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"A security guard at an airport can be a a machine gun on wheels" - are you serious? That is a job which is 99.99% about understanding human intentions in confu

"A security guard at an airport can be a a machine gun on wheels" - are you serious? That is a job which is 99.99% about understanding human intentions in confusing and ambiguous situations, and where making a mistake will literally kill people. It's the last job you want to automate with "AI".

raincole 3y ago
It's a very good example to understand how "AI evangelists" think. Anyone with even slightest common senes would immediately understands why it's a bad idea, but AI evangelists just can't.
- ido 3y ago
  We had a whole series of films (RoboCop) warning us about exactly this particular Torment Nexus[0] [0] https://twitter.com/alexblechman/status/1457842724128833538 https://twitter.com/alexblechman/status/1457842724128833538
  - staz 3y ago
    non twitter link https://knowyourmeme.com/memes/torment-nexus https://knowyourmeme.com/memes/torment-nexus
- amoss 3y ago
  So AI evangelism is a role that is ripe for disruption by ChatGPT.
  - gpderetta 3y ago
    What if it already was and AIs are evangelizing for themselves?
- digitalengineer 3y ago
  It's also very... American to not think mention the absurdity of machine guns at airports, even in the hands of humans. Even if lethal force is required, would you want a security person (not a trained policeman) to "start blasting" and spraying bullets with a machine-gun?
  - JohnFen 3y ago
    I have never seen people armed with machine guns at a US airport.
    - toomuchtodo 3y ago
      Houston and Nashville airport LEO have previously carried AR-15s, not sure if they still do.
  - raxxorraxor 3y ago
    I first thought so as well but have now been desensitized by machine guns at school. The war on terror really drove people crazy...
    - Loquebantur 3y ago
      Yes, measured by impact, foreign terrorism was terrifyingly successful. The "answers" the US came up with rather exacerbated the problem. Most also don't work with homegrown terrorism at all. Using AI to profile such potential endemic perpetrators is ironically just another instance of trying to fit the problem to the tool.
  - ben_w 3y ago
    > It's also very... American to not think mention the absurdity of machine guns at airports Now you mention it, despite the two respective national stereotypes, the only airports where I can remember seeing machine guns on the security team were one of the London airports. If I saw machine guns in SFO or JFK, I was too tired from the flight to remember.
    - version_five 3y ago
      From what I can remember, it's an everyday occurrence in various european cities to see police armed with machine guns. The first time I saw it it was very surprising and I wondered what was going on. Definitely not a uniquely american thing.
- EGreg 3y ago
  Finally HN is starting to treat AI evangelists like Web3 evangelists
  - HeWhoLurksLate 3y ago
    Honestly, zealots in general get exhausting quick, especially when they can't acknowledge the faults or limitations of the god/God they serve
- version_five 3y ago
  That's a particular case of the general idea that there are a lot of completely clueless people, whether tech bros, business leaders, politicians, etc that have only the most superficial understanding of various problems and are arrogant enough to think that their super simple solution is novel and can address the problem.
- sanderjd 3y ago
  I think "doomers" is a better description in this case. "Evangelists" are "AI will do everything and that's great" and doomers are "AI will do everything and that's terrible". The OP is a representative of the middle way: AI is an important new tool and that's a mixed bag but net positive.
dsign 3y ago
>> It's the last job you want to automate with "AI". Have you been at the Charles de Gaulle Airport in France? The security people there look like paratroopers[^1]. It's terrifying, and it's a reason I avoid that particular airport every time I fly. It sends the message "Paris is an unsafe place to be, we are very paranoid, blame the others, don't come here." The machine guns have no business among civilians, being with robots or people, period. >> That is a job which is 99.99% about understanding human intentions in confusing and ambiguous situations, and where making a mistake will literally kill people. Yes, if you ever are allowed to pull the trigger. And in that case, I wouldn't trust machine nor person; I have been profiled on the basis of my physical appearance more times that I can count. But in some cases, like the airport above, the goal and effect is to simply terrify civilians. You can't deny that a machine would do a better job at that[^2]. [^1]: Just search Google images for "Security at Charles de Gaulle airport." I've been there, and that's exactly how they look. [^2]: Here, have a Dalek with a white paint job: https://www.knightscope.com/ https://www.knightscope.com/ .
- seanmcdirmid 3y ago
  The police look like that in Paris’s suburbs as well, for I guess obvious reasons.
  - dontupvoteme 3y ago
    I'm an order of magnitude more afraid of a regular cop back in America than any police in Europe.
- dontupvoteme 3y ago
  >Have you been at the Charles de Gaulle Airport in France? The security people there look like paratroopers[^1]. It's terrifying, and it's a reason I avoid that particular airport every time I fly. It sends the message "Paris is an unsafe place to be, we are very paranoid, blame the others, don't come here." The machine guns have no business among civilians, being with robots or people, period. In europe there's 1-2 orders of less police brutality and issues overall, but the tradeoff is you randomly have military police walking around with rifles. They're quite friendly actually, I've ended up getting directions from them once or twice when trying to catch a connection. Also the FAMAS is a beautiful piece of French Engineering What does suck about CDG is how horrifically unorganized they are. Like "print your boarding pass, but the printer was out of ink, so the barcode didn't generate, and they just *wave you through* the check with an invalid boarding pass because it happens all the time that is what scares me, not European cops with guns
ricardo81 3y ago
Agree on your sentiment. To be honest, if we're talking about most minimum wage jobs being performed better by AI (I would imagine being armed security, at least in the UK is a lot more than min wage, because of the responsibility and trust of course), I'd worry less about their AI machine gun at airports vs the existential questions around there being a working class (in the original sense).
moffkalast 3y ago
Yeah, areas where there's a high liability and potential loss of life are the last ones that will be fully automated. On the other hand, most office jobs are easy targets because work can be verified in non-realtime before using it. Trains and planes already operate completely autonomously 99.9% of the time. Yet we still have pilots and train engineers there to handle the edge cases because having one or two people to keep an eye on a million dollar machine that can kill hundreds of people and cause billions in property damages if handled incorrectly works out to be a pretty good deal. This is the main problem with self driving cars. They can kill people.
zzzeek 3y ago
it's one of the first jobs they will automate
albrewer 3y ago
They literally made a movie about this in the 80's called Robocop.

