7 ms·

Design a keyboard with Ergogen v4

97 points by rajishx 3y ago

hillcrestenigma 3y ago
A similar web-based keyboard model/layout generator for Dactyl (concave) keyboards is https://ryanis.cool/dactyl https://ryanis.cool/dactyl. I think concave keyboards tend to be more ergonomic than 2d layouts, but to each their own.
amelius 3y ago
It's frustrating that nobody ever explains how to make your own key caps.
- totolouis 3y ago
  There is a company in California that let you design your own keycaps. It is called MaxKeyboard.
  - Findecanor 3y ago
    WASD Keyboards [1] (also in California, BTW) offers custom-printed whole sets and individual keys in OEM profile Cherry keycaps. XVX [2] offers sets of four in Cherry profile .. and I'm sure there are more options out there. Then there's the whole "artisan" community, which sculpt and cast individual keycaps in various designs and shapes, more for looks and collecting than for typing on. I've seen group buys of tooling for making these. 1. <https://www.wasdkeyboards.com https://www.wasdkeyboards.com> 2. <https://en.xvxchannel.com/en-eu/products/xvx-custom-art-icon-or-text-cherry-mx-keycaps-4-keys-set https://en.xvxchannel.com/en-eu/products/xvx-custom-art-icon...>
  - eviks 3y ago
    I see they do printed keycaps, is there any company that would allow having custom see-through forms in the keycaps that would support keyboard lights? E.g., in addition to QW letters that glow in the dark you could add your custom symbols that would also help you learn all the custom keybinds you've made
- xypage 3y ago
  Key caps have lower tolerances than the rest of the board, and the slot for the stems is a very small (the whole cross is 4.1mm wide with the "arms" of it being 1.17mm [1]) negative space, which 3d printing isn't great at. It's certainly possible and I know Zach Freedman [2] did this using his publicly available/free mx keycap model [3], but honestly unless you're more committed to having a board totally made by you than having one that sounds/looks good (which is totally reasonable, making one just to be able to build one from scratch yourself is something I want to do too), I'd say buy some. 1: https://www.cherrymx.de/en/dev.html https://www.cherrymx.de/en/dev.html 2: https://youtu.be/yYcNi9hKxDk?t=688 https://youtu.be/yYcNi9hKxDk?t=688 3: https://thangs.com/designer/ZackFreedman/3d-model/KeyV2%20G20%20Cherry%20MX%20Keycap-10467 https://thangs.com/designer/ZackFreedman/3d-model/KeyV2%20G2...
lars_francke 3y ago
I've been too afraid of asking on Reddit. I'd love a split keyboard with an integrated trackball but the community is creating an overwhelming amount of new content and products. I have not been able to find a good entry point. The threads often reference shops, specific people, firmwares or discord communities without going into details. Does anyone happen to know a good resource for how and where to get started today? What's the state of the art, where to buy what etc.
- rgoulter 3y ago
  If you mean "I saw a keyboard someone else had, I'd like one too", then you're probably going to get good results if you send a message like "wow, this is really cool, how do I go about making one of these". Generally, the shops I've seen are all quite happy to sell parts, & provide assembly guides. I think those are good starting points for learning about the things you don't know.
- jerezzprime 3y ago
  Which subreddit are you looking at? I am also interested in an ergo keyboard with an integrated trackball.
  - avidiax 3y ago
    What I've done is take a Kinesis Advantage2 and add an Apple Magic Trackpad, like this: [1] I use museum wax as the mounting method, which allows slight adjustments but is otherwise a firm hold. [1] https://www.reddit.com/r/kinesisadvantage/comments/s2n2k3/kinesis_advantage_magic_trackpad_integration/ https://www.reddit.com/r/kinesisadvantage/comments/s2n2k3/ki...
    - jerezzprime 3y ago
      So it's only a small movement with one of your hands for mouse control? Seems like a simple solution.
  - lars_francke 3y ago
    I've been subscribed to https://www.reddit.com/r/ErgoMechKeyboards https://www.reddit.com/r/ErgoMechKeyboards for a year or so now and there is a lot of energy there. It's just really hard to follow when you're only casually browsing.
adamws 3y ago
I developed something similar (PCB only, no cases) as KiCad plugin: https://github.com/adamws/kicad-kbplacer https://github.com/adamws/kicad-kbplacer - it uses layouts from keyboard-layout-editor.com as input. It has web interface as well: https://keyboard-tools.xyz/ https://keyboard-tools.xyz/
ceoloide 3y ago
Check out the Samoklava GitHub repository (https://github.com/soundmonster/samoklava https://github.com/soundmonster/samoklava) for an example of auto-generated and auto-routed board leveraging Ergogen. I am following on the steps of FlatFootFox to replicate the Corne (Cherry) in code, WIP for the moment: https://github.com/ceoloide/corney-island https://github.com/ceoloide/corney-island Don't forget to support the creator of Ergogen, MrZealot: https://github.com/sponsors/mrzealot https://github.com/sponsors/mrzealot
- ozozozd 3y ago
  What does routing mean in this context?
  - fellowmartian 3y ago
    PCB trace routing
    - ceoloide 3y ago
      Right. Basically routing (i.e. connecting pads / terminals of various electronic components) is a relatively hard problem and usually gets done by hand. Ergogen lacks the ability to spit out routed PCBs, but the Samoklava repositories shows how to use a KiCad CLI addon to do just that and generate final files ready for fabrication (though you should always inspect them).
vrglvrglvrgl 3y ago
[dead]
layer8 3y ago
The one thing that keeps me from building my own keyboard is that I’d want a 3D-curved keyboard (similar to the Microsoft ergonomic keyboards), and I haven’t seen anyone tackling such a project yet. Ergogen as well seems to only support “flat” layouts.
- microjim 3y ago
  See the dactyl tool linked as a sibling comment: https://ryanis.cool/dactyl https://ryanis.cool/dactyl by https://news.ycombinator.com/item?id=35769435 https://news.ycombinator.com/item?id=35769435
idiocrat 3y ago
Is there a way to ask for a reasonably-priced custom made keyboard? I have a key layout in mind, and I just want a ready product, not to fiddle with hardware and firmware myself. The order lot is very tiny of maybe 4-5 pcs. The layout is quite simple QWERTY, based on Omnikey Ultra T.
- Kimcha 3y ago
  How much do you think would be reasonably-priced?
  - idiocrat 3y ago
    In a range of 100-150 US$ a piece. Perhaps 500-800 US$ for 5 finished keyboards. Similar to this Omnikey Ultra T, in a similar build quality, but with few keys rearranged. I wish the F11 and F12 on the life side to be below F9 and F10 keys. https://www.thurrott.com/forums/general-discussion/hardware/thread/northgate-omnikey-ultra-keyboard-first-look https://www.thurrott.com/forums/general-discussion/hardware/... I like the heavy metal bottom plate, but can be (cheaper) molded plastic. My current Ultra T is at end of life, I am resoldering the gradually failing white ALPS.
- deleted 3y ago
  [deleted]

