4 ms·

You mean doing what users want is bad?

stuartjohnson12 3y ago
Selling tools to commit crimes can be bad depending on the crime. Removing Youtube's ability to monetise probably doesn't do that much harm on a micro scale, but is problematic on a macro scale. This isn't like most piracy where the sales baseline remains the same and those who wouldn't buy will pirate, this is mostly just directly revenue negative to Youtube.
- calderknight 3y ago
  Where is it a crime to block advertisements?
  - rplnt 3y ago
    I mean, we’re heading there.
  - amadvance 3y ago
    You made me remember the scene from A Clockwork Orange where the main character is forced to watch television screens.
- bad_alloc 3y ago
  > commit crimes Is this really a crime? The tool does not redistribute copyrighted material for example. It only reshapes video sent to your device, allowing you to decide which parts to view.
  - fullarr 3y ago
    YouTube makes money by spying on you and serving you ads So yeah it's theft
    - anonymous_sorry 3y ago
      I'm not sure that's how the law works.
      - fullarr 3y ago
        [flagged]
    - t0mas88 3y ago
      The fact that someone makes money spying on me doesn't make it illegal for me to take countermeasures. If your business is taking pictures of people on the street and I decide to wear a baseball cap and sunglasses, you're just out of luck.
      - fullarr 3y ago
        This is a weak argument because YouTube isn't a public street it's a private business You aren't forced to use it, it is a choice And this application (FreeTube) is for the sole purpose of circumventing their (YouTube) monetization for the sake of convenience I don't have a dog in the fight and I'm certainly not a fan of YouTube or Google, but you can't argue it's somehow ok just because you dislike ads or lack of privacy on a "free" video streaming website
        t0mas88 3y ago
        And YouTube as a private business can refuse to serve people using ad blockers or alternative clients. But that doesn't make it illegal to use an ad blocker as the parent post was implying.
    - BLKNSLVR 3y ago
      I'm confused as to whether you're for it against the behaviour. I'd say both of those things makes it ok to do whatever you can to avoid them - given that YouTube appears happy enough to serve ads for various obvious scams that wouldn't make it past television advertising standards bodies.
    - 3y ago
- madeofpalk 3y ago
  Is not playing the ads before the video a crime?
- anonymous_sorry 3y ago
  Is this a crime? I'm free to pick and configure my user agent, YouTube is free to decide whether or not to serve me content.
3cats-in-a-coat 3y ago
As a user I also want to walk into a grocery store and walk out with everything and not paying. But is that bad, let's think about it?
- bad_alloc 3y ago
  Is stealing physical goods the same as removing parts of a video stream?
  - izacus 3y ago
    Yes, when the service asks for money to see that video stream without those parts. Especially when that money finances the video creator and infrastructure costs for said service. Your point really isn't such a "gotcha" as you think it is. Use this smartarsery to support Nebula or PeerTube instead.
    - _ZeD_ 3y ago
      so you never walk away or change station when there is advertising on tv/radio/billboards?
    - anothernewdude 3y ago
      And? Some food places charge money for delivering the food to your home, it's not a crime to move the food yourself. You've said nothing.
    - DrScientist 3y ago
      So if I close my eyes during the ad, walk away and make myself a coffee, or switch my focus to another window while it's playing - is that illegal? When I visit a web site for the first time, I don't remember agreeing to looking at/watching or reading the ads.
- candiddevmike 3y ago
  You wouldn't copy groceries
izacus 3y ago
DMCA says so (and several such projects have been removed via DMCA takedown). youtube-dl also walked into that one. In general, software engineers even on HN tend to agree with that - that using their paid service without paying is bad, yeah.
- wzdd 3y ago
  > using their paid service without paying is bad Software engineers on HN or anywhere else certainly do not tend to agree that stripping ads from freely-available content is equivalent to using a paid service without paying.
  - HenryBemis 3y ago
    (not defending Google here) I believe that YT costs money to operate. So when I use it without watching ads (which is exactly what I do), I kinda cheat a few cents from them per day/month/year. Also, having built IOS apps in the past: I love the idea that people use them I hate the idea that people use them without paying for them
    - wzdd 3y ago
      > I kinda cheat a few cents from them per day/month/year You certainly do not. There is a very simple and legally-recognised way to recuperate costs associated with providing a service and that is to charge money for the service. Youtube is very happy to give you content for free; you're cheating nobody. Or do you think you're cheating if you watch the ads but don't buy any of the products too? > I hate the idea that people use [my apps] without paying for them Do you charge money for them?
  - nomel 3y ago
    > freely-available It’s not freely available. It has very real costs associated with it, which is why YouTube was a money burn pit for the majority of its existence.
    - wzdd 3y ago

