9 ms·

Samsung hardware is top-notch, but the software bloat is ridiculous. The problem is they make some OS changes that are actually useful to the end-user, especial

Samsung hardware is top-notch, but the software bloat is ridiculous. The problem is they make some OS changes that are actually useful to the end-user, especially when Google seems to be asleep at the wheel. We got really really close for a couple years there when HTC was shipping excellent hardware (the HTC One line) along with an interface that felt like a barely-skinned vanilla Android operating system. But then they kept hemorrhaging money, losing market position, and sold off most of their engineers to Google. Oh well...

BugsJustFindMe 4y ago
> Samsung hardware is top-notch Sometimes. In some ways. Their appliances (washer/dryer/etc) are notoriously unreliable, and their phone batteries appear to swell more than others.
- gjsman-1000 4y ago
  Can speak to that. We went with a Samsung kitchen about ~5 years ago. 2 Dishwashers, 1 Refrigerator, 1 Robot Vacuum, and 2 Stoves later... well, we still have the 2nd Samsung Refrigerator (covered in dents though because the "stainless steel" is apparently super thin) and the Microwave (though we have been told it has a critical flaw, so treat the door gently), but everything else isn't Samsung anymore. It just all broke in one way or another. We also had a Galaxy Note9 in the family that became ludicrously slow after a year and started dropping phone calls - apparently a known software issue that randomly plagued people, absolutely no fix to this day, software reset will not fix. We basically went to all Bosch and Apple after that. Heaven help anyone who bought recent high-end Samsung SSDs and doesn't read the news.
- kop316 4y ago
  > Their appliances (washer/dryer/etc) are notoriously unreliable Yep. I am in a house that is all Sanmsung appliances. The Dishwasher's intake valve started leaking, the Oven's LCD panel broke and only showed garbled information, and the dryer's heating source broke. These were all appliances bought in 2019. Thankfully, I was able to get replacement parts for the first two and fix easily enough, but there was no way to easily fix the dryer (I ended up getting a new dryer). There is no way I would buy a Samsung Appliance again, and it frankly makes me question the quality of anything they make.
  - ocbyc 4y ago
    LG seems to be the more reliable alternative in each of these areas.
    - tim-- 4y ago
      Possibly might want to stay away from their fridges though.
      - lotsofpulp 4y ago
        I think LG fixed their inverted linear compressor problem. I had to buy a few fridges a few years ago, and they all work great and completely silent still.
    - dachryn 4y ago
      I went with AEG specifically because they guarantee at least 10 year of replacement parts availability on those specific devices. To me that's more valuable than a 2 or 3 year warranty.
- rootusrootus 4y ago
  > Their appliances (washer/dryer/etc) are notoriously unreliable What I don't get about this is that consumer reports continues to frequently recommend their appliances. We bought a Samsung fridge, and that experience told me "don't buy any more Samsung appliances" but when we needed a new washer and dryer, CR rated a pair of Samsungs as top of the list. I thought "well, CR is supposed to be reliable, so maybe I am okay to get these." Both broke within the first 18 months of ownership and left us unable to wash clothes until a repair could be scheduled. Fool me twice, yep. I'm the fool. But I can learn, and never another Samsung appliance shall be brought into my house. With the possible exception of a TV; my current TV is a big Samsung and it's been flawless. I think it's actually a different company entirely, even though the appliances and electronics all claim to be "Samsung"
  - gjsman-1000 4y ago