raincole 3y ago

It's a very good example to understand how "AI evangelists" think. Anyone with even slightest common senes would immediately understands why it's a bad idea, but AI evangelists just can't.

ido 3y ago
We had a whole series of films (RoboCop) warning us about exactly this particular Torment Nexus[0] [0] https://twitter.com/alexblechman/status/1457842724128833538 https://twitter.com/alexblechman/status/1457842724128833538
- staz 3y ago
  non twitter link https://knowyourmeme.com/memes/torment-nexus https://knowyourmeme.com/memes/torment-nexus
amoss 3y ago
So AI evangelism is a role that is ripe for disruption by ChatGPT.
- gpderetta 3y ago
  What if it already was and AIs are evangelizing for themselves?
digitalengineer 3y ago
It's also very... American to not think mention the absurdity of machine guns at airports, even in the hands of humans. Even if lethal force is required, would you want a security person (not a trained policeman) to "start blasting" and spraying bullets with a machine-gun?
- JohnFen 3y ago
  I have never seen people armed with machine guns at a US airport.
  - toomuchtodo 3y ago
    Houston and Nashville airport LEO have previously carried AR-15s, not sure if they still do.
- raxxorraxor 3y ago
  I first thought so as well but have now been desensitized by machine guns at school. The war on terror really drove people crazy...
  - Loquebantur 3y ago
    Yes, measured by impact, foreign terrorism was terrifyingly successful. The "answers" the US came up with rather exacerbated the problem. Most also don't work with homegrown terrorism at all. Using AI to profile such potential endemic perpetrators is ironically just another instance of trying to fit the problem to the tool.
- ben_w 3y ago
  > It's also very... American to not think mention the absurdity of machine guns at airports Now you mention it, despite the two respective national stereotypes, the only airports where I can remember seeing machine guns on the security team were one of the London airports. If I saw machine guns in SFO or JFK, I was too tired from the flight to remember.
  - version_five 3y ago
    From what I can remember, it's an everyday occurrence in various european cities to see police armed with machine guns. The first time I saw it it was very surprising and I wondered what was going on. Definitely not a uniquely american thing.
EGreg 3y ago
Finally HN is starting to treat AI evangelists like Web3 evangelists
- HeWhoLurksLate 3y ago
  Honestly, zealots in general get exhausting quick, especially when they can't acknowledge the faults or limitations of the god/God they serve
version_five 3y ago
That's a particular case of the general idea that there are a lot of completely clueless people, whether tech bros, business leaders, politicians, etc that have only the most superficial understanding of various problems and are arrogant enough to think that their super simple solution is novel and can address the problem.
sanderjd 3y ago
I think "doomers" is a better description in this case. "Evangelists" are "AI will do everything and that's great" and doomers are "AI will do everything and that's terrible". The OP is a representative of the middle way: AI is an important new tool and that's a mixed bag but net positive.