97 points by rajishx 3y ago

A similar web-based keyboard model/layout generator for Dactyl (concave) keyboards is https://ryanis.cool/dactyl https://ryanis.cool/dactyl. I think concave keyboards tend to be more ergonomic than 2d layouts, but to each their own.

amelius 3y ago

It's frustrating that nobody ever explains how to make your own key caps.

totolouis 3y ago
There is a company in California that let you design your own keycaps. It is called MaxKeyboard.
- Findecanor 3y ago
  WASD Keyboards [1] (also in California, BTW) offers custom-printed whole sets and individual keys in OEM profile Cherry keycaps. XVX [2] offers sets of four in Cherry profile .. and I'm sure there are more options out there. Then there's the whole "artisan" community, which sculpt and cast individual keycaps in various designs and shapes, more for looks and collecting than for typing on. I've seen group buys of tooling for making these. 1. <https://www.wasdkeyboards.com https://www.wasdkeyboards.com> 2. <https://en.xvxchannel.com/en-eu/products/xvx-custom-art-icon-or-text-cherry-mx-keycaps-4-keys-set https://en.xvxchannel.com/en-eu/products/xvx-custom-art-icon...>
- eviks 3y ago
  I see they do printed keycaps, is there any company that would allow having custom see-through forms in the keycaps that would support keyboard lights? E.g., in addition to QW letters that glow in the dark you could add your custom symbols that would also help you learn all the custom keybinds you've made
xypage 3y ago
Key caps have lower tolerances than the rest of the board, and the slot for the stems is a very small (the whole cross is 4.1mm wide with the "arms" of it being 1.17mm [1]) negative space, which 3d printing isn't great at. It's certainly possible and I know Zach Freedman [2] did this using his publicly available/free mx keycap model [3], but honestly unless you're more committed to having a board totally made by you than having one that sounds/looks good (which is totally reasonable, making one just to be able to build one from scratch yourself is something I want to do too), I'd say buy some. 1: https://www.cherrymx.de/en/dev.html https://www.cherrymx.de/en/dev.html 2: https://youtu.be/yYcNi9hKxDk?t=688 https://youtu.be/yYcNi9hKxDk?t=688 3: https://thangs.com/designer/ZackFreedman/3d-model/KeyV2%20G20%20Cherry%20MX%20Keycap-10467 https://thangs.com/designer/ZackFreedman/3d-model/KeyV2%20G2...

