8 ms·

I expect there will be higher cases of psychosis happening on intense retreats, but as anecdotal as this, I had it happen to me (albeit not as extreme as OP) af

I expect there will be higher cases of psychosis happening on intense retreats, but as anecdotal as this, I had it happen to me (albeit not as extreme as OP) after meditating for much shorter periods (approx 10 minutes up to an hour). I really did not see it coming. For some context, I don't know of any deep seated trauma that I have and I liked to think of myself as someone robust mentally. I experienced a deep realisation that our thoughts manifest from nowhere and not from ourselves (words fail me here) and that the construct of 'me' was completely false and was just a reverberation of my environment. I understood there was no me. This was really nice for about two weeks. I started to think that I should be looking to help other people and become a guru, perhaps write a book to help humanity, but then my ego (I expect) came back with a vengeance, kicked my ass and brought me back down to earth with a crash (maybe its a safety system). I experienced huge panic attacks like I have never had before, I carried this constant feeling of absolute dread in my soul, like a sense of impending doom. I have heard it described as the dark night of the soul. Some try to push through this, but I held back as i cannot afford to have a complete meltdown as I need to care for a young family and hold down a job. I spoke with a well respected meditator about this, and they said the some people are wired to have an accelerated experience and are able to obtain deep introspection with limited time on the cushion. I would say I am almost back to normal now. I had to stop all meditation and instead focused on health food, sleep habits and lots of exercise. My main mediation type thing is now running, it quietens my mind, but the grounding effect of the movement keeps me in a safe play pen to explore my reality. meditation is incredibly powerful, in the west we have confused it as being a corporate stress ball that you squeeze or like a lavender scented, candle lit bath while listening to Enya. The truth is, it can reveal incredibly deep seated aspects of ourselves that we are in no way prepared to witness, let alone accept.