dsign 3y ago

>> It's the last job you want to automate with "AI". Have you been at the Charles de Gaulle Airport in France? The security people there look like paratroopers[^1]. It's terrifying, and it's a reason I avoid that particular airport every time I fly. It sends the message "Paris is an unsafe place to be, we are very paranoid, blame the others, don't come here." The machine guns have no business among civilians, being with robots or people, period. >> That is a job which is 99.99% about understanding human intentions in confusing and ambiguous situations, and where making a mistake will literally kill people. Yes, if you ever are allowed to pull the trigger. And in that case, I wouldn't trust machine nor person; I have been profiled on the basis of my physical appearance more times that I can count. But in some cases, like the airport above, the goal and effect is to simply terrify civilians. You can't deny that a machine would do a better job at that[^2]. [^1]: Just search Google images for "Security at Charles de Gaulle airport." I've been there, and that's exactly how they look. [^2]: Here, have a Dalek with a white paint job: https://www.knightscope.com/ https://www.knightscope.com/ .

seanmcdirmid 3y ago
The police look like that in Paris’s suburbs as well, for I guess obvious reasons.
- dontupvoteme 3y ago
  I'm an order of magnitude more afraid of a regular cop back in America than any police in Europe.
dontupvoteme 3y ago
>Have you been at the Charles de Gaulle Airport in France? The security people there look like paratroopers[^1]. It's terrifying, and it's a reason I avoid that particular airport every time I fly. It sends the message "Paris is an unsafe place to be, we are very paranoid, blame the others, don't come here." The machine guns have no business among civilians, being with robots or people, period. In europe there's 1-2 orders of less police brutality and issues overall, but the tradeoff is you randomly have military police walking around with rifles. They're quite friendly actually, I've ended up getting directions from them once or twice when trying to catch a connection. Also the FAMAS is a beautiful piece of French Engineering What does suck about CDG is how horrifically unorganized they are. Like "print your boarding pass, but the printer was out of ink, so the barcode didn't generate, and they just *wave you through* the check with an invalid boarding pass because it happens all the time that is what scares me, not European cops with guns

ricardo81 3y ago

Agree on your sentiment. To be honest, if we're talking about most minimum wage jobs being performed better by AI (I would imagine being armed security, at least in the UK is a lot more than min wage, because of the responsibility and trust of course), I'd worry less about their AI machine gun at airports vs the existential questions around there being a working class (in the original sense).

moffkalast 3y ago

Yeah, areas where there's a high liability and potential loss of life are the last ones that will be fully automated. On the other hand, most office jobs are easy targets because work can be verified in non-realtime before using it. Trains and planes already operate completely autonomously 99.9% of the time. Yet we still have pilots and train engineers there to handle the edge cases because having one or two people to keep an eye on a million dollar machine that can kill hundreds of people and cause billions in property damages if handled incorrectly works out to be a pretty good deal. This is the main problem with self driving cars. They can kill people.

zzzeek 3y ago

it's one of the first jobs they will automate

albrewer 3y ago

They literally made a movie about this in the 80's called Robocop.