7 ms·

Still running a M1 Air 13“, now into my third job since, and refusing to bother with company provided computers. Still feeling as great as 3 years ago… will onl

Still running a M1 Air 13“, now into my third job since, and refusing to bother with company provided computers. Still feeling as great as 3 years ago… will only upgrade if the next gen is substantially better (read: not just %faster somewhere). Can comfortably develop on my lap for a full day if needed, only MS Teams draws power like crazy, but apart from that 8 hours+. Best computer I ever had I think.

matsemann 3y ago
I'm a bit confused by the "still". How often would you expect to upgrade hardware? Keeping a computer for three years is completely normal for most people.
- edu 3y ago
  True… here I’m going wondering if it’s time to upgrade my 2017 MacBook Pro because a couple of keys started to fail and I’m having a hard time…
  - bombolo 3y ago
    A thinkpad keyboard replacement cost ~50$ last time I needed it (and I thought it was unreasonably expensive).
  - aktuel 3y ago
    I am using my Dell XPS 13 now for almost ten years. Still works perfectly.
    - melling 3y ago
      I have a 10 year old MacBook Pro that works perfectly too. Unfortunately, Apple doesn’t allow OS upgrades. I’ll probably get an M3 and use it for 8-10 years.
      - shujito 3y ago
        Ever tried OCLP [1]? It allows for patched MacOS installs on officially unsupported Apple hardware. [1] https://dortania.github.io/OpenCore-Legacy-Patcher/ https://dortania.github.io/OpenCore-Legacy-Patcher/
      - deleted 3y ago
        [deleted]
      - psd1 3y ago
        Thinkpad x220 checking in, still rocking my Sandy Lake and still enjoying a real keyboard. It's about 12 now. Other laptops have come and gone. I couldn't live with my macbook m1. I hated the keyboard and the desktop - why is there no delete key, pray? UTM crashed a lot. Asahi was lovely but I just didn't like touching the hardware.
        camgunz 3y ago
        I got my M1 Max MBP 14" at the end of 2021 (so almost 2 years ago now) and my previous machine was an X220. The main reasons I switched were: - I was a consultant/contractor, and sometimes you have to run software you really don't want to (Citrix, Teams). You can kind of do this on Linux w/ emulation, but on an older machine it's painful. - Can't drive a 4k monitor at 60fps - 1366x768 is hard to webdev on I also had a multi-machine setup so like, a Chromebook for being spied on, a Windows machine for gaming, and an air-gapped Windows machine for music production. My partner and I had decided to move abroad and it felt like a little much to bring 4 laptops over, so I reluctantly consolidated. In truth the only thing I really gave up was acquiescing to being spied on, but at this point that's more because I haven't set up a pi-hole (etc.) than anything. I do miss (Arch) Linux, and obviously the X220 input system is unparalleled, but I'll say that I'm pretty accustomed to the MBP input system now (I learned Fn-Delete is actual delete, which actually improved my life significantly). I probably lost ~30WPM (I'm around 100-150WPM on a good keyboard) and it's definitely a worse ergonomic experience to have to leave home row to use the trackpad (you're telling me you want me to stretch my ulnar nerve even more?). There are other niceties. My partner can airdrop me things. I can load truly ridiculous Excel spreadsheets. I can move my music production onto it. I can stream both an Snes9x emulator window and a webcam grab through OBS to game w/ my brother in the states. Glossy screens on laptops don't make any sense to me though. The argument is you get better color reproduction, but there are great matte screens that do that (I have a 32" matte display with 100% AdobeRGB that proves it), and besides that, I bet if the difference matters to you you've got a high performance glossy screen on your desk in an office with controlled lighting. Laptops go places! Sometimes they're sunny! Matte screens please!
  - GhostWhisperer 3y ago
    you're changing architecture, and memory and storage speed in one go; i think you're going to like it
  - lawgimenez 3y ago
    This year I upgraded from MBP 2015 to M2. I am still bothered by the notch on the M2.
    - satvikpendem 3y ago
      I use a completely black background, I forget the notch exists plus I save a bit of battery.
      - bombcar 3y ago
        This is the way, or have an external monitor as your main monitor. Or have four external monitors; the reason I had to wait for the M1 Pro.
- NooneAtAll3 3y ago
  it's Apple customer we're talking here...
- tomr75 3y ago
  I upgrade every 2-3 years. Although current device is first macbook so maybe i'll break that (+ an M1)
  - StackOverlord 3y ago
    I upgrade my macbook once per decade. I changed the battery, the ssd and the bluetooth card about 6 month ago (8 years into owning my second macbook). I need to change the screen (1 cm black strip on the left because of a shock) and the speakers are broken. Anyone has a tip for replacing the screen cheaply ? I spotted some going for 30$ on Aliexpress, it looked like the seller had a rather important stock.
- rejectfinite 3y ago
