8 ms·
Peter Thiel was an FBI informant
- atemerev 3y agoBut who wasn’t.
- achenet 3y ago> claims to be libertarian > starts a billion dollar company that helps the government spy on people, become FBI informant Ironic.
- tjrgergw 3y agoLibertarians are always guilty of such "ironies", some would even call them hypocrisies. It's almost like the veneer of well reasoned ideology is a front just wanting more power.
- gonzo41 3y agoI don't know why you're being down voted. This is spot on.
- doggerel 3y ago[flagged]
- derbOac 3y agoI think the issue is stereotyping. Replace "libertarian" with "republican" or "democrat" and reconsider the statement.
- coderaptor 3y agoIt’s called painting with too wide a brush. A lot of us are simply interested in promoting and continuing to evolve and understand that well-reasoned ideology. We feel its application can improve the human condition.
- goodpoint 3y agoHN is a discussion board connected to a venture capital platform and it attracts lot of libertarians and they don't like to be called out. The term "libertarian" changed a lot over time, from socialist libertarianism to far-right libertarianism. https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Timeline_of_libertarian_thinkers https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Timeline_of_libertarian_thinke... Here we are talking about https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Anarcho-capitalism https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Anarcho-capitalism and check out https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Anarcho-capitalism#Analysis_and_criticism https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Anarcho-capitalism#Analysis_an...
- brvsft 3y agoIf it is being downvoted, it's at least partly because it's an unrealistic standard that is about as serious as the take that "socialists" shouldn't be allowed to use smartphones or other products of "capitalism."
- nvm0n2 3y agoIt's being downvoted because there is no inconsistency between publicly stated beliefs and actions. Look into it more closely.
- deleted 3y ago[deleted]
- solarman5000 3y agoYou must be new to politics... There are bad apples in every party, the actions of one individual do not represent the whole party
- denton-scratch 3y ago> the actions of one individual do not represent the whole party The "bad apples" phrase is often (usually?) misused. The whole saying is: "One bad apple spoils the barrel". In general, it refers to corruption, and especially bent coppers. Here in the UK, we recently had the Commissioner of the Metropolitan Police saying that the rash of rapists in the Met is just "a few bad apples". It's not just a question of taint; if you leave the "bad apples" in there, you'll end up with no good apples at all.
- wsc981 3y agoHypocrisy can be found in many groups. For example I've seen many leftists that claim to be pro-immigration, protest against asylum centra opening in their wealthy neighbourhoods. Or people that claim to be worried about climate change travel the world and protest against wind turbines near their neighbourhoods. Hypocrisy is not limited to certain groups, pretty much all people are hypocritical at times.
- gavinhoward 3y agoNot disagreeing with you. But you have reminded me to do a self-assessment, find all of the hypocrisy I can, and correct it.
- scott_w 3y agoIs that protesting immigration processing or immigration detention centres? I can see why a pro-immigration person can be against what looks like a prison going up in a leafy suburb. They may change their mind if what’s going up is simply a document processing centre that people visit when they need to.
- snovv_crash 3y agoYou are cherry picking the one (weaker) example by badly interpreting it and trying to extend that to the others. All groups have hypocrisy where people push for others to aim for lofty goals, but fight tooth and nail to not have their local community pay the costs. Left, right, authoritarians, anarchists, etc.
- scott_w 3y agoI didn't provide the example.
- jimmydoe 3y agoLibertarian has been a loaded term, and what you are referring to is probably right-libertarianism which is the dorminant form in the US. Most folks already know that, but I just want to point it out since I personally identify as left libertarian.
- o_1 3y agoWhom it attracts doesn't define it. I think we could all postulate some interesting personalities for some other ideologies.
- doggerel 3y ago> claims to be libertarian > ruins press outlet that used too much free speech by burning them with lawsuits
- brvsft 3y agoI like that this thread is going to become a bunch of invective where people who aren't libertarians are going to claim libertarian hypocrisy on subjects like (a) outing someone as homosexual and (b) suing a media outlet for what was effectively revenge porn. Is it your honest opinion that all libertarians are supposed to be ethically okay with outing someone's sexuality or posting revenge porn tapes? If so, why?
