4 ms·

Not a lawyer, but that still feels like dubious territory. I would still be on the hook for acquiring the original download, which Facebook has been launching d

Not a lawyer, but that still feels like dubious territory. I would still be on the hook for acquiring the original download, which Facebook has been launching dmca takedown requests for the llama-dl project.

zhisbug 4y ago
https://github.com/facebookresearch/llama/pull/184 https://github.com/facebookresearch/llama/pull/184
- 0cf8612b2e1e 4y ago
  Nobody at Facebook approved it? Given the attention it has received, hard to imagine it has slipped through the cracks, but a deliberate decision to not address.
capableweb 4y ago
Very unlikely you'd face any legal action for usage of anything. If you share it, then it becomes less unlikely. Edit: Also, judging by a comment from the team in the GitHub repository (https://github.com/lm-sys/FastChat/issues/86#issuecomment-1491358353 https://github.com/lm-sys/FastChat/issues/86#issuecomment-14...), they seem to at least hint about been in contact with the llama team.
sebzim4500 4y ago
The llama-dl project actually helped you download the weights, whereas this just assumes you already have them. That feels like a pretty massive difference to me.
gaogao 4y ago
It's fairly similar to a ROM patch in the video game space, which has mostly stood the test of time.
- 0cf8612b2e1e 4y ago
  With a ROM, you could at least make a claim that it was your backup copy. I have no such claims to Facebook’s model.
  - SargeZT 4y ago
    Researchers unaffiliated with Facebook are allowed to possess and use the original weights though, and they can make use of these weights.
- muyuu 4y ago
  like that but requiring 60GBs of CPU RAM for some reason :-P one has to wonder how did they implement the storage of those deltas to require that sort of RAM
  - wongarsu 4y ago
    For perspective, that's about $200-$250 of RAM on a desktop computer. They might just not have cared. Though I expect somebody to write a patch to make this more accessible to people on laptops.
sillysaurusx 4y ago
(I work on llama-dl.) We’re fighting back against the DMCA requests on the basis that NN weights aren’t copyrightable. This thread has details: https://news.ycombinator.com/item?id=35393782 https://news.ycombinator.com/item?id=35393782 I don't think you have to worry about Facebook going after you. The worst that will happen is that they issue a DMCA, in which case your project gets knocked offline. I don’t think they’ll be going the RIAA route of suing individual hackers. The DMCAs were also launched by a third party law firm, not Meta themselves, so there’s a bit of “left hand doesn’t know what the right hand is doing” in all of this. I’ll keep everyone updated. For now, hack freely.
- meghan_rain 4y ago
  keep up god's work!
  - knodi123 4y ago
    > god's work creating sentient life?
    - oh_sigh 4y ago
      That can't be his work, since he only picked up that hobby about 0.000625% of the universe's timespan ago.
      - stcredzero 4y ago
        For many humans, some "hobbies" involve "projects" which may involve seemingly infinite degrees of procrastination. (This certainly applies to me!)
        oh_sigh 4y ago
        You're not wrong - but for perspective this is equivalent to a 90 year old picking up a hobby 5 hours ago.

zhisbug 4y ago

https://github.com/facebookresearch/llama/pull/184 https://github.com/facebookresearch/llama/pull/184

0cf8612b2e1e 4y ago
Nobody at Facebook approved it? Given the attention it has received, hard to imagine it has slipped through the cracks, but a deliberate decision to not address.

capableweb 4y ago

Very unlikely you'd face any legal action for usage of anything. If you share it, then it becomes less unlikely. Edit: Also, judging by a comment from the team in the GitHub repository (https://github.com/lm-sys/FastChat/issues/86#issuecomment-1491358353 https://github.com/lm-sys/FastChat/issues/86#issuecomment-14...), they seem to at least hint about been in contact with the llama team.

sebzim4500 4y ago

The llama-dl project actually helped you download the weights, whereas this just assumes you already have them. That feels like a pretty massive difference to me.

gaogao 4y ago

It's fairly similar to a ROM patch in the video game space, which has mostly stood the test of time.

0cf8612b2e1e 4y ago
With a ROM, you could at least make a claim that it was your backup copy. I have no such claims to Facebook’s model.
- SargeZT 4y ago
  Researchers unaffiliated with Facebook are allowed to possess and use the original weights though, and they can make use of these weights.
muyuu 4y ago
like that but requiring 60GBs of CPU RAM for some reason :-P one has to wonder how did they implement the storage of those deltas to require that sort of RAM
- wongarsu 4y ago
  For perspective, that's about $200-$250 of RAM on a desktop computer. They might just not have cared. Though I expect somebody to write a patch to make this more accessible to people on laptops.

sillysaurusx 4y ago

(I work on llama-dl.) We’re fighting back against the DMCA requests on the basis that NN weights aren’t copyrightable. This thread has details: https://news.ycombinator.com/item?id=35393782 https://news.ycombinator.com/item?id=35393782 I don't think you have to worry about Facebook going after you. The worst that will happen is that they issue a DMCA, in which case your project gets knocked offline. I don’t think they’ll be going the RIAA route of suing individual hackers. The DMCAs were also launched by a third party law firm, not Meta themselves, so there’s a bit of “left hand doesn’t know what the right hand is doing” in all of this. I’ll keep everyone updated. For now, hack freely.

meghan_rain 4y ago
keep up god's work!
- knodi123 4y ago
  > god's work creating sentient life?
  - oh_sigh 4y ago
    That can't be his work, since he only picked up that hobby about 0.000625% of the universe's timespan ago.
    - stcredzero 4y ago
      For many humans, some "hobbies" involve "projects" which may involve seemingly infinite degrees of procrastination. (This certainly applies to me!)
      - oh_sigh 4y ago
        You're not wrong - but for perspective this is equivalent to a 90 year old picking up a hobby 5 hours ago.