  True, I am using my 2014 desktop and my work PC is from 2020. Totally normal...
- rickette 3y ago
  So true, 4-5 years seems reasonable to me, 3 years isn't much
- anonyfox 3y ago
  Lower-end consumer laptops (think: Acer, Asus, ...) tend to fall apart after a year, this is what I was starting out with in university being rather poor. Now its more like: the current device has zero issues, but the newer available models look increasingly tempting for my inner child to play with. Also I owe my career, salary and life situation basically to open source (so I donate regularly) and ... apple computers that work flawlessly in many situations other laptops would be dead already or require me to tinker with stuff instead of doing billable things.
ThrowAway1922A 3y ago
What do you mean still? They’re only a few years old at this point. It shouldn’t be impressive that a basically new computer still does everything that one would want to do.
- licebmi__at__ 3y ago
  Not OP, but I can describe a similar experience. Still feels better than brand new $current-year non m1 laptops.
- darthrupert 3y ago
  It’s not a great thing, but most companies supply employees new laptops every 3 years if they want to keep those employees.
  - GhostWhisperer 3y ago
    is it rare the decommissioned machines are given back to the employee after cleanup?
    - darthrupert 3y ago
      Depends on how the computers were procured. Leasing deals won’t allow that, for instance.
    - gvurrdon 3y ago
      My org insists that the disks of all obsolete machines are destroyed and the rest of the hardware sent for disposal. I have a few systems that could be wiped and given away for charity but that’s not allowed. This seems incredibly wasteful to me.
      - GhostWhisperer 3y ago
        seems a lot of orgs work on cargo-cult knowledge https://twitter.com/SwiftOnSecurity/status/568915862003933184 https://twitter.com/SwiftOnSecurity/status/56891586200393318... (2015) https://twitter.com/SwiftOnSecurity/status/1191771345362796544 https://twitter.com/SwiftOnSecurity/status/11917713453627965... (2019) i think swift had another post about it a bit more recently but i cannot find it now if you encrypt the disk at the os level, you only need to throw away the keys, ie: reformat the drive. no need to physically erase as what is store is just noise once the keys are gone.
dmz73 3y ago
The main problem with devices like Apple's Mx series laptops is that everything works fine...until it doesn't. This device is non-repairable and non-upgradeable as far as CPU, RAM and disk are concerned. Now people may claim that Apple hardware is superior to other manufacturers and that it will last longer. So far I have found that to be false, I have more old non-Apple hardware that is still working fine and few Apple devices that can no longer be used as Apple devices but at least I was able to replace failed hard drives on them. Similarly, people will claim that Apple's superior hardware is the reason for their inflated prices but I have also found that to be false...it is the Apple's perceived value that is driving those prices. Apple users will actually pay more for second hand devices that what they would for new Apple devices. I saw this just recently on ebay where I followed a few auctions and the ending price for 2nd hand Mx laptop was higher that what I would pay for newer model in the store. Madness.
- sneak 3y ago
  > The main problem with devices like Apple's Mx series laptops is that everything works fine...until it doesn't. This device is non-repairable and non-upgradeable as far as CPU, RAM and disk are concerned. Given inflation, the Macbook Airs are pretty crazy cheap. If they break you can just replace them. The base base low end M1 Air is only $1000 last I looked (and another $100 off for those in education). They're some of the best price:perf in a laptop the world has ever seen. "inflated prices" is not an accurate description of an $899 retina M1.
  - Iulioh 3y ago
    The base model price is a little misleading. 256 and 8 gb are lowkey unusable for anything but a Facebook machine . I always look at the price for the 16/500 or 16/1t machine as the reference point
    - dave84 3y ago
      That’s not true at all. Have you actually used one? Edit: obviously if you need a windows vm you’re out of luck at 8gb ram
rejectfinite 3y ago
>and refusing to bother with company provided computers To you and people that do this: Do you enroll your personal PC in the companies MDM like intune or Jamf? Do you install their endpoint protection/antivirus/EDR/MDR? or you just leave it unmanaged?
- bdavbdav 3y ago
  Was wondering the same thing - going through a tech audit at the moment for ISO and that certainly wouldn’t fly, unless we were able to prove that we effectively treated it like we owned it.
- anonyfox 3y ago
  Working at companies without strict audits, and previously at bigger corps that had audits we established parallel networks for developers. Either way, BYOD was possible after all. Also I insist on not having security based on VPN/VPC only, but treat every service as if (and often has) direct internet connections, so devs are _forced_ to think about security from day 1.

