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Agreed, the US immigration system is only just barely decent to you if you're a highly skilled scientist in an in-demand field, but when your home country is qu

Agreed, the US immigration system is only just barely decent to you if you're a highly skilled scientist in an in-demand field, but when your home country is quickly catching up on offering good opportunities and can pay more relative to cost of living, it's understandable that they're increasingly choosing not to stay. Especially if they're of Chinese or Russian origin, it's many years of fighting to prove you deserve to be here with increased scrutiny whenever it's politically favorable for whoever is in charge. Even with India, immigration is such a grueling process, with just another decade or so of development to create more opportunities and we'll probably be seeing a similar process with Indians. India even has a slightly lower barrier in that compared to Russia and China there's less totalitarianism to make people prefer the US.

jacquesm 3y ago
US Immigration is insufferable no matter where you're from.
ChumpGPT 3y ago
US Immigration bad? 3 million Indian H1B's have arrived in the last 20 or so years. How can it be bad? The US accepts more immigrants every year than any other country in the world, how can it be bad?
- chii 3y ago
  H1Bs are not citizens, unlike naturalized immigrants. They are effectively "indentured servants" of the company that sponsored them, and have a gruelling 10-20 yr application process to gain full citizenship. The fact that you don't know this is exactly what the OP was referring to, since most US natural born citizens don't know about it much.
  - Grazester 3y ago
    This is not true for all H1B visa holders. I know many who have obtained their permanent residency after a few years. This is not in the IT field though but medical field.
    - chii 3y ago
      > I know many who have obtained their permanent residency after a few years. they are the lucky few. It's a lottery system basically.
      - seanmcdirmid 3y ago
        H1B terminates in permanent residency, but if you are from certain countries (India, China, Philippines, Mexico), you have to wait for quota to free up (so you are in limbo having an extension of your visa but no PR yet). Still, to say that only “a lucky few” get green cards from an H1B is disingenuous when the vast majority get them within a few years of their renewal ending (after 6 years). The USA still issues 740k green cards a year, after all.
        chii 3y ago
        Wait times: https://youtu.be/kRhZdmtw3Wg?t=516 https://youtu.be/kRhZdmtw3Wg?t=516 Somebody applying for PR on jan 1st 2009 (from india, for example), is just now able to receive their green card (in 2023). While the majority (~50%) of the wait is around 5-6 years, there's some 20-25% that have 10-19 years of wait times! And because the quota system is nationality based, the more populous nations tend to have higher wait times.
        seanmcdirmid 3y ago
        It isn’t just the more populated countries. It is any country with a lot of emigration to the USA proportional to their own population. So India, China, Philippines, Mexico. China is at 4 years, Mexico and the Philippines are at 1.25 year, India is at 14 years. I agree it’s dumb and we shouldn’t do it that way, but India is a huge outlier under the current system.

jacquesm 3y ago

US Immigration is insufferable no matter where you're from.

ChumpGPT 3y ago

US Immigration bad? 3 million Indian H1B's have arrived in the last 20 or so years. How can it be bad? The US accepts more immigrants every year than any other country in the world, how can it be bad?

chii 3y ago
H1Bs are not citizens, unlike naturalized immigrants. They are effectively "indentured servants" of the company that sponsored them, and have a gruelling 10-20 yr application process to gain full citizenship. The fact that you don't know this is exactly what the OP was referring to, since most US natural born citizens don't know about it much.
- Grazester 3y ago
  This is not true for all H1B visa holders. I know many who have obtained their permanent residency after a few years. This is not in the IT field though but medical field.
  - chii 3y ago
    > I know many who have obtained their permanent residency after a few years. they are the lucky few. It's a lottery system basically.
    - seanmcdirmid 3y ago
      H1B terminates in permanent residency, but if you are from certain countries (India, China, Philippines, Mexico), you have to wait for quota to free up (so you are in limbo having an extension of your visa but no PR yet). Still, to say that only “a lucky few” get green cards from an H1B is disingenuous when the vast majority get them within a few years of their renewal ending (after 6 years). The USA still issues 740k green cards a year, after all.
      - chii 3y ago
        Wait times: https://youtu.be/kRhZdmtw3Wg?t=516 https://youtu.be/kRhZdmtw3Wg?t=516 Somebody applying for PR on jan 1st 2009 (from india, for example), is just now able to receive their green card (in 2023). While the majority (~50%) of the wait is around 5-6 years, there's some 20-25% that have 10-19 years of wait times! And because the quota system is nationality based, the more populous nations tend to have higher wait times.
        seanmcdirmid 3y ago
        It isn’t just the more populated countries. It is any country with a lot of emigration to the USA proportional to their own population. So India, China, Philippines, Mexico. China is at 4 years, Mexico and the Philippines are at 1.25 year, India is at 14 years. I agree it’s dumb and we shouldn’t do it that way, but India is a huge outlier under the current system.