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Netflix is such a crook. I had cancelled my subscription a while ago. They gave me the rest of the month to watch (since i already paid that month). Well, I had

• Spivak 3y ago
  Isn't that basically bait for a chargeback? No financial institution would ever call that an authorized transaction.
• lolinder 3y ago
  Do you know the details of what happened here? Unless you know otherwise, it sounds like your father probably ended up clicking the "renew subscription now" button when prompted, not that simply logging in triggered the charge. I'm ready to believe that the renewal prompt was heavily geared towards making it easy to renew, and Netflix should be required to make it equally easy to cancel, but unless you know he didn't click a button to confirm the charge (with dollar amount listed), I'd hesitate to label the re-onboarding process as crooked.
  • sitkack 3y ago
    No the onus is not on the customer to not step on the landmine.
    • lolinder 3y ago
      My point is that we don't know if it was a landmine or a very clearly labeled bit of C4 with a lever next to it labeled "explode". I've logged into a cancelled Netflix account before, and while they definitely want you to renew, there's a very clearly marked button that includes the renewal price. If OP's dad absent-mindedly clicked that button, that's a very different story than if simply logging in and navigating to a movie issued a new charge.
      • sitkack 3y ago
        There should be no lever named “explode”. That is the flaw.
    • katbyte 3y ago
      We should not enable and allow companies to do shitty things via dark patterns just to make a quick buck. For one I don’t want to spend my life dealing with every underhanded attempt to take my money and two kids elderly and the vulnerable are the ones who fall prey to it and usually the least able to absorb the financial cost.
  • atum47 3y ago
    I have talked to my father, he did not clicked anything. By simple watching after the final date they gave us it triggered a renewal. the solution proposed in the chat was to logout every device at once and delete my credit card so that wouldn't happen again.
    • themitigating 3y ago
      I would love to test this because I'm pretty sure that simply using netflix after you canceled will not start the subscription again without any prompt. What if you dad is lying to avoid embarrassment?
      • atum47 3y ago
        > What if you dad is lying to avoid embarrassment? Shouldn't matter, right?! Once I cancelled was not supposed to be charged again unless I agree to it. If my father wanted to renew the subscription, he should use his card, right? the renewal process should function as a new subscription, if not done by the same person that subscribed in the first place.
        • lolinder 3y ago
          Were you and your father using two separate usernames/passwords? Or a shared login? If it was a shared login then Netflix would have reasonably assumed that you authorized the charge. If it was a separate account, you have a point—only the plan owner should be able to renew the plan.
          • gabeio 3y ago
            Unless I am missing something there is no way to have more than 1 login for netflix. Everyone uses shared logins.
            • lolinder 3y ago
              They recently added support for sharing your plan with an "Extra Member", for an additional fee: https://help.netflix.com/en/node/123279 https://help.netflix.com/en/node/123279
  • mint2 3y ago
    I cancelled Amazon prime a couple years ago and ran into the same issue. It was absurd frankly. I went through the cancellation process got a cancellation confirmation email and then still got billed at the end of the month. I called and they did reverse the charges and told me it had happened because a behind the scenes box was checked for automatic payments - I scoured the page to see if that was a user facing option and it was nowhere. Cancelling but continuing payments simply makes no sense.
    • ropeladder 3y ago
      Well, not for the customer...
  • spandrew 3y ago
    He almost certainly did click renew sub — esp. if that is in the flow? User researchers know very well people's recollection of their use is not reliable data.
  • partdavid 3y ago
    I had more or less the exact same thing. I certainly didn't like the idea that my "authorized users" (who are in my home) could simply click on a show to watch it, or even "renew" without giving a password and restart a cancelled--not suspended--account. It's bad treatment and only makes me want to never do business with Netflix, but... okay, it's kinda sorta "my" fault. But when I had my customer service interaction, they said they could not tell me that that's what happened, or if it did, when and on what device. That to me is inexcusable. If you're going to charge me money you need to be able to justify why and for what. Secondly, I could not use Netflix's interface to remove or deauthorize my payment method. Also unconscionable. The customer service agent needed to "block" my card (how do I know that they even did it? I have no way to verify as the payment method remains associated with the account). It's not on me to "know" someone "didn't" do something--it's incumbent on Netflix to actually know and have a record that that's what happened. If they don't do that--then yeah, crooked.
  • atum47 3y ago
    Take AliExpress for instance, they have my credit card stored. But even if I login and try to buy something, they still ask for the security code on the back of my card. How come Netflix would allow anyone other than me use my credit card to subscribe (or renew the subscription) without even asking that? My father don't have access to my card, neither other members of my family. If Netflix was being honest they would ask at least that. The security code of your card to prove it is the card holder making a purchase.
