17 ms·

Along with (hopefully) that french startup (Mistral) founded by the LLaMA guys, the EU is putting together the pieces they need to keep up with AI and maintain

Along with (hopefully) that french startup (Mistral) founded by the LLaMA guys, the EU is putting together the pieces they need to keep up with AI and maintain their ability to leverage their control mechanisms upon the FAANGS. Realpolitk wise they absolutely cannot risk regulatory capture to a few select firms on the west coast of the USA. Altman himself threatened (for a brief period) to cut off GPT to the EU after Italy rightfully brought up issues with data privacy. Microsoft made him walk that one back real quick - he probably wasn't really aware that he is now one of their employees - but it hopefully got through to Brussels about how these guys want to operate. We'll also probably get a lot better support for languges which aren't english (especially French, I really love their stubborn nature to stick with their langauge over the anglo one), an entire other scary effect of LLMs is the potential to accelerate language death Very nice to see.

Nux 3y ago
I think AI is an afterthought here, if at all. Automotive is the main target and to a degree IoT. They couldn't build cars during the pandemic due to broken supply chains, that's when their lightbulb went on afaik.
- berkes 3y ago
  But isn't a lot of modern automotive all about ai? Stuff like image recognition on camera's and sensors, error prediction, data-aggregation and, in future, self-driving?
  - qwytw 3y ago
    You're not going to run that AI on chips made in fab which will be already outdated by 15+ years when it's opened.
  - arlcode 3y ago
    Not really. Most tasks in a car do not run on high speed cutting edge chips. A few random examples: - adjusting your side mirrors - the control of the AC cooling unit and speed of the fans - electronically adjustable seats - parking sensors (the beeping kind) - wiper controls - engine controls (ice or BV) - inverter (BV) All of those require electronics most require a microcontroller but not the latest 3nm Snapdragon.
  - martin8412 3y ago
    Most of the stuff in a car could run on a 6502. The rest will run on something akin to the NXP i.MX8. Not at all cutting edge, but more than sufficient. It is more than fast enough to process input from sensors and it has hardware support for video.
    - parl_match 3y ago
      eh, modern ECUs, accident compute, etc are doing timing and tuning calculations in real time such that you need something a little more adequate. A 40mhz PowerPC CPU with an FPU, for example. Aside from mandatory ADAS, most cars can definitely get away with "90s tech" but probably not "80s tech"
      - martin8412 3y ago
        The 6502 in my argument was meant for something like controlling seats or mirrors. The ECU obviously needs more compute power. That said 6502 was an over exaggeration.
        parl_match 3y ago
        fwiw modern car buses have signing and authentication - using a shared bus significantly lowers car weight and increases reliability, but also introduces security challenges. signing operations are too expensive for a 6502
croes 3y ago
The fab is supposed to supply mainly the automotive industry, who made the mistake of cancelling their orders during Corona and were then surprised to find that the capacities were allocated elsewhere when they wanted to order again. They will still have the same problem, but they don't think that far ahead.
- r0b1n 3y ago
  It isn't even thinking ahead. It is pure, plain and simple arrogance, of the most despicable and stupid kind. The German auto producers are used to be able to strong-arm politicians and their suppliers. What they say goes, because usually they can threaten whole regions with unemployment and whole companies (the ones that produce car-parts such as seat cushions or engine parts mostly/only) with bankruptcy. Don't want to accept a mandatory 20% price reduction mid-contract? We'll just delay payment until you do, good luck surviving long enough for the courts to recognize your claim... With chip makers, it is different, because chips can be used in lots of different products and there is lots of demand from all corners. So car makers tried their usual strong-arm tactics and failed miserably. Chips being a sellers market, after all. After which car makers went whining to their politician puppets, getting them to OK billions in subsidies for "supply chain security".
  - ferongr 3y ago
    I don't know why this is downvoted but it's more or less correct regarding the industry here in Europe.
  - thenaturalist 3y ago
    The nice thing about this situation and one that is not appreciated by enough people in the economy is that it's not a zero sum game. Two things can be true at the same time!
  - croes 3y ago
    Yes, the german automotive industry is used to extort and exploit their suppliers. It must have been a shocking experience for them that chip manufacturers have alternative buyers.
sho_hn 3y ago
Aren't LLMs potentially great to ward off language death due to their significant abilities to transpose ideas into different languages?
- dontupvoteme 3y ago
  I admit that I talk to it in English the most (as it's my native tongue) but I had read here that it has gotten noticeably worse in other languages, even making grammar mistakes in linguistically-close-to-english-and-sufficently-present-in-training-data western european languages like German or French. I do enjoy translating things into Sindarian or other conglangs from literature though. I had a theory that giving it the custom instructions in latin might give better results, but i haven't had time to figure out how to benchmark something that's so non-deterministic and black-boxy
- oblio 3y ago
  > Aren't LLMs potentially great to ward off language death due to their significant abilities to transpose ideas into different languages? What do you mean?
  - berkes 3y ago