- doggerel 3y agoAbout the lawsuits that he bankrolled that shut down a press outlet, he himself said: "I strongly believe in the First Amendment" [...] "I believe journalists are a privileged group in our society. They play an important role in getting us information and in the system of checks and balances. But these were not journalists." https://www.engadget.com/2016-10-31-peter-thiel-silicon-valley-billionaires-justice.html https://www.engadget.com/2016-10-31-peter-thiel-silicon-vall... It is my honest opinion that Thiel is a hypocrite and is a libertarian only if and when it's convenient to him. In this quote, he's letting himself off the hook for undermining the First Amendment protection of the press, which he also did covertly, btw, by claiming that his targets were not journalists when they were. I'm not saying they weren't scumbags for publishing what they did, but he doesn't get to have it both ways. That's the point.
- WanderPanda 3y agoDon‘t hate the player, hate the game!
- transcriptase 3y agoWhat's that line that people on one end of the political spectrum like to use? "Freedom of speech doesn't mean freedom from consequences"?
- monero-xmr 3y agoI’m a libertarian and I believe in a “night watchmen state” https://en.m.wikipedia.org/wiki/Night-watchman_state https://en.m.wikipedia.org/wiki/Night-watchman_state Not all libertarians are anarchists, that is a faction but not the majority IMO. I would overhaul the law enforcement apparatus in my ideal society. But their current existence would not prevent me from providing information to them and asking for assistance if the reason was justified. People calling Peter Thiel a hypocrite are wrong.
- BiteCode_dev 3y agoAnd those whatchmen, you think they are more "justice league" or "the boyz"? Because history has proven our people in power seldom demonstrate benevolence nor competence to solve the average citizens problems.
- monero-xmr 3y agoI cannot solve the problem of nuclear weapons without a formal state with a military, and war in general. So we can argue about how best to organize it but the state must exist and is legitimate IMO.
- WanderPanda 3y agoAgreed but that is a very shallow set of requirements compared to what we have now
- o_1 3y agoGovernment always serves the ruling class. The point of libertarianism is to eliminate the abuse of government so the capabilities of the individual can progress freely. Libertarian ideology assumes government to have a worse case scenario impact. Blissful ignorance of an over-watch is not worse case.
- macNchz 3y agoPalantir is like the dream tool for an authoritarian police state.
- goodmunky 3y agoAnd that’s exactly the “thought” that hit piece was designed to introduce.
- k8svet 3y agoI'm sorry... what? Thiel's political opinions, alignments and investments are not remotely a secret. And having actually read the article, it seems pretty preposterous to imply it was a hit piece. If anything, this makes me feel like maybe Thiel is more complicated or nuanced than I'd previously thought him.
- HumblyTossed 3y ago> Thiel is more complicated or nuanced Or maybe, simply, just more impulsive.
- HumblyTossed 3y agoHa! As if anyone would even need to do a hit piece on Thiel.
- FireBeyond 3y ago"There you go, bringing my words and actions into the debate!"
- randomdata 3y agoLibertarians stand firm behind the rule of law, and a “free market” solution to help with that is in line with such values.
- lostlogin 3y ago100%. When stuff looked a bit iffy, he bought citizenship in New Zealand as a bolt hole. The free market dictates that such things are possible. https://www.nzherald.co.nz/indepth/national/how-peter-thiel-got-new-zealand-citizenship/ https://www.nzherald.co.nz/indepth/national/how-peter-thiel-...
- nvm0n2 3y agoLibertarianism isn't the same as anarchism. Libertarians want there to be law enforcement and a defense industry, and they want the private sector to play a role in that when possible, but not to fully replace the government's role. The state having a monopoly on violence is a key part of libertarian thinking, in fact. So there's no hypocrisy here. However, the Insider article is clearly designed as an attack piece on Thiel, and is probably written by people who don't understand what libertarianism is - a very common issue with those who attack it.