matsemann 3y ago

I'm a bit confused by the "still". How often would you expect to upgrade hardware? Keeping a computer for three years is completely normal for most people.

edu 3y ago
True… here I’m going wondering if it’s time to upgrade my 2017 MacBook Pro because a couple of keys started to fail and I’m having a hard time…
- bombolo 3y ago
  A thinkpad keyboard replacement cost ~50$ last time I needed it (and I thought it was unreasonably expensive).
- aktuel 3y ago
  I am using my Dell XPS 13 now for almost ten years. Still works perfectly.
  - melling 3y ago
    I have a 10 year old MacBook Pro that works perfectly too. Unfortunately, Apple doesn’t allow OS upgrades. I’ll probably get an M3 and use it for 8-10 years.
    - shujito 3y ago
      Ever tried OCLP [1]? It allows for patched MacOS installs on officially unsupported Apple hardware. [1] https://dortania.github.io/OpenCore-Legacy-Patcher/ https://dortania.github.io/OpenCore-Legacy-Patcher/
    - deleted 3y ago
      [deleted]
    - psd1 3y ago
      Thinkpad x220 checking in, still rocking my Sandy Lake and still enjoying a real keyboard. It's about 12 now. Other laptops have come and gone. I couldn't live with my macbook m1. I hated the keyboard and the desktop - why is there no delete key, pray? UTM crashed a lot. Asahi was lovely but I just didn't like touching the hardware.
      - camgunz 3y ago
        I got my M1 Max MBP 14" at the end of 2021 (so almost 2 years ago now) and my previous machine was an X220. The main reasons I switched were: - I was a consultant/contractor, and sometimes you have to run software you really don't want to (Citrix, Teams). You can kind of do this on Linux w/ emulation, but on an older machine it's painful. - Can't drive a 4k monitor at 60fps - 1366x768 is hard to webdev on I also had a multi-machine setup so like, a Chromebook for being spied on, a Windows machine for gaming, and an air-gapped Windows machine for music production. My partner and I had decided to move abroad and it felt like a little much to bring 4 laptops over, so I reluctantly consolidated. In truth the only thing I really gave up was acquiescing to being spied on, but at this point that's more because I haven't set up a pi-hole (etc.) than anything. I do miss (Arch) Linux, and obviously the X220 input system is unparalleled, but I'll say that I'm pretty accustomed to the MBP input system now (I learned Fn-Delete is actual delete, which actually improved my life significantly). I probably lost ~30WPM (I'm around 100-150WPM on a good keyboard) and it's definitely a worse ergonomic experience to have to leave home row to use the trackpad (you're telling me you want me to stretch my ulnar nerve even more?). There are other niceties. My partner can airdrop me things. I can load truly ridiculous Excel spreadsheets. I can move my music production onto it. I can stream both an Snes9x emulator window and a webcam grab through OBS to game w/ my brother in the states. Glossy screens on laptops don't make any sense to me though. The argument is you get better color reproduction, but there are great matte screens that do that (I have a 32" matte display with 100% AdobeRGB that proves it), and besides that, I bet if the difference matters to you you've got a high performance glossy screen on your desk in an office with controlled lighting. Laptops go places! Sometimes they're sunny! Matte screens please!
- GhostWhisperer 3y ago
  you're changing architecture, and memory and storage speed in one go; i think you're going to like it
- lawgimenez 3y ago
  This year I upgraded from MBP 2015 to M2. I am still bothered by the notch on the M2.
  - satvikpendem 3y ago
    I use a completely black background, I forget the notch exists plus I save a bit of battery.
    - bombcar 3y ago
      This is the way, or have an external monitor as your main monitor. Or have four external monitors; the reason I had to wait for the M1 Pro.
NooneAtAll3 3y ago
it's Apple customer we're talking here...
tomr75 3y ago
I upgrade every 2-3 years. Although current device is first macbook so maybe i'll break that (+ an M1)
- StackOverlord 3y ago
  I upgrade my macbook once per decade. I changed the battery, the ssd and the bluetooth card about 6 month ago (8 years into owning my second macbook). I need to change the screen (1 cm black strip on the left because of a shock) and the speakers are broken. Anyone has a tip for replacing the screen cheaply ? I spotted some going for 30$ on Aliexpress, it looked like the seller had a rather important stock.
rejectfinite 3y ago
True, I am using my 2014 desktop and my work PC is from 2020. Totally normal...
rickette 3y ago
So true, 4-5 years seems reasonable to me, 3 years isn't much
anonyfox 3y ago
Lower-end consumer laptops (think: Acer, Asus, ...) tend to fall apart after a year, this is what I was starting out with in university being rather poor. Now its more like: the current device has zero issues, but the newer available models look increasingly tempting for my inner child to play with. Also I owe my career, salary and life situation basically to open source (so I donate regularly) and ... apple computers that work flawlessly in many situations other laptops would be dead already or require me to tinker with stuff instead of doing billable things.