    Not GP, but in my case, I find my conversations with ChatGPT or Copilot often being in my native language. Whereas with Google, official docs, and StackExchage it's only and always English. Obviously, the code I write in the end is English. But explaining a domain in a native language - especially when that domain embeds cultural things - helps a lot. For example, there's a massive difference between "add_high_VAT()" in a Dutch Context from a US context. Even add_VAT(lookup_VAT("FR", "low")) demands quite some domain-knowledge about EU tax system. Which I can express in English, but is much easier in my native language.
enigma20 3y ago
Why would be the language death bad. Imho, from practical point of view it doesn't make sense to have multiple languages, or?
- dontupvoteme 3y ago
  Language is culture, and if the sapir-whorf hypothesis holds, different languages are literally different methods of thinking. there are also other potential benefits, e.g. "the" in english gives little information about what noun may follow. "die/das/der" in general cut the probability space to a third.
  - kmlx 3y ago
    > "the" in english gives little information about what noun may follow for us non-native english speakers, this is an understated blessing.
  - Brusco_RF 3y ago
    When speakers of a dying language learn a dominant one they don't lose their way of thinking, rather they adapt the dominant language to their needs. In this way the dominant language evolves. It's why there are ~180k english words but only 1200 Sindarian words. While I agree that cultural loss is tragic, consider that it is inevitable. Homo Sapiens have existed for ~200,000 years. We only have SOME traces of SOME cultures for say 10k of those years. So from that lens, the vast majority of human culture has already been lost.
- gostsamo 3y ago
  Kids cannot use foreign language tools to their full abilities. However, if ChatGPT is good for english only, it might stimulate some competition for providing similar service in the local language. I won't mind it, tbh.
- fomine3 3y ago
  imperialism
- scythe 3y ago
tuyiown 3y ago
> I really love their stubborn nature to stick with their langauge over the anglo one I think you're talking about the Québécois, because the french around here are swimming in a sea of _épouvantable_ mix of french and english words. But as afterthought you're still quite right, this mix usage is sliding downhill from ill inspired managers to general low class now.
bboygravity 3y ago
Just weird to me that they build in Germany. Germany basically pressed "delete" on (clean) energy for the coming decades and has very little capacity to seriously expand their energy conversion.
- j-pb 3y ago
  Germany has build more PV capacity in the last three years than the total nuclear capacity it ever build, and the numbers are increasing thanks to regulatory cutbacks by the current government. Meanwhile new nuclear reactors cost 4 times as much as renewables and take decades to build. So stop spreading FUD.
  - cpursley 3y ago
    What are the actual numbers? Is PV reliable as nuclear? As cheap as piped natural gas? Can VW build a profitable car and Bosch a washing machine at those rates (vs very strong competitors like South Korea)? Because that’s what keeps the German economy humming (and the EU together).
    - t43562 3y ago
      VW is using renewables for building it's EVs.
      - cpursley 3y ago
        Best of luck to them, they're gonna need it.
        knallfrosch 3y ago
        What would it even take to change your mind lmao
        cpursley 3y ago
        Healthy numbers. If people aren’t buying VW vehicles because the prices are higher than Hyundai due to the energy situation, that’s not good. Germany is deindustrializing as we speak (chemicals, auto and auto related, etc). Once you deindustrialize past a certain threshold, it’s very difficult to come back.
kmlx 3y ago
> putting together the pieces they need to keep up with AI and maintain their ability to leverage their control mechanisms upon the FAANGS. from the press release itself: > ESMC marks a significant step towards construction of a 300mm fab to support the future capacity needs of the fast-growing automotive and industrial sectors, with the final investment decision pending confirmation of the level of public funding for this project. it's a 300mm fab. > Realpolitk wise they absolutely cannot risk regulatory capture to a few select firms on the west coast of the USA. not only is this 40 years too late, but the press release itself contradicts this comment.
- pgeorgi 3y ago
  > it's a 300mm fab. 300mm wafer diameter, yes. That's state of the art, with some vendors looking at 450mm with little to show for now.
- oytis 3y ago
  > it's a 300mm fab. 300mm is larger than a vacuum tube!
ablated_maquis 3y ago
> "The planned fab ... [is expected to produce] wafers on TSMC’s 28/22 nanometer planar CMOS and 16/12 nanometer FinFET process technology" These are not leading node semiconductors that will be used for training AI. These are commodity chips that will be used in the automotive industry.
nottorp 3y ago
What does a low tech (for chips) chip fab have with AI?
- FirmwareBurner 3y ago
  Nothing, it's just hopium from people who haven't read the article, fishing for upvotes.
coliveira 3y ago
That's not the only issue. TSMC has a big problem in creating fabs in the US, which is the lack of talent in sufficient numbers for the project to be successful, and the very high cost of existing talent. No surprise that they're delaying the US fab and going ahead with plants in Germany, where there is less expensive specialized labor.
onlyrealcuzzo 3y ago
> Altman himself threatened (for a brief period) to cut off GPT to the EU after Italy rightfully brought up issues with data privacy. This wouldn't be a big deal. GPT is not some one-of-a-kind leaps-and-bounds ahead of everyone else ground-breaking technology.
- hospitalJail 3y ago
  Still in denial? I have a hard time understanding the people who visit this website and havent used the technology.
