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Apple's switch away from the physical home button to gestures has created a usability threshold for the iPhone that many can't cross. Intricate gestures are di

Apple's switch away from the physical home button to gestures has created a usability threshold for the iPhone that many can't cross. Intricate gestures are difficult to grok for some, and difficult to perform for others. Try using an iPhone and closing an app with shaky hands. Currently the iPhone SE still has a physical button, but I'm worried what device I'll start recommending to older/less tech savvy people when that goes away. iOS itself is a bit of a disaster zone too now. I see people constantly get stuck having activated the "press to edit your lock screen" by mistake, or getting confused by a constant stream of ads for iCloud, Apple Arcade etc. It's sad because most of this poor UX is unnecessary. It feels like its origins are in Apple no longer caring, combined with running out of real ideas and getting distracted with things like widgets.

staplers 3y ago
Generally it's when the bean-counters get more leverage during economic slowdowns you see the dark patterns emerge.
- bornfreddy 3y ago
  Not sure if they are to blame here though. Cars, sure. But for phones design and software cost doesn't decrease with worse UX, support costs probably even rise.
  - deleted 3y ago
    [deleted]
jgtrosh 3y ago
Not an elderly or disabled person, I probably even fit some people's definition of a touch screen wizard since I regularly use swiping keyboards without looking, but I really can't be bothered with those weird slidey gestures between apps on iOS or Android. At least on Android I can switch to regular (configurable!) bottom buttons.
- causi 3y ago
  Gods I miss having real customizable gestures on Android. It took me years to unlearn my gesture set, especially "double tap with three fingers" to close the current app and go home.
  - nottheengineer 3y ago
    I used to use xposed edge to configure the crap out my gestures, it was great. Now that xposed isn't really a thing anymore, I followed the rest of the world and use my phone with two hands most of the time and use my index finger for the top of the screen with one hand. Not terribly hard at my age, but why do I have to?
- layer8 3y ago
  In principle, I like for example the four-finger sliding gesture to switch apps on the iPad, but it’s implemented in a way that makes it very easy to accidentally swipe to the second-next app instead of to the next app. Similarly, there’s a gesture for Speak Screen where you swipe down from the top with two fingers, but it regularly takes me more than three attempts before it doesn’t instead swipe down the lock screen or the control center. I honestly don’t understand how they think this is fine.
Frost1x 3y ago
My biggest gripe is continuously changing interfaces. You've sold me. I'm a customer, I'm using your thing. Why do you want to make it difficult for me to memorize my use of your thing? Moving menus and buttons around all the time is craziness. I don't have time, cognitive capacity, or interest in finding new ways to do the same functionality from before. Things do need to change over time, I get it, I create things too. Sometimes new functionality evolves and has to go somewhere, sometimes you find a previous design was bad and there truly is an improved layout that will help most. Fine. Those sorts of states should converge quickly so I can memorize and dedicate it to muscle memory vs having to actively look and think all the time.
- nottheengineer 3y ago
  This is a big part of what made me start using linux. On windows, there's a new way to do basic stuff all the time and they screw around with menus that work perfectly well just to have something new. That means that any tutorials will quickly get outdated and you can spend half your mental capacity just keeping up with this crap. The amount of times I googled how to do something in MS office, clicked an article from half a year ago and found that one of the options it mentions doesn't exist anymore is too damn high. Things are nice on linux, especially the CLI world. You learn a little program once and use it for decades without thinking about it.
  - mvdtnz 3y ago
    As always with Linux it depends on which distribution you're on but that hasn't been my experience at all with distributions like Ubuntu and Mint. I used Ubuntu back when the close, maximise and minimise buttons were on the top right and they moved them right from under me. I've tried to adjust to using flat packs but struggled with their very serious limitations while programs I rely on are no longer available in other package types. I have seen them see-saw between the horrible global menu and window menus, make wholesale changes to areas of the settings screen like display settings and mouse and trackpad settings. And I don't even know how many wildly different iterations of that horrible main menu application selector UI I have had to suffer through.
dfxm12 3y ago
>... getting confused by a constant stream of ads for iCloud, Apple Arcade etc. It's sad because most of this poor UX is unnecessary. UX went from an altruist field around making tasks easier to perform to tricking people into spending money, clicking away rights to their personal data, etc. It's the logical path of end users being the product. This axiom started around "free" services like Facebook, but now we see it even in expensive products like iPhones and Windows 11.
user_7832 3y ago
> Apple's switch away from the physical home button to gestures has created a usability threshold for the iPhone that many can't cross. Funny you mention home buttons being more usable. I've got mild wrist pain (not RSI levels fortunately), and I find the pressure required to press it disturbingly high, often resorting to using the assitivetouch button instead.
- throwaway290 3y ago
  It was better with actual physical button. Current SE has a fake software button that didn't move, only vibrate at certain pressure. It feels more difficult to press even at easiest setting because of the way pressure detection works.
Moldoteck 3y ago
Imo ios gestures are not even that good compared to android. The ability to go back by swiping from any edge is so much easier than reaching to the top left of the screen...
- thiht 3y ago
  iOS does that too though, you almost never have to use the top left arrow
chadcmulligan 3y ago
My mum finds the iPhone hard to use (she has early stage dementia), she has an Apple Watch for fall detection, I've tried turning off everything but still there's stacks of stuff you can't turn off. I'd love to make a simple interface with "Answer Phone" and a list of people she can call but its not possible, once you see her use it, you realise how insanely complex the UI is. Swiping is also harder for older people because their hands are dryer and less conductive. We need to keep the iPhone though for the fall detection, I'm examining options but there's not much around.
- kridsdale3 3y ago
  Luckily this kind of thing was announced this year: https://www.macrumors.com/2023/05/16/apple-previews-ios-17-accessibility-features/ https://www.macrumors.com/2023/05/16/apple-previews-ios-17-a...
  - DonHopkins 3y ago
    Wow, Point and Speak looks amazing. Despite all their faults, Apple really deserves credit for bringing great accessibility stuff like this to millions of consumers. >Detection Mode in Magnifier and Point and Speak >In the Magnifier app, Point and Speak helps users interact with physical objects that have several text labels. For example, while using a household appliance, Point and Speak combines input from the Camera app, the LiDAR Scanner, and on-device machine learning to announce the text on buttons as users move their finger across the keypad. >Point and Speak is built into the Magnifier app on iPhone and iPad , works with VoiceOver, and can be used with other Magnifier features such as People Detection, Door Detection, and Image Descriptions to help users navigate their physical environment more effectively.
    - askafriend 3y ago
      > to millions of consumers. It's billions!
      - PeterisP 3y ago
deleted 3y ago
[deleted]
nikau 3y ago
The samsung s8 was the best compromise for this - it didn't have a physical home button, but had an area on screen where the home button would normally be that acted like the home button with a firm press of the finger. Not sure if it had special hardware or just well written drivers, but it always worked flawlessly even with a hung app in the foreground.

