6 ms·
1 in 5 adults don’t want children –– and they don’t regret it later
- amriksohata 3y agoI read that as 80% want children, those who say they arent having children to save the planet...whom are you saving it for?
- californiadreem 3y agoA Fox one day spied a beautiful bunch of ripe grapes hanging from a vine trained along the branches of a tree. The grapes seemed ready to burst with juice, and the Fox's mouth watered as he gazed longingly at them. The bunch hung from a high branch, and the Fox had to jump for it. The first time he jumped he missed it by a long way. So he walked off a short distance and took a running leap at it, only to fall short once more. Again and again he tried, but in vain. Now he sat down and looked at the grapes in disgust. "What a fool I am," he said. "Here I am wearing myself out to get a bunch of sour grapes that are not worth gaping for." And off he walked very, very scornfully. There are many who pretend to despise and belittle that which is beyond their reach.
- thunky 3y agoYour story would be more on point if the fox walked past the grapes without interest and never regretted it. Then had a big meal.
- effingwewt 3y agoThere's a difference between opting out of having children, and not being able to physically. There's more nuance here than your fable can expound on. Some people don't want to bring a child into a world in its current state, some cannot afford it, some do not want the externalized costs, etc. Choosing not to have children isn't always sour grapes. It's a choice- let them make theirs.
- bradknowles 3y agoSome of us recognize that we wouldn't make good parents and that we are not ready, and probably never will be. My wife and I are okay with our cats. I don't think we have any regrets in this area.
- pg_1234 3y agoIt sounds like you are saying children are like juicy grapes when seen from a distance, but are sour and disgusting up close. And then the last line is a bit of a non-sequitur, particularly given that the fox was longing after that which was beyond it's reach.
- valbaca 3y agoGrapes are literally toxic to foxes (and dogs). What a perfect analogy.
- gaganyaan 3y agoThis comment triggered a lot of cope, congrats.
- babelthuap 3y ago[dead]
- toomuchtodo 3y agohttps://doi.org/10.1038/s41598-022-15728-z https://doi.org/10.1038/s41598-022-15728-z (paper) https://osf.io/8avrd/ https://osf.io/8avrd/ (data and code to reproduce the analysis)
- ianai 3y ago“symmetric affective polarization among parents and childfree adults driven primarily by parent’s ingroup favoritism” Hard time parsing this statement. Are they suggesting parents being prejudicial makes kids less likely to later become parents themselves?
- deleted 3y ago[deleted]
- toomuchtodo 3y ago> Affective polarization refers to the phenomenon where individuals' feelings and emotions towards members of their own political party or group become more positive, while their feelings towards members of the opposing party or group become more negative. https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Political_polarization https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Political_polarization One of the study authors (Dr. Zachary Neal) provided an impromptu AMA about the paper on r/childfree and r/science (cited below). Provided in the event answers in thread answer additional questions on the subject. https://old.reddit.com/r/childfree/comments/w8l7zf/study_one_in_five_adults_dont_want_children_and/ https://old.reddit.com/r/childfree/comments/w8l7zf/study_one... https://old.reddit.com/r/science/comments/12dgpah/msu_study_confirms_1_in_5_adults_dont_want/ https://old.reddit.com/r/science/comments/12dgpah/msu_study_...
- agonmon 3y agoI appreciate their sacrifice, though I'm afraid that in most cases it is dysgenic. It's going to be intense for our descendents in a couple generations when the gene pool is only left with high fecundity actors. The real resource wars will start then.
- pokstad 3y agoHow is it sacrifice? Many people simply don’t want kids or can’t afford them. Has little to do with sacrifice.
- sourcecodeplz 3y agoI think it is actually selfish because you were given the greatest gift of all, life, and you should "pay it forward".
- saiojd 3y agoNot really selfish at all when you consider that the Earth's population cannot grow infinitely. Some people have kids, others don't, not a big deal.
- hsbauauvhabzb 3y agoThat’s assuming the human race naturally reducing or eventually dying out is considered selfish in the first place. We really place too much longevity of humans while extinguishing animals for sport.
- pokstad 3y agoThat’s not necessarily true. The biggest resource constraint on the earth we can’t live without is food and we are extremely inefficient at producing it. Right now it takes large fields of biological crops, but the future might solve that problem.
- saiojd 3y ago
- barbariangrunge 3y agoReferring to the lack of regret later in life, what ages count as "later in life"? 40? or 70?
- Dalewyn 3y agoWith regards specifically to women, I recall that having children in your 40s or beyond carries significantly higher risks of complications and birth defects. Ideally you want children in your 20s, even 30s is pushing it let alone your 40s. So that's one metric for "later in life".
- Fire-Dragon-DoL 3y agoFrom a medical perspective, I've been told by doctors that after 42 the dangerous things began. As usual, it also depends extremely by the body of the person. You can totally have children at 40 though, it's pretty common.
- tarboreus 3y agoIt's more like 35, but really ramps up in the 40s.
- deleted 3y ago[deleted]
- ianai 3y agoI took it to mean enough years have passed that it’s no longer easy/possible to change the decision and to then have children.
- nickm12 3y agoThe there is a distinct disconnect between the headline, which claims that child-free adults don't regret not having children, and the quote in the article which talks about overall life regret differences between parents and non-parents.