ThrowAway1922A 3y ago

What do you mean still? They’re only a few years old at this point. It shouldn’t be impressive that a basically new computer still does everything that one would want to do.

licebmi__at__ 3y ago
Not OP, but I can describe a similar experience. Still feels better than brand new $current-year non m1 laptops.
darthrupert 3y ago
It’s not a great thing, but most companies supply employees new laptops every 3 years if they want to keep those employees.
- GhostWhisperer 3y ago
  is it rare the decommissioned machines are given back to the employee after cleanup?
  - darthrupert 3y ago
    Depends on how the computers were procured. Leasing deals won’t allow that, for instance.
  - gvurrdon 3y ago
    My org insists that the disks of all obsolete machines are destroyed and the rest of the hardware sent for disposal. I have a few systems that could be wiped and given away for charity but that’s not allowed. This seems incredibly wasteful to me.
    - GhostWhisperer 3y ago
      seems a lot of orgs work on cargo-cult knowledge https://twitter.com/SwiftOnSecurity/status/568915862003933184 https://twitter.com/SwiftOnSecurity/status/56891586200393318... (2015) https://twitter.com/SwiftOnSecurity/status/1191771345362796544 https://twitter.com/SwiftOnSecurity/status/11917713453627965... (2019) i think swift had another post about it a bit more recently but i cannot find it now if you encrypt the disk at the os level, you only need to throw away the keys, ie: reformat the drive. no need to physically erase as what is store is just noise once the keys are gone.

dmz73 3y ago

The main problem with devices like Apple's Mx series laptops is that everything works fine...until it doesn't. This device is non-repairable and non-upgradeable as far as CPU, RAM and disk are concerned. Now people may claim that Apple hardware is superior to other manufacturers and that it will last longer. So far I have found that to be false, I have more old non-Apple hardware that is still working fine and few Apple devices that can no longer be used as Apple devices but at least I was able to replace failed hard drives on them. Similarly, people will claim that Apple's superior hardware is the reason for their inflated prices but I have also found that to be false...it is the Apple's perceived value that is driving those prices. Apple users will actually pay more for second hand devices that what they would for new Apple devices. I saw this just recently on ebay where I followed a few auctions and the ending price for 2nd hand Mx laptop was higher that what I would pay for newer model in the store. Madness.

sneak 3y ago
> The main problem with devices like Apple's Mx series laptops is that everything works fine...until it doesn't. This device is non-repairable and non-upgradeable as far as CPU, RAM and disk are concerned. Given inflation, the Macbook Airs are pretty crazy cheap. If they break you can just replace them. The base base low end M1 Air is only $1000 last I looked (and another $100 off for those in education). They're some of the best price:perf in a laptop the world has ever seen. "inflated prices" is not an accurate description of an $899 retina M1.
- Iulioh 3y ago
  The base model price is a little misleading. 256 and 8 gb are lowkey unusable for anything but a Facebook machine . I always look at the price for the 16/500 or 16/1t machine as the reference point
  - dave84 3y ago
    That’s not true at all. Have you actually used one? Edit: obviously if you need a windows vm you’re out of luck at 8gb ram

rejectfinite 3y ago

>and refusing to bother with company provided computers To you and people that do this: Do you enroll your personal PC in the companies MDM like intune or Jamf? Do you install their endpoint protection/antivirus/EDR/MDR? or you just leave it unmanaged?

bdavbdav 3y ago
Was wondering the same thing - going through a tech audit at the moment for ISO and that certainly wouldn’t fly, unless we were able to prove that we effectively treated it like we owned it.
anonyfox 3y ago
Working at companies without strict audits, and previously at bigger corps that had audits we established parallel networks for developers. Either way, BYOD was possible after all. Also I insist on not having security based on VPN/VPC only, but treat every service as if (and often has) direct internet connections, so devs are _forced_ to think about security from day 1.