10 ms·

I was interested in seeing the kind of job opportunities this would create. Especially after reading Chip War [1] which goes into the history of the offshoring

• throw9away6 3y ago
  Medium/low pay for the work required
  • andrei_says_ 3y ago
    This statement sounds cynical. I hate the fact that I agree - feeling cynical myself. At this point when I read about $megacorp moving production to the US, I see an indication of globalization-level exploitation and profits being applied to the US labor market.
    • RandomTisk 3y ago
      Those are still quite livable wages, I'm not seeing tremendous wealth but I'm not seeing any exploitation either. I imagine in fifty years some people will be getting paid minimum wage accomplishing basically the same output that a masters degree + 250k+ salary is pulling in now, it all depends on the technology in the tools.
      • throw9away6 3y ago
        These were livable wages 3 years ago. Now it’s surviving wages
    • ajmurmann 3y ago
      > At this point when I read about $megacorp moving production to the US, I see an indication of globalization-level exploitation and profits being applied to the US labor market. What do you expect or want to happen? Companies will pay the lowest price they can to adequately fill the role they need to fill. As everything it comes down to demand and supply. If lots of folks are available who can fill the role well, the comp is gonna be pretty low. Do you want companies to pay more just out of charity? When apples are on sale, do you ever just pay double the price because it feels fairer? The only place where we do this is with tips and that's usually already priced in.
      • throw9away6 3y ago
        At that pay band they are looking for warm body levels of fill. Like we need a guy to sit in chair for compliance reasons but he probably shouldn’t touch any of the controls level of pay. Like for reference brown bear car wash pays 22 per hour and a straight out of 2 year trade school mechanic gets 37 with union benefits in Washington state (outside Seattle)
        • ajmurmann 3y ago
          Sounds like they won't be able to hire at that price then. Nice how these problems solve themselves.
      • andrei_says_ 3y ago
        > what do you expect to happen? I am not surprised, I am disappointed. I hope that we’ll at some point consider economic models that account for externalities, for the finite nature of Earth, for our humanity. Like the donut economics model aiming for sustainability - or a similar approach.
        • ajmurmann 3y ago
          I too am hoping that we could account for negative externalities and therefore would love to see a carbon tax for example. Can you explain what the unaccounted externality is in this case?
  • antonjs 3y ago
    I've got to admit I was pretty surprised when I learned about the pay + hard work setup for semi engineers at TSMC in Taiwan. I'd be curious if anyone has any first hand experience with it.
    • justinclift 3y ago
      A (westerner) friend who lived in Taiwan for a few years returned recently. He keeps on saying the general lifestyle and living conditions in Taiwan are really lousy compared to Australia. eg the climate is so wet/humid in Taiwan that the buildings tend to generate mold, most things are run down, and that kind of thing. Didn't sound like a good place to live (yeah, as a generalisation), if you've got a choice in the matter.
    • throwaway2037 3y ago
      Total comp for onshore TSMC engineers is surprisingly low compared to finance or tech jobs in the US. Yes, cost of living is lower in Taiwan, but most of the big factories are outside mid-sized, unappealing cities. (I'm looking at you Taichung and Hsinchu.)
• rayiner 3y ago
  That asic digital designer range is really low unless the equity is very generous.
  • thatoneguy 3y ago
    Yeah, I remember meeting someone who designed ASICs back in 2000 or 2001 and he made ~$260k/year ($1000/work day) as a salaried employee for a certain large printer company.
• senko 3y ago
  Pick any two: - better wages - US jobs - lower price
  • skywal_l 3y ago
    Doesn't the first and last one cancel each other out?
    • fakedang 3y ago
      Lower price of the product I presume.
    • _the_special_ 3y ago
      If you want better wages (relative to the location the employees are) and also lower prices of goods, then you can't have production in the US
      • skywal_l 3y ago
        I understand that, but if better wages lead to increase costs, it should be a zero sum game in the grand scheme of things. But, at least, you are not dependent on China for making stuff.
