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Ask HN: IP cameras that don't require an app or internet?

• yootyootr 3y ago
  Axis cameras is a strong recommendation from me. They make a huge range from tiny "server room" cameras through to spy-agency grade dome-CCTV cameras, industrial, weather proof etc etc. Their basic range all have a web GUI, RTSP and ethernet/wifi. Have a look at the M11 range, or the M30 for a cheap dome camera.
  • kramerger 3y ago
    +1 for Axis. I heard they are the go to brand for any goverment organisation that cares about security and privacy.
• neilalexander 3y ago
  UniFi Protect cameras can all be set up in standalone mode by visiting the camera's IP address in a web browser — they will obtain an address from DHCP by default. From there you can set up the RTSP streams which become accessible from the camera IP directly. You do not need to use a UniFi Protect app or console in this configuration.
  • sgjohnson 3y ago
    You can also get a console and not connect it to the internet for central management.
  • leesalminen 3y ago
    Not anymore with their latest models. You are required to have a Protect NVR and account before they’ll let you use standalone mode, and, apparently some new models disable it entirely. Check out the UniFi subreddit for details. Very disappointed, as that was my go to brand for standalone IP cameras.
    • unethical_ban 3y ago
      I knew they stopped distributing the video server software (forcing a hardware purchase) but I didn't know they required an account now. It's just impossible for a business not to screw customers, isn't it?
    • sliken 3y ago
      Sadly ubiquiti seems to be going downhill on multiple fronts.
      • somehnguy 3y ago
        So disappointing. I can finally afford to buy all the Ubiquiti equipment I wanted in the past but no longer want to buy it. I went TP-Link Omada for my APs and have been satisfied.
        • leesalminen 3y ago
          I also just set up an Omada system (8 switches, 20 APs) for a friend for the first time after recommending UniFi for years. Very happy with it so far.
        • kevin_thibedeau 3y ago
          I bought a TP-Link Kasa smart outlet to power cycle my modem in the basement. I couldn't get the open source Python utility to activate it so I relented and set it up via the official app. The account creation explicitly has a marketing opt-out that they promptly ignored. They have also ignored all my unsubscribe attempts from their spam. I'd recommend avoiding them.
• jimmyh8pie 3y ago
  Reolink NVR kits do not require apps, and you can configure them on no-internet vlans as well. There is a max number of cameras though. You could spin up your own ShinobiCCTV if NVRs are your problem.
• lloydatkinson 3y ago
  This is a very disturbing trend for sure. Given that these new cameras that need accounts sure aren’t showing ads on the feeds either, meanwhile an account being required must be important to the manufacturers in some way. I can only conclude that they must be selling access to feeds, because even the most incompetent agile product delivery manager type person isn’t going to simply suggest every camera needs an account along with all the extra engineering requirements involved for that for simply no reason - there surely must be a financial motive. Furthermore what good is the feed if they can’t also sell the associated metadata, such as the account holders details, nearby WiFi access points, the list of devices on the network. This is yet another angle they can use to try track every aspect of a home including the infamous example of Samsung “analysing” what type of content you’re watching and selling that to ad companies. OP is probably better off looking at enterprise/industrial manufacturers.
  • pc86 3y ago
    I agree that they are very likely selling all this data, but let's not underestimate the incompetence of product people.
  • ramesh31 3y ago
    This is happening with routers, too. Just recently had someone give me a new Netgear Nighthawk for free, and I was stoked until it wanted me to download an app and create an account to manage my network. Straight to the garbage.
    • perrylaj 3y ago
      Decent consumer hardware, in the future I'd suggest trying out something like OpenWRT rather than binning it. https://openwrt.org/toh/netgear/r7000 https://openwrt.org/toh/netgear/r7000
      • ramesh31 3y ago
        Yeah I didn't realize they could be flashed with OpenWRT. Might give that shot.
• kunwon1 3y ago
  I have worked professionally with access control and surveillance. I can give you two manufacturer recommendations: Axis and Geovision. Axis cameras are high end and expensive, but they will, in my experience, do anything an IP camera could reasonably be expected to do, and they will do it well. They are European in origin and are available from various retail outlets to ship this week. Geovision cameras are low end and not expensive. They are Taiwanese in origin and are pretty easy to find. I have personally configured a wide range of cameras from both of these manufacturers and I have never needed an app or internet connectivity. It's been a few years since I looked at Geovision's product lineup though, my information is not 100% current. I don't have any specific camera recommendations. If I were setting up a home NVR today, I would buy Geovision cameras and put them on an isolated network. Both of these manufacturers are nominally ONVIF compliant (ONVIF compliance is a mixed bag and can't be fully trusted from any manufacturer IMO) and have readily accessible RTSP streams
  • vermilingua 3y ago
    To add to this: search the catalog of whatever access control / electronic security wholesaler is local to your country. Almost all stock IP CCTV cameras and peripherals, and it's an easy way to get an idea of what manufacturers produce the cameras you need. Panasonic and Hikvision cameras are also quite good for a more reasonable price than Axis, but I'd agree with the above poster that they are the gold standard in IP CCTV.