  - throwaway1777 3y ago
    Still have a hard time understanding people who refuse to look at the data and benchmarks myself. Chatgpt was a game changer and let the cat out of the bag, but it’s not far ahead anymore.
  - onlyrealcuzzo 3y ago
    The people most hyped on GPT are the people who see the potential for it if it continues to get exponentially better - which Altman himself pretty much said it won't.
    - adventured 3y ago
      > GPT is not some one-of-a-kind leaps-and-bounds ahead of everyone else ground-breaking technology. GPT 3 and 4 were already exactly that, leaps and bounds ahead of everybody else. GPT 4 shocked the connected planet and massively disrupted plans across the tech industry globally. Version 4 has been every bit as disruptive as the iPhone (which completely altered the trajectory of the phone & mobile markets). It has been talked about from coast to coast across the globe non-stop since its release. Covered endlessly by every major media outlet in the West. GPT this, AI that, non-stop since V4 sparked enormous consumer attention and debate. It has dozens of major companies and open source groups desperately attempting to copy it or catch up to it. It has governments terrified of AI and attempting to quickly place regulations to control it. It has programmers - one of the elite, highest paying professions in the world - running scared that half the software development jobs in the industry are going away in the next decade (they are). 1.3 million software developers in the US earning a median of $115,000 before benefits ($200+ billion in total annual compensation for that employee pool). Half of those jobs, at a minimum, will be eliminated by this type of AI, and it was GPT 4 that made it clear it was not just a far-off premise. Its the first highly potent consumer AI product. Over one hundred million people quickly signed up to use it. There hasn't been anything remotely close to it so far (Siri and Alexa have been barely useful jokes by comparison). The same people that like to pretend Tesla didn't spark the electric car revolution, and like to pretend Apple didn't spark the smartphone revolution, like to pretend OpenAI didn't just set off a revolution in AI.
zpeti 3y ago
Is the EU marketing budget now doing sponsored posting on HN? What the hell is this comment? It’s completely wrong on facts yet full of quasi praise for eu politics
llm_nerd 3y ago
The fab is for chips that are something along the lines of 4 generations old, and that's ignoring that they won't start manufacturing until 2027... This has absolutely nothing to do with AI or LLMs. Generally these are automation chips for machinery or vehicles. "Microsoft made him walk that one back real quick" This sounds like a weird fan fiction. OpenAI openly negotiates with EU governments. No one walked back anything.
- posterboy 3y ago
  Suppose you need automation for machinery in a cutting edge fab, that would be much further in the future? They could ship from Taiwan, so the idea that this is a back up does not sound entirely wrong. Sounds like fan-fiction, too, true enough. AMD is already there and Intel is building in Lower Saxony. Must be something about the region, perhaps the chemistry since the Erzgebirge has a history in mining. Meisner Porcelain for example beat Venice and replaced good old China (pun intended). > No one walked back anything. I'm not sure about that (haven't heard this story). My impression is that EU sticks to discretion very much, and they aren't free from corruption. The US on the other hand is not known to play nice with matters of law in international affairs (Edit: shouldn't have said "international law"). Taiwan is a partner was the point, I believe. Of course they aren't going to give away the crown jewels either.
  - logifail 3y ago
    > Must be something about the region [snip] Following Occam's razor, perhaps it's that it's just cheaper? "The monthly pay ranking of German states is headed by Hamburg with 3,619 euros, followed by Baden-Württemberg with 3,546 euros and Hesse with 3,494 euros. The lowest salaries are received by employees in Mecklenburg-Western Pomerania with an average of 2,391 euros. Slightly more is earned in Thuringia with 2,459 euros and Saxony with 2,479 euros."[0] [0] https://www.deutschland.de/en/topic/business/pay-in-germany-national-average-and-regional-differences https://www.deutschland.de/en/topic/business/pay-in-germany-...
    - posterboy 3y ago
nabakin 3y ago
> Microsoft made him walk that one back real quick - he probably wasn't really aware that he is now one of their employees Source?
dna_polymerase 3y ago
> Along with (hopefully) that french startup (Mistral) founded by the LLaMA guys, the EU is putting together the pieces they need to keep up with AI and maintain their ability to leverage their control mechanisms upon the FAANGS. These nodes are generations old and basically only in use in German cars with their abysmal 'software'. The only touching point these processors will ever have with AI is as an API endpoint to Google Voice or Siri. Moreover, Mistral was widely seen as a joke and testimony to the catastrophic state European tech is in. Europe is done. I have no idea why they rushed to regulate anything. In the end the U.S. startups will tell us what to do. Europe is a joke.
- martin8412 3y ago
  What abysmal software? The software in my VW is more than adequate. Not that I see what interest I'd have in any kind of AI in my car. Yes, these chips are for automotive and industrial use, what's the problem? Those are both important use cases. You may think Europe is done, but who makes the EUV lithography machines used for TSMCs' cutting edge nodes? Who makes the leading ERP system used by a lot of companies around the world? Where was the Chrome V8 JavaScript engine developed? The point is, Europe has plenty of innovation. But unlike the US, people don't go around boasting every chance they get. People just do stuff and are happy with that.