Selling tools to commit crimes can be bad depending on the crime. Removing Youtube's ability to monetise probably doesn't do that much harm on a micro scale, but is problematic on a macro scale. This isn't like most piracy where the sales baseline remains the same and those who wouldn't buy will pirate, this is mostly just directly revenue negative to Youtube.

calderknight 3y ago
Where is it a crime to block advertisements?
- rplnt 3y ago
  I mean, we’re heading there.
- amadvance 3y ago
  You made me remember the scene from A Clockwork Orange where the main character is forced to watch television screens.
bad_alloc 3y ago
> commit crimes Is this really a crime? The tool does not redistribute copyrighted material for example. It only reshapes video sent to your device, allowing you to decide which parts to view.
- fullarr 3y ago
  YouTube makes money by spying on you and serving you ads So yeah it's theft
  - anonymous_sorry 3y ago
    I'm not sure that's how the law works.
    - fullarr 3y ago
      [flagged]
  - t0mas88 3y ago
    The fact that someone makes money spying on me doesn't make it illegal for me to take countermeasures. If your business is taking pictures of people on the street and I decide to wear a baseball cap and sunglasses, you're just out of luck.
    - fullarr 3y ago
      This is a weak argument because YouTube isn't a public street it's a private business You aren't forced to use it, it is a choice And this application (FreeTube) is for the sole purpose of circumventing their (YouTube) monetization for the sake of convenience I don't have a dog in the fight and I'm certainly not a fan of YouTube or Google, but you can't argue it's somehow ok just because you dislike ads or lack of privacy on a "free" video streaming website
      - t0mas88 3y ago
        And YouTube as a private business can refuse to serve people using ad blockers or alternative clients. But that doesn't make it illegal to use an ad blocker as the parent post was implying.
  - BLKNSLVR 3y ago
    I'm confused as to whether you're for it against the behaviour. I'd say both of those things makes it ok to do whatever you can to avoid them - given that YouTube appears happy enough to serve ads for various obvious scams that wouldn't make it past television advertising standards bodies.
  - 3y ago
madeofpalk 3y ago
Is not playing the ads before the video a crime?
anonymous_sorry 3y ago
Is this a crime? I'm free to pick and configure my user agent, YouTube is free to decide whether or not to serve me content.

3cats-in-a-coat 3y ago

As a user I also want to walk into a grocery store and walk out with everything and not paying. But is that bad, let's think about it?

bad_alloc 3y ago
Is stealing physical goods the same as removing parts of a video stream?
- izacus 3y ago
  Yes, when the service asks for money to see that video stream without those parts. Especially when that money finances the video creator and infrastructure costs for said service. Your point really isn't such a "gotcha" as you think it is. Use this smartarsery to support Nebula or PeerTube instead.
  - _ZeD_ 3y ago
    so you never walk away or change station when there is advertising on tv/radio/billboards?
  - anothernewdude 3y ago
    And? Some food places charge money for delivering the food to your home, it's not a crime to move the food yourself. You've said nothing.
  - DrScientist 3y ago
    So if I close my eyes during the ad, walk away and make myself a coffee, or switch my focus to another window while it's playing - is that illegal? When I visit a web site for the first time, I don't remember agreeing to looking at/watching or reading the ads.
candiddevmike 3y ago
You wouldn't copy groceries

izacus 3y ago

DMCA says so (and several such projects have been removed via DMCA takedown). youtube-dl also walked into that one. In general, software engineers even on HN tend to agree with that - that using their paid service without paying is bad, yeah.

wzdd 3y ago
> using their paid service without paying is bad Software engineers on HN or anywhere else certainly do not tend to agree that stripping ads from freely-available content is equivalent to using a paid service without paying.
- HenryBemis 3y ago
  (not defending Google here) I believe that YT costs money to operate. So when I use it without watching ads (which is exactly what I do), I kinda cheat a few cents from them per day/month/year. Also, having built IOS apps in the past: I love the idea that people use them I hate the idea that people use them without paying for them
  - wzdd 3y ago
    > I kinda cheat a few cents from them per day/month/year You certainly do not. There is a very simple and legally-recognised way to recuperate costs associated with providing a service and that is to charge money for the service. Youtube is very happy to give you content for free; you're cheating nobody. Or do you think you're cheating if you watch the ads but don't buy any of the products too? > I hate the idea that people use [my apps] without paying for them Do you charge money for them?
- nomel 3y ago
  > freely-available It’s not freely available. It has very real costs associated with it, which is why YouTube was a money burn pit for the majority of its existence.
  - wzdd 3y ago