14 ms·

The idea that any of these would normally worry an average young teen is hilarious to me. I grew up during cold war, USSR collapse, multiple wars in the region.

The idea that any of these would normally worry an average young teen is hilarious to me. I grew up during cold war, USSR collapse, multiple wars in the region. At no point was I (or any of my peers to my knowledge) gravely concerned for our future. Because none of us yet had any idea what our normal future is supposed to look like. The only way these mild horrors get into children heads is, again, through social media.

demindiro 3y ago
We have a hot war right now on the border of the EU that likely will escalate further. I'm sure China has plans too.
- marcusverus 3y ago
  Why would China have plans? China is well on their way to becoming the unrivaled military power of the world in the next couple of decades. All they have to do is wait and let the current trends play out. The only possible way to derail their ascent is a premature war--economic or otherwise--with the west.
  - arbitrary_name 3y ago
    I do not think this is necessarily the case. Their population is ageing rapidly, with due consequences for the company between citizens and the CCP. Internal tendons between the rich coastal regions, attracting all the labor, and the hollowed out interior could cause issues. I don't think their ascendancy is necessity assured.
- HaZeust 3y ago
  I mean, barring legitimacy on 2023 doom-and-gloom rhetoric, those who grew up during the Cold War do have this generation beat when it comes to warmongery worries. Problem is, there was not nearly as much domestic disarray back then - and there was still a sense of unity.
  - kibwen 3y ago
    > there was not nearly as much domestic disarray back then - and there was still a sense of unity The more one looks, the less this appears to be true. Malcom X and the Black Panthers didn't arise because things were just peachy. MLK's murder wasn't just a stray bullet. When the Philadelphia Police Department dropped a bomb on their own city, it wasn't just an accident. When the National Guard massacred a defenseless crowd of students in Ohio, it wasn't because twenty-eight trigger fingers slipped simultaneously. All while McCarthyism ran rampant, dividing Americans into Faithful Patriots and Godless Communists, pitting neighbor against neighbor in a nationalistic furor gleefully fed by the upper echelons of government, media, and industry. I ain't trying to say things are going well these days, but let's not forget how shitty the past was.
    - deleted 3y ago
      [deleted]
anigbrowl 3y ago
I grew up in approximately the same period and grim possibilities, along with local economic problems to a lesser extent, were certainly a concern for me and my peers. Other risks existed as well, kids in my neighborhood school died of drug overdoses, accidents, and medical problems. Others had to deal with poverty, abusive parents, or a family member behind bars. Back then middle aged people blamed television your any despondency among youth. I imagine previous generations blamed radio and newspapers. The only way these mild horrors get into children heads is, again, through social media. School shootings are such a regular feature of American life that every school holds safety drills for the risk. I don't think all children get to enjoy the same sort of carefree bubble that you did. Media certainly amplifies the awareness of problems but many kids are far better informed than many adults admit, or want to be themselves.
- lumb63 3y ago
  > School shootings are such a regular feature of American life […] Media certainly amplifies the awareness of problems Case in point: in 2022 there were 51 school shootings [1]. Certainly more than I’d like there to be, but in a nation with about 129,000 schools [2], I certainly wouldn’t call them a “regular feature”. If students are in school for 18 years, let’s say, to include pre-K, Kindergarten, and an undergrad degree, and the number of school shootings stayed steady for that whole time, they’d be in school for 918 school shootings, or a 0.7% chance that they go to a school which experiences a school shooting. Not common. Yet the media reports them heavily, and that causes fear, and that fear is what drives schools to hold safety drills regularly to prepare students for these situations. [1]: https://www.edweek.org/leadership/school-shootings-this-year-how-many-and-where/2022/01 https://www.edweek.org/leadership/school-shootings-this-year... [2]: https://www.edweek.org/leadership/education-statistics-facts-about-american-schools/2019/01 https://www.edweek.org/leadership/education-statistics-facts...
  - NoImmatureAdHom 3y ago
    I would add that many of the "school shootings" counted in the edweek.org data are not what most people would understand to be school shootings. Things like Person A shoots Person B outside of a school, nobody dies, neither A or B are students, teachers, or otherwise affiliated with the school. Edweek is providing what are known as "advocacy numbers", in that they are stretching the truth as much as they possibly can. Your kid's chances of being killed in a school shooting are about the same as being struck and killed by lightning (many more people are struck and survive).