staplers 3y ago

Generally it's when the bean-counters get more leverage during economic slowdowns you see the dark patterns emerge.

bornfreddy 3y ago
Not sure if they are to blame here though. Cars, sure. But for phones design and software cost doesn't decrease with worse UX, support costs probably even rise.
- deleted 3y ago
  [deleted]

jgtrosh 3y ago

Not an elderly or disabled person, I probably even fit some people's definition of a touch screen wizard since I regularly use swiping keyboards without looking, but I really can't be bothered with those weird slidey gestures between apps on iOS or Android. At least on Android I can switch to regular (configurable!) bottom buttons.

causi 3y ago
Gods I miss having real customizable gestures on Android. It took me years to unlearn my gesture set, especially "double tap with three fingers" to close the current app and go home.
- nottheengineer 3y ago
  I used to use xposed edge to configure the crap out my gestures, it was great. Now that xposed isn't really a thing anymore, I followed the rest of the world and use my phone with two hands most of the time and use my index finger for the top of the screen with one hand. Not terribly hard at my age, but why do I have to?
layer8 3y ago
In principle, I like for example the four-finger sliding gesture to switch apps on the iPad, but it’s implemented in a way that makes it very easy to accidentally swipe to the second-next app instead of to the next app. Similarly, there’s a gesture for Speak Screen where you swipe down from the top with two fingers, but it regularly takes me more than three attempts before it doesn’t instead swipe down the lock screen or the control center. I honestly don’t understand how they think this is fine.