  • akerl_ 3y ago
    I can second this. I have several Axis M1065-LW cameras inside (running on wall plugs and wifi) and several Axis P1447-LE externally (running on PoE). Would recommend both of them. Notably, I had one exterior camera fail (wouldn’t run off PoE), and the Axis support/RMA process was smooth and fast.
    • kova12 3y ago
      P1447-LE is sold for over $500 used. What is it that's inside of that camera, which makes it so pricey?!
• hello_computer 3y ago
  I bought a couple Amcrests just a week ago, and they still operate identically to ones I purchased back in 2017. They have apparently been re-branding Dahua's software, since the HTTP APIs are identical, and there are still lots of "Dauha" strings in the configs[0]. I think a lot of the problems with IP cams aren't with the cameras themselves, but the poor state of open-source media players. Getting mplayer, ffplay, or vlc to play nicely with any ipcam has been a Labor of Hercules. If you're using the versions in repos--which are usually quite stale--all bets are off. I've had much better luck using the latest installers, direct from the project websites. So far, VLC seems to work best for me[1]. [0] https://github.com/BourgeoisBear/amdacli https://github.com/BourgeoisBear/amdacli [1] https://www.videolan.org/vlc/ https://www.videolan.org/vlc/
  • idatum 3y ago
    I recommend explicitly blocking internet access for Amcrest devices. I configured my camera with a static IP and blocked it in my PF rules with logging, and my camera model was making 1000s (16k in 24 hours) of DNS requests for config.amcrestcloud.com. I don't use any of their cloud services.
    • hello_computer 3y ago
      Rather than play whack-a-mole with filters, it's simpler to put mystery-meat devices on a separate VLAN+subnet that doesn't route. Firewall will keep the camera from accessing the internet, but does nothing to protect other hosts on the LAN. The cloud thing can be disabled from their web UI or the HTTP API, but between all of the knock-offs out there (of any brand), and the eventual end of firmware updates, it's best not to trust any of this stuff.
      • k_roy 3y ago
        This is doubly important now that devices are starting to use DNS over HTTPs
        • hello_computer 3y ago
• ben_w 3y ago
  I'm assuming, given where you're asking, that it would be fine to suggest a DIY option? If so: on my desk right now is a Raspberry Pi Zero with a NoIR camera, configured so that when it gets power a small Python script starts up as a web server and begins hosting the camera output. Here's the code for both the server and a webpage to auto-refresh the camera view. MIT license, so have fun: https://github.com/BenWheatley/PiWebcam https://github.com/BenWheatley/PiWebcam
• cmonagle 3y ago
  I'm not sure if this is specifically what you're looking for, but some folks have developed software for the budget "Yi" cameras. It complements (doesn't replace) existing firmware, but you can bypass account creation and disable the manufacturer's cloud. I use mine only occasionally so I don't know how it stands up to frequent use. There are different maintainers for different models, but as far as I can tell they're all pretty similar: https://github.com/search?q=yi%20hack&type=repositories https://github.com/search?q=yi%20hack&type=repositories Edit to add they work pretty well with Home Assistant with this HACS integration: https://github.com/roleoroleo/yi-hack_ha_integration https://github.com/roleoroleo/yi-hack_ha_integration
• angst_ridden 3y ago
  The gear from SCW can be used without any internet connection at all. https://getscw.com https://getscw.com I am not affiliated with them, other than that I've bought equipment from them in the past.
• iaresee 3y ago
  You can build out a UniFi system without giving them any information. The entire system can be run local-only.
  • leesalminen 3y ago
    I was looking at buying a new camera from them to use in standalone mode. AIUI, you are required to have a Protect account to activate newer model cameras. It appears as though they’ve done away with standalone RTSP streams. This is a new change on their newest models.
• sirmoveon 3y ago
  Are you sure you are not stuck at their "easy setup wizards"? To me it seems unlikely that there won't be a webUI access. Which models specifically are you using?