- lostlogin 3y ago> The state having a monopoly on violence is a key part of libertarian thinking, in fact. Don’t libertarians usually want less gun control?
- nvm0n2 3y agoAmerican libertarians do, not those everywhere. In the US they square it by saying that guns are a bulwark against the state going rogue and turning its own weapons on its citizens, but that in normal times (outside of civil war) guns are only meant for things like self defense in cases where the police can't get there in time, or hunting. I think if you want to argue hypocrisy that's still a better place to start than with being an FBI informant, but the article isn't about gun control.
- lostlogin 3y agoThanks - and obviously it’s a hot topic. I wasn’t looking to go down that track so much as query the ‘monopoly on violence’ thing. I didn’t know this was a libertarian view, and assumed a broad ‘self-defence’ belief.
- justincredible 3y ago[dead]
- Ancapistani 3y ago> Libertarianism isn't the same as anarchism. I agree, but have a clarification I'd like to make: many forms of anarchism are in a superset of libertarianism.
- dmix 3y agoBeing libertarian leaning is not being an anarchist. A core part of being a libertarian is a strong judicial system and only the fringiest of an already fringe are against police, such as the sovereign citizen types. FBI does counter intelligence as its primary mission anyway (as opposed to just law enforcement) and Thiel seems to be concerned with China, not using the gov as a weapon against citizens domestically.
- zardo 3y ago> A core part of being a libertarian is a strong judicial system and only the fringiest of an already fringe are against police, such as the sovereign citizen types. Does that make taxation a core part of being a libertarian as well? To pay for vital government services?
- randomdata 3y agoYes, taxation is a core part of being a libertarian. Generally, libertarians believe in taxation only for essential government services, but policing is definitely considered essential to libertarians. It is central to the ideology. Colloquially, anarcho-capitalism is sometimes also referred to as libertarianism. Those who subscribe to anarcho-capitalism believe in stateless societies, of which taxation would be incompatible. However, Thiel purports to be a libertarian in the stricter sense. This usage is not applicable here.
- wankerrific 3y agoThey’re all “libertarian” until their favorite bank goes belly up and needs a bail out.
- ekianjo 3y ago> starts a billion dollar company that helps the government spy on people, become FBI informant That's not necessarily antithetic. Although you could make the rationale that doing such a company reinforces the power of the government, and therefore creates a bigger government which would be against libertarian ideals
- FFP999 3y ago[dead]
- zeroCalories 3y agoEveryone that knows anything about Peter Thiel knows that he's not a libertarian. In his book and various interviews he makes it clear that he is heavily influenced by post-enlightenment thinkers. He's even explicitly said he does not believe freedom and democracy can co-exist, and that we need silicon valley in the defense industry to help combat the enemies of america.
- seydor 3y agohe has accused big tech for not cooperating with the USA , so it seems he s drinking his koolaid
- zkid18 3y agoPalantir works with FBI, no?
- ekianjo 3y agoprobably not just the FBI. NSA, CIA...
- mikhailfranco 3y ago... DHS, ICE ... ... as well as regular military. P.S. Palantir was founded by the CIA (In-Q-Tel): https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Palantir_Technologies#2003%E2%80%932008:_Founding_and_early_years https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Palantir_Technologies#2003%E2%...
- _kbh_ 3y ago> P.S. Palantir was founded by the CIA (In-Q-Tel): Based on that article specifically. >> The only early investments were $2 million from the U.S. Central Intelligence Agency's venture capital arm In-Q-Tel, and $30 million from Thiel himself and his venture capital firm, Founders Fund.[6][7][13][14][15] Sounds like the CIAs investment arm funded Palantir and didn’t found it, the funding amount also seems pretty inconsequential given the overall funding.
- stevehawk 3y agoThe intelligence community is one of their biggest customers, if not the biggest.
- sleepybrett 3y agoHow do you think Thiel gets all the intelligence that lets him make billions?