- anonzzzies 3y agoNot this ‘research’, but this thread really makes me hope the AIs is the next step of evolution.
- mensetmanusman 3y agoMaybe centuries away, requires ai to build its own robots to turn sand into cpus.
- langitbiru 3y agoAnother perspective: "One in five women are childless at midlife, with about 90% of those in that position not by choice." https://www.theguardian.com/commentisfree/2023/apr/07/chasm-mothers-childless-women-widening-motherhood-empathy https://www.theguardian.com/commentisfree/2023/apr/07/chasm-...
- amanaplanacanal 3y agoIf the pro life folks get what they want, there should be plenty of adoptable infants available shortly.
- Spivak 3y agoYeah it's surreal how the political pro-life movement is intertwined with great replacement conspiracy nuts. Like the logic makes sense but odd bedfellows.
- ianai 3y agoI’m missing the sourcing on that poll. That article is an anecdote.
- defrost 3y agoThe source (no comment on quality) is cited in a secondary Guardian article: > But who are the childless and how many of them wanted children? The closest we can come is a 2010 meta-analysis by the Dutch academic Prof Renske Keiser[2], which suggested that only 10% of childless women actively chose not to become mothers. That leaves 90% of women like Day. Only 9% of that 90% are childless for known medical reasons [1]. [1] https://www.theguardian.com/lifeandstyle/2017/oct/02/the-desire-to-have-a-child-never-goes-away-how-the-involuntarily-childless-are-forming-a-new-movement https://www.theguardian.com/lifeandstyle/2017/oct/02/the-des... [2] https://www.nwo.nl/actueel/nieuws/2010/Kinderloosheid+is+zelden+een+keuze.html https://www.nwo.nl/actueel/nieuws/2010/Kinderloosheid+is+zel... NOTE!! [2] is the actual link given in the 2017 Guardian article and that link to a Dutch popsci site no longer works - link rot strikes again. For myself I'm rarely swayed by third hand references to meta surveys that "suggest" a result.
- gumby 3y ago> In fact, older parents were slightly more likely to want to change something about their life.” As I’m a parent, I know lots of parents and it’s clear several should not have had kids. I don’t mean they appear to be bad at parenting,* I mean they plainly appear to regret the decision. * in that case I think it’s unreasonable to say such folks shouldn’t have had kids.
- rayiner 3y agoGreat. More resources for my offspring.
- dredmorbius 3y agoThe irony of course being that regardless of whether or not one believes in the principle of finite resources and/or carrying capacity, the expression and apparently wide-spread holding of such views is an immensely strong argument against individual choice in such matters, and for some collective mechanism of restraint. Not necessarily coercive, which has proved both unpopular and controversial, but perhaps based on nudges, norms, and opportunities for alternatives which don't inherently penalise cooperators and reward defectors, as illustrated here.
- rayiner 3y agoHistorically we have had nudges, called inpatient parents, uncles, and aunts. Whether we need to keep nudging in that direction or the other one depends very much on what you think the carrying capacity is.
- harryh 3y agoWorse demographic ratios though which I think is likely more important.
- mensetmanusman 3y agoLots of recent studies on this. Reasons are interesting: “ their findings provide evidence that the predominant reason cited by Americans who do not want kids is a desire to maintain their personal independence, rather than economic pressures or environmental concerns. ”
- ianai 3y agoThere could be a dollar figure that could get me to think twice. But it looks more like a Heavyside step function than a curve and significant. Like winning a huge lotto.
- thatguymike 3y agoI’m genuinely puzzled by the people around me who don’t want kids. They have stable jobs, they get to travel, they give to charity, they go to restaurants and go out on the weekends. It seems so dull to me. I’ve been to a lot of parties, done a lot of traveling, and it’s fine. Good, even. But to have that be your highest purpose in life? If you’re building a major company or becoming president or doing cancer research or are a schoolworker or social worker, then I can understand saying you don’t want kids because you’re doing other important things with your time. But to miss out on life’s greatest mystery and many of the extremes of human emotion, and to not experience spreading your selfhood across others in the deepest and fundamental way because you want to watch more netflix, enjoy happy hour and learn to surf… feels profoundly unimaginative and dull?
- gauku 3y agoTo me, your comment perfectly captures the reason why I don’t want to have kids - it’s all about the parent! Maybe the act of bringing a new life into this world should give more consideration to things from that new life’s perspective.
- deleted 3y ago[deleted]
- thunfischbrot 3y agoThe parents I experience around me are the very definition of dull. They lament simultaneously all the drawbacks one expects from raising children, having no time to do what they want, worrying about their children all the time, experiencing stress from financially stretching themselves, brain fog from being unable to sleep 8 uninterrupted hours at night. Forget about hobbies, forget about having maintaining your relationship to your spouse or even your previous circle of friends. Yes, most are sick to add that they nevertheless wouldn't change it for anything. My impression take-away though is the exact opposite of yours: Making the same decision as your parents and most everyone around you, because you fear having to come up with your own ways to spend your time, it's the most dull thing I ever heard.
- morninglight 3y agoImagine a world where both the man and woman needed to take a pill in order to have in pregnancy. No accidental pregnancies.
- albertopv 3y agoRecently I begun traveling for work, you can't buy the joy given you by a kid that hugs you when you come home after a 3 days trip.