• WarOnPrivacy 3y ago
  Past what's being offered here, IP Cam Talk forum is a great resource. Whatever I've asked, they've got an answer. https://ipcamtalk.com/forums/ https://ipcamtalk.com/forums/
• j_h_o 3y ago
  Bosch, Hanwha, Axis, Ubiquiti/UniFi. I personally prefer Bosch and Hanwha cameras. Great optics, low light performance and solid firmware. Axis tends to be expensive and low light performance is not as good, for the price. UniFi Protect cameras are decent, but the standalone firmware is rather limited. I connect these cameras to Frigate[1] locally. Some example model numbers: Bosch Flexidome IP Starlight 6000 Dome Security Camera - NIN63023A3; Hanwha Techwin XNO-8080R WiseNet X Series Network Bullet Camera 5MP 3.7-9.4mm; AXIS P1468-LE Bullet Camera I usually find these on eBay. [1] https://github.com/blakeblackshear/frigate https://github.com/blakeblackshear/frigate
  • lsllc 3y ago
    +1 for Ubiquiti/UniFi Protect. Their cameras are pretty decent are PoE and can be managed by a local (or remote via VPN) NVR but can also operate standalone RSTP (and web app) if you don't want to run them with an NVR. You can access the NVR via an app on your phone if you want to "cloud enable it" (but it's just a relay of some sort at no additional/recurring cost I might add). I know UBNT have had a few missteps recently, but in general I like their kit and am pretty happy with it.
  • stragies 3y ago
    Thanks, the HomeAssistant integration of frigate.video looks nice! Do you happen to know a way to use the audio-backchannels of the to broadcast audio out of the cameras? And/or use them as "speakerphone" with SIP/xy? Somehow integrate them with pipewire?
• syntaxing 3y ago
  Which Amcrest one did you buy? I recently got their cheaper PoE one and it worked without an app.
• tga 3y ago
  As far as I know, you can also add Hikvision cameras to the list of LAN-only, no-app devices. In general, you probably want to look more towards the commercial CCTV market, even at the cheap end, rather than at any cameras aimed directly at home consumers.
• mavhc 3y ago
  What a really want is a IP camera with open source firmware. It's odd that no one is offering that, think of the money you'd save not writing software
• vanburen 3y ago
  I just purchased an Amcrest IP4M-1041B and IP4M-1041W (Different colors of the same model) and they have a functional web interface. They are available on Amazon.
• rhysrhaven 3y ago
  Dahua and Hikvision are the largest manufactures, with most companies rebranding them. Even if you don't use Synology, this is a handy list. https://www.synology.com/en-us/compatibility/camera https://www.synology.com/en-us/compatibility/camera
  • Jeslijar 3y ago
    Pretty sure hikvision is suspected to have spyware in it. UK has banned it from government sites afaik. China of course denies. https://www.bbc.com/news/world-asia-china-65307503 https://www.bbc.com/news/world-asia-china-65307503 It is known to have major vulnerabilities https://www.bleepingcomputer.com/news/security/over-80-000-exploitable-hikvision-cameras-exposed-online/ https://www.bleepingcomputer.com/news/security/over-80-000-e...
    • dmm 3y ago
      IP cameras in general are little, proprietary computers that you shouldn't trust with internet access. Put them on an isolated network and access them through a more trusted(FOSS) NVR.
    • entrepy123 3y ago
      Yeah, I was going to suggest Hikvision as being a possible/standard good fit for the OP's inquiry (cameras specifically for LAN use "offline" (not connected to public internet). Straight-up Hikvision would be lower cost than US-based rebranders. However, I checked Wikipedia first and saw "In November 2022, the FCC banned sales or import of equipment made by Hikvision". So, Hikvision seems to not be a great answer in 2023 after all (an apparent 100% shift from just several years ago). I wonder about the current status of the ban, and what the rebranders and their distributors are doing; a cursory look at web material still shows Hikvision-derived products AFAICT (though I haven't checked in much depth). As for management software; a dedicated NVR appliance is most convenient IMO in terms of hands-off just-works, but if one wanted to put more time and resources into it, Blue Iris looked interesting the last time I looked several years ago; again, I wonder how that landscape may have updated since then.
• cyphertruck 3y ago
  I have similar needs, but aldo need them to be outdoor/waterproof and PoE capable. I looked at DIY with Raspberry Pi high quality cameras, but the outdoor requirements mean I really need a manufactured housing. (Camera will be in an area very hard to reach for servicing.) I wonder if there is any project to hack the generic chinese camera makes and install custom firmware?
  • anfractuosity 3y ago
    I use a Raspberry Pi with PoE+ hat which I've just placed in a waterproof CCTV enclosure. I used a waterproof ethernet cable gland.
