative externalities. For those that remain, that’s too bad because just like eating meat I’m not going to stop doing it because that’s what makes me happy. I’m only living as humanity has always done, people in dense urban centers are the anomaly when viewed historically. I probably more than make up for any remaining externalities by growing my own meat and eggs and partially growing my own vegetables. That’s probably thousands of miles of transportation emissions saved.
  - Mawr 3y ago
    > A bicycle is trash (fun to ride, not that useful). Entirely dependent on the infrastructure: https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=pqQSwQLDIK8 https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=pqQSwQLDIK8 > What are you going to carry on your bike? Five bags? Seems like a lot of groceries to buy at a time, but if you really want to: https://youtu.be/rQhzEnWCgHA?t=379 https://youtu.be/rQhzEnWCgHA?t=379 > I don’t want to go 5 miles away, I want to go 200. You cover 200 miles every day? https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=REni8Oi1QJQ&t=185s https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=REni8Oi1QJQ&t=185s Regardless, you can own a car for those longer journeys just fine and still make most trips by bicycle. > With bikes and walking, your world is small. Yeah, that's why public transport is important too. Cars as well, although deprioritized. > Electric cars powered by renewable energy get rid of most of the negative externalities. They get rid of some of the noise and almost all of the harmful exhaust. That's about it. They're still 2 ton+ massive steel cages that are incredibly dangerous to everyone else, take up a ridiculous amount of space, and require extremely expensive infrastructure. As for the rest, sure, I'm not really criticising your particular choices, it sounds like you live in a rural area where a car is necessary anyway. However, there's no way for everybody to be able to live like you do. There are just too many people. We need to live with long-term sustainability in mind.
mrastro 3y ago
If we (North America) had more walkable streets a lot of these problems would be solved: grocery stores are easier to place in population centers a short distance with less car and more foot traffic and you can rent a car for occasional "off-road" recreational driving. In terms of transportation and city design, the US could learn a lot from Europe if it weren't so addicted to cars. It's better for the environment, mental well-being, and a sense of community.
- shipscode 3y ago
  Except in the real world this is the opposite case… population centers are full of food desert pockets and the suburbs are the land of plenty.
  - djrobstep 3y ago
    ? Reality is the exact opposite of what you say
- nradov 3y ago
  No thanks. Even if Costco was only a few blocks away I wouldn't be able to carry that much stuff home on foot. I drive back with my car pretty much filled. The places where I go most often in Europe, people are nearly as car dependent as in North America. Get out of the big cities and you'll see how regular people live. And rental cars can't be taken off road. It says so right on the rental contract.
  - idontwantthis 3y ago
    In a walkable environment you don’t go to Costco because you don’t need to cram two weeks of shopping into one gigantic trip that takes a long time. You can walk to stores for things you need when you need them. The “grocery bag problem” is a problem caused by cars.
    - nradov 3y ago
      I don't have time to go shopping so frequently.
djrobstep 3y ago
What's wrong with sharing space with other people? Do you have some kind of phobia? You don't need to lug groceries around - just get them delivered.
- mrshadowgoose 3y ago
  > What's wrong with sharing space with other people? Do you have some kind of phobia? Not OP, but I enjoy and value having personal space when I travel. Being able to reliably sit down is also nice. It's amusing to see that your immediate reaction to someone else having different values is to accuse them of having a mental illness, and then trying to force your personal preferences onto them.
  - djrobstep 3y ago
    Nobody likes crowded or dirty space, but an aversion per se to having other people around is definitely pathological. I think this is a social trust thing - lots of people are just scared of strangers. This is particularly true for high-violence/high-tension societies like the US. My city (in Australia) is very peaceful and I don't feel bothered or frightened at all by the general public - in fact I like being able to people-watch, feel a certain sense of vibrancy, etc.
    - mrshadowgoose 3y ago
      "People who like different things than me definitely have pathological issues." Good luck winning people to your side with that.
      - djrobstep 3y ago
        I’m not trying to win anybody over. Agoraphobia is a real disease. Look it up.
        mrshadowgoose 3y ago
        Yeah, believe it or not I'm familiar with that word. Is it really that hard to understand that other people simply might not like the same things as you?