Nux 3y ago

I think AI is an afterthought here, if at all. Automotive is the main target and to a degree IoT. They couldn't build cars during the pandemic due to broken supply chains, that's when their lightbulb went on afaik.

berkes 3y ago
But isn't a lot of modern automotive all about ai? Stuff like image recognition on camera's and sensors, error prediction, data-aggregation and, in future, self-driving?
- qwytw 3y ago
  You're not going to run that AI on chips made in fab which will be already outdated by 15+ years when it's opened.
- arlcode 3y ago
  Not really. Most tasks in a car do not run on high speed cutting edge chips. A few random examples: - adjusting your side mirrors - the control of the AC cooling unit and speed of the fans - electronically adjustable seats - parking sensors (the beeping kind) - wiper controls - engine controls (ice or BV) - inverter (BV) All of those require electronics most require a microcontroller but not the latest 3nm Snapdragon.
- martin8412 3y ago
  Most of the stuff in a car could run on a 6502. The rest will run on something akin to the NXP i.MX8. Not at all cutting edge, but more than sufficient. It is more than fast enough to process input from sensors and it has hardware support for video.
  - parl_match 3y ago
    eh, modern ECUs, accident compute, etc are doing timing and tuning calculations in real time such that you need something a little more adequate. A 40mhz PowerPC CPU with an FPU, for example. Aside from mandatory ADAS, most cars can definitely get away with "90s tech" but probably not "80s tech"
    - martin8412 3y ago
      The 6502 in my argument was meant for something like controlling seats or mirrors. The ECU obviously needs more compute power. That said 6502 was an over exaggeration.
      - parl_match 3y ago
        fwiw modern car buses have signing and authentication - using a shared bus significantly lowers car weight and increases reliability, but also introduces security challenges. signing operations are too expensive for a 6502

croes 3y ago

The fab is supposed to supply mainly the automotive industry, who made the mistake of cancelling their orders during Corona and were then surprised to find that the capacities were allocated elsewhere when they wanted to order again. They will still have the same problem, but they don't think that far ahead.

