6 ms·

This drives me crazy, especially because it breaks finding within a page. Eg. if you order food and you already know what you want. Old days: Cmd + f, type wha

This drives me crazy, especially because it breaks finding within a page. Eg. if you order food and you already know what you want. Old days: Cmd + f, type what you want. New days: first scroll to the end of the page so that all the contents are actually loaded. Cmd + f, type what you want. Is just a list of dishes, some with small thumbnails, some without any images at all. If you can't load a page with 30 dishes fast enough, you have a serious problem (you could always lazily load the thumbnails if you want to cheat).

mikecoles 3y ago
I miss typing / to search on pages. Ctrl-W still messes me up at times when using a terminal in a browser.
- TechieKid 3y ago
  You can search with / on Firefox.
  - 5e92cb50239222b 3y ago
    ' will search in URLs, skipping plain text.
  - GrinningFool 3y ago
    Unless you're on github.com, because it rather inconsiderately takes over `/`.
- abdusco 3y ago
  Firefox lets you use / for search.
- dbtc 3y ago
  vimium / vimium-ff
- _a_a_a_ 3y ago
  Firefox allows you to use / to start a conventional search. As a bonus, in Firefox if you hit the ' key (apostrophe) you get a search that looks only within hyperlinks and ignores all the un-clickable plain text. Give it a try, sometimes it can be very useful
TeMPOraL 3y ago
> New days: first scroll to the end of the page so that all the contents are actually loaded. Cmd + f, type what you want. Only to discover that 2/3 of the matches are invisible text that's put there for $deity knows what reason, and the rest only gives you the subset of what you want, as the UI truncates the list of ingredients/toppings and you need to click or hover over it to see it in full.
vhcr 3y ago
Or even worse, Cmd + F doesn't work because the page is lazily rendered.
- pohuing 3y ago
  Twitter does that and I don't understand why. Do they think their js blob can figure out which divs to render faster than the browser engine itself?
  - RichardCA 3y ago
    I am in no way a front-end person, but my understanding is that it has to do with React and the way it maintains a virtual copy of the DOM. Having Ctrl-F not work correctly is maddening and I hate it.
    - korm 3y ago
      Nothing to do with React, it's a common optimization to improve performance with long lists. You only render the dom elements in the viewport, with some buffer. A common technique to achieve that is called "virtualization" or "windowing". It's common enough that there were a couple browser proposals to deal with this and would address the Ctrl+F issue. I believe this has been merged into the CSS Containment spec, but at the moment it doesn't make windowing obsolete in every situation.
      - ziml77 3y ago
        It's not even a technique limited to browsers. When I did Android development years ago it was a technique used in native list controls to reduce the overhead of them. Though in that case, there's no search based on what's been rendered like a web browser has. And of course if you did implement search, you could have that look at the underlying data, so it doesn't matter if it's been rendered.
      - pohuing 3y ago
        But Web browsers already don't render off screen content right? I'm pretty sure I remember opening hundreds of megs of data in Firefox at one point without an issue. Or old reddit with RES has infinite scroll and you can go dozens of pages deep without a hitch. All while not lazily rendering the other pages.
sazz 3y ago