• goodells 3y ago
  For my apartment, I run rtsp-simple-server[1] on my home server and use Raspberry Pis with generic USB webcams running ffmpeg to stream the audio/video to the RTSP server. Then I run camera.ui[2] separately for a nicer interface on top of all the cameras, HomeKit integration, etc. The only downside hardware-wise is I don't get any indoor IR night vision with these, which some of the nicer "smart home" account-locked ones do. It's honestly not too bad to set up if you run [1] and [2] in Docker. I've done disaster recovery scenarios of my home infra where I straight up disconnect the modem's uplink and everything works without any issues. [1] - https://github.com/bluenviron/mediamtx https://github.com/bluenviron/mediamtx [2] - https://github.com/seydx/camera.ui https://github.com/seydx/camera.ui
  • throwanem 3y ago
    > I've done disaster recovery scenarios of my home infra where I straight up disconnect the modem's uplink and everything works without any issues. As a Comcast customer in a region with no competing provider, I really respect and appreciate their proactive stance toward ensuring all their customers frequently have the opportunity to reaffirm this level of confidence in our local networking infrastructures.
  • omgwtfbyobbq 3y ago
    Ditto on the Pis. I use zoneminder, but whatever works, works. I also have a few IR cameras that work ok. The biggest issue is finding decent ir LEDs. The ones that come with the IR cameras aren't great. I purchased standalone IR LEDs, which are better for reliability and ir illumination.
• Jiocus 3y ago
  Just because there's an app available doesn't necessarily mean it's required. It might be that other solutions just haven't been typed out in their docs. I've recently worked with some of D-Links consumer IP cameras, DCS-8302LH and DCS-8000LHV2. They offer an app and optionally cloud storage but they ship with ONVIF support. No web interface afaik, but what I found was that I just needed to start interacting through ONVIF to get going with a local-only setup (this would automatically disconnect the camera from the app as well). These cameras are some of the cheapest available, but they have been solid.
• scosman 3y ago
  Not exactly the ask, but a user friendly alternative is HomeKit cameras with a HomePod mini as a hub for local processing. Some can be paired without any app, and once paired you can block internet access at the router level. You can access them through the local network. If you trust apples e2e encryption you can access remotely through the homepod.
  • ezfe 3y ago
    I was going to say the same. My Logitech Circle has no app, even if I wanted one. All setup is in the Home app and it works even if my home WiFi is not connected to the wider internet.
• pcdoodle 3y ago
  IP cams are an interesting animal. On one side, very versatile but on the other side a huge waist: Most IP cameras use 3W just creating a RTSP stream. add another 5W for IR LEDs that come on in the evening. If i was shopping, i'd look for sensors with very high sensitivity that don't need 5W of IR to get good night images. I have a few where i've physically disconnected the IR array and the shutter will adapt and still get very good static images and a little bit of smearing when something moves. It all depends of your use case though.
  • hello_computer 3y ago
    High sensitivity isn't a solution. It's a basic signal-to-noise issue. If you have a large area and want a crisp image, the light is essential.
  • Kirby64 3y ago
    Broadly, cameras designed to be used with IR are going to look like trash if you can adjust the shutter to work in dark conditions. Smearing is bad. If you want to identify anything, it's worthless. If the goal is to just see if anything is there, then almost any camera works... But that's not useful for much.
• fullstop 3y ago
  Take a look at https://openipc.org/ https://openipc.org/ and choose a camera from their supported list.
  • leesalminen 3y ago
    I’m in a similar situation to OP and recently came across this project. Their supported hardware lists compatible SoCs, not actual make/models of cameras. I’ve found it fairly hard to map an SoC to a camera. Anyone have any suggestions?
    • fullstop 3y ago
      Right, I should have said SoC and not camera in my original post. To install these you will generally need to physically open the camera and attach a serial adapter to issue the commands, so it's probably not for everyone. I'm also curious if anyone has found cameras available through Amazon or Ali which guarantee support. edit: I found this -- https://github.com/OpenIPC/wiki/blob/master/en/guide-supported-devices.md https://github.com/OpenIPC/wiki/blob/master/en/guide-support...
    • rektide 3y ago
      The project is so excellent, so impressive. And needing to open the case & attach a serial connection is not for the faint of heart (but so fun). But above all, it's exactly this that's the biggest problem. I'd wager like 75% of devices have an OpenIPC capable chipset. But there's only rudimentary tracking of what devices have what chipsets. And it's unknown what other wrinkles folks might run into if they do get a device with a valid chipset. Most should just work, but a number will also require more embedded hacking. Such an amazing project though. Stunningly wide support for a huge array of chipsets.
• kowbell 3y ago
  I recently bought two Amcrest cameras (4k[1] and 1080p[2]) and did not need to download an app or make an account to set them up. Both just plugged in to a PoE cable and I was able to access them individually on my WAN by typing in their IPs as well as use them on NVR software. 1: https://a.co/d/8k1BWBY https://a.co/d/8k1BWBY 2: https://a.co/d/4a0xnPP https://a.co/d/4a0xnPP
  • jhot 3y ago
    I use Amcrest cameras with external routing blocked. Integrate nicely over RTSP with my favorite apps and Home Assistant. For Wifi ones, like my doorbell camera, I had to use their app to connect them to Wifi but subsequently block their internet access with no issues. I can still react to events and control settings using Home Assistant and the Dahua HACS plugin.
