7 ms·

So long and sooner into the landfill for a thermal camera, higher end environmental noise monitoring microphone, decent wrap around game controller pad, etc, an

by xoa 3y ago

So long and sooner into the landfill for a thermal camera, higher end environmental noise monitoring microphone, decent wrap around game controller pad, etc, and repurchasing all of the above. This must be some of that "reducing ewaste" and "saving us money" thing I've heard so much about on HN. Yay. Edit: as I replied below, some accessories are form fitting, so no, can't use an adapter. Gamepad example I have (https://www.amazon.com/gp/product/B08FFPKRYW/ https://www.amazon.com/gp/product/B08FFPKRYW/). And even for those that can work with an adapter, for anything but cables the result is longer/flimsier/more awkward/another point of failure, and what are adapters if not more ewaste? And is everyone supposed to by adapters for even lightning cables? I'm fairly certain lightning cables are all going to get tossed too, or at least a very high percentage as people switch. I'm resigned to it and I can afford it, just feels like this time was itself a waste and not based on data and carefully thought through tradeoffs but populism.

deleted 3y ago
[deleted]
zuminator 3y ago
> and repurchasing all of the above ? https://www.amazon.com/xPOWR-3-Pack-Lightning-Adapter-iPhone/dp/B0C9HL5W1J https://www.amazon.com/xPOWR-3-Pack-Lightning-Adapter-iPhone...
- Symmetry 3y ago
  If you have that between the phone and the add-on the phone won't be held securely by the add on as a rigid unit.
- 05 3y ago
  Those are charging adapters, you would need different ones for peripherals. I'm sure they'll show up soon enough. EDIT: see e.g. here https://developer.apple.com/forums/thread/663707 https://developer.apple.com/forums/thread/663707
- xoa 3y ago
  Huh, I was going to respond to someone else but the post was deleted. So upvoting you, and here is what I wrote out when it was only a single reply: ---- A lot of accessories, docks etc are form fitting for good reason, and in that case no there will be no adapters, there just physically is no room. For anything handheld adapters tend to be more awkward and crappier if they work at all for anything that isn't a cable, hard to avoid in a that kind of space constrained scenario. For accessories like the mic yes an adapter likely could work, though it'll still be an extra half inch or whatever more fragile stuff stuck on the end. An irritation and extra expense for no value but not the end of it. The conversation around it has been pretty annoying and self righteous though by promoters, even as it also felt like fait accompli as regulators started forcing it. Lots of braying about "ewaste" without any sort of analysis of what percentage of the waste stream that is (looks pretty minuscule) or the ROI on sweeping away all the enormous existing capital investment the public has made. I could even accept some sort of "yes this will mean more junk and cost in the near term but it'll pay off in 20 years". But for some reason all the conversations I've seen have brushed it aside with "uh adapters" or "well I only use cables myself". Anyway, just consider my post a grumpy resigned last bit of pushback. I still don't really feel like government forcing Lightning -> USB-C was really worth it, if we were forcing a change I'd have preferred it at least going to something really thought through, ground shifting, and future proof forever like an optical hybrid. I think (I sure hope!) USB-C isn't "the end of history" in terms of peripheral connectors. But it's also all water under the dam at this point, and younger me may have been less grumpy, not like I haven't seen lots and lots (and lots)^n of connectors come and go over the decades already.
  - ghaff 3y ago
    I pretty much agree with all that. I'm not doing high-fives about the shift to USB-C because as a long-time Apple phone (and other Apple products) customer I'm perfectly happy with the existing Lightning ports. But the shift is also sort of inevitable European regulators or not and everyone knew it was coming. And Apple have never been ones to maintain legacy interfaces even in devices less space constrained than a phone. (e.g. would it have killed them to maintain a USB-A port in a MacBook Pro?) But here we are.
  - zuminator 3y ago
deleted 3y ago
[deleted]
ejstronge 3y ago
> So long and sooner into the landfill for a thermal camera, higher end environmental noise monitoring microphone, decent wrap around game controller pad, etc, and repurchasing all of the above. This must be some of that "reducing ewaste" and "saving us money" thing I've heard so much about on HN. Yay. These peripherals had lightning ports in them? You can't use a USB-C - Lightning cable and continue using them??
- discussDev 3y ago
  While a small percentage of people will have things that can't be used, my IR camera also connects directly to the phone bottom and you specify what port you want when you buy it as it is flush with the phone. For most people however I doubt it will be an issue.
- foobarian 3y ago
  Or, you know, don't get the 15 for 5 years or so.
gnicholas 3y ago
There was a certain irony that they spent so much time talking about their environmental progress (the video with Mother Nature was riduculous, IMO), and then slid in the USB-C bit without mentioning the environmental impact of ditching the lightning connector.
- toast0 3y ago
  I'm sure the environmental impact of ditching lightning is mixed. On the plus side, long term, having everyone on the same connector is good in lots of ways. In the short term, it's disruptive. It also makes it easier to switch between platforms or live in a multi-platform household; this is good for people, and might be good for Apple or might not. There's a reason Apple waited 10 years to change on iPhones, even though they switched to USB-C on other products. They could have potentially had both ports, but nobody seems to want to put two ports on phones, and Apple is not one to put an old and new thing together.
- nerpderp82 3y ago
  USB-C should have been the lightning connector, it is a better connector than USB-C.
  - Dork1234 3y ago
    USB-C came out after lighting connector, 30 pin connector was at the end of the life when it came out. Apple didn't have a good choice.
    - nerpderp82 3y ago
      USB-C should have been the paddle style lightning connector. I am not saying that Apple should have used USB-C, I am saying that the physical connector for USB-C should have been the paddle style of lightning.
  - Dylan16807 3y ago
    Lightning seems to have some physical issues with power delivery, and I haven't seen the size difference matter for anything bigger than earbuds.
buildbot 3y ago
<snark> People complain for 11 years that they used lightning, now of course, we can complain that Apple has created a bunch of e-waste. Wins for everyone who loves to complain! </snark> This is the reason Apple waited 11 years - to reduce the impact. Plus, there will be adapters.
- ninkendo 3y ago
  Every year they waited is another year for more lightning peripherals to get bought and become future e-waste. They should have done this far sooner, the moment it became "inevitable" (ie. when they started moving all their other devices to it.)
- NickC25 3y ago
  I think it's more that Apple had the money to ignore the EU regulators for 11 years, rather than wanting to reduce the environmental impact of their chargers. They were pissed that the EU doesn't bend to the will of corporations like the US does, so they dragged their feet for over a decade.
  - mercutio2 3y ago
    USB-C has only existed for 9 years. Apple has not been ignoring EU regulators for 11 years.
    - Nullabillity 3y ago
      They were ignoring Micro-USB long before that.
      - buildbot 3y ago
        Micro-usb really sucked though. I had several android phones that had broken micro-usb ports. Lightning is actually a really nice connector design, despite the hate.
- Dylan16807 3y ago
xattt 3y ago
I can’t believe also Apple announced that Tim Cook himself will go into peoples’ homes to rip out existing devices from their hands. /s
yohannparis 3y ago
Or don't throw away your iPhone with lightning! I'm sure the iPhone SE and 14 are still for sell for a couple of years. So unless you want a brand new iPhone every year, then your argument is nill.