Mawr 3y ago

> Public transit is no good. It's easy and convenient: • https://youtu.be/SDXB0CY2tSQ?t=43 https://youtu.be/SDXB0CY2tSQ?t=43 • https://youtu.be/muPcHs-E4qc?t=65 https://youtu.be/muPcHs-E4qc?t=65 > I don’t want to walk to a station and then share the space with other people. I don’t want to lug grocery bags around. Alright, use a bicycle then. I hear ebikes are pretty good these days. Or use a micro car if you must: https://youtu.be/B9ly7JjqEb0?t=101 https://youtu.be/B9ly7JjqEb0?t=101. > I want to make pit stops. A bicycle is better than a car for this. > I want to go off road. Bicycle again, but if you really wanna use a car the few times a year you may wanna go off road, go ahead. > Want to live in the suburbs or semi rural areas so I can have a lot of land. By all means, go ahead. Just as long as you pay in full for all the negative externalities you inflict on everyone else by doing so.

huytersd 3y ago
A bicycle is trash (fun to ride, not that useful). What are you going to carry on your bike? Five bags? That’s not even going to get your family through 3 days. I don’t want to go 5 miles away, I want to go 200. With bikes and walking, your world is small. Electric cars powered by renewable energy get rid of most of the negative externalities. For those that remain, that’s too bad because just like eating meat I’m not going to stop doing it because that’s what makes me happy. I’m only living as humanity has always done, people in dense urban centers are the anomaly when viewed historically. I probably more than make up for any remaining externalities by growing my own meat and eggs and partially growing my own vegetables. That’s probably thousands of miles of transportation emissions saved.
- Mawr 3y ago
  > A bicycle is trash (fun to ride, not that useful). Entirely dependent on the infrastructure: https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=pqQSwQLDIK8 https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=pqQSwQLDIK8 > What are you going to carry on your bike? Five bags? Seems like a lot of groceries to buy at a time, but if you really want to: https://youtu.be/rQhzEnWCgHA?t=379 https://youtu.be/rQhzEnWCgHA?t=379 > I don’t want to go 5 miles away, I want to go 200. You cover 200 miles every day? https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=REni8Oi1QJQ&t=185s https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=REni8Oi1QJQ&t=185s Regardless, you can own a car for those longer journeys just fine and still make most trips by bicycle. > With bikes and walking, your world is small. Yeah, that's why public transport is important too. Cars as well, although deprioritized. > Electric cars powered by renewable energy get rid of most of the negative externalities. They get rid of some of the noise and almost all of the harmful exhaust. That's about it. They're still 2 ton+ massive steel cages that are incredibly dangerous to everyone else, take up a ridiculous amount of space, and require extremely expensive infrastructure. As for the rest, sure, I'm not really criticising your particular choices, it sounds like you live in a rural area where a car is necessary anyway. However, there's no way for everybody to be able to live like you do. There are just too many people. We need to live with long-term sustainability in mind.

mrastro 3y ago

If we (North America) had more walkable streets a lot of these problems would be solved: grocery stores are easier to place in population centers a short distance with less car and more foot traffic and you can rent a car for occasional "off-road" recreational driving. In terms of transportation and city design, the US could learn a lot from Europe if it weren't so addicted to cars. It's better for the environment, mental well-being, and a sense of community.

shipscode 3y ago
Except in the real world this is the opposite case… population centers are full of food desert pockets and the suburbs are the land of plenty.
- djrobstep 3y ago
  ? Reality is the exact opposite of what you say
nradov 3y ago
No thanks. Even if Costco was only a few blocks away I wouldn't be able to carry that much stuff home on foot. I drive back with my car pretty much filled. The places where I go most often in Europe, people are nearly as car dependent as in North America. Get out of the big cities and you'll see how regular people live. And rental cars can't be taken off road. It says so right on the rental contract.
- idontwantthis 3y ago
  In a walkable environment you don’t go to Costco because you don’t need to cram two weeks of shopping into one gigantic trip that takes a long time. You can walk to stores for things you need when you need them. The “grocery bag problem” is a problem caused by cars.
  - nradov 3y ago
    I don't have time to go shopping so frequently.

djrobstep 3y ago

What's wrong with sharing space with other people? Do you have some kind of phobia? You don't need to lug groceries around - just get them delivered.

mrshadowgoose 3y ago
> What's wrong with sharing space with other people? Do you have some kind of phobia? Not OP, but I enjoy and value having personal space when I travel. Being able to reliably sit down is also nice. It's amusing to see that your immediate reaction to someone else having different values is to accuse them of having a mental illness, and then trying to force your personal preferences onto them.
- djrobstep 3y ago
  Nobody likes crowded or dirty space, but an aversion per se to having other people around is definitely pathological. I think this is a social trust thing - lots of people are just scared of strangers. This is particularly true for high-violence/high-tension societies like the US. My city (in Australia) is very peaceful and I don't feel bothered or frightened at all by the general public - in fact I like being able to people-watch, feel a certain sense of vibrancy, etc.
  - mrshadowgoose 3y ago
    "People who like different things than me definitely have pathological issues." Good luck winning people to your side with that.
    - djrobstep 3y ago
      I’m not trying to win anybody over. Agoraphobia is a real disease. Look it up.
      - mrshadowgoose 3y ago
        Yeah, believe it or not I'm familiar with that word. Is it really that hard to understand that other people simply might not like the same things as you?