Frost1x 3y ago

My biggest gripe is continuously changing interfaces. You've sold me. I'm a customer, I'm using your thing. Why do you want to make it difficult for me to memorize my use of your thing? Moving menus and buttons around all the time is craziness. I don't have time, cognitive capacity, or interest in finding new ways to do the same functionality from before. Things do need to change over time, I get it, I create things too. Sometimes new functionality evolves and has to go somewhere, sometimes you find a previous design was bad and there truly is an improved layout that will help most. Fine. Those sorts of states should converge quickly so I can memorize and dedicate it to muscle memory vs having to actively look and think all the time.

nottheengineer 3y ago
This is a big part of what made me start using linux. On windows, there's a new way to do basic stuff all the time and they screw around with menus that work perfectly well just to have something new. That means that any tutorials will quickly get outdated and you can spend half your mental capacity just keeping up with this crap. The amount of times I googled how to do something in MS office, clicked an article from half a year ago and found that one of the options it mentions doesn't exist anymore is too damn high. Things are nice on linux, especially the CLI world. You learn a little program once and use it for decades without thinking about it.
- mvdtnz 3y ago
  As always with Linux it depends on which distribution you're on but that hasn't been my experience at all with distributions like Ubuntu and Mint. I used Ubuntu back when the close, maximise and minimise buttons were on the top right and they moved them right from under me. I've tried to adjust to using flat packs but struggled with their very serious limitations while programs I rely on are no longer available in other package types. I have seen them see-saw between the horrible global menu and window menus, make wholesale changes to areas of the settings screen like display settings and mouse and trackpad settings. And I don't even know how many wildly different iterations of that horrible main menu application selector UI I have had to suffer through.

dfxm12 3y ago

>... getting confused by a constant stream of ads for iCloud, Apple Arcade etc. It's sad because most of this poor UX is unnecessary. UX went from an altruist field around making tasks easier to perform to tricking people into spending money, clicking away rights to their personal data, etc. It's the logical path of end users being the product. This axiom started around "free" services like Facebook, but now we see it even in expensive products like iPhones and Windows 11.

user_7832 3y ago

> Apple's switch away from the physical home button to gestures has created a usability threshold for the iPhone that many can't cross. Funny you mention home buttons being more usable. I've got mild wrist pain (not RSI levels fortunately), and I find the pressure required to press it disturbingly high, often resorting to using the assitivetouch button instead.

throwaway290 3y ago
It was better with actual physical button. Current SE has a fake software button that didn't move, only vibrate at certain pressure. It feels more difficult to press even at easiest setting because of the way pressure detection works.

Moldoteck 3y ago

Imo ios gestures are not even that good compared to android. The ability to go back by swiping from any edge is so much easier than reaching to the top left of the screen...

thiht 3y ago
iOS does that too though, you almost never have to use the top left arrow

chadcmulligan 3y ago

My mum finds the iPhone hard to use (she has early stage dementia), she has an Apple Watch for fall detection, I've tried turning off everything but still there's stacks of stuff you can't turn off. I'd love to make a simple interface with "Answer Phone" and a list of people she can call but its not possible, once you see her use it, you realise how insanely complex the UI is. Swiping is also harder for older people because their hands are dryer and less conductive. We need to keep the iPhone though for the fall detection, I'm examining options but there's not much around.

kridsdale3 3y ago
Luckily this kind of thing was announced this year: https://www.macrumors.com/2023/05/16/apple-previews-ios-17-accessibility-features/ https://www.macrumors.com/2023/05/16/apple-previews-ios-17-a...
- DonHopkins 3y ago
  Wow, Point and Speak looks amazing. Despite all their faults, Apple really deserves credit for bringing great accessibility stuff like this to millions of consumers. >Detection Mode in Magnifier and Point and Speak >In the Magnifier app, Point and Speak helps users interact with physical objects that have several text labels. For example, while using a household appliance, Point and Speak combines input from the Camera app, the LiDAR Scanner, and on-device machine learning to announce the text on buttons as users move their finger across the keypad. >Point and Speak is built into the Magnifier app on iPhone and iPad , works with VoiceOver, and can be used with other Magnifier features such as People Detection, Door Detection, and Image Descriptions to help users navigate their physical environment more effectively.
  - askafriend 3y ago
    > to millions of consumers. It's billions!
    - PeterisP 3y ago

deleted 3y ago

[deleted]

nikau 3y ago

The samsung s8 was the best compromise for this - it didn't have a physical home button, but had an area on screen where the home button would normally be that acted like the home button with a firm press of the finger. Not sure if it had special hardware or just well written drivers, but it always worked flawlessly even with a hung app in the foreground.