- deleted 3y ago[deleted]
- fredgrott 3y agoFor context, guess which famous Russian investor in FB is a PT contact and friend. Ah ah, PT had contact with China investors as well so I am sure it was both groups.
- chiefalchemist 3y agoIn exchange for what?
- lacrimacida 3y agoServices
- aarong11 3y agoContinuing government contracts, expectation of favours in return, they almost certainly hold some dirt on him (and many others).
- chiefalchemist 3y agoAnd that's story init? Not that anyone "rolls over" for the FBI. We all know it happens. The question is why. in this case it's likely not money. PT has plenty. 1) So what would motivate him? 2) How often do these type of "exchanges" go on, and we have no idea someone's (e.g., politician, journalist, industry titan, etc) actions were dictated by the Intelligence Community? This isn't a conspiracy theory. It's IC 101.
- aarong11 3y agoI mean it happens every day. When people have a lot to lose and not much left to gain, they tend to roll over a lot more easily. As far as what would motivate him: look at what's happening to Musk right now as an example. I'm not saying he doesn't comply and cooperate with law enforcement, but he's certainly being made a big example of right now from all sides.
- 1sembiyan 3y agoLooks like he was doing his patriotic duty.”Thiel's reporting to the FBI was largely limited to foreign contacts and attempts by foreign governments to penetrate Silicon Valley.” Not uncommon in rest of the world. Once upon a time, it was American journalists who enthusiastically did this: 1. C.I.A. Established Many Links To Journalists in U.S. and Abroad: https://www.nytimes.com/1977/12/27/archives/cia-established-many-links-to-journalists-in-us-and-abroad-cias.html https://www.nytimes.com/1977/12/27/archives/cia-established-... 2. Correspondence and collusion between the New York Times and the CIA: https://amp.theguardian.com/commentisfree/2012/aug/29/correspondence-collusion-new-york-times-cia https://amp.theguardian.com/commentisfree/2012/aug/29/corres...
- DueDilligence 3y ago[dead]
- neilv 3y agoOuting an FBI CHS sounds like something not to do lightly, even though there might be public interest in knowing some complicated entanglements that might need oversight. > In a written statement to Insider, [...] Johnson said that he was exposing Thiel's work as a CHS as retribution [...] They actually wrote "retribution". Sounds like an additional hint that outing might not be OK. Can a seasoned journalist say what the professional guidelines are here?
- eduction 3y agoYou would balance the public interest in the revelation against the possible harm. Best guess is they see the harm as minor as 1. It is not revealed who Thiel was informing on and 2. To the extent a target could guess, Thiel is very well equipped to protect himself from physical threats. Further, it doesn’t seem Johnson is implying physical retribution, it seems more like (arguably) he’s trying to expose what he sees as some sort of ideological hypocrisy. So any harm would be reputational (and debatable) if that’s the case. Many sources for news articles act out of self interest, whether to benefit themselves or hurt an enemy, so that would not be inherently disqualifying. (Not endorsing the presumed logic just describing it.)
- donkeyd 3y agoYou comment made me do a bit of research. Apparently the owner of Insider is Axel Springer, which in Germany is compared to Fox News. So I guess that pretty much answers the question (to me at least).
- ruune 3y agoWouldn't jump to conclusions that fast tbh. BILD, Springers biggest brand, might be comparable to Fox, but Springer has more reputable stuff too. Politico was bought by them too
- baryphonic 3y ago>> In a written statement to Insider, [...] Johnson said that he was exposing Thiel's work as a CHS as retribution [...] > They actually wrote "retribution". Sounds like an additional hint that outing might not be OK. Charles C. Johnson has a very colorful history. Rep. Matt Gaetz (also in the news lately) invited him to the State of the Union in 2018 after which multiple outlets reported on Johnson's Holocaust denier past and his other activities.[0][1] In my opinion, I wouldn't trust Johnson or let him know any real secrets – damaging or not – about me. I'm a bit surprised Thiel would trust him – seems like a blunder that he typically doesn't make. The rest of the article is a hit piece with a bunch of guilt-by-association attacks against Thiel, but Johnson is curiously spared from having his past brought up. [0] https://floridaphoenix.com/blog/matt-gaetz-once-again-hangs-out-with-holocaust-denier-charles-johnson/ https://floridaphoenix.com/blog/matt-gaetz-once-again-hangs-... [1]https://www.bostonglobe.com/news/politics/2018/02/09/spurned-milton-race-baiting-troll-has-found-acceptance-trump/jk2YPROcjHz8OPLMrj3zFL/story.html https://www.bostonglobe.com/news/politics/2018/02/09/spurned...
