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> and it seemed inevitable that China would absorb Taiwan. No, it's unrealistic to think the the ROC would ever effectively surrender to the PRC however HK's r

> and it seemed inevitable that China would absorb Taiwan. No, it's unrealistic to think the the ROC would ever effectively surrender to the PRC however HK's reintegration was managed.

bryanlarsen 4y ago
Hong Kong was promised to have democracy, human rights and access to China. If they had kept those promises, then I believe many Taiwanese would have welcomed reunification.
- gudh 4y ago
  Well, I doubt about that. Reunification? Maybe welcomed by the elders, among the young people, majority prefer to be independent
- re-thc 4y ago
  We all knew (hopefully) that would never happen (keep their promise). It's nothing China specific. Even lots of elected politicians fail on it in any country.
  - chii 4y ago
    I think hindsight might've clouded your assessment of the attitude during the time pre-HK crackdown. It was originally a time of optimistic hope that China would become more and more democratic, and the integration of HK back to the mainland will not have been hard (at least, china would meet somewhere in the middle).
    - re-thc 4y ago
      There was already a wave of people considering, planning and did actually leave pre-1997 and around that time. A few did go back to HK afterwards when things looked better but left again due to the current issues. I don't know who was optimistic. The West? Definitely not those in HK. It was a time when anti-China sentiment was high and supported by the media, artists, etc as the trend (vs the crackdown now). There were songs and campaigns supporting those that wanted freedom. Learnt from history many of the older generation that have witnessed the war and after knew of how CCP and army worked. No 1 wanted a death sentence either. Those have worked in the mainland know the "law" doesn't exist as it does in the West (including HK at the time). Gang activity vastly dropped post-1997 because of a fear of the death sentence. A lot of them and their money left for other countries.
      - mytailorisrich 4y ago
        British HK was an act of aggression and a national humiliation for China. The ROC/Taiwan was also happy to see the British go and their regret was that the communists succeeded where they had failed (and in fact did nothing at all as all foreign settlements were kicked out by the PRC).
        re-thc 4y ago
        Why would ROC/Taiwan be happy about it? It helps distract the PRC from ROC/Taiwan. The focus has shifted to Taiwan recently because HK has been "dealt with".
        mytailorisrich 4y ago
        British HK was an humiliation for China. That does not mean for the PRC, that does mean China as a whole and a whole people. Both sides for the straight were glad to see the British go. It's a lack of cultural and historical understanding not to realise that. Likewise the focus since 1949 has always been Taiwan. It's HK that has been used as a distraction and 'tool' by the West.
satvikpendem 4y ago
Your statement does not falsify the quoted statement; both can be true that the ROC would not surrender and that China might inevitably absorb Taiwan. If we want to get really pedantic, no timeline was also stated, so this could also be 50 to 500 years from now.
- concordDance 4y ago
  I would be very surprised if humans are still the main form of intelligence 500 years from now, let alone any countries still existing.
  - re-thc 4y ago
    Resident aliens would still be around.
- mytailorisrich 4y ago
  Your comment is indeed pedantic and misses the point. Obviously, the context the meaning was that there was a cause to effect link between how things were going in China and, especially HK, and the likelihood of a reunification with Taiwan. So I pointed out that the situation in HK is not really relevant because, even if it had gone perfectly 'well' the ROC would still never had surrendered to the communists. The bottom line is that regime change on the mainland is a necessary condition.
  - satvikpendem 4y ago
    Again, it doesn't matter what ROC would have done, they don't have the military power of the PRC, which was my point.
    - candiodari 4y ago
      China has never performed well in any war, including wars where you'd think they'd have overwhelming advantages.
charlieyu1 4y ago
There is always someone who is willing to take some money.

> and it seemed inevitable that China would absorb Taiwan. No, it's unrealistic to think the the ROC would ever effectively surrender to the PRC however HK's reintegration was managed.

bryanlarsen 4y ago

Hong Kong was promised to have democracy, human rights and access to China. If they had kept those promises, then I believe many Taiwanese would have welcomed reunification.

gudh 4y ago
Well, I doubt about that. Reunification? Maybe welcomed by the elders, among the young people, majority prefer to be independent
re-thc 4y ago
We all knew (hopefully) that would never happen (keep their promise). It's nothing China specific. Even lots of elected politicians fail on it in any country.
- chii 4y ago
  I think hindsight might've clouded your assessment of the attitude during the time pre-HK crackdown. It was originally a time of optimistic hope that China would become more and more democratic, and the integration of HK back to the mainland will not have been hard (at least, china would meet somewhere in the middle).
  - re-thc 4y ago
    There was already a wave of people considering, planning and did actually leave pre-1997 and around that time. A few did go back to HK afterwards when things looked better but left again due to the current issues. I don't know who was optimistic. The West? Definitely not those in HK. It was a time when anti-China sentiment was high and supported by the media, artists, etc as the trend (vs the crackdown now). There were songs and campaigns supporting those that wanted freedom. Learnt from history many of the older generation that have witnessed the war and after knew of how CCP and army worked. No 1 wanted a death sentence either. Those have worked in the mainland know the "law" doesn't exist as it does in the West (including HK at the time). Gang activity vastly dropped post-1997 because of a fear of the death sentence. A lot of them and their money left for other countries.
    - mytailorisrich 4y ago
      British HK was an act of aggression and a national humiliation for China. The ROC/Taiwan was also happy to see the British go and their regret was that the communists succeeded where they had failed (and in fact did nothing at all as all foreign settlements were kicked out by the PRC).
      - re-thc 4y ago
        Why would ROC/Taiwan be happy about it? It helps distract the PRC from ROC/Taiwan. The focus has shifted to Taiwan recently because HK has been "dealt with".
        mytailorisrich 4y ago
        British HK was an humiliation for China. That does not mean for the PRC, that does mean China as a whole and a whole people. Both sides for the straight were glad to see the British go. It's a lack of cultural and historical understanding not to realise that. Likewise the focus since 1949 has always been Taiwan. It's HK that has been used as a distraction and 'tool' by the West.

satvikpendem 4y ago

Your statement does not falsify the quoted statement; both can be true that the ROC would not surrender and that China might inevitably absorb Taiwan. If we want to get really pedantic, no timeline was also stated, so this could also be 50 to 500 years from now.

concordDance 4y ago
I would be very surprised if humans are still the main form of intelligence 500 years from now, let alone any countries still existing.
- re-thc 4y ago
  Resident aliens would still be around.
mytailorisrich 4y ago
Your comment is indeed pedantic and misses the point. Obviously, the context the meaning was that there was a cause to effect link between how things were going in China and, especially HK, and the likelihood of a reunification with Taiwan. So I pointed out that the situation in HK is not really relevant because, even if it had gone perfectly 'well' the ROC would still never had surrendered to the communists. The bottom line is that regime change on the mainland is a necessary condition.
- satvikpendem 4y ago
  Again, it doesn't matter what ROC would have done, they don't have the military power of the PRC, which was my point.
  - candiodari 4y ago
    China has never performed well in any war, including wars where you'd think they'd have overwhelming advantages.

charlieyu1 4y ago

There is always someone who is willing to take some money.