Loquebantur 3y ago
Things can kill your fast or slow, right now or in the distant future. You end up dead regardless, so you need to avoid them all. Also, you seem to conflate locally and personally with globally and universally relevant. Threats are diverse and not restricted to being simplistic. Proper handling necessitates serious effort on all levels and certainly isn't done by relying on tradition.
worik 3y ago
Not me I was terrified my entire adolescence by the prospect of nuclear war
HaZeust 3y ago
I've seen a lot of assertions that the rhetoric and agenda online or on social media exist from those places in isolation, and "don't reflect the real world". The problem with this line of thinking is that the majority of humans with access to the internet in 2023 use the information they acquire online as a means to build their real-world beliefs and values. This idea that social media/online doesn't reflect the real world isn't true; it has made our present-day beliefs of the real-world, and has seeped out of the monitor and into our individual psyches and collective consciousness.
birdyrooster 3y ago
Your comment is a case study on pathological dismissiveness.
poulsbohemian 3y ago
I think you are underestimating kids. Does the average child / teen have the same level of detailed understanding of the world as an informed adult? Likely not. But - I can tell you that on the elementary playground during the 2016 election, my kids and their peers were very aware of the threat to the kids whose parents had come (legally or otherwise) from Mexico as it pertained to the two candidates and parties. Heck, when I was that age back in the 80s, there was a group of kids very angry at my dad because he pushed through zoning / permitting regulations that their construction industry parents didn't like. Imagine as a 9 year old having to defend urban growth policy! And that was in a poor, shitty subburb.
soulofmischief 3y ago
Your lack of imagination is your own; Kids today have a better understanding of the economic lifecycle in which they're being forced to participate.
goodpoint 3y ago
> The only way these mild horrors get into children heads is, again, through social media. I never heard a better justification for blissful ignorance and no, it's not a good thing.
still_grokking 3y ago
There are no issues, sure. At least as long everybody practices the three apes method…
atleastoptimal 3y ago
In the past, it was a crisis of the present, with hope for the future. Now, it's a tranquil present, with no hope for the future. While the latter is materially better, psychologically it's far more damning. Every single successful society survived on a story, or myth, of a better future. The current Western world is the only society that has fully abandoned that notion, and we are seeing the consequences. Every single political struggle, artificial conflict and strife is downstream of this fundamental disruption in this core societal promise.
skeaker 3y ago
It's really strange that your idea of a solution to the problems that you tacitly admit exist is to just not tell people about them.
r00fus 3y ago
All of those things impact family stability and happiness. That impacts kids' lives quite immensely. Social media isn't the cure, but it sure as hell didn't cause all those other things.
kar5pt 3y ago
That doesn't really sound comparable unless you actually grew up in the USSR (your comment is kind of ambiguous as to whether you're from the area or just grew up in the US during that time period). The soviet era had the risk of nuclear, but there was still a good chance that would never happen. By contrast, most of the things OP mentioned are already happening.
jhbadger 3y ago
But the USSR collapse was (at least outside Russia) a great thing. Eastern Europe was no longer colonized by Russia and in the West, the fear of nuclear war was gone.
autoexec 3y ago
> I grew up during cold war, USSR collapse, multiple wars in the region. At no point was I (or any of my peers to my knowledge) gravely concerned for our future. Kids in our day got it through regular media. The cold war had a big influence on music at the time and shows like The Day After (https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/The_Day_After https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/The_Day_After) were on TV. I was very aware that we could be nuked at any moment, and later, that we were destroying the environment. We had the rest of the world's evils pushed on us by Very Special Episodes and After School Specials. I had plenty of other mundane concerns to worry about too, but concern for our future was always there in the background. Kids today get it much worse since the message is that it's already too late and we're basically doomed.
CalRobert 3y ago
I'm 40 and was worried about climate change even as an 8-10 year old.