Well, the tech stack is insane: Some virtual machine running a web browser process running a virtual machine for a html renderer which consumes a document declaration language incorporating a scripting language to overcome the document limitations trying to build interactive programs. Actually much worse as Microsoft once did with their COM model, ActiveX based on MFC foundation classes with C++ templates, etc. And to build those interactive programs somebody is trained to use React, Vue, etc. using their own eco systems of tools. This is operated by a stack of build tools, a stack of distribution tools, kubernetes for hosting and AWS for managing that whole damn thing. Oh - and do not talk even about Dependency Management, Monitoring, Microservices, Authorization and so on... But I really wonder - what would be more complex? Building interactive programs based on HTML or Logo (if anybody does remember)?
- myth2018 3y ago
  And don't forget the UX designers armed with their figmas and alikes. The tech-stack is only one among a number of organizational and cultural issues crippling the field.
  - wellanyway 3y ago
    Howdoes figma contribute to laggy UI of the end product?
    - myth2018 3y ago
      Notice that in this sub-topic we're talking more generally about causes for low-quality software -- laggy UIs being only one of the symptoms. Figma contributes by enabling UI designers to easily author interfaces which look allegedly beautiful but are complex to build, test and maintain. And the resources burned on building such esthetically pleasant piles of barely usable software could find better use on making it simpler, faster and more focused on user actual functional and non-functional requirements (much of them taking place on the server-side) instead of sugaring their eyes by throwing tons of code on their clients
- atchoo 3y ago
nzach 3y ago
>If you can't load a page with 30 dishes fast enough, you have a serious problem That depends on your scale. If your product is "large enough" it is relatively easy to get into the range of several seconds of response time. Here are some of the steps you may want to execute before responding a resquest to your user: - Get all the dishes that have the filters the user selected - Remove all dishes from restaurants that doen't delivery in the user location - Remove all dishes from restaurants that aren't open right now - Get all discount campaigns for the user and apply its effects for every dish - Reorder the dish list based on the history of the user interactions Now imagine that for every step in this list you have, at least, a single team of developers. Add some legacy requirements and a little bit of tech debt... That's it, now you have the perfect stage for a request that takes 5-10 seconds.
- bamfly 3y ago
  Dafuq kind of scale could even a service for lots of restaurants have, that that wouldn't be a single query taking milliseconds to execute? I'd maybe split the last bit (user history re-ordering) into another operation, but the rest, nah, not seeing it, one quick query, probably behind a view. I mean maybe your DB is a single node running on a potato and your load's very high but you're also somehow never hitting cache, but otherwise... no, there's no good reason for that to be slow. [EDIT] Your last paragraph is the reason, though: it's made extremely poorly. That'll do it.
  - immibis 3y ago
    Recently I stumbled across the online catalog for Segor Electronics (segor.de I think? Google it. Only in German. They're not paying me to post this) It's extremely fast. Super duper fast. And a quick look at the network debugging tab shows why: it loads the shop's entire catalog data (about 3 megs) upfront, and the entire application runs locally with not a single request until you buy something. Now that's efficiency. Really. Go to their website, clock on KATALOG and click some random buttons, pick a product at random, add it to your cart, remove it from your cart. The product images are the only things that aren't pre-loaded.
- jerf 3y ago
brazzledazzle 3y ago
If you think that’s enraging just wait until you get a page that unloads the previous content as you scroll. You can only search the text that’s visible. Maddening.