by xoa 3y ago

deleted 3y ago

[deleted]

zuminator 3y ago

> and repurchasing all of the above ? https://www.amazon.com/xPOWR-3-Pack-Lightning-Adapter-iPhone/dp/B0C9HL5W1J https://www.amazon.com/xPOWR-3-Pack-Lightning-Adapter-iPhone...

Symmetry 3y ago
If you have that between the phone and the add-on the phone won't be held securely by the add on as a rigid unit.
05 3y ago
Those are charging adapters, you would need different ones for peripherals. I'm sure they'll show up soon enough. EDIT: see e.g. here https://developer.apple.com/forums/thread/663707 https://developer.apple.com/forums/thread/663707
xoa 3y ago
Huh, I was going to respond to someone else but the post was deleted. So upvoting you, and here is what I wrote out when it was only a single reply: ---- A lot of accessories, docks etc are form fitting for good reason, and in that case no there will be no adapters, there just physically is no room. For anything handheld adapters tend to be more awkward and crappier if they work at all for anything that isn't a cable, hard to avoid in a that kind of space constrained scenario. For accessories like the mic yes an adapter likely could work, though it'll still be an extra half inch or whatever more fragile stuff stuck on the end. An irritation and extra expense for no value but not the end of it. The conversation around it has been pretty annoying and self righteous though by promoters, even as it also felt like fait accompli as regulators started forcing it. Lots of braying about "ewaste" without any sort of analysis of what percentage of the waste stream that is (looks pretty minuscule) or the ROI on sweeping away all the enormous existing capital investment the public has made. I could even accept some sort of "yes this will mean more junk and cost in the near term but it'll pay off in 20 years". But for some reason all the conversations I've seen have brushed it aside with "uh adapters" or "well I only use cables myself". Anyway, just consider my post a grumpy resigned last bit of pushback. I still don't really feel like government forcing Lightning -> USB-C was really worth it, if we were forcing a change I'd have preferred it at least going to something really thought through, ground shifting, and future proof forever like an optical hybrid. I think (I sure hope!) USB-C isn't "the end of history" in terms of peripheral connectors. But it's also all water under the dam at this point, and younger me may have been less grumpy, not like I haven't seen lots and lots (and lots)^n of connectors come and go over the decades already.
- ghaff 3y ago
  I pretty much agree with all that. I'm not doing high-fives about the shift to USB-C because as a long-time Apple phone (and other Apple products) customer I'm perfectly happy with the existing Lightning ports. But the shift is also sort of inevitable European regulators or not and everyone knew it was coming. And Apple have never been ones to maintain legacy interfaces even in devices less space constrained than a phone. (e.g. would it have killed them to maintain a USB-A port in a MacBook Pro?) But here we are.
- zuminator 3y ago