- OsrsNeedsf2P 3y agohttps://archive.is/DZMxf https://archive.is/DZMxf
- BiteCode_dev 3y agoI always assumed all billionaires were in constant interaction with their country secret services, not necessarily willingly. They concentrate so much power it's the logical thing to do.
- motohagiography 3y ago> Thiel's reporting to the FBI was largely limited to foreign contacts and attempts by foreign governments to penetrate Silicon Valley. Thiel has publicly called on the FBI to investigate Google's ties to the Chinese government. Seems like a lot of words to leave this comment buried in the middle of. The story seems like a soup of hopeful political operators trying to sow chaos, and since they're all on the same side, the publisher is happy to oblige. Talking to the IC at all gives them the unlimited option to call you an informant if you ever get involved in something counter-establishment anyway. One gets the impression that part of America's new class system is whether you are connected to the intelligence community somehow, as if you have a certain level of responsibility at all, someone who knows someone always seems to be in touch or within a degree of separation.
- Yeul 3y ago[flagged]
- TheCaptain4815 3y agoAnd it’s working like a charm. Look at half the comments here who didn’t read the article and go off on an anti-libertarian tangent.
- colpabar 3y agoAnything posted here about thiel or musk (especially musk) is bound to be full of useless comments that boil down to nothing more than "i don't like him." It doesn't matter what the article is about, if the headline can be used to justify that dislike, those will be the majority of the comments.
- ksec 3y agoMusk, Thiel, Zukerberg, Larry Ellison and their respective company along with Qualcomm. To the point for a number of years ycombinator wouldn't even mention Thiel or Musk at all. Things only got back a little easier in the past 12 months or so.
- 3y ago
- ants_everywhere 3y agoOn the one hand, I don't think this surprises anyone given Thiel's history. On the other hand, I don't think the tech community talks honestly enough about the dangers posed by a small number of powerful tech people with fringe ideologies.
- clubm8 3y ago[flagged]
- nightowl_games 3y agoWhat beliefs of Thiels are you categorizing as fringe? I think he's not fringe, he's just outspoken.
- frob 3y ago"Since 1920, the vast increase in welfare beneficiaries and the extension of the franchise to women—two constituencies that are notoriously tough for libertarians—have rendered the notion of ‘capitalist democracy’ into an oxymoron."
- giraffe_lady 3y agoMaybe not around here? But technocratic nationalism is certainly an unusual strain nationally, come on. We don't get to know his inner mind obviously, but whatever ideology runs through "socially conservative gay man" is likely to be rare.
- ants_everywhere 3y agoPeter Thiel has publicly said he doesn't believe in democracy, and he heavily backed someone who tried to violently overthrow the US government.
- MrMan 3y ago[dead]
- Balgair 3y ago
- suggestion 3y agoThere's no such thing as a former informant
- PapaPalpatine 3y agoWhat do you mean? Are the informants euthanized after they’re no longer useful?
- denton-scratch 3y agoI think OP meant it in the way that there's no such thing as a former KGB agent, or a former mafia enforcer; if you try to leave, they can reach you.
- suggestion 3y agoNo, once you're an informant you're always an informant. The relationship never ceases, whether you like it or not.
- ttyprintk 3y agoIt’s the other way around: programs which cannot adapt to the availability of info coming from CHS risk losing funding. This article claims the program dried up late last year.
- Ylpertnodi 3y ago"Do you still beat your spouse?"