mikecoles 3y ago

I miss typing / to search on pages. Ctrl-W still messes me up at times when using a terminal in a browser.

TechieKid 3y ago
You can search with / on Firefox.
- 5e92cb50239222b 3y ago
  ' will search in URLs, skipping plain text.
- GrinningFool 3y ago
  Unless you're on github.com, because it rather inconsiderately takes over `/`.
abdusco 3y ago
Firefox lets you use / for search.
dbtc 3y ago
vimium / vimium-ff
_a_a_a_ 3y ago
Firefox allows you to use / to start a conventional search. As a bonus, in Firefox if you hit the ' key (apostrophe) you get a search that looks only within hyperlinks and ignores all the un-clickable plain text. Give it a try, sometimes it can be very useful

TeMPOraL 3y ago

> New days: first scroll to the end of the page so that all the contents are actually loaded. Cmd + f, type what you want. Only to discover that 2/3 of the matches are invisible text that's put there for $deity knows what reason, and the rest only gives you the subset of what you want, as the UI truncates the list of ingredients/toppings and you need to click or hover over it to see it in full.

vhcr 3y ago

Or even worse, Cmd + F doesn't work because the page is lazily rendered.

pohuing 3y ago
Twitter does that and I don't understand why. Do they think their js blob can figure out which divs to render faster than the browser engine itself?
- RichardCA 3y ago
  I am in no way a front-end person, but my understanding is that it has to do with React and the way it maintains a virtual copy of the DOM. Having Ctrl-F not work correctly is maddening and I hate it.
  - korm 3y ago
    Nothing to do with React, it's a common optimization to improve performance with long lists. You only render the dom elements in the viewport, with some buffer. A common technique to achieve that is called "virtualization" or "windowing". It's common enough that there were a couple browser proposals to deal with this and would address the Ctrl+F issue. I believe this has been merged into the CSS Containment spec, but at the moment it doesn't make windowing obsolete in every situation.
    - ziml77 3y ago
      It's not even a technique limited to browsers. When I did Android development years ago it was a technique used in native list controls to reduce the overhead of them. Though in that case, there's no search based on what's been rendered like a web browser has. And of course if you did implement search, you could have that look at the underlying data, so it doesn't matter if it's been rendered.
    - pohuing 3y ago
      But Web browsers already don't render off screen content right? I'm pretty sure I remember opening hundreds of megs of data in Firefox at one point without an issue. Or old reddit with RES has infinite scroll and you can go dozens of pages deep without a hitch. All while not lazily rendering the other pages.

sazz 3y ago

Well, the tech stack is insane: Some virtual machine running a web browser process running a virtual machine for a html renderer which consumes a document declaration language incorporating a scripting language to overcome the document limitations trying to build interactive programs. Actually much worse as Microsoft once did with their COM model, ActiveX based on MFC foundation classes with C++ templates, etc. And to build those interactive programs somebody is trained to use React, Vue, etc. using their own eco systems of tools. This is operated by a stack of build tools, a stack of distribution tools, kubernetes for hosting and AWS for managing that whole damn thing. Oh - and do not talk even about Dependency Management, Monitoring, Microservices, Authorization and so on... But I really wonder - what would be more complex? Building interactive programs based on HTML or Logo (if anybody does remember)?

myth2018 3y ago
And don't forget the UX designers armed with their figmas and alikes. The tech-stack is only one among a number of organizational and cultural issues crippling the field.
- wellanyway 3y ago
  Howdoes figma contribute to laggy UI of the end product?
  - myth2018 3y ago
    Notice that in this sub-topic we're talking more generally about causes for low-quality software -- laggy UIs being only one of the symptoms. Figma contributes by enabling UI designers to easily author interfaces which look allegedly beautiful but are complex to build, test and maintain. And the resources burned on building such esthetically pleasant piles of barely usable software could find better use on making it simpler, faster and more focused on user actual functional and non-functional requirements (much of them taking place on the server-side) instead of sugaring their eyes by throwing tons of code on their clients
atchoo 3y ago

nzach 3y ago

>If you can't load a page with 30 dishes fast enough, you have a serious problem That depends on your scale. If your product is "large enough" it is relatively easy to get into the range of several seconds of response time. Here are some of the steps you may want to execute before responding a resquest to your user: - Get all the dishes that have the filters the user selected - Remove all dishes from restaurants that doen't delivery in the user location - Remove all dishes from restaurants that aren't open right now - Get all discount campaigns for the user and apply its effects for every dish - Reorder the dish list based on the history of the user interactions Now imagine that for every step in this list you have, at least, a single team of developers. Add some legacy requirements and a little bit of tech debt... That's it, now you have the perfect stage for a request that takes 5-10 seconds.

bamfly 3y ago
Dafuq kind of scale could even a service for lots of restaurants have, that that wouldn't be a single query taking milliseconds to execute? I'd maybe split the last bit (user history re-ordering) into another operation, but the rest, nah, not seeing it, one quick query, probably behind a view. I mean maybe your DB is a single node running on a potato and your load's very high but you're also somehow never hitting cache, but otherwise... no, there's no good reason for that to be slow. [EDIT] Your last paragraph is the reason, though: it's made extremely poorly. That'll do it.
- immibis 3y ago
  Recently I stumbled across the online catalog for Segor Electronics (segor.de I think? Google it. Only in German. They're not paying me to post this) It's extremely fast. Super duper fast. And a quick look at the network debugging tab shows why: it loads the shop's entire catalog data (about 3 megs) upfront, and the entire application runs locally with not a single request until you buy something. Now that's efficiency. Really. Go to their website, clock on KATALOG and click some random buttons, pick a product at random, add it to your cart, remove it from your cart. The product images are the only things that aren't pre-loaded.
jerf 3y ago

brazzledazzle 3y ago

If you think that’s enraging just wait until you get a page that unloads the previous content as you scroll. You can only search the text that’s visible. Maddening.