cutler 4y ago
“Before enlightenment chop wood, carry water. After enlightenment chop wood, carry water.” We need the mundane earthly activities to balance any inward quests.
- jossclimb 4y ago
  totally agree.
- Cthulhu_ 4y ago
  That sounds pragmatic; in the end, you still have to return to the real world and get on with things like survive. Although this talk about becoming enlightened sounds like people have given up on themselves and realilty entirely to pursue something in their minds. It sounds like a self-induced state of tripping balls.
  - robertlagrant 4y ago
    Cthulhu discussion Buddhism. Am I tripping?
- Southworth 4y ago
  One of my most treasured quotes. Glad to see it here.
- yamtaddle 4y ago
  I've always taken it to (also) mean that one ought not expect rebirth in enlightenment, or some instant transformation of one's condition and even of one's spiritual (if you will) practice. It's not like graduating from school and moving into the workforce, where you stop going to classes and your life shifts radically in a short span. One day you're not enlightened, the next you are, and... that's the whole thing, congrats, you did it, now life goes on surprisingly-similarly to how it did before. "Oh, you're enlightened? That's nice. Now, on with what we were doing...."
  - deleted 4y ago
    [deleted]
- hrnnnnnn 4y ago
  Or the contemporary version: after enlightenment, the dishes.
tuyiown 4y ago
> I experienced a deep realisation that our thoughts manifest from nowhere and not from ourselves (words fail me here) and that the construct of 'me' was completely false and was just a reverberation of my environment. I understood there was no me. This was really nice for about two weeks and then my ego (I expect) just kicked my arse and brought me back down to earth with a crash (maybe its a safety system) Just for the conversation: the «from nowhere» really just might be the unconscious brain, as the relationship between conscious and unconscious is ambiguous at best. The conscious insist in being in control, most of the time fooling itself, while the unconscious does most of the work in a really autonomous way. Maybe the «safety system» was just the unconscious rebelling to prove it does indeed exist and that the conscious should take note, and resume its part in the general guidance of the being :)
- haswell 4y ago
  > * the «from nowhere» really just might be the unconscious brain* The trouble is that once you start to consider the nature of the unconscious brain, such consideration leads to the same conclusion. If the unconscious brain somehow has “control”, from where does it derive this control? Unless you then accept some kind of metaphysical explanation, it’s centerlessness all the way down.
  - tuyiown 4y ago
    > it’s centerlessness all the way down Well I didn't meant anything else actually. I realize that the «unconscious» term is tainted, as it can represent something like a hidden part of personality, especially on Freudian literature and likes. I didn't meant that, I was thinking of the sum of the autonomous processing and coordination of the numerous intricate and distributed functions of the brain, senses, motor, emotional, etc…
    - haswell 4y ago
      That's a good clarification clarification. I misread the quoted part as trying to shift the "well" of consciousness to the unconscious brain, which really just moves the problem down one level.
analyst74 4y ago
> I experienced a deep realisation that our thoughts manifest from nowhere and not from ourselves (words fail me here) and that the construct of 'me' was completely false and was just a reverberation of my environment. Wait, is this not common knowledge??
- haswell 4y ago
  Knowledge is not the same thing as insight, and experiencing what the parent comment describes is something that most people never attempt (or even realize there is something to attempt). Having a philosophical/intellectual conversation about the nature of mind is very different than your own mind wrapping itself around these concepts directly.
- yyyk 4y ago
  It's a common argument, which may or may not be true if it can be properly defined at all.
DontchaKnowit 4y ago
Interestingly you describe the shattering of your delusion as the return of your ego - I think it is the opposite. I think you invited an inflated ego into your life through your meditation : "I should become a guru and help humanity" <-- that is ego speaking. The shattering of this idea is is not ego but humility, to my way of thinking.
- 2-718-281-828 4y ago
  you have a point
  - realce 4y ago
    It's also just a mind that might be desperate for a core identity after having its last one logically dissolved through introspection. While ego can hijack identity for it's own mad desires, an identity is required for the actuation of relational actions on a basic level. With no "center" from which to make decisions, the functions of your mind tasked with making choices will panic - this is a foundation of brainwashing/psychological manipulation. Very similar things happen to people who have a TBI, where they become stressed when forced to make choices that seem to have zero baring on "their" lives. So dissolved identity > Panic attacks when choice-satisfaction plummets > subconscious suggests all kinds of cartoonist extremes for an easy and powerful identity > Conscious mind agrees to play along, uses this character to make decisions about > Choice-satisfaction rises.
    - Eupraxias 4y ago
      "So dissolved identity > Panic attacks when choice-satisfaction plummets > subconscious suggests all kinds of cartoonist extremes for an easy and powerful identity > Conscious mind agrees to play along, uses this character to make decisions about > Choice-satisfaction rises. " I'm sure it's different for most others, but I had the opposite experience. It has introduced a great calm into my life. From where I am now, I see identity as the central problem we face as a species.
      - 4y ago
janeerie 4y ago
A couple of years ago, I started a light meditation practice (10-20 minutes) and did it for about a month with good results. At that point, I read this article (on Hacker News) and spent the next two years terrified this would happen to me. I had struggled with panic disorder in the past, but CBT pretty much fixed it for me. This article triggered my first panic attacks in years and led to a constant sense of dread and anxiety. It was so terrifying to think that a simple mental process could potentially trigger a breakdown (and like you, I had a family to take care of). Fast-forward a couple of years, and I'm moving towards the view that these breakdowns are simple anxiety disorders that just happen to be triggered by meditation, in the same way that a panic attack triggered my anxiety disorder when I was young. I don't think there's anything particularly special or mystical about it - it's just our stupid brains activating the fear response, and it appears that the same methods for dealing with anxiety disorders work here. I feel like in a way I was the control group for an experiment - can a fear of meditation provoke the same response as meditation itself?
- zozbot234 4y ago
  > This article triggered my first panic attacks in years and led to a constant sense of dread and anxiety. Perhaps you should think of your dread and anxiety as a symptom of craving. But if you think your family obligations get in the way, there's nothing wrong with avoiding deep insight practices for now. You can do light meditation and even take an intellectual interest in the deeper teachings without seriously triggering anything.
  - robocat 4y ago
