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‘We need to see pain’: Multimillionaire says unemployment must rise
- austin-cheney 3y agoI wonder what software would look like if employers wanted to see a jump in productivity and thus eliminate all usage of things like web frameworks and jobs reliant upon such. That would restrict employees and hiring to fewer people capable of performing without those frameworks.
- sublinear 3y agoWhat the hell does the broader business care about web frameworks? Everyone's on salary and there's deadlines. You wanna really eliminate people? Start missing deadlines. They'll replace everyone with contractors indiscriminately regardless of how much you love python or rust and hate javascript.
- austin-cheney 3y agoThe purpose of software is automation. If that means eliminating positions that cannot achieve automation, because they just fill in the blanks of some tool API, then so be it. Ultimately it comes down to a single business question: What costs more, training people or hiring many replaceable people to backfill some tool?
- sublinear 3y agoThat's a naive perspective of web dev or any dev for that matter. What "training"? You're getting ripped off if you're getting billed for that beyond a subscription to Udemy or whatever. I can't think of any dev projects I've ever worked on that weren't full of unique problems to solve web or otherwise. Most of the work is integration, not just making a frontend, and much of that bleeds into the frontend anyway. What costs the most is destroying projects and burning bridges with clients after delivering crap just to save a few bucks. Assuming your projects are scoped correctly, the ratio of devs to projects tends to be about pizza scale (3 to 5 people or so). If you're trying to lean it out more than that, expect disasters or at least to be significantly late on deadlines. If you try to hire "replaceable people" you must anticipate what happens when they're replaced. False economy is what's being sold to ignorant bosses the world over. If cutting payroll despite all this common advice still looks like the only way, you're dealing with years of debt at the hands of severe incompetence. What's being made is always more important than how much it costs. Costs are far less flexible than the sale price. Automation is not a silver bullet and most software dev is already as cheap as it gets in any industry. Just give up and sell the company to someone who knows better before further eroding the value left. Leave the employees alone.
- austin-cheney 3y agoThe perspective is not naive. I have been writing frontend code for 25 years and been a full time JavaScript developer for 15 years. The single greatest human problem I encounter in this space is insecurity and a variety of compensating or masking behaviors. That insecurity is almost universally the result of poor preparation.
- Qem 3y agoI say multimillionaires should pay more taxes.
- up2isomorphism 3y agoAnyone who naively think so will only made them actually pay less taxes relatively to middle classes.
- dctoedt 3y ago> Anyone who naively think so will only made them actually pay less taxes relatively to middle classes. You mean the way it worked in the 1950s [Narrator: No, it didn't] when the U.S. had something like a 91% top marginal tax rate? https://slate.com/business/2017/08/the-history-of-tax-rates-for-the-rich.html https://slate.com/business/2017/08/the-history-of-tax-rates-... https://taxfoundation.org/data/all/federal/income-taxes-on-the-rich-1950s-not-high/ https://taxfoundation.org/data/all/federal/income-taxes-on-t...
- willcipriano 3y agoThey still have you guys fooled with the income/capital gains trick huh? When corporatist dems say "tax the rich" they are talking about income tax, but that isn't how the rich make their money. Paul Pelosi's insider trading profits shall not be infringed!
- derelicta 3y agoThat's why I genuinely dont like justice-through-taxation. Expropriation is a way more effective tool to restore democratic balance and a powerful deterrent.
- GoToRO 3y agoA clawback tax would do the trick.
- toomuchtodo 3y ago
- sublinear 3y ago* in Australia
- FranzFerdiNaN 3y agoPerson who earns money from exploiting labor says labor should be cheaper. Shocking.
- tmnvix 3y agoThis is the same person that said young people can't afford houses because they spend too much money on avocado on toast.
- treyfitty 3y agoI believe, in spirit, what he was referring to was the inordinate premium young people spend for conveniences. He doesn’t have anything against avocado toast, except for the fact that it costs $1.25 to make, but restaurants in NYC or any large city may charge $12 before gratuity for it. No lie, I’ve seen a slice of avocado toast on a menu for $12. It made me irate. When I go out to eat, I optimize for price, and difficulty to make at home. Thus, I often opt for Ribs with brusselsprouts, because both take a lot of time: tending to the grill, chopping annoying Brussels in half…etc. Even then, you can mess it up, rendering your time spent wasted. I’ve eaten bangin’ ribs with Brussels for $25. Avocado toast takes 2 min, tops and requires 0 skill. I think that’s the point he was trying to make.
- wenebego 3y agoYou're defending his point while simultaneously missing it. See this quote: "There was no discussions around, could I go out for breakfast, could I go out for dinner."
- UncleMeat 3y agoThis is ridiculous, IMO. When you go out to eat you should optimize for pleasure, not the difficulty of constructing a dish. Avocado Toast was chosen in the "young people suck" articles because it was trendy, not because it simple. Look at the other complaint - espresso drinks at cafes. People whine that young people could save more money if they just stopped buying lattes. Given that virtually nobody has an espresso machine at home, this is the polar opposite of the "well, you can make it at home" situation. No. The complaint is "young people should stop complaining about their economic fortunes because it is their own damn fault." Nothing to do with trading money for convenience.
- notyourwork 3y ago
- Tade0 3y agoToo late for that. Too few people were born in the 21st century and now are entering the workforce in record low numbers. And this time you can't just throw people at the problem, because it's a worldwide phenomenon - at least in countries where most of the population gets the 9+ years of education required to participate in an advanced economy.
- benj111 3y ago1. Retirement ages have generally been increasing over the period which should offset this. 2. Immigration is a thing. 3. Kids are labour intensive so if we weren't having kids, maybe that freed up labour depressing wages that are now returning to 'normal' rather than wages being 'normal' previously. 4. What nation has anywhere near zero employment?