demindiro 3y ago

We have a hot war right now on the border of the EU that likely will escalate further. I'm sure China has plans too.

marcusverus 3y ago
Why would China have plans? China is well on their way to becoming the unrivaled military power of the world in the next couple of decades. All they have to do is wait and let the current trends play out. The only possible way to derail their ascent is a premature war--economic or otherwise--with the west.
- arbitrary_name 3y ago
  I do not think this is necessarily the case. Their population is ageing rapidly, with due consequences for the company between citizens and the CCP. Internal tendons between the rich coastal regions, attracting all the labor, and the hollowed out interior could cause issues. I don't think their ascendancy is necessity assured.
HaZeust 3y ago
I mean, barring legitimacy on 2023 doom-and-gloom rhetoric, those who grew up during the Cold War do have this generation beat when it comes to warmongery worries. Problem is, there was not nearly as much domestic disarray back then - and there was still a sense of unity.
- kibwen 3y ago
  > there was not nearly as much domestic disarray back then - and there was still a sense of unity The more one looks, the less this appears to be true. Malcom X and the Black Panthers didn't arise because things were just peachy. MLK's murder wasn't just a stray bullet. When the Philadelphia Police Department dropped a bomb on their own city, it wasn't just an accident. When the National Guard massacred a defenseless crowd of students in Ohio, it wasn't because twenty-eight trigger fingers slipped simultaneously. All while McCarthyism ran rampant, dividing Americans into Faithful Patriots and Godless Communists, pitting neighbor against neighbor in a nationalistic furor gleefully fed by the upper echelons of government, media, and industry. I ain't trying to say things are going well these days, but let's not forget how shitty the past was.
  - deleted 3y ago
    [deleted]

anigbrowl 3y ago

I grew up in approximately the same period and grim possibilities, along with local economic problems to a lesser extent, were certainly a concern for me and my peers. Other risks existed as well, kids in my neighborhood school died of drug overdoses, accidents, and medical problems. Others had to deal with poverty, abusive parents, or a family member behind bars. Back then middle aged people blamed television your any despondency among youth. I imagine previous generations blamed radio and newspapers. The only way these mild horrors get into children heads is, again, through social media. School shootings are such a regular feature of American life that every school holds safety drills for the risk. I don't think all children get to enjoy the same sort of carefree bubble that you did. Media certainly amplifies the awareness of problems but many kids are far better informed than many adults admit, or want to be themselves.

lumb63 3y ago
> School shootings are such a regular feature of American life […] Media certainly amplifies the awareness of problems Case in point: in 2022 there were 51 school shootings [1]. Certainly more than I’d like there to be, but in a nation with about 129,000 schools [2], I certainly wouldn’t call them a “regular feature”. If students are in school for 18 years, let’s say, to include pre-K, Kindergarten, and an undergrad degree, and the number of school shootings stayed steady for that whole time, they’d be in school for 918 school shootings, or a 0.7% chance that they go to a school which experiences a school shooting. Not common. Yet the media reports them heavily, and that causes fear, and that fear is what drives schools to hold safety drills regularly to prepare students for these situations. [1]: https://www.edweek.org/leadership/school-shootings-this-year-how-many-and-where/2022/01 https://www.edweek.org/leadership/school-shootings-this-year... [2]: https://www.edweek.org/leadership/education-statistics-facts-about-american-schools/2019/01 https://www.edweek.org/leadership/education-statistics-facts...
- NoImmatureAdHom 3y ago
  I would add that many of the "school shootings" counted in the edweek.org data are not what most people would understand to be school shootings. Things like Person A shoots Person B outside of a school, nobody dies, neither A or B are students, teachers, or otherwise affiliated with the school. Edweek is providing what are known as "advocacy numbers", in that they are stretching the truth as much as they possibly can. Your kid's chances of being killed in a school shooting are about the same as being struck and killed by lightning (many more people are struck and survive).