lars_francke 3y ago

I've been too afraid of asking on Reddit. I'd love a split keyboard with an integrated trackball but the community is creating an overwhelming amount of new content and products. I have not been able to find a good entry point. The threads often reference shops, specific people, firmwares or discord communities without going into details. Does anyone happen to know a good resource for how and where to get started today? What's the state of the art, where to buy what etc.

rgoulter 3y ago
If you mean "I saw a keyboard someone else had, I'd like one too", then you're probably going to get good results if you send a message like "wow, this is really cool, how do I go about making one of these". Generally, the shops I've seen are all quite happy to sell parts, & provide assembly guides. I think those are good starting points for learning about the things you don't know.
jerezzprime 3y ago
Which subreddit are you looking at? I am also interested in an ergo keyboard with an integrated trackball.
- avidiax 3y ago
  What I've done is take a Kinesis Advantage2 and add an Apple Magic Trackpad, like this: [1] I use museum wax as the mounting method, which allows slight adjustments but is otherwise a firm hold. [1] https://www.reddit.com/r/kinesisadvantage/comments/s2n2k3/kinesis_advantage_magic_trackpad_integration/ https://www.reddit.com/r/kinesisadvantage/comments/s2n2k3/ki...
  - jerezzprime 3y ago
    So it's only a small movement with one of your hands for mouse control? Seems like a simple solution.
- lars_francke 3y ago
  I've been subscribed to https://www.reddit.com/r/ErgoMechKeyboards https://www.reddit.com/r/ErgoMechKeyboards for a year or so now and there is a lot of energy there. It's just really hard to follow when you're only casually browsing.

adamws 3y ago

I developed something similar (PCB only, no cases) as KiCad plugin: https://github.com/adamws/kicad-kbplacer https://github.com/adamws/kicad-kbplacer - it uses layouts from keyboard-layout-editor.com as input. It has web interface as well: https://keyboard-tools.xyz/ https://keyboard-tools.xyz/

ceoloide 3y ago

Check out the Samoklava GitHub repository (https://github.com/soundmonster/samoklava https://github.com/soundmonster/samoklava) for an example of auto-generated and auto-routed board leveraging Ergogen. I am following on the steps of FlatFootFox to replicate the Corne (Cherry) in code, WIP for the moment: https://github.com/ceoloide/corney-island https://github.com/ceoloide/corney-island Don't forget to support the creator of Ergogen, MrZealot: https://github.com/sponsors/mrzealot https://github.com/sponsors/mrzealot

ozozozd 3y ago
What does routing mean in this context?
- fellowmartian 3y ago
  PCB trace routing
  - ceoloide 3y ago
    Right. Basically routing (i.e. connecting pads / terminals of various electronic components) is a relatively hard problem and usually gets done by hand. Ergogen lacks the ability to spit out routed PCBs, but the Samoklava repositories shows how to use a KiCad CLI addon to do just that and generate final files ready for fabrication (though you should always inspect them).

vrglvrglvrgl 3y ago

[dead]

layer8 3y ago

The one thing that keeps me from building my own keyboard is that I’d want a 3D-curved keyboard (similar to the Microsoft ergonomic keyboards), and I haven’t seen anyone tackling such a project yet. Ergogen as well seems to only support “flat” layouts.

microjim 3y ago
See the dactyl tool linked as a sibling comment: https://ryanis.cool/dactyl https://ryanis.cool/dactyl by https://news.ycombinator.com/item?id=35769435 https://news.ycombinator.com/item?id=35769435

idiocrat 3y ago

Is there a way to ask for a reasonably-priced custom made keyboard? I have a key layout in mind, and I just want a ready product, not to fiddle with hardware and firmware myself. The order lot is very tiny of maybe 4-5 pcs. The layout is quite simple QWERTY, based on Omnikey Ultra T.

Kimcha 3y ago
How much do you think would be reasonably-priced?
- idiocrat 3y ago
  In a range of 100-150 US$ a piece. Perhaps 500-800 US$ for 5 finished keyboards. Similar to this Omnikey Ultra T, in a similar build quality, but with few keys rearranged. I wish the F11 and F12 on the life side to be below F9 and F10 keys. https://www.thurrott.com/forums/general-discussion/hardware/thread/northgate-omnikey-ultra-keyboard-first-look https://www.thurrott.com/forums/general-discussion/hardware/... I like the heavy metal bottom plate, but can be (cheaper) molded plastic. My current Ultra T is at end of life, I am resoldering the gradually failing white ALPS.
deleted 3y ago
[deleted]