    > my current TV is a big Samsung and it's been flawless. The TVs are better... but the OS was too much for me. Not only because it is full of ads and unlikely to get updates for very long, but also because it's Tizen (which one security researcher, admittedly in 2017, said "may be the worst code I've ever seen" and "Everything you can do wrong there, they do it." He also single-handedly found 40 separate flaws.) Considering Samsung's track record, I find it hard to believe that they would have improved in the last 5 years. https://arstechnica.com/gadgets/2017/04/samsungs-tizen-is-riddled-with-security-flaws-amateurishly-written/ https://arstechnica.com/gadgets/2017/04/samsungs-tizen-is-ri...
  - SllX 4y ago
    Samsung makes good components but they make lousy products. If you’re tempted by a Samsung TV, find another brand that has their panels (e.g. I know Sony used their QD-OLED panels).
    - rootusrootus 4y ago
      That's a good piece of advice I hadn't thought of. I hope my Samsung TV lasts many more years, as it seems to be one of the last "smart" TVs that isn't preloaded with ads (and I've never connected it to the 'net, nor will I). That's going to be my major bit of research whenever it comes time to buy the next one. If I must, I'll get a commercial unit.
- seszett 4y ago
  Since we're telling anecdotes on Samsung appliances, well I have to say my Samsung fridge bought in 2008 works just fine today. It's just a fridge though, not much to go wrong with that I guess.
  - sundvor 4y ago
    Ha ha, I just made a post that reads almost exactly like yours. Saw yours after. We might have the same model fridge. :)
- King-Aaron 4y ago
  Interesting, my Samsung front loader has been chugging away faultlessly for several years now. I must have bought one on a good day.
- throw0101c 4y ago
  > Their appliances (washer/dryer/etc) are notoriously unreliable […] Yale Appliances in Boston, MA, runs their own service department (instead of sub-contracting it out), and so have in-house statistics. According to them, Samsung are relatively reliable as compared to other brands they sell: * https://blog.yaleappliance.com/are-samsung-appliances-reliable https://blog.yaleappliance.com/are-samsung-appliances-reliab... One thing they note is that Samsung has become quite popular, and so even if you have a low rate, if the total units are high, then you're going to get a number of service calls, which can raise visibility.
lcfcjs 4y ago
[dead]
clumsysmurf 4y ago
Android has a bloat problem in general. I uninstalled almost everything on my new iPad. On my Pixel 6A, I can only disable stock apps (they are still there taking up space). Its 2023, I should be able to completely uninstall apps I don't need.
- murderfs 4y ago
  That's likely because Apple is doing the same thing but just lying to you about it. You can't uninstall stock apps because they came on a read-only system image that was signed by your device manufacturer.
  - MBCook 4y ago
    Depends on the app. You can get rid of the real ones like Pages or Sheets or Clips. Mail or Calculator or Find My is just getting hidden.
  - deleted 4y ago
    [deleted]
  - marcellus23 4y ago
    This isn’t true. Deleting apps does actually remove that app and usually user data too. Associated system frameworks might stick around because other parts of the OS depend on them.
    - Mindwipe 4y ago
      > This isn’t true. Deleting apps does actually remove that app and usually user data too. It is true. Factory reset your iOS device and they will come back. That happens because the app is stored still, Apple just creates a second copy that it deletes when you remove the app.
      - deleted 4y ago
        [deleted]
  - deleted 4y ago
isthiseasymode 4y ago
> Samsung hardware is top-notch, but the software bloat is ridiculous. Their self developed UIs are also garbage. My Samsung tv remote has no source button and source menu is hidden in home all the way to the left. If I make the mistake of clicking on an unrecognized device, it spends forever trying to detect it. I may just be complaining about smart tvs in general, but my old TCL was not this much of a pain to use.
- yongjik 4y ago
  Same. I had a TCL "smart" TV which was pretty straightforward to use, and then my teenage daughter decided to get tripped up on the cord. Ruined the TV, decided to buy one with sturdy feet that won't trip, ended up buying Samsung. Man, the UI is a clusterfuck. A lovecraftian horror show. At least the feet are stable.
  - ocbyc 4y ago
    LG+ ROKU seems to be a good alternative to Samsung's Bloat.