• qbasic_forever 3y ago
  I don't know if it's supported anymore but some Wyze cameras have an official but unsupported alternative firmware you can flash that exposes them as a local network video stream. They work great and anything on your network can ingest the video. I don't think they made this firmware for their fancier cameras that have motorized pan/tilt etc though.
  • 312c 3y ago
    The firmware exists for the Cam v2, Cam v3, and Cam Pan v1 Cam v2 - https://download.wyzecam.com/firmware/rtsp/demo_4.28.4.51.bin https://download.wyzecam.com/firmware/rtsp/demo_4.28.4.51.bi... Cam v3 - https://download.wyzecam.com/firmware/rtsp/demo_v3_RTSP_4.61.0.1.zip https://download.wyzecam.com/firmware/rtsp/demo_v3_RTSP_4.61... Cam Pan v1 - https://download.wyzecam.com/firmware/rtsp/demo_4.29.4.51.bin https://download.wyzecam.com/firmware/rtsp/demo_4.29.4.51.bi...
  • stevenicr 3y ago
    How do we trust the firmware from a company that had backdoors in their product open to the world? The first time there was a lot of 'well any multi-team product devs could screw up..' but the second time it was exposed they knew of the open exploit for quite some time and chose not to patch it right?
• LukeShu 3y ago
  One trick is to look at whatever camera FRC (high school robotics competition) is using in their kits, since those are requirements for putting the camera on a robot, and they've got to put out a new kit each year, so there will always be a current model. Last I knew, they were using Axis cameras, but that was a few years ago.
• dboreham 3y ago
  Nice to see this because I was mulling posting basically the same question. My quest is to find cameras that don't depend on a cloud service, because in my experience such services are always flaky and end up being EoL'ed. My current setup is Samsung cameras (bought at Costco years ago) which are now suffering from the aforementioned problem. Before that I used RPi with OTS USB cameras and OSS webcam s/w. The RPi burned through their memory cards in short order however. It does appear from the posts here that Axis has the market still.
• zamalek 3y ago
  Reolink cameras are the go-to on many home improvement YouTube channels that I watch - they support ONVIF and RTSP. Unifi is mentioned by other comments: I use it and it does require an app to set up.
• starky 3y ago
  I'm not going to recommend specific cameras (as I work for a company that sells them), but one tip is to look for industrial cameras with ONVIF certification and them look them up in the conformant cameras database [1]. They have a page for each camera that describes how you can connect to them on the first time. [1] https://www.onvif.org/conformant-products/ https://www.onvif.org/conformant-products/
• poorman 3y ago
  I have 4x of these and they work great. They meet all your requirements. They have their own web server on each of them for managing their connections, although I have them all streaming via RTSP into Frigate to do computer vision detection on them. https://www.amazon.com/gp/product/B07S47VXGY https://www.amazon.com/gp/product/B07S47VXGY
• disposition2 3y ago
  I have some Amcrest IP5M-T1179E that didn’t require any external apps for setup.
• deleted 3y ago
  [deleted]
• zorrobyte 3y ago
  Search RTSP on shodan and check out the device models.
• ishanjain28 3y ago
  Reolink! They perform quite well even in direct sunlight(47C temperature) and rain. Low light performance is not super great but I can't blame the camera for that. The only thing missing is the lack of IPv6. I like everything else about it. I have the 510A, 810A and duo 2 poe
  • bri3d 3y ago
    I've had mixed luck with Reolink cameras. The RTSP streams have always been really unreliable for me, although the HTTP streams are pretty good. They also do the classic hardware-manufacturer thing where they send random beta firmwares to people on forums on Google Drive that add massive swaths of features (ONVIF support, even), but then they get lost before they make it to release.
    • martin8412 3y ago
      It wildly depends on the model of camera. Never had an issue with my RLC-823A cameras. I've heard many horror stories about their earlier models.
• mezzomix 3y ago
  I really like my "IN-9008 Full HD" from https://www.instar.com https://www.instar.com - I think it matches all the requirements. (They ship to the US an all cloud services they offer are optional)
• c00lio 3y ago
  Had great experience with Mobotix cameras in internal non-internet-connected networks. There are also models that can write on SD-Cards and such. But I didn't really shop around and compare, don't know how that supplier was picked.
  • Wistar 3y ago
    At our business, we have four Mobotix M16 dual sensor (day/night) cameras, and all here who deal with them rave about them.