r0b1n 3y ago
It isn't even thinking ahead. It is pure, plain and simple arrogance, of the most despicable and stupid kind. The German auto producers are used to be able to strong-arm politicians and their suppliers. What they say goes, because usually they can threaten whole regions with unemployment and whole companies (the ones that produce car-parts such as seat cushions or engine parts mostly/only) with bankruptcy. Don't want to accept a mandatory 20% price reduction mid-contract? We'll just delay payment until you do, good luck surviving long enough for the courts to recognize your claim... With chip makers, it is different, because chips can be used in lots of different products and there is lots of demand from all corners. So car makers tried their usual strong-arm tactics and failed miserably. Chips being a sellers market, after all. After which car makers went whining to their politician puppets, getting them to OK billions in subsidies for "supply chain security".
- ferongr 3y ago
  I don't know why this is downvoted but it's more or less correct regarding the industry here in Europe.
- thenaturalist 3y ago
  The nice thing about this situation and one that is not appreciated by enough people in the economy is that it's not a zero sum game. Two things can be true at the same time!
- croes 3y ago
  Yes, the german automotive industry is used to extort and exploit their suppliers. It must have been a shocking experience for them that chip manufacturers have alternative buyers.

sho_hn 3y ago

Aren't LLMs potentially great to ward off language death due to their significant abilities to transpose ideas into different languages?

dontupvoteme 3y ago
I admit that I talk to it in English the most (as it's my native tongue) but I had read here that it has gotten noticeably worse in other languages, even making grammar mistakes in linguistically-close-to-english-and-sufficently-present-in-training-data western european languages like German or French. I do enjoy translating things into Sindarian or other conglangs from literature though. I had a theory that giving it the custom instructions in latin might give better results, but i haven't had time to figure out how to benchmark something that's so non-deterministic and black-boxy
oblio 3y ago
> Aren't LLMs potentially great to ward off language death due to their significant abilities to transpose ideas into different languages? What do you mean?
- berkes 3y ago
  Not GP, but in my case, I find my conversations with ChatGPT or Copilot often being in my native language. Whereas with Google, official docs, and StackExchage it's only and always English. Obviously, the code I write in the end is English. But explaining a domain in a native language - especially when that domain embeds cultural things - helps a lot. For example, there's a massive difference between "add_high_VAT()" in a Dutch Context from a US context. Even add_VAT(lookup_VAT("FR", "low")) demands quite some domain-knowledge about EU tax system. Which I can express in English, but is much easier in my native language.

enigma20 3y ago

Why would be the language death bad. Imho, from practical point of view it doesn't make sense to have multiple languages, or?

dontupvoteme 3y ago
Language is culture, and if the sapir-whorf hypothesis holds, different languages are literally different methods of thinking. there are also other potential benefits, e.g. "the" in english gives little information about what noun may follow. "die/das/der" in general cut the probability space to a third.
- kmlx 3y ago
  > "the" in english gives little information about what noun may follow for us non-native english speakers, this is an understated blessing.
- Brusco_RF 3y ago
  When speakers of a dying language learn a dominant one they don't lose their way of thinking, rather they adapt the dominant language to their needs. In this way the dominant language evolves. It's why there are ~180k english words but only 1200 Sindarian words. While I agree that cultural loss is tragic, consider that it is inevitable. Homo Sapiens have existed for ~200,000 years. We only have SOME traces of SOME cultures for say 10k of those years. So from that lens, the vast majority of human culture has already been lost.
gostsamo 3y ago
Kids cannot use foreign language tools to their full abilities. However, if ChatGPT is good for english only, it might stimulate some competition for providing similar service in the local language. I won't mind it, tbh.
fomine3 3y ago
imperialism
scythe 3y ago

tuyiown 3y ago

> I really love their stubborn nature to stick with their langauge over the anglo one I think you're talking about the Québécois, because the french around here are swimming in a sea of _épouvantable_ mix of french and english words. But as afterthought you're still quite right, this mix usage is sliding downhill from ill inspired managers to general low class now.