    - propogandist 4y ago
      Roku is constantly phoning home and is the chattiest device with PiHole. Roku considers itself and ad company more than a hardware/software company, also.
  - doublerabbit 4y ago
    Just wait until you try Sony. My mother required a television so I bought her one. Sony is a good brand right? WiFi drops out at the most random times. The router is touching differences away. The UI lags as it tries to connect to netflix to download all the latest "trends". So you have to wait many-frustrating seconds upon turning on the TV to actually use any UI feature. You can't even change the channel during that time. Firmware upgrades when it wants. BBC iPlayer has a dogtag that appears on any BBC channel "Press Green to watch from beginning" that intrudes any program witb no opt-out setting. Sigh.
myko 4y ago
I agree re: the hardware but Google's OS feels pristine/top of class in the mobile world, Samsung (and other phone maker's) bloatware just seems annoying.
aceazzameen 4y ago
For a few phone generations, I thought Samsung's OS changes were superior to AOSP. But it seems like they've been degenerating back to the old clunky TouchWiz days lately. But if I'm being honest, I'm not happy with any phone manufacturer's hardware/software anymore.
nfriedly 4y ago
Man, HTC made some of my favorite phones. I wish they were still doing it. Some of Motorola's mid-range phones are actually pretty good these days - the moto g100 has performance roughly on par with a flagship from a couple of years ago, a huge battery, a microSD slot, a headphones jack, USB-C video output with "Ready For" which is arguably better than Samsung Dex (aside from the name), and official LineageOS support. I got mine for ~$270 on ebay, and if it broke, I'd probably buy the same phone again. The Sony Xperia 1 IV and 5 IV are also interesting, with many of those same features, but the Snapdragon 8 Gen 1 CPU is hot garbage and Sony didn't provide sufficient cooling (or tuning) to keep it from overheating and thermally throttling after a few minutes of usage.
- Acutulus 4y ago
  HTC devices were great. I too have had pretty good experiences with motorola lately. In early '21 I wanted a decent and metaphorically disposable phone so I got an unlocked moto G play from the local Target. I expected it to, like seemingly all others, have a locked bootloader and/or completely prevent root access. But I was pleasantly surprised! With a visit to motorola's website IMEI in hand and a couple hours of pulling up XDA pages (like the good old days) I had my device the way I wanted it. It would be nice if mine didn't ship with the amount of bloatware that it did given that I couldn't find a replacement ROM at the time. But after some filesystem scouring and ADB commands it was cleaned up enough for me. When I end up needing another new phone I'll likely hunt down another motorola, and probably the g100 given your positive experience; thanks for sharing it
- Semaphor 4y ago
  My first Android was the HTC Desire-Z (T-Mobile G2 in the US), it was a great phone, I miss full keyboard phones.
- chemmail 4y ago
  I've had HTC phones since the HTC XDa IIs(Blue Angel/Harrier) Windows 2003 phone. It had Wifi and Bluetooth and a 400MHz processor. It was one of the most versatile phones of its time and helped spawn XDA developers. There were so many ROMs for this phone, even Android. I had a HTC Diamond after that and it was pretty amazing, lasting me over 6 years and i had a ton of maps downloaded to it and wikipedia. It helped a lot in Japan when wifi was just barely starting up and you need to get around with maps and train schedules. Now Google Pixel has taken over most of the original HTC phone division, so you will have to look there for the spiritual successors.
nicce 4y ago
> a couple years there when HTC was shipping excellent hardware (the HTC One line) It has been a decade already....
sfmike 4y ago
Taiwan should make a great cell phone producer again. HTC 2.0 with TSMC's best chips with a clean android = yes.
- astrange 4y ago
  TSMC doesn't have chips, they have chip factories; other people design them. That's the basis of their business, they promise not to compete with their customers.