deleted 3y ago

[deleted]

ejstronge 3y ago

> So long and sooner into the landfill for a thermal camera, higher end environmental noise monitoring microphone, decent wrap around game controller pad, etc, and repurchasing all of the above. This must be some of that "reducing ewaste" and "saving us money" thing I've heard so much about on HN. Yay. These peripherals had lightning ports in them? You can't use a USB-C - Lightning cable and continue using them??

discussDev 3y ago
While a small percentage of people will have things that can't be used, my IR camera also connects directly to the phone bottom and you specify what port you want when you buy it as it is flush with the phone. For most people however I doubt it will be an issue.
foobarian 3y ago
Or, you know, don't get the 15 for 5 years or so.

gnicholas 3y ago

There was a certain irony that they spent so much time talking about their environmental progress (the video with Mother Nature was riduculous, IMO), and then slid in the USB-C bit without mentioning the environmental impact of ditching the lightning connector.

toast0 3y ago
I'm sure the environmental impact of ditching lightning is mixed. On the plus side, long term, having everyone on the same connector is good in lots of ways. In the short term, it's disruptive. It also makes it easier to switch between platforms or live in a multi-platform household; this is good for people, and might be good for Apple or might not. There's a reason Apple waited 10 years to change on iPhones, even though they switched to USB-C on other products. They could have potentially had both ports, but nobody seems to want to put two ports on phones, and Apple is not one to put an old and new thing together.
nerpderp82 3y ago
USB-C should have been the lightning connector, it is a better connector than USB-C.
- Dork1234 3y ago
  USB-C came out after lighting connector, 30 pin connector was at the end of the life when it came out. Apple didn't have a good choice.
  - nerpderp82 3y ago
    USB-C should have been the paddle style lightning connector. I am not saying that Apple should have used USB-C, I am saying that the physical connector for USB-C should have been the paddle style of lightning.
- Dylan16807 3y ago
  Lightning seems to have some physical issues with power delivery, and I haven't seen the size difference matter for anything bigger than earbuds.

buildbot 3y ago

<snark> People complain for 11 years that they used lightning, now of course, we can complain that Apple has created a bunch of e-waste. Wins for everyone who loves to complain! </snark> This is the reason Apple waited 11 years - to reduce the impact. Plus, there will be adapters.

ninkendo 3y ago
Every year they waited is another year for more lightning peripherals to get bought and become future e-waste. They should have done this far sooner, the moment it became "inevitable" (ie. when they started moving all their other devices to it.)
NickC25 3y ago
I think it's more that Apple had the money to ignore the EU regulators for 11 years, rather than wanting to reduce the environmental impact of their chargers. They were pissed that the EU doesn't bend to the will of corporations like the US does, so they dragged their feet for over a decade.
- mercutio2 3y ago
  USB-C has only existed for 9 years. Apple has not been ignoring EU regulators for 11 years.
  - Nullabillity 3y ago
    They were ignoring Micro-USB long before that.
    - buildbot 3y ago
      Micro-usb really sucked though. I had several android phones that had broken micro-usb ports. Lightning is actually a really nice connector design, despite the hate.
Dylan16807 3y ago

xattt 3y ago

I can’t believe also Apple announced that Tim Cook himself will go into peoples’ homes to rip out existing devices from their hands. /s

yohannparis 3y ago

Or don't throw away your iPhone with lightning! I'm sure the iPhone SE and 14 are still for sell for a couple of years. So unless you want a brand new iPhone every year, then your argument is nill.