    > You can do light meditation and even take an intellectual interest in the deeper teachings without seriously triggering anything. Our fears can dominate our reality, and you are tritely recommending a possibly harmful path without knowing anything about them . . . like recommending eating a peanut to someone who knows they have a dangerous allergic reaction to peanuts. In the context of the article, your advice is especially egregious. Please tread carefully in the world, effortless advice can cause long term harm. Sometimes it is good to listen to our fears, sometimes not. Hard to judge others across the vast distance of a few sentences.
dsubburam 4y ago
> I experienced a deep realisation that our thoughts manifest from nowhere and not from ourselves (words fail me here) and that the construct of 'me' was completely false and was just a reverberation of my environment. I understood there was no me. A way to frame such an experience (a version of which I've had too) is to say that we realize that the purpose we've been having for our striving is bogus. e.g. There's no special "me" that's important to make look good, that needs respect and fame etc. But that doesn't mean we lose all striving. We just find a new, more wholesome, purpose for it. I think Eckhart Tolle talks about this. There are other perspectives, too, that one can garner by reading philosophy. (e.g. Aristotle's Nicomachean Ethics, which puts virtue as most worth striving for; there're also much simpler takes on what's worth striving for in an ego-less sense, which are paradoxically harder to intellectually grok while being much more commonly espoused in practice, such as love for home, and family).
kodah 4y ago
> I experienced a deep realisation that our thoughts manifest from nowhere and not from ourselves (words fail me here) and that the construct of 'me' was completely false and was just a reverberation of my environment. I understood there was no me. If you were tripping this is called ego death. In some circles, including mine, what you described after: > I started to think that I should be looking to help other people and become a guru, perhaps write a book to help humanity, but then my ego (I expect) came back with a vengeance, kicked my ass and brought me back down to earth with a crash (maybe its a safety system). Can be common. When I experienced ego death I was aware that it would return so I was able to deal with it. I think of it kind of like the trip itself; the more you fight it the harder it fights you. Not sure this helps as it's entirely my own experience and was drug induced, but I do think occasional ego death is worth it. Just be cognizant of what you're doing. The mind is a powerful place.
- zozbot234 4y ago
  And this is exactly why "tripping" is heavily frowned upon by serious meditators and spiritual practitioners. Experiencing "ego death" (i.e. the three marks of existence) without having the previous spiritual grounding for it to help free you from attachment to the ego, is only a recipe for being even more deeply mired in craving and dukkha.
  - jcbrand 4y ago
    > And this is exactly why "tripping" is heavily frowned upon by serious meditators and spiritual practitioners. This is needlessly judgmental. I know life-long meditators, 30+ of years disciplined practice who sometimes take psychedelics. I'm not a fan of various aspects of the psychedelic scene, e.g. the spiritual bypassing and the narcissism that can sometimes come from it, but let's not throw the baby out with the bathwater. Usage of psychedelics can be profoundly healing and helpful.
    - zozbot234 4y ago
      > I know life-long meditators, 30+ of years disciplined practice who sometimes take psychedelics. I'm not dismissing spiritual practice, but psychedelics are entirely incidental to it and can be a snare for the unprepared mind. What's "profoundly healing and helpful" is always the spiritual part, not the means used to achieve it.
jvanderbot 4y ago
The stories we tell ourselves matter. Staring into the mind and seeing nothing is a powerful and frightening story. There may be a more positive reframing, but it's also not a mandatory story to tell yourself.
wafflemaker 4y ago
So there is this pattern of light spiritual practice (ok, not in your case, here light was the heavy) being safe and chill, And of heavy spiritual practice having the potential to be dangerous. I see an analogy to using psychedelics as described in this lecture fragment (starts around 12th minute) https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=j72C_lDHTk0 https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=j72C_lDHTk0 Ram Dass on "When is it right to use psychedealics?" There he talks about two types of psychedelic usage. Recreational - here we don't need to prepare, we should use little of the substance and can enjoy f.ex. our favorite music sounding a little better. Transformational - here, we have to prepare thoroughly studying spiritual/philosophical books, have a proper fast before the experience and have a proper guide. This way the potential for a difficult experience lessens and the potential for transformative experience grows. Interestingly, the lecture excerpt starts with description of ancient/historical use of psychedelics, where they were used in rituals aimed at transformation of the subject. Subject attended the ritual being thoroughly prepared, something completely different than being offered psylocibin mushrooms/acid on a party. I wonder if this advice (going light doesn't require preparation, going heavy requires preparing as much as possible trough fasting and study) could also apply here, to meditation practice. Sorry if this idea/lecture was posted here already, had only limited time to read and reply in this thread.
hosh 4y ago
That’s the No Self realization. I only had a brief glimpse of it, including the weirdly simultaneous panic. It did not happen during a meditation session, and it was brief. I remember a podcast interview with Adyashanti about this. A lot of people experience unity consciousness first before no self, but some people experience no self first. He mentioned about someone he knows who experienced that, and had it for years, while also having to care for a child. On reddit, I read someone stating that psychedelic can break someone, and it happened to him. Lots of people responded by saying things, and he was telling them, no, literally, there was something that broke and there’s no coming back from it.
AnonCoward42 4y ago
> I wasn't born Richard Alpert. I was just born as a human being and then I learned this whole business of who I am, whether I'm good or bad, achieving or not - all that's learned along the way. And you see all those learn things separate, so you start to have this dissociative experience, where all that can become is a point of awareness. I remember the first time this happened to me, I got a terrible panic, because indeed I was gonna cease to exist. -- Richard Alpert aka Ram Dass I hope it's transcribed correctly.
- quijoteuniv 4y ago
  But you are anoncoward42?
blueprint 4y ago
> that the construct of 'me' was completely false and was just a reverberation of my environment you are mistaken as you misunderstood in a subtle but critical way. your sentence is self contradictory. for it to be true it must have some permanent existence. everything that is true does. in the law of cause and effect there are three kinds of causes. environment is one of them. this is the law buddha told us about after he opened his eye. it reveals the entirety of existence, along with another law or two. do not cheat yourself by thinking you can see the truth yet. we can check if you doubt this. it would be to your benefit. but few want what is most important for them.