• cheekibreeki2 3y ago
  Amcrest
• asylteltine 3y ago
  [dead]
• fabioyy 3y ago
  A little off topic, i don´t know your use case, but you can use an old phone as webcam, they will be better in quality than any IP camera. A little example using my old galaxy s11. ( its connected to a pc using usb, airplane mode, no internet ) https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=2CDE7PsLwzk https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=2CDE7PsLwzk
  • disposition2 3y ago
    Be careful when doing this. If left unchecked this could very easily start a fire. I did this with an old Nexus 5 and it only took a couple of days before I had a spicy pillow. Although, this probably works well for a device with a removable battery and that can be powered by USB alone.
    • freedomben 3y ago
      Yes, this is solid advice. If you are going to leave it plugged in all the time, check on the battery regularly to make sure it isn't swelling.
      • bobbean 3y ago
        Would it be possible to use the phone without a battery?
        • blobcode 3y ago
          There are a good number of androids that can run without a battery as long as they are plugged in, though that varies by model and manufacturer.
        • megous 3y ago
          If the hardware and software are designed and tested for it, then yes. Otherwise you may run into various issues caused by phone self-limiting power it takes from USB port. Some kind of negotiation needs to happen before the phone can safely raise the input power limits. If it needs more than currently allowed, it will just poweroff immediately, instead of satisfying the excess need from the battery.
• bombcar 3y ago
  I buy very cheap PoE cameras that are direct from China, and block the living daylights out of them at the firewalls so they can't leak to the internet.
  • donmcronald 3y ago
    Avoid Amazon Blink stuff if you do this. I set some up for someone and they're a total scam. They advertise a local only mode that doesn't require a subscription, but it's crippled and makes the cameras nearly unusable. They disable thumbnails and bulk deletion of video. Worst of all, they'll stealthily enable a "trial" subscription for 3 months when you set them up in local mode, so they seem ok until they get crippled with demands for a subscription fee.
    • bombcar 3y ago
      Oh, certainly. If the "user manual" has anything but Chinese characters and absolutely broken Engrish, run screaming. You want something yumcha like https://www.alptopsecurity.com/20.html https://www.alptopsecurity.com/20.html
• tehlike 3y ago
  You didn't ask for this, but I have been using Camect as the "camera hub" for my home, and i love it. I wanted something i can mix-match different cameras, and could essentially use an IP camera on an internal network, but still have "AI" capabilities. Give it a look in case it's something you'd need. As for Wyze, WYZE has "dafang hacks" and also "official firmware" that converts the camera to an RTSP.
• cvwright 3y ago
  One helpful tip to avoid most of the sketchy cheap cameras that try to send your data to China: Look for "NDAA compliant" cameras that are approved for use by the US government. There's a Taiwanese brand Vivotek that makes some relatively affordable NDAA cameras. I'm hoping to try them out myself, but unfortunately haven't had time yet.
• acd 3y ago
  Axis cameras
• xorrop 3y ago
  OP didn't mention, but is this purchase for personal or resale/client purposes? I ask because there are NDAA/FAR purchasing requirements that the client may be under. Axis and Geovision both have NDAA compliant equipment. Dahua and Hikvision are cheap but they're like E.T. - they phone "home".
• xony 3y ago
  i have a camera that requires app, my wifi account , cloud connectivity etc .. possibility is that 1.they may watch us live 2.sell the data to thief , or a hacker would hack it and sell it to thief 3.spam our mails 4.push ads , suuckk our data , may run crypto/ads mining
• thewataccount 3y ago
  Which Amcrest cameras did you buy? I noticed the "consumer" ones that are targeted at the non-techy have that issue. But last I saw the 60$ PTZ model didn't require an app at all (admittedly a little bit ago)?
  • rocmcd 3y ago
    Just an FYI it might not need an app but the Amcrest cameras I have do phone home pretty aggressively. I black-holed them on my network, but no idea what kind of data it might be sending back.
• burnte 3y ago
  Ubiquiti.