- deleted 3y ago[deleted]
- boringg 3y agoIs this the beginning of the presidential run?
- coffeebeqn 3y agoNot a natural born citizen
- lostlogin 3y agoHe bought citizenship in New Zealand in dubious circumstances, so if it doesn’t pan out, maybe he could try here?
- Cornbilly 3y agoThankfully, that would require changing the constitution, something that is probably impossible in his lifetime.
- chimeracoder 3y ago> Thankfully, that would require changing the constitution, something that is probably impossible in his lifetime. Or a violent coup, something which is much more feasible within his lifetime.
- lokar 3y agoA successful vampire can live a very long time
- 5cott0 3y agoAlmost forgot about Charles Johnson >Deadspin floated an old college rumor that Johnson had once defecated on a dormitory floor at Claremont. When Johnson tweeted on Friday that he’s considering a run for Congress, the first reply suggested his campaign slogan could be “Outing rape victims and pooping on the floor since 2014. Vote for me.” Of course, I had to ask him about the allegations. “For the record, I did not shit on the seventh floor, but I wish I did,” he told me. https://www.motherjones.com/politics/2014/12/charles-chuck-johnson-gotnews-rolling-stone/ https://www.motherjones.com/politics/2014/12/charles-chuck-j...
- clubm8 3y agowait so he only denied the floor pooping not the more serious allegation? that's almost as funny as the tweet. forever sad i let my precarity to drive me to post so badly i got removed from The Website
- 5cott0 3y agohe didn't say he didn't poop on the floor he said he didn't poop on the 7th floor
- mensetmanusman 3y agoDoes the world need more informants or fewer?
- HlessClaudesman 3y agoIt depends on whether the enforcement of laws is a necessary thing or an infringement of someone's rights.
- bonadrag 3y agoLooks like a hit piece on him and the politicians he is associated with.
- marban 3y agoSilicon Valley meets The Blacklist
- eunos 3y agoSuch a good show. Early seasons at least.
- EVa5I7bHFq9mnYK 3y agoPeople usually become informants after being caught for a crime ... wonder what that might be.
- benopal64 3y agoI'm surprised at how many Theil defenders there are in the ycombinator chat. We don't have to defend every VC bro just because we are on ycombinator... Also, this is a pattern with the US law enforcement agencies for decades. If you read this article on Hank Asher you will probably get what I'm talking about: https://www.nytimes.com/2023/09/22/magazine/hank-asher-data.html https://www.nytimes.com/2023/09/22/magazine/hank-asher-data.... I think it is concerning when law enforcement develops close, symbiotic relationships with wealthy business figures who have shady pasts. This can easily lead to conflicts of interest, lack of oversight, and preferential treatment. And for those "libertarian" folk in the discussion, why do you care about Peter Theil so much? Why go to the chat section and defend him so ardently?
- kbelder 3y agoHow would you characterize the split for/against in this chat? I'd roughly say 75% or so of the comments are hostile to Thiel. Is that too low?
- TheRealDunkirk 3y agoFreaking Business Insider. Funny, this particular article isn't paywalled, nor complaining about my adblocker. Weird, huh? I wish that site would just implode already.
- deleted 3y ago[deleted]
- karaterobot 3y ago> Insider spoke to multiple people who claim Thiel became a “confidential human source” for a Los Angeles-based agent named Johnathan Buma — a term that indicates a long-running relationship with the FBI > Neither Thiel nor the FBI commented to Insider about the report. And one of Insider’s sources is Charles Johnson, a far-right political figure and blogger that Insider acknowledges has spread a mix of accurate and false information in the past. How would Johnson know about a long term relationship between Thiel and Buma, if all he did was introduce them? Is the implication that the FBI leaked a confidential source, or that Thiel told him about it, or... and stay with me here... should we assume this person who has spread false information in the past is doing it again?
- wutwutwat 3y agoWhat’s it matter in either case he’s burned and any value as an informant vanished when the claim left the first person’s mouth, whether it was true or not.