Loquebantur 3y ago

Things can kill your fast or slow, right now or in the distant future. You end up dead regardless, so you need to avoid them all. Also, you seem to conflate locally and personally with globally and universally relevant. Threats are diverse and not restricted to being simplistic. Proper handling necessitates serious effort on all levels and certainly isn't done by relying on tradition.

worik 3y ago

Not me I was terrified my entire adolescence by the prospect of nuclear war

HaZeust 3y ago

I've seen a lot of assertions that the rhetoric and agenda online or on social media exist from those places in isolation, and "don't reflect the real world". The problem with this line of thinking is that the majority of humans with access to the internet in 2023 use the information they acquire online as a means to build their real-world beliefs and values. This idea that social media/online doesn't reflect the real world isn't true; it has made our present-day beliefs of the real-world, and has seeped out of the monitor and into our individual psyches and collective consciousness.

birdyrooster 3y ago

Your comment is a case study on pathological dismissiveness.

poulsbohemian 3y ago

I think you are underestimating kids. Does the average child / teen have the same level of detailed understanding of the world as an informed adult? Likely not. But - I can tell you that on the elementary playground during the 2016 election, my kids and their peers were very aware of the threat to the kids whose parents had come (legally or otherwise) from Mexico as it pertained to the two candidates and parties. Heck, when I was that age back in the 80s, there was a group of kids very angry at my dad because he pushed through zoning / permitting regulations that their construction industry parents didn't like. Imagine as a 9 year old having to defend urban growth policy! And that was in a poor, shitty subburb.

soulofmischief 3y ago

Your lack of imagination is your own; Kids today have a better understanding of the economic lifecycle in which they're being forced to participate.

goodpoint 3y ago

> The only way these mild horrors get into children heads is, again, through social media. I never heard a better justification for blissful ignorance and no, it's not a good thing.

still_grokking 3y ago

There are no issues, sure. At least as long everybody practices the three apes method…

atleastoptimal 3y ago

In the past, it was a crisis of the present, with hope for the future. Now, it's a tranquil present, with no hope for the future. While the latter is materially better, psychologically it's far more damning. Every single successful society survived on a story, or myth, of a better future. The current Western world is the only society that has fully abandoned that notion, and we are seeing the consequences. Every single political struggle, artificial conflict and strife is downstream of this fundamental disruption in this core societal promise.

skeaker 3y ago

It's really strange that your idea of a solution to the problems that you tacitly admit exist is to just not tell people about them.

r00fus 3y ago

All of those things impact family stability and happiness. That impacts kids' lives quite immensely. Social media isn't the cure, but it sure as hell didn't cause all those other things.

kar5pt 3y ago

That doesn't really sound comparable unless you actually grew up in the USSR (your comment is kind of ambiguous as to whether you're from the area or just grew up in the US during that time period). The soviet era had the risk of nuclear, but there was still a good chance that would never happen. By contrast, most of the things OP mentioned are already happening.

jhbadger 3y ago

But the USSR collapse was (at least outside Russia) a great thing. Eastern Europe was no longer colonized by Russia and in the West, the fear of nuclear war was gone.

autoexec 3y ago

> I grew up during cold war, USSR collapse, multiple wars in the region. At no point was I (or any of my peers to my knowledge) gravely concerned for our future. Kids in our day got it through regular media. The cold war had a big influence on music at the time and shows like The Day After (https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/The_Day_After https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/The_Day_After) were on TV. I was very aware that we could be nuked at any moment, and later, that we were destroying the environment. We had the rest of the world's evils pushed on us by Very Special Episodes and After School Specials. I had plenty of other mundane concerns to worry about too, but concern for our future was always there in the background. Kids today get it much worse since the message is that it's already too late and we're basically doomed.

CalRobert 3y ago

I'm 40 and was worried about climate change even as an 8-10 year old.