• cameron_b 3y ago
  I want to add a term that I haven't seen in this discussion so far. IP cameras can interoperate with Open Standard NVR systems using ONVIF. [0] ONVIF cameras, or cameras that support ONVIF are capable of communicating settings and streaming video to recording servers without intermediaries. RTSP or MJPEG are available as media layers ( not the only ones, but ones called out so far in the conversation as desirable for viewing and recording), but the ONVIF configuration makes this easier. Looking for ONVIF cameras will help you find cameras that might not NEED the app for full functionality use even though, like Reolink, they may offer one. The NVR is the appropriate "glue" for those app functions. Examples of ONVIF NVRs are not rare, but self-hostable, and free to try or use at some scale are hard to find. These are often the Big Boys. Milestone XProtect, Senstar [ Aimetis] Symphony, but also more DIY options like iSpy, Blueiris, and things in the middle, like Orchid from IPConfigure [1] that you can run on a Raspberry Pi at a small scale, or a Hybrid Cloud setup for enterprise use. [0] - https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/ONVIF https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/ONVIF [1] - https://www.ipconfigure.com/ https://www.ipconfigure.com/
  • KyleBerezin 3y ago
    I've done this a lot, it has worked with every ONVIF capable camera I have tried. It is sometimes a real nightmare to figure out the stream location and video settings though.
  • supergeek 3y ago
    Additionally, Amcrest sells ONVIF compatible cameras that do have a web UI and can connect to any of those NVRs, or a wide number of ONVIF viewer apps on any device you want. They're a bit more expensive, but still dirt cheap compared to more reputable brands mentioned in this thread.
• jasonjayr 3y ago
  We recently setup Ring, but without a subscription they don't save/record anything, and of course are (creepily) cloud dependant. Is there any similar hardware that (a) Can run local only? (b) Is "non-tech partner-proof"? (ie, looks decent on a house, works reliably, wifi/24vac or PoE) Are there any self-hosted apps/servers that can replace the Ring software?
  • jmbwell 3y ago
    For this, I would consider UniFi Protect. Their doorbell cam is nice, their other cameras are nice, their software isn't the worst by a mile. With some simple detours, you can set up a Protect system -- cameras and "console" (NVR) -- to operate completely independent of the cloud, or altogether isolated if you like. Attractive devices and family-friendly. Homekit compatible via an excellent Homebridge plugin. Not necessarily the cheapest, but, again, there are no recurring fees, either, as there would be for much equipment of similar quality.
• MarkusWandel 3y ago
  I have my sketchy Chinacams on a "red LAN" that does not have internet access. It only goes to the second ethernet port on the device that does the capture/motion detect; it does not route to the internet or even do DNS resolution. This was originally done to keep all that traffic off my main LAN, but it has a handy anti-cloud/anti-spyware firewall purpose too. My Chinacams come from an era, though, where all you had to do is uncheck "cloud" in the ridiculous ActiveX required GUI setup, and that was it for them trying to access the internet. Things may have changed; the last of these didn't even let me set a password to get into the GUI before activating through the cloud and that was a few years ago. Spending extra to get a commercial grade camera is really not that bad if you plan to use the camera for a while.
• bri3d 3y ago
  Loryta 5442. There are whole forums for this topic - check out the ipcamtalk site.
• tezza 3y ago
  I’ve used Dericam. TS Mpeg stream to a home NAS I had to wrap the microphone cable in aluminium foil and expand the plastic microphone hole to get decent sound capture. But they’re cost effective and stay in the LAN http://www.dericam.com/index.php?s=/List/index/cid/9.html http://www.dericam.com/index.php?s=/List/index/cid/9.html
• b112 3y ago
  reolink
• lbotos 3y ago
  Anyone have experience with Hanwha Techwin? I've been debating between them an Axis.
• mountainofdeath 3y ago
  Axis supports ONVIF as do HikVision and Dahua (if you are OK with Chinese brands). I've yet to find an ONVIF compatible camera with reasonable quality that didn't cost $$$.
• T3RMINATED 3y ago
  [dead]
• user3939382 3y ago
  Hikvision ONVIF cameras are my professional recommendation. They can be had on eBay for about ~$120.
  • rasz 3y ago
    afaik they still call the mothership regularly
• joshstrange 3y ago
  After managing ZoneMinder for years I finally went with Reolink and I've been very happy with their cameras and NVR. Now it "just works" and I never think about it. I use their app sometimes to view the streams but via holes I punched in my network (you could also VPN) and I don't use any of their "cloud" features. If you wanted you could hook up your own client to the streams off the NVR, I have HomeAssistant grabbing those feeds and that's how I view my cameras 90% of the time.
  • samtho 3y ago
    I use Reolink as well, they work reasonably well, inexpensive, PoE, and speak ONVIF.
  • ShakataGaNai 3y ago
    Reolink are the perfect price/performance for home use, in my book. Are they perfect? No. The focus drifts on some models after time (they'll fix it on their own, just not perfectly crisp all the time). The quality of video is "ok". Etc. I'd love to go Axis, those are AMAZING. But an Axis dome camera is about $600 and Reolink is $90. If you're a business, Axis is the way to go. For home? Reolink. All the individual cameras in my house are on their own LAN simply because they are plugged directly into the Reolink NVR. I can block the NVR from internet access if I choose. Doesn't seem to need it, other than for remote camera viewing. Which I can do via tailscale.