BugsJustFindMe 4y ago

> Samsung hardware is top-notch Sometimes. In some ways. Their appliances (washer/dryer/etc) are notoriously unreliable, and their phone batteries appear to swell more than others.

gjsman-1000 4y ago
Can speak to that. We went with a Samsung kitchen about ~5 years ago. 2 Dishwashers, 1 Refrigerator, 1 Robot Vacuum, and 2 Stoves later... well, we still have the 2nd Samsung Refrigerator (covered in dents though because the "stainless steel" is apparently super thin) and the Microwave (though we have been told it has a critical flaw, so treat the door gently), but everything else isn't Samsung anymore. It just all broke in one way or another. We also had a Galaxy Note9 in the family that became ludicrously slow after a year and started dropping phone calls - apparently a known software issue that randomly plagued people, absolutely no fix to this day, software reset will not fix. We basically went to all Bosch and Apple after that. Heaven help anyone who bought recent high-end Samsung SSDs and doesn't read the news.
kop316 4y ago
> Their appliances (washer/dryer/etc) are notoriously unreliable Yep. I am in a house that is all Sanmsung appliances. The Dishwasher's intake valve started leaking, the Oven's LCD panel broke and only showed garbled information, and the dryer's heating source broke. These were all appliances bought in 2019. Thankfully, I was able to get replacement parts for the first two and fix easily enough, but there was no way to easily fix the dryer (I ended up getting a new dryer). There is no way I would buy a Samsung Appliance again, and it frankly makes me question the quality of anything they make.
- ocbyc 4y ago
  LG seems to be the more reliable alternative in each of these areas.
  - tim-- 4y ago
    Possibly might want to stay away from their fridges though.
    - lotsofpulp 4y ago
      I think LG fixed their inverted linear compressor problem. I had to buy a few fridges a few years ago, and they all work great and completely silent still.
  - dachryn 4y ago
    I went with AEG specifically because they guarantee at least 10 year of replacement parts availability on those specific devices. To me that's more valuable than a 2 or 3 year warranty.
rootusrootus 4y ago
> Their appliances (washer/dryer/etc) are notoriously unreliable What I don't get about this is that consumer reports continues to frequently recommend their appliances. We bought a Samsung fridge, and that experience told me "don't buy any more Samsung appliances" but when we needed a new washer and dryer, CR rated a pair of Samsungs as top of the list. I thought "well, CR is supposed to be reliable, so maybe I am okay to get these." Both broke within the first 18 months of ownership and left us unable to wash clothes until a repair could be scheduled. Fool me twice, yep. I'm the fool. But I can learn, and never another Samsung appliance shall be brought into my house. With the possible exception of a TV; my current TV is a big Samsung and it's been flawless. I think it's actually a different company entirely, even though the appliances and electronics all claim to be "Samsung"
- gjsman-1000 4y ago
  > my current TV is a big Samsung and it's been flawless. The TVs are better... but the OS was too much for me. Not only because it is full of ads and unlikely to get updates for very long, but also because it's Tizen (which one security researcher, admittedly in 2017, said "may be the worst code I've ever seen" and "Everything you can do wrong there, they do it." He also single-handedly found 40 separate flaws.) Considering Samsung's track record, I find it hard to believe that they would have improved in the last 5 years. https://arstechnica.com/gadgets/2017/04/samsungs-tizen-is-riddled-with-security-flaws-amateurishly-written/ https://arstechnica.com/gadgets/2017/04/samsungs-tizen-is-ri...
- SllX 4y ago
  Samsung makes good components but they make lousy products. If you’re tempted by a Samsung TV, find another brand that has their panels (e.g. I know Sony used their QD-OLED panels).
  - rootusrootus 4y ago
    That's a good piece of advice I hadn't thought of. I hope my Samsung TV lasts many more years, as it seems to be one of the last "smart" TVs that isn't preloaded with ads (and I've never connected it to the 'net, nor will I). That's going to be my major bit of research whenever it comes time to buy the next one. If I must, I'll get a commercial unit.
seszett 4y ago
Since we're telling anecdotes on Samsung appliances, well I have to say my Samsung fridge bought in 2008 works just fine today. It's just a fridge though, not much to go wrong with that I guess.
- sundvor 4y ago
  Ha ha, I just made a post that reads almost exactly like yours. Saw yours after. We might have the same model fridge. :)
King-Aaron 4y ago
Interesting, my Samsung front loader has been chugging away faultlessly for several years now. I must have bought one on a good day.
throw0101c 4y ago
> Their appliances (washer/dryer/etc) are notoriously unreliable […] Yale Appliances in Boston, MA, runs their own service department (instead of sub-contracting it out), and so have in-house statistics. According to them, Samsung are relatively reliable as compared to other brands they sell: * https://blog.yaleappliance.com/are-samsung-appliances-reliable https://blog.yaleappliance.com/are-samsung-appliances-reliab... One thing they note is that Samsung has become quite popular, and so even if you have a low rate, if the total units are high, then you're going to get a number of service calls, which can raise visibility.

lcfcjs 4y ago

[dead]

clumsysmurf 4y ago

Android has a bloat problem in general. I uninstalled almost everything on my new iPad. On my Pixel 6A, I can only disable stock apps (they are still there taking up space). Its 2023, I should be able to completely uninstall apps I don't need.

murderfs 4y ago
That's likely because Apple is doing the same thing but just lying to you about it. You can't uninstall stock apps because they came on a read-only system image that was signed by your device manufacturer.
- MBCook 4y ago
  Depends on the app. You can get rid of the real ones like Pages or Sheets or Clips. Mail or Calculator or Find My is just getting hidden.
- deleted 4y ago
  [deleted]
- marcellus23 4y ago
  This isn’t true. Deleting apps does actually remove that app and usually user data too. Associated system frameworks might stick around because other parts of the OS depend on them.
  - Mindwipe 4y ago
    > This isn’t true. Deleting apps does actually remove that app and usually user data too. It is true. Factory reset your iOS device and they will come back. That happens because the app is stored still, Apple just creates a second copy that it deletes when you remove the app.
    - deleted 4y ago
      [deleted]
- deleted 4y ago

isthiseasymode 4y ago

> Samsung hardware is top-notch, but the software bloat is ridiculous. Their self developed UIs are also garbage. My Samsung tv remote has no source button and source menu is hidden in home all the way to the left. If I make the mistake of clicking on an unrecognized device, it spends forever trying to detect it. I may just be complaining about smart tvs in general, but my old TCL was not this much of a pain to use.