bboygravity 3y ago

Just weird to me that they build in Germany. Germany basically pressed "delete" on (clean) energy for the coming decades and has very little capacity to seriously expand their energy conversion.

j-pb 3y ago
Germany has build more PV capacity in the last three years than the total nuclear capacity it ever build, and the numbers are increasing thanks to regulatory cutbacks by the current government. Meanwhile new nuclear reactors cost 4 times as much as renewables and take decades to build. So stop spreading FUD.
- cpursley 3y ago
  What are the actual numbers? Is PV reliable as nuclear? As cheap as piped natural gas? Can VW build a profitable car and Bosch a washing machine at those rates (vs very strong competitors like South Korea)? Because that’s what keeps the German economy humming (and the EU together).
  - t43562 3y ago
    VW is using renewables for building it's EVs.
    - cpursley 3y ago
      Best of luck to them, they're gonna need it.
      - knallfrosch 3y ago
        What would it even take to change your mind lmao
        cpursley 3y ago
        Healthy numbers. If people aren’t buying VW vehicles because the prices are higher than Hyundai due to the energy situation, that’s not good. Germany is deindustrializing as we speak (chemicals, auto and auto related, etc). Once you deindustrialize past a certain threshold, it’s very difficult to come back.

kmlx 3y ago

> putting together the pieces they need to keep up with AI and maintain their ability to leverage their control mechanisms upon the FAANGS. from the press release itself: > ESMC marks a significant step towards construction of a 300mm fab to support the future capacity needs of the fast-growing automotive and industrial sectors, with the final investment decision pending confirmation of the level of public funding for this project. it's a 300mm fab. > Realpolitk wise they absolutely cannot risk regulatory capture to a few select firms on the west coast of the USA. not only is this 40 years too late, but the press release itself contradicts this comment.

pgeorgi 3y ago
> it's a 300mm fab. 300mm wafer diameter, yes. That's state of the art, with some vendors looking at 450mm with little to show for now.
oytis 3y ago
> it's a 300mm fab. 300mm is larger than a vacuum tube!

ablated_maquis 3y ago

> "The planned fab ... [is expected to produce] wafers on TSMC’s 28/22 nanometer planar CMOS and 16/12 nanometer FinFET process technology" These are not leading node semiconductors that will be used for training AI. These are commodity chips that will be used in the automotive industry.

nottorp 3y ago

What does a low tech (for chips) chip fab have with AI?

FirmwareBurner 3y ago
Nothing, it's just hopium from people who haven't read the article, fishing for upvotes.

coliveira 3y ago

That's not the only issue. TSMC has a big problem in creating fabs in the US, which is the lack of talent in sufficient numbers for the project to be successful, and the very high cost of existing talent. No surprise that they're delaying the US fab and going ahead with plants in Germany, where there is less expensive specialized labor.

onlyrealcuzzo 3y ago

> Altman himself threatened (for a brief period) to cut off GPT to the EU after Italy rightfully brought up issues with data privacy. This wouldn't be a big deal. GPT is not some one-of-a-kind leaps-and-bounds ahead of everyone else ground-breaking technology.

hospitalJail 3y ago
Still in denial? I have a hard time understanding the people who visit this website and havent used the technology.
- throwaway1777 3y ago
  Still have a hard time understanding people who refuse to look at the data and benchmarks myself. Chatgpt was a game changer and let the cat out of the bag, but it’s not far ahead anymore.
- onlyrealcuzzo 3y ago
  The people most hyped on GPT are the people who see the potential for it if it continues to get exponentially better - which Altman himself pretty much said it won't.
  - adventured 3y ago
    > GPT is not some one-of-a-kind leaps-and-bounds ahead of everyone else ground-breaking technology. GPT 3 and 4 were already exactly that, leaps and bounds ahead of everybody else. GPT 4 shocked the connected planet and massively disrupted plans across the tech industry globally. Version 4 has been every bit as disruptive as the iPhone (which completely altered the trajectory of the phone & mobile markets). It has been talked about from coast to coast across the globe non-stop since its release. Covered endlessly by every major media outlet in the West. GPT this, AI that, non-stop since V4 sparked enormous consumer attention and debate. It has dozens of major companies and open source groups desperately attempting to copy it or catch up to it. It has governments terrified of AI and attempting to quickly place regulations to control it. It has programmers - one of the elite, highest paying professions in the world - running scared that half the software development jobs in the industry are going away in the next decade (they are). 1.3 million software developers in the US earning a median of $115,000 before benefits ($200+ billion in total annual compensation for that employee pool). Half of those jobs, at a minimum, will be eliminated by this type of AI, and it was GPT 4 that made it clear it was not just a far-off premise. Its the first highly potent consumer AI product. Over one hundred million people quickly signed up to use it. There hasn't been anything remotely close to it so far (Siri and Alexa have been barely useful jokes by comparison). The same people that like to pretend Tesla didn't spark the electric car revolution, and like to pretend Apple didn't spark the smartphone revolution, like to pretend OpenAI didn't just set off a revolution in AI.