  • Shish2k 3y ago
    +1 for reolink - I have four of them, running with both network and power over ethernet, each initially configured via their individual built-in web server, and now all hooked up seamlessly with home assistant. My only complaint is that the model I bought 4 of has been deprecated, and the closest equivalent is more featureful but more expensive :(
• MegaDeKay 3y ago
  You don't mention your use case but the ESP32-CAM gets you an ESP32-based wifi streaming camera for about $10 USD. No app. No account. Surprisingly powerful. https://randomnerdtutorials.com/esp32-cam-video-streaming-face-recognition-arduino-ide/ https://randomnerdtutorials.com/esp32-cam-video-streaming-fa...
  • mkeedlinger 3y ago
    This is cool, and I have one of these! It's performance can be surprising both ways: somehow I am both underwhelmed and impressed at the same time. I'm for sure looking for an alternative though.
  • deepspace 3y ago
    Have they fixed the stability issues yet? When I last looked at ESP32-CAM a couple of years ago, it was so unstable as to be unusable. Have newer versions of software and/or hardware made an improvement?
    • MegaDeKay 3y ago
      I don't know. Got one myself a short while ago but have not gotten to trying it out yet. I'd be quite surprised if it hasn't improved over that time though.
  • kbar13 3y ago
    esp32-cam is just ok. the quality of the camera is generally very very low. it also can't do h264 meaning that certain integrations like streaming/recording/detecting motion in apple home will require you to do transcodes on some other hardware (which can get expensive).
• ta1243 3y ago
  Currently using some canon cr-c300s for remote production from a music festival this weekend. They seem to do the job, depends whether you're happy with ndi-hx or not (we're actually taking the SDI out and putting them into Magewells with speedhq) Probably not the price range you're thinking of. PTZ control and preview is via a normal webpage. https://www.canon.co.uk/ptz-cameras/cr-x300/ https://www.canon.co.uk/ptz-cameras/cr-x300/
• opello 3y ago
  Disappointing to hear about Amcrest. I was hoping to go that route as my single IP8M-T2669EW-AI has worked so well for me. I guess this means it's going with Axis which is only disappointing from a cost perspective.
• kbar13 3y ago
  i use yi home camera (4 pack on amazon for $72 currently) which runs over wifi and firmware via https://github.com/roleoroleo/yi-hack-Allwinner-v2 https://github.com/roleoroleo/yi-hack-Allwinner-v2. this bypasses the app and internet connection entirely. you will need some microSD cards to flash and run the cameras. this exposes RTSP/ONVIF and also allows for local motion detection and recording capabilities. i also use https://www.scrypted.app/ https://www.scrypted.app/ to handle MQTT for motion detection events from the camera and restream to apple home to take advantage of notifications on my phone, remote streaming, etc. this works fairly well, the downsides are that the install process is probably more involved than it should be, and the stand it comes with is just /ok/ but the mounting bracket is such that you can 3d print your own fairly easily. 1080 stream quality is good enough tho i'm sure there are better quality cameras on the market.
• allenbrunson 3y ago
  as long as we are talking about security cameras, i have a related question. i have a bunch of power-over-ethernet cameras installed in my home. all the ethernet cables route back to a server box, which has a hard drive for saving the video for about a week. it also has a mobile app that lets me view the feeds in realtime. so far, so good. now, what can i do to also route the video footage to, say, AWS or some other cloud storage option, and have it deleted after a week or so, the same as my camera hub server currently does? i figure this will require me to buy a new server hub box, and that is fine with me. the one i have now is adequate, at best. i'd rather have a better one.
• rasz 3y ago
  Xiaomi yi with replacement firmware https://github.com/alienatedsec/yi-hack-v5 https://github.com/alienatedsec/yi-hack-v5
• mikalauskas 3y ago
  Hikvision cameras does not require any app and work without internet and without account
• npteljes 3y ago
  I have an Axis cam that I purchased used, quite cheap. It basically runs Linux, a web server, something that serves RTSP, and maybe other things too. It has a neat web UI for administration, online manuals, and easy endpoints where you can get camera output and metadata easily. I can highly recommend.
• andrewstuart 3y ago
  Maybe just buy a webcam.
• roobre 3y ago
  I own two Reolink cameras. These are very cheap, like 50 EUR or so, and come with wireless and ethernet connectivity. They speak RTSP and have a web UI. You can set them up entirely locally through that web UI. I cannot attest whether they phone home or not as I run them on an isolated network, but they work fairly well and the web UI exposes all the features the camera has.
• villgax 3y ago
  TP-Link works with web UI & App. Allows rtsp too.
• stevemethiew 3y ago
  [dead]