      • lstamour 3y ago
        I dunno, I think it’s actually Pick three: - extreme corporate profits - better wages - US jobs - lower prices You can’t optimize both for extreme shareholder returns and extreme wealth at the top and also pay first world good wages/living standards and have lower prices. Unfortunately, in this race, shareholder returns is often still the last thing compromised on, it seems.
        • AnthonyMouse 3y ago
          That's not actually pick three. It's that if you have uncompetitive markets (and therefore high rents/inefficiency), you end up with worse wages, loss of US jobs and high prices. Because then the price companies can charge is no longer tied to their labor cost, so they can cut labor costs without lowering prices. This is clearly what's happened and needs fixing, but even after that, you still have a trade off between high-paying US jobs and low consumer prices. But the answer to that one isn't as obvious because it isn't linear. In a competitive market, competition with labor in other countries might cause you to get paid $1000/year less, but lower your cost of living by $2000/year.
• PragmaticPulp 3y ago
  These are in Fort Collins, CO. It's the 151st largest metro area in the US, so it's not really a tech jobs hub. Getting up to $150K plus equity and benefits wouldn't be a great salary in San Jose or Seattle, but it's not out of line with a lot of tech jobs in less populated metro areas.
  • Kye 3y ago
    https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Fort_Collins,_Colorado#Economy https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Fort_Collins,_Colorado#Economy >> "Many high-tech companies have relocated to Fort Collins because of the resources of Colorado State University and its research facilities. Hewlett-Packard, Intel, AMD, Broadcom, Beckman Coulter, Microsoft, Rubicon Water and Pelco all have offices in Fort Collins. Other industries include clean energy, bioscience, and agri-tech businesses." Maybe not a hub yet, but it's headed that way. It's also only an hour away from Denver.
    • CubsFan1060 3y ago
      It's sadly been moving a bit the other way. HP/HPE have significantly downsized and Microsoft's office is pretty tiny. I"m not sure AMD even has an office here anymore, if so, they took down the sign on the building it used to be on. HP, Broadcom, Intel, and AMD used to all be on the same intersection.
      • open-paren 3y ago
        And Intel just chopped the size of the office in half. They don't use the upper floor anymore.
    • BowBun 3y ago
      People who have been to Fort Collins know that that city needs a _lot_ of infrastructure work to become anything more than it is now. FC already bulges under the pressure of college move-in/out and tourism there is fairly big for Coloradans. I also don't think residents are the kinds that would go for large expansion. Denver still has more than enough room to grow before they push out into the smaller towns, and if they did Boulder would go first since it already has a startup ecosystem IMO.
• dylan604 3y ago
  >12.25 hour shifts I've never seen this. Is that a required 15 overlap for shift change?
  • grecy 3y ago
    That is exactly what my buddies do in the Alberta oilsands for exactly the overlap reason.
  • tomassre 3y ago
    12 hour shifts are 13+ hours of actually being there because of lunch / breaks. For example Genentech in SF / Vacaville are "12 hours paid shifts" with 1 hour mandatory lunch. So no it is not required for an overlap because there i already a required by law break (lunch) that forces overlap (assuming this applies to more states than just CA).
    • dylan604 3y ago
      This is the way it was handled when I worked in a place that had 3 8 hour shifts. You actually were there 8.5 hours with a 30 minute lunch, so this additional .25 hours just seemed odd that it was necessary.
• nimbius 3y ago
  General Mechanical Technician is another name for mechanical maintenance. in my experience, if "alarm response" is a big part of the gig then run for the hills because this company intends to run their equipment until its literally a pile of flaming grease and beeping melted plastic. alarm response means you as a mech tech/mechanical maintenance have failed proactive or preventative work and will spend the rest of your career working mandatory overtime to fix what aint fixable anymore. the reason for this failure is nearly always management pushing for higher uptime and output. alarm response should never constitute a new factories big ticket issues.
• neximo64 3y ago
  The competition is Taiwan, you realise that? - Automation can't easily justify higher salaries, as it is highly automated to begin with. - The product's pricing has to be cheap too, which is going to be difficult.