zpeti 3y ago

Is the EU marketing budget now doing sponsored posting on HN? What the hell is this comment? It’s completely wrong on facts yet full of quasi praise for eu politics

llm_nerd 3y ago

The fab is for chips that are something along the lines of 4 generations old, and that's ignoring that they won't start manufacturing until 2027... This has absolutely nothing to do with AI or LLMs. Generally these are automation chips for machinery or vehicles. "Microsoft made him walk that one back real quick" This sounds like a weird fan fiction. OpenAI openly negotiates with EU governments. No one walked back anything.

posterboy 3y ago
Suppose you need automation for machinery in a cutting edge fab, that would be much further in the future? They could ship from Taiwan, so the idea that this is a back up does not sound entirely wrong. Sounds like fan-fiction, too, true enough. AMD is already there and Intel is building in Lower Saxony. Must be something about the region, perhaps the chemistry since the Erzgebirge has a history in mining. Meisner Porcelain for example beat Venice and replaced good old China (pun intended). > No one walked back anything. I'm not sure about that (haven't heard this story). My impression is that EU sticks to discretion very much, and they aren't free from corruption. The US on the other hand is not known to play nice with matters of law in international affairs (Edit: shouldn't have said "international law"). Taiwan is a partner was the point, I believe. Of course they aren't going to give away the crown jewels either.
- logifail 3y ago
  > Must be something about the region [snip] Following Occam's razor, perhaps it's that it's just cheaper? "The monthly pay ranking of German states is headed by Hamburg with 3,619 euros, followed by Baden-Württemberg with 3,546 euros and Hesse with 3,494 euros. The lowest salaries are received by employees in Mecklenburg-Western Pomerania with an average of 2,391 euros. Slightly more is earned in Thuringia with 2,459 euros and Saxony with 2,479 euros."[0] [0] https://www.deutschland.de/en/topic/business/pay-in-germany-national-average-and-regional-differences https://www.deutschland.de/en/topic/business/pay-in-germany-...
  - posterboy 3y ago

nabakin 3y ago

> Microsoft made him walk that one back real quick - he probably wasn't really aware that he is now one of their employees Source?

dna_polymerase 3y ago

> Along with (hopefully) that french startup (Mistral) founded by the LLaMA guys, the EU is putting together the pieces they need to keep up with AI and maintain their ability to leverage their control mechanisms upon the FAANGS. These nodes are generations old and basically only in use in German cars with their abysmal 'software'. The only touching point these processors will ever have with AI is as an API endpoint to Google Voice or Siri. Moreover, Mistral was widely seen as a joke and testimony to the catastrophic state European tech is in. Europe is done. I have no idea why they rushed to regulate anything. In the end the U.S. startups will tell us what to do. Europe is a joke.

martin8412 3y ago
What abysmal software? The software in my VW is more than adequate. Not that I see what interest I'd have in any kind of AI in my car. Yes, these chips are for automotive and industrial use, what's the problem? Those are both important use cases. You may think Europe is done, but who makes the EUV lithography machines used for TSMCs' cutting edge nodes? Who makes the leading ERP system used by a lot of companies around the world? Where was the Chrome V8 JavaScript engine developed? The point is, Europe has plenty of innovation. But unlike the US, people don't go around boasting every chance they get. People just do stuff and are happy with that.