cutler 4y ago

“Before enlightenment chop wood, carry water. After enlightenment chop wood, carry water.” We need the mundane earthly activities to balance any inward quests.

jossclimb 4y ago
totally agree.
Cthulhu_ 4y ago
That sounds pragmatic; in the end, you still have to return to the real world and get on with things like survive. Although this talk about becoming enlightened sounds like people have given up on themselves and realilty entirely to pursue something in their minds. It sounds like a self-induced state of tripping balls.
- robertlagrant 4y ago
  Cthulhu discussion Buddhism. Am I tripping?
Southworth 4y ago
One of my most treasured quotes. Glad to see it here.
yamtaddle 4y ago
I've always taken it to (also) mean that one ought not expect rebirth in enlightenment, or some instant transformation of one's condition and even of one's spiritual (if you will) practice. It's not like graduating from school and moving into the workforce, where you stop going to classes and your life shifts radically in a short span. One day you're not enlightened, the next you are, and... that's the whole thing, congrats, you did it, now life goes on surprisingly-similarly to how it did before. "Oh, you're enlightened? That's nice. Now, on with what we were doing...."
- deleted 4y ago
  [deleted]
hrnnnnnn 4y ago
Or the contemporary version: after enlightenment, the dishes.

tuyiown 4y ago

> I experienced a deep realisation that our thoughts manifest from nowhere and not from ourselves (words fail me here) and that the construct of 'me' was completely false and was just a reverberation of my environment. I understood there was no me. This was really nice for about two weeks and then my ego (I expect) just kicked my arse and brought me back down to earth with a crash (maybe its a safety system) Just for the conversation: the «from nowhere» really just might be the unconscious brain, as the relationship between conscious and unconscious is ambiguous at best. The conscious insist in being in control, most of the time fooling itself, while the unconscious does most of the work in a really autonomous way. Maybe the «safety system» was just the unconscious rebelling to prove it does indeed exist and that the conscious should take note, and resume its part in the general guidance of the being :)

haswell 4y ago
> * the «from nowhere» really just might be the unconscious brain* The trouble is that once you start to consider the nature of the unconscious brain, such consideration leads to the same conclusion. If the unconscious brain somehow has “control”, from where does it derive this control? Unless you then accept some kind of metaphysical explanation, it’s centerlessness all the way down.
- tuyiown 4y ago
  > it’s centerlessness all the way down Well I didn't meant anything else actually. I realize that the «unconscious» term is tainted, as it can represent something like a hidden part of personality, especially on Freudian literature and likes. I didn't meant that, I was thinking of the sum of the autonomous processing and coordination of the numerous intricate and distributed functions of the brain, senses, motor, emotional, etc…
  - haswell 4y ago
    That's a good clarification clarification. I misread the quoted part as trying to shift the "well" of consciousness to the unconscious brain, which really just moves the problem down one level.

analyst74 4y ago

haswell 4y ago
Knowledge is not the same thing as insight, and experiencing what the parent comment describes is something that most people never attempt (or even realize there is something to attempt). Having a philosophical/intellectual conversation about the nature of mind is very different than your own mind wrapping itself around these concepts directly.
yyyk 4y ago
It's a common argument, which may or may not be true if it can be properly defined at all.