yongjik 4y ago
Same. I had a TCL "smart" TV which was pretty straightforward to use, and then my teenage daughter decided to get tripped up on the cord. Ruined the TV, decided to buy one with sturdy feet that won't trip, ended up buying Samsung. Man, the UI is a clusterfuck. A lovecraftian horror show. At least the feet are stable.
- ocbyc 4y ago
  LG+ ROKU seems to be a good alternative to Samsung's Bloat.
  - propogandist 4y ago
    Roku is constantly phoning home and is the chattiest device with PiHole. Roku considers itself and ad company more than a hardware/software company, also.
- doublerabbit 4y ago
  Just wait until you try Sony. My mother required a television so I bought her one. Sony is a good brand right? WiFi drops out at the most random times. The router is touching differences away. The UI lags as it tries to connect to netflix to download all the latest "trends". So you have to wait many-frustrating seconds upon turning on the TV to actually use any UI feature. You can't even change the channel during that time. Firmware upgrades when it wants. BBC iPlayer has a dogtag that appears on any BBC channel "Press Green to watch from beginning" that intrudes any program witb no opt-out setting. Sigh.

myko 4y ago

I agree re: the hardware but Google's OS feels pristine/top of class in the mobile world, Samsung (and other phone maker's) bloatware just seems annoying.

aceazzameen 4y ago

For a few phone generations, I thought Samsung's OS changes were superior to AOSP. But it seems like they've been degenerating back to the old clunky TouchWiz days lately. But if I'm being honest, I'm not happy with any phone manufacturer's hardware/software anymore.

nfriedly 4y ago

Man, HTC made some of my favorite phones. I wish they were still doing it. Some of Motorola's mid-range phones are actually pretty good these days - the moto g100 has performance roughly on par with a flagship from a couple of years ago, a huge battery, a microSD slot, a headphones jack, USB-C video output with "Ready For" which is arguably better than Samsung Dex (aside from the name), and official LineageOS support. I got mine for ~$270 on ebay, and if it broke, I'd probably buy the same phone again. The Sony Xperia 1 IV and 5 IV are also interesting, with many of those same features, but the Snapdragon 8 Gen 1 CPU is hot garbage and Sony didn't provide sufficient cooling (or tuning) to keep it from overheating and thermally throttling after a few minutes of usage.

Acutulus 4y ago
HTC devices were great. I too have had pretty good experiences with motorola lately. In early '21 I wanted a decent and metaphorically disposable phone so I got an unlocked moto G play from the local Target. I expected it to, like seemingly all others, have a locked bootloader and/or completely prevent root access. But I was pleasantly surprised! With a visit to motorola's website IMEI in hand and a couple hours of pulling up XDA pages (like the good old days) I had my device the way I wanted it. It would be nice if mine didn't ship with the amount of bloatware that it did given that I couldn't find a replacement ROM at the time. But after some filesystem scouring and ADB commands it was cleaned up enough for me. When I end up needing another new phone I'll likely hunt down another motorola, and probably the g100 given your positive experience; thanks for sharing it
Semaphor 4y ago
My first Android was the HTC Desire-Z (T-Mobile G2 in the US), it was a great phone, I miss full keyboard phones.
chemmail 4y ago
I've had HTC phones since the HTC XDa IIs(Blue Angel/Harrier) Windows 2003 phone. It had Wifi and Bluetooth and a 400MHz processor. It was one of the most versatile phones of its time and helped spawn XDA developers. There were so many ROMs for this phone, even Android. I had a HTC Diamond after that and it was pretty amazing, lasting me over 6 years and i had a ton of maps downloaded to it and wikipedia. It helped a lot in Japan when wifi was just barely starting up and you need to get around with maps and train schedules. Now Google Pixel has taken over most of the original HTC phone division, so you will have to look there for the spiritual successors.

nicce 4y ago

> a couple years there when HTC was shipping excellent hardware (the HTC One line) It has been a decade already....

sfmike 4y ago

Taiwan should make a great cell phone producer again. HTC 2.0 with TSMC's best chips with a clean android = yes.

astrange 4y ago
TSMC doesn't have chips, they have chip factories; other people design them. That's the basis of their business, they promise not to compete with their customers.