- karaterobot 3y agoI think it would matter to Thiel if he was alleged to have been informing to the FBI about his friends or business partners.
- wutwutwat 3y agoHis friends and business partners would know better than to believe it if it's a lie, and, if it's true or they are worried about being narc'd on (by Thiel or anyone) to the FBI, they have bigger problems to worry about than this
- jdougan 3y agoI had thought Charles Johnson had moved left politicaly? I haven't looked at his blog in a long time (15 years?)
- cr__ 3y ago
- ChrisArchitect 3y ago[dupe] More discussion earlier: https://news.ycombinator.com/item?id=37941881 https://news.ycombinator.com/item?id=37941881
- AlexanderTheGr8 3y agoIf we are to speculate, what happens to Thiel's social reputation now (regardless of whether the allegation is true or not)? Do people stop talking to him in fear of saying something bad? Do his old friends stop contact because of what he might have told FBI? Does he stop getting invited to parties? Or will all of this blow over in a couple weeks and it's business as usual? My thinking is that his social life will change quite a bit (even accounting for him being a billionaire) and he is done with politics. I don't think any politician will want to involve themselves with Thiel now.
- Freedom2 3y agoDiscussed previously: https://news.ycombinator.com/item?id=37941881 https://news.ycombinator.com/item?id=37941881
- cheaprentalyeti 3y agoI thought Thiel's primary business was Palantir, which is a subcontractor performing data analysis for military intelligence and law enforcement. He literally works for them to begin with out in the open.
- that_guy_iain 3y agoAlso, he’s not a criminal so why would it matter if he was an informant?
- marcod 3y agoAnd? How is this newsworthy?
- justinclift 3y agoWell, his company is trying to get hold of the UK health system's patient data. That's solidly in "info on foreigners" territory. :(
- deleted 3y ago[deleted]
- Alupis 3y agoSo we have an unsubstantiated hit piece against yet another prominent Trump supporter that hinges on "anonymous sources" and a big fat helping of "trust us"? Even if it were true, what exactly constitutes an informant? Answered some questions once or deliberately worked his way into things with the express intent of informing on the activities? According to The Intercept[1], there's thousands and thousands and thousands of FBI Informants today. Everyone in a powerful position with access to the greatest and latest technology is likely an informant on some level. [1] https://theintercept.com/annotation_sets/how-the-fbi-recruits-and-handles-its-army-of-informants/#:~:text=In%201975%2C%20the%20FBI%20ran,number%20has%20soared%20to%2015%2C000 https://theintercept.com/annotation_sets/how-the-fbi-recruit....
- cyanydeez 3y agoUnfortunately, any one connected to Trump Nd republicans have lost all good faith beliefs.
- FireBeyond 3y ago> So we have an unsubstantiated hit piece against yet another prominent Trump supporter Peter Thiel had his fair share of detractors before Trump. Disclaimer before discussing the following: I'm not saying Gawker was not trash media. That is orthogonal to Thiel's involvement. That being said, Gawker never "outed" Thiel. The man's social media profile pictures and galleries were full of him shirtless on gay cruise liners. And whether you agree or not, courts have repeatedly held that billionaires are considered "public figures" by virtue of their "outsized influence and impact on public affairs". These are reasons Gawker was never successfully sued by Thiel. A fundamental concept of our legal system is the right to face your accuser. Thiel and his lawyers manipulated Hogan like a puppet: * Hogan had already settled with the person who leaked his video (for 1/5000th of the amount he would later claim from Gawker). * Hogan had reached a tentative settlement with Gawker that would include part ownership of Gawker, and entitlements to profits. Then along come Thiel, and he offers to pay for lawyers, or use his lawyers (how that's not a conflict, I don't know - what if what Hogan wants conflicts with what Thiel, the person paying the bills, wants, how does your lawyer ethically reconcile that?) And when they do, damages were upped to ridiculous levels. Financial/economic (note: NOT emotional distress, which was claimed separately) damages of fifty million dollars. Fun fact: Hogan's net worth in 2007 at his divorce was $30M, and at the time of the video publication, $8M. I'm not sure how someone whose career earnings were estimated at $15M could claim, with a straight face, that the video being published cost him $50M in purely economic damages... from what? Did networks stop re-running old Wrestlemania episodes as a result? His burgeoning retirement celebrity endorsement income? And when everything was settled, Thiel's lawyers had Hogan withdraw the one claim that would have allowed Gawker's liability insurance to kick in. Weird, huh? You're interested in owning a part of a media company, and getting a share of their profits, but "your" lawyers tell you to withdraw a claim, knowing that the only possible outcome of doing so will be immediate insolvency and bankruptcy. However reprehensible Gawker was in this, there absolutely a wide crevice where there are perfectly valid ethical questions about Thiel's involvement and motivations in this whole debacle.