DontchaKnowit 4y ago

Interestingly you describe the shattering of your delusion as the return of your ego - I think it is the opposite. I think you invited an inflated ego into your life through your meditation : "I should become a guru and help humanity" <-- that is ego speaking. The shattering of this idea is is not ego but humility, to my way of thinking.

2-718-281-828 4y ago
you have a point
- realce 4y ago
  It's also just a mind that might be desperate for a core identity after having its last one logically dissolved through introspection. While ego can hijack identity for it's own mad desires, an identity is required for the actuation of relational actions on a basic level. With no "center" from which to make decisions, the functions of your mind tasked with making choices will panic - this is a foundation of brainwashing/psychological manipulation. Very similar things happen to people who have a TBI, where they become stressed when forced to make choices that seem to have zero baring on "their" lives. So dissolved identity > Panic attacks when choice-satisfaction plummets > subconscious suggests all kinds of cartoonist extremes for an easy and powerful identity > Conscious mind agrees to play along, uses this character to make decisions about > Choice-satisfaction rises.
  - Eupraxias 4y ago
    "So dissolved identity > Panic attacks when choice-satisfaction plummets > subconscious suggests all kinds of cartoonist extremes for an easy and powerful identity > Conscious mind agrees to play along, uses this character to make decisions about > Choice-satisfaction rises. " I'm sure it's different for most others, but I had the opposite experience. It has introduced a great calm into my life. From where I am now, I see identity as the central problem we face as a species.
    - 4y ago

janeerie 4y ago

A couple of years ago, I started a light meditation practice (10-20 minutes) and did it for about a month with good results. At that point, I read this article (on Hacker News) and spent the next two years terrified this would happen to me. I had struggled with panic disorder in the past, but CBT pretty much fixed it for me. This article triggered my first panic attacks in years and led to a constant sense of dread and anxiety. It was so terrifying to think that a simple mental process could potentially trigger a breakdown (and like you, I had a family to take care of). Fast-forward a couple of years, and I'm moving towards the view that these breakdowns are simple anxiety disorders that just happen to be triggered by meditation, in the same way that a panic attack triggered my anxiety disorder when I was young. I don't think there's anything particularly special or mystical about it - it's just our stupid brains activating the fear response, and it appears that the same methods for dealing with anxiety disorders work here. I feel like in a way I was the control group for an experiment - can a fear of meditation provoke the same response as meditation itself?

zozbot234 4y ago
> This article triggered my first panic attacks in years and led to a constant sense of dread and anxiety. Perhaps you should think of your dread and anxiety as a symptom of craving. But if you think your family obligations get in the way, there's nothing wrong with avoiding deep insight practices for now. You can do light meditation and even take an intellectual interest in the deeper teachings without seriously triggering anything.
- robocat 4y ago
  > You can do light meditation and even take an intellectual interest in the deeper teachings without seriously triggering anything. Our fears can dominate our reality, and you are tritely recommending a possibly harmful path without knowing anything about them . . . like recommending eating a peanut to someone who knows they have a dangerous allergic reaction to peanuts. In the context of the article, your advice is especially egregious. Please tread carefully in the world, effortless advice can cause long term harm. Sometimes it is good to listen to our fears, sometimes not. Hard to judge others across the vast distance of a few sentences.

dsubburam 4y ago

> I experienced a deep realisation that our thoughts manifest from nowhere and not from ourselves (words fail me here) and that the construct of 'me' was completely false and was just a reverberation of my environment. I understood there was no me. A way to frame such an experience (a version of which I've had too) is to say that we realize that the purpose we've been having for our striving is bogus. e.g. There's no special "me" that's important to make look good, that needs respect and fame etc. But that doesn't mean we lose all striving. We just find a new, more wholesome, purpose for it. I think Eckhart Tolle talks about this. There are other perspectives, too, that one can garner by reading philosophy. (e.g. Aristotle's Nicomachean Ethics, which puts virtue as most worth striving for; there're also much simpler takes on what's worth striving for in an ego-less sense, which are paradoxically harder to intellectually grok while being much more commonly espoused in practice, such as love for home, and family).

kodah 4y ago

> I experienced a deep realisation that our thoughts manifest from nowhere and not from ourselves (words fail me here) and that the construct of 'me' was completely false and was just a reverberation of my environment. I understood there was no me. If you were tripping this is called ego death. In some circles, including mine, what you described after: > I started to think that I should be looking to help other people and become a guru, perhaps write a book to help humanity, but then my ego (I expect) came back with a vengeance, kicked my ass and brought me back down to earth with a crash (maybe its a safety system). Can be common. When I experienced ego death I was aware that it would return so I was able to deal with it. I think of it kind of like the trip itself; the more you fight it the harder it fights you. Not sure this helps as it's entirely my own experience and was drug induced, but I do think occasional ego death is worth it. Just be cognizant of what you're doing. The mind is a powerful place.