    • lolinder 3y ago
      > anyone other than me Password sharing means that they assume everyone using your account is you. I notice you ignored my question about whether your father had a separate account, so I'm assuming he did not.
• LanceH 3y ago
  And most of these don't allow removing the last card on file, even if it's cancelled.
  • cad1 3y ago
    I was going to mention this dark pattern too. So many sites have no way of removing a payment method. It should really be illegal, but until then I will use virtual card numbers.
    • metiscus 3y ago
      Otherwise, in cases where you have a very pernicious party that will absolutely not stop charging your card, you can contact your bank and have them cancel that card. When they do, there is often a convenience feature that allows pre-existing subscriptions to continue to bill using the old card info. You need to make sure you tell the bank that you do not want that to happen for this card. They have a way to shut that feature off and that will remove the ability for the company to abuse that feature. You can still end up accruing a debt with them that they may try to collect on eventually so this is not a suggested method to get out of a subscription, but when you have tried everything else, it does seem to work in my experience.
  • Roark66 3y ago
    At least in Europe there is GDPR, you have a right to request a copy of _all_ data any company has on you as well as you can request it's deletion.
• dylan604 3y ago
  I had a new card issued, and I intentionally did not go online to update with them or any other website expecting to receive email notifications from any and all sites that needed me to update my payment method. Netflix did not. It took me calling them to find out, but they have an agreement with card issuers where they can find out that you have been issued a new card and automatically be granted authorization to start billing against that new card without you providing them the information. "It's a courtesy service to avoid interruptions in your service" is how it was explained to me. Sounds like card fraud to me.
  • lolinder 3y ago
    Netflix doesn't have a special agreement with card issuers. Like most businesses today, Netflix uses issuer tokens instead of saving your credit card information [0]. This is a good thing—aside from reducing accidental interruptions (not a big deal for you and Netflix, but a huge deal for you and your power company), it's much more secure. Netflix should make it easy to cancel your subscription, but using an issuer token isn't card fraud, it's good business and an overall benefit to 99% of customers. [0] https://www.bitsaboutmoney.com/archive/improving-cards-under-the-hood/ https://www.bitsaboutmoney.com/archive/improving-cards-under... Edit, source for my claim that Netflix uses tokens: https://www.businesswire.com/news/home/20181018005247/en/Visa-Expands-Tokenization-Partnership-With-Netflix-to-Improve-Digital-Payments-Experience-Globally https://www.businesswire.com/news/home/20181018005247/en/Vis...
    • dylan604 3y ago
      So the reps on the phone that I spoke to lied to me? After talking with Netflix, I then called my bank, and they acknowledged this service exists. What you're on about acting like I don't know what I'm talking about is absolute nonsense.
      • GrinningFool 3y ago
        It may be that the script provided to the rep was given because it's easier than explaining the concept of issuer tokens to the uninformed?
• tracker1 3y ago
  That's messed up. I remember a bit more than a decade ago, when I was receiving DVDs as well as the streaming had started a couple years earlier. I had cancelled as I was just too busy to use the service. No muss, no fuss, just two clicks and done. They didn't inundate me with email messages either, like some other services (about one a quarter). I was happy to re-join six months later because of that smooth experience. Contrast to when I was a happy user of XM radio... I had sold one of my cars, and just wanted to remove one of 4 radios on the account. I get placed in a 40 minute hold queue, and when the rep couldn't talk me out of it, I was suddenly dropped from the call... mysterious eh. Well, the third time I was so pissed off I cancelled everything. I've had rather visceral feelings towards them ever since. If you ever deal with them, my own suggestion would be to use a one-time only card to setup the account. Of course, you're better off if you have good cell coverage just using spotify, youtube music or similar.
• atum47 3y ago
  UPDATE 2 After not being able to find any email or conversation with the support I was able to log back in Netflix and get a history of charges to my credit cards, which is still stored in their system. Dates are in DD/MM/YYYY format https://victorribeiro.com/netflix.jpg https://victorribeiro.com/netflix.jpg
  • jsweojtj 3y ago
    It looks like it renewed automatically on the 17th every month, and then... it was reactivated on the 20th? I think this lends credibility to the idea that someone on the account tried to watch something 3 days after the subscription ended, couldn't without resubscribing, and simply clicked to restart the subscription. Obviously, it could be as you described it as well. A simple test would be to see what happens if you try to, today, try to watch something on Netflix. Does it allow you to start watching shows? Or does it ask you to do something like restart a subscription? What do you see today?
• standardUser 3y ago
  Netflix is doing what every business does - using and abusing the rules as much as they can to maximize their own gain. It is how business works, how it has always worked and how it always will work. If you want something different, don't yell at some company that is only acting the way all companies act. Yell at your government for failing to make laws that protoize us, actual people, over business interests. Most businesses follow the laws most of the time, so if they are acting shitty it is because your government has shitty laws.