- WarOnPrivacy 3y agoMy first exposure to Thiel was from his revenge campaign to destroy Gawker.[a] Two lessons became cemented in unbreakable stone for me. 1) Enough money will eventually bend any justice system to your will.[b] 2) Threats to news orgs' existence will bloom after press gives a pass to the previous threats.[c] [a] https://www.techdirt.com/2016/06/13/peter-thiels-plan-to-destroy-gawker-went-way-beyond-hogans-case/ https://www.techdirt.com/2016/06/13/peter-thiels-plan-to-des... [b] https://www.techdirt.com/2016/08/16/billionaire-backer-palantir-facebook-insists-hes-bankrupting-journalists-to-protect-your-privacy/ https://www.techdirt.com/2016/08/16/billionaire-backer-palan... [c] https://www.cjr.org/first_person/amazon-roy-price.php https://www.cjr.org/first_person/amazon-roy-price.php
- FireBeyond 3y agoHis revenge campaign against Gawker was frankly, a travesty against justice, if you ask me (see my other comments on this thread).
- A_D_E_P_T 3y ago> Enough money will eventually bend any justice system to your will.[b] Not "any." The US legal (don't call it justice) system happens to be extremely corruptible, in a sort of "de facto" sense, because securing representation in court is extremely expensive, and everything secondary to representation -- depositions, expert witnesses, investigations, etc. -- is also extremely expensive. In the end, virtually all civil cases become wars of financial attrition. But it's possible to imagine different systems that avoid this sorry outcome. It's as simple as making trial lawyers, still called "officers of the court," actual employees of the court. Assign them at random to litigants or defendants, just as judges are assigned. What one litigant gets (e.g. should one side request depositions or expert witnesses) the other also gets on an equal basis. You could pay 'em out of taxpayer dollars, and it would hardly register a blip in civic/state/federal budgets. We'd all benefit from a more even playing field before the law. But it'll never happen, because legislators are virtually all lawyers, and they rather like the old status quo, which works very well at enriching lawyers.
- WarOnPrivacy 3y ago
- darigo 3y agoOh man. Dissident right Twitter (sorry, 𝕏) is probably gonna go nuts. I myself don't have strong political opinions, but I listen to a lot of historically Thiel-adjacent media (redscare pod, Urbit) and I'm looking forward to the wild conspiratorial takes about what appears, with even the slightest bit of investigation, to be a massive nothingburguesa.
- NN88 3y ago[flagged]
- TradingPlaces 3y agoThe FBI agent is this guy. https://www.businessinsider.com/fbi-didnt-care-giuliani-compromised-by-kremlin-whistleblower-buma-2023-9 https://www.businessinsider.com/fbi-didnt-care-giuliani-comp...
- Lockal 3y agoWhy everybody discussing this? It looks obvious that any US citizen at any moment can be reached by FBI with a call for information; there is no countermeasure against it; since Patriot Act was enacted, you'll never know who gave any piece of information to FBI. And now, somehow, "according to anonymous source", BusinessInsider highlights a very specific pro-Trump person and trying to convince readers of something. But what exactly happened?
- hi41 3y agoHow does super secret FBI informants information come to public view like this? Isn’t making such information public a national security threat?