zozbot234 4y ago
And this is exactly why "tripping" is heavily frowned upon by serious meditators and spiritual practitioners. Experiencing "ego death" (i.e. the three marks of existence) without having the previous spiritual grounding for it to help free you from attachment to the ego, is only a recipe for being even more deeply mired in craving and dukkha.
- jcbrand 4y ago
  > And this is exactly why "tripping" is heavily frowned upon by serious meditators and spiritual practitioners. This is needlessly judgmental. I know life-long meditators, 30+ of years disciplined practice who sometimes take psychedelics. I'm not a fan of various aspects of the psychedelic scene, e.g. the spiritual bypassing and the narcissism that can sometimes come from it, but let's not throw the baby out with the bathwater. Usage of psychedelics can be profoundly healing and helpful.
  - zozbot234 4y ago
    > I know life-long meditators, 30+ of years disciplined practice who sometimes take psychedelics. I'm not dismissing spiritual practice, but psychedelics are entirely incidental to it and can be a snare for the unprepared mind. What's "profoundly healing and helpful" is always the spiritual part, not the means used to achieve it.

jvanderbot 4y ago

The stories we tell ourselves matter. Staring into the mind and seeing nothing is a powerful and frightening story. There may be a more positive reframing, but it's also not a mandatory story to tell yourself.

wafflemaker 4y ago

So there is this pattern of light spiritual practice (ok, not in your case, here light was the heavy) being safe and chill, And of heavy spiritual practice having the potential to be dangerous. I see an analogy to using psychedelics as described in this lecture fragment (starts around 12th minute) https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=j72C_lDHTk0 https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=j72C_lDHTk0 Ram Dass on "When is it right to use psychedealics?" There he talks about two types of psychedelic usage. Recreational - here we don't need to prepare, we should use little of the substance and can enjoy f.ex. our favorite music sounding a little better. Transformational - here, we have to prepare thoroughly studying spiritual/philosophical books, have a proper fast before the experience and have a proper guide. This way the potential for a difficult experience lessens and the potential for transformative experience grows. Interestingly, the lecture excerpt starts with description of ancient/historical use of psychedelics, where they were used in rituals aimed at transformation of the subject. Subject attended the ritual being thoroughly prepared, something completely different than being offered psylocibin mushrooms/acid on a party. I wonder if this advice (going light doesn't require preparation, going heavy requires preparing as much as possible trough fasting and study) could also apply here, to meditation practice. Sorry if this idea/lecture was posted here already, had only limited time to read and reply in this thread.

hosh 4y ago

That’s the No Self realization. I only had a brief glimpse of it, including the weirdly simultaneous panic. It did not happen during a meditation session, and it was brief. I remember a podcast interview with Adyashanti about this. A lot of people experience unity consciousness first before no self, but some people experience no self first. He mentioned about someone he knows who experienced that, and had it for years, while also having to care for a child. On reddit, I read someone stating that psychedelic can break someone, and it happened to him. Lots of people responded by saying things, and he was telling them, no, literally, there was something that broke and there’s no coming back from it.

AnonCoward42 4y ago

> I wasn't born Richard Alpert. I was just born as a human being and then I learned this whole business of who I am, whether I'm good or bad, achieving or not - all that's learned along the way. And you see all those learn things separate, so you start to have this dissociative experience, where all that can become is a point of awareness. I remember the first time this happened to me, I got a terrible panic, because indeed I was gonna cease to exist. -- Richard Alpert aka Ram Dass I hope it's transcribed correctly.

quijoteuniv 4y ago
But you are anoncoward42?

blueprint 4y ago

> that the construct of 'me' was completely false and was just a reverberation of my environment you are mistaken as you misunderstood in a subtle but critical way. your sentence is self contradictory. for it to be true it must have some permanent existence. everything that is true does. in the law of cause and effect there are three kinds of causes. environment is one of them. this is the law buddha told us about after he opened his eye. it reveals the entirety of existence, along with another law or two. do not cheat yourself by thinking you can see the truth yet. we can check if you doubt this. it would be to your benefit. but few want what is most important for them.