- lm28469 3y ago> Retirement ages have generally been increasing over the period which should offset this. Wait wasn't capitalism supposed to bring us less work hours and less overall working years ? That's what every politicians/economics were saying in the 60s/70s/80s, where did it go ? > Immigration is a thing. A thing that brings other things that are less and less accepted in a lot of countries
- mortureb 3y agoLike what? 51% of the top 500 billion dollar unicorns in the US are founded by immigrants. Job creation is unacceptable?
- krapp 3y agoAnd then there's this asshole.
- 0dayz 3y agoOr maybe just maybe, we ought to move away from our current school of economics and find a different one that addresses the shortcomings of the current one. I would love to see more coops start up as it puts each employee with the responsibility of working as hard as they wish, but also taking on the responsibility. Or at least giving employees stock shares. Oh also raise taxes, on the rich or force them to invest their excessive money into the economy (investment projects or even funds/stocks for instance).
- treyfitty 3y agoHuberman Lab and Marc Andreesen just had an episode about this. Something about status and power dynamics, and how the current guard will never allow such a drastic change to the status quo because it jeopardizes their existence. Idk if they said this in the episode, but I believe this to be true, even if it were the most optimal economic arrangement. People’s desire for finding their local maxima prevents us from achieving a global maxima.
- pcdoodle 3y agoDidn't even realize I'm subscribed to their channel on youtube. Thanks for "jarring" my memory.
- anon373839 3y agoI have long thought our society would be a lot better if we did more to incentivize small and medium-sized businesses to flourish, and to discourage scale. Better for employees, better for consumers, better for the overall character of communities. Also, regions that are dominated by smaller firms tend to have the most robust economies.
- willcipriano 3y agoI have previously said interest rates only rising in the face of wage inflation and ignoring decades of asset inflation was a attack by the investor class who feel they shouldn't have to share the rewards with workers. This guy confirms that thinking is likely prevalent. Workers need to be reminded who they work for? They need to be reminded that the Hamptons isn't a defensible position.
- oarabbus_ 3y agoAsset multiples will collapse if unemployment rises significantly and the labor market weakens. Surely the investor class will still come out ahead, but it's interesting they seem to be ignoring this fact (except Warren Buffett, who's cash reserve to equity ratio is far greater than most of his peers)
- deleted 3y ago[deleted]
- cornfutes 3y ago“Winning is not enough, others must fail”. Quite ironic that the investor class sees it as a zero sum game.
- nullindividual 3y agoIt’s fear. They fear losing wealth, which if why they must always have more of and do anything to keep, even at the detriment of others— sometimes even their own family. These people are dangerous.
- rekabis 3y ago[flagged]
- cvccvroomvroom 3y agoThey're sociopathic, genocidal vampires.
- 5350-uiop-1130 3y ago> "if we’re not growing, we’re dead." is this driven by something fundamental in human nature or is it a byproduct of neolib capitalism.
- yobbo 3y agoWhen he says "we", he likely means the rent-seeker class.
- wenebego 3y agoI would probably say capitalism generally, but certainly this neolib variety
- StopHammoTime 3y agoIronically of course, the standard of living for the average Australian hasn’t changed over the last 20 years. Growth means nothing to most Australians, because ultimately, the money doesn’t wind up in our pockets. Politicians and rich people treat ever increasing GDP as some kind of admirable pursuit when in reality it’s making Australia far worse. We are not investing in infrastructure and any investments we do make are quickly skimmed and shipped overseas. I want to try a stagnant economy, as I’d rather everyone works 20 hours and have great lives than what we have now.
- derelicta 3y agopeak capitalistic moral decay
- yawnxyz 3y agoAs an American who has spent a couple of years in Sydney, there are a few interesting observations: - Tradies (construction workers, train workers, etc) are super common, it's a well-respected job, and it pays well (something like $25-30/hr AUD). - Sydney has so many construction projects. Every little bit of road is endlessly built, ripped up, redesigned, and built again. There are MANY train stations (~200?) and many of them constantly get refreshed and made super nice. - Speaking of trains, there are like 7 competing public transit train systems in the greater Sydney area. Many of them are not interoperable - Construction is FAST here. From train station upgrades to apartments (though they're cookie cutter like the US), everything goes up in like 6-12 months. A part of me feels they have so much money to slosh around everyone's got jobs, and they can throw it on endless civic projects. It's like playing Sim City with an infinite money cheat. The joke here is that Australia makes money "by selling pieces of it to China" but that will probably end sooner or later... and that's when unemployment will soar, and the good times will end. Until then, let the good times roll (on one of the competing train lines)
- dronodeath 3y agoTrades pay significantly more than that in the urban US in my experience. Not sure if it is because of a history of being less well-respected but supply is definitely low still relative to demand post-COVID. I wish my midwestern US city had some more money sloshing into civic projects.
- Michelangelo11 3y agoWow, cartoon supervillain stuff.
- d_tr 3y ago> "We need to see pain in the economy." Says the person who has been allowed to accumulate $912M under the very same economy. > "We need to remind people that they work for the employer, not the other way around." The people work for themselves. Too bad the free market is slightly inconvenient for you right now. > "There’s been a systematic change where employees feel the employer is extremely lucky to have them, as opposed to the other way around." So they 're supposed to believe that they are so lucky to be able to have a job at all and (most importantly) behave accordingly. The nerve of that shithead...
- Khelavaster 3y agoI don't want unemployed people desperate to survive threatening order...
- cvccvroomvroom 3y agoThe guy who would blow up their own society to either become a modern socialist country or implode and sink into Lord of the Flies.