30 ms·

Dwarf Fortress – randomly generated, persistent fantasy world

527 points by loa_in_ 4y ago

brown 4y ago
Not sure why Dwarf Fortress is on the front page, but I will always upvote. If you're intimidated by ASCII visuals, consider wishlisting the graphics release, scheduled for Dec 6, 2022: https://store.steampowered.com/app/975370/Dwarf_Fortress/ https://store.steampowered.com/app/975370/Dwarf_Fortress/
- kennu 4y ago
  Nice to see there is a release date now! Wishlisted quite a while ago already, when no date was set.
- agiacalone 4y ago
  Love the ASCII version, but totally buying to support the devs.
  - deelowe 4y ago
    As soon as I learned why Tarn needed to put out a paid release on Steam, I committed to purchasing even if I never play it.
    - deleted 4y ago
      [deleted]
    - MikeTheGreat 4y ago
      You can't just leave a comment like that and walk away from it. :) Why did Tarn need to put out a paid release? (I think I know / I kinda remember, but hey - there's no better place to tell us why we should be helping a fellow geek)
      - deelowe 4y ago
        https://gamerant.com/dwarf-fortress-interview-new-age-health-problems-inspiration/ https://gamerant.com/dwarf-fortress-interview-new-age-health...
      - bombcar 4y ago
        A hospital/illness scare made them realize they have nothing setup for illness/insurance and need a more secure source of income. It's probably true that if word got out that Tarn or Zack needed medical care, the donations would flow like water, but it's understandable wanting to prepare.
      - ilyt 4y ago
        American healthcare system
      - nonethewiser 4y ago
        As I recall he had some medical issues to pay for. The other brother didnt have insurance nor a regular income... just his split of the DF donation money. It bring up a lot of criticism of healthcare in the US which I don't quite understand. Yes, healthcare is expensive in the US, especially without insurance. It has been for a while, so dont be surprised when not having a regular income nor insurance puts you in a bad spot. It was poor planning as much as it is expensive healthcare. It basically amounts to one day realizing "oh shit, $35,000/year and no health insurance isn't enough money. This is the fault of the United States."
        munk-a 4y ago
        Very briefly as a counter example - these folks made a thing that thousands maybe tens of thousands of people treasure. They've worked on it as a passion project and when ill luck befell them they had to scramble to secure funds. Yes, we live in a capitalist system but supporting neat art like this and exploratory projects is a societal investment that the US has stiffly refused to make. The more we provide social safety nets the more folks will be free to do experimental and artistic work and give us gems like dwarf fortress. This isn't the fault of the United States - the US has made a choice in how the game works and they weren't playing by the rules laid out for them to follow. The expected course was for them to work in some job that robs them of their free time to produce a work of this caliber and if they had done so they'd be just fine... and we wouldn't have dwarf fortress.
  - mjamesaustin 4y ago
    Just a heads up, if you purchase on itch.io rather than Steam, the devs receive a larger share of the revenue. (Though obviously it's not integrated into Steam, if you prefer that.) https://kitfoxgames.itch.io/dwarf-fortress https://kitfoxgames.itch.io/dwarf-fortress
    - Daunk 4y ago
      Noted. I will buy it on both itch.io and Steam then.
      - munk-a 4y ago
        Considering I've given them a few bucks a month for a decade and a bit now which doesn't even come close to the value I've gotten that is a great idea.
  - mminer237 4y ago
    You can also just donate directly: http://www.bay12games.com/support.html http://www.bay12games.com/support.html They used to personally make a crayon drawing for each person who donated. They stopped in 2020, but I made sure to get one of the final ones before then: http://www.bay12games.com/support.html http://www.bay12games.com/support.html My $10 was a small price to pay for all the hours of fun I got. (I'll surely buy the Steam version too though.)
    - mminer237 4y ago
      Whoops, I messed up the links. This is the drawing I got: https://matthewminer.name/assets/my_dwarf_fortress_crayon_drawing.jpg https://matthewminer.name/assets/my_dwarf_fortress_crayon_dr...
- rococode 4y ago
  As a Rimworld lover who couldn't quite get past the ASCII in Dwarf Fortress, I'm super excited for the upcoming release! Rimworld has been a blast and I've heard the two games have many similarities (with Rimworld maybe being a slightly more approachable game that's a bit shallower).
  - tstrimple 4y ago
    I love ribworld as well! It's my most played game by far at this point. The mod ecosystem is simply outstanding. That being said, it doesn't even attempt to be the simulation engine that Dwarf Fortress does. It feels like DF is a simulation engine first, with emergent game play almost as a side effect. As much as I like DF, that simulation first development process can be felt during almost every interaction in the game. It's not so bad once you've committed everything to muscle memory, but the learning curve is no joke. https://i.stack.imgur.com/iECXl.jpg https://i.stack.imgur.com/iECXl.jpg
    - krisroadruck 4y ago
      if you like these games you might also like Oxygen Not Included. It's side-on view instead of top down, but is another excellent little ant farm to sink a couple thousand hours into. Sort of a Rimworld meets Factorio type vibe.
      - ericbarrett 4y ago
        > is another excellent little ant farm I call ONI my "dollhouse." It's such a sleeper compared to similar games. The art and sound effects really elevate it. Klei has such a unique art style and it's really shown off. Also has a much more interesting "survival" curve than most; you'll be presented with many many hours of challenges trying to get a sustainable base, without cheap tricks like ever-escalating interruptions based on quantitative progress (looking at you, Rimworld.)
    - bombcar 4y ago
      The new version is going to fix some of that; the normalization of menus, etc, will go a long way to "making it feel more game-like".
- jrm4 4y ago
  Whoooaaa. So, this has been a game that's always fascinated me, though when trying to play myself I nope out within minutes. On one hand, graphics might get me there -- and yet, even to me, it feels kinda wrong :)
- PeterisP 4y ago
  The Lazy Newb Pack (and other third-party options) has been an easy way to get cute graphics for Dwarf Fortress for many, many years now.
  - signalToNose 4y ago
    But the UI has all joy and ease of Emacs
    - bombcar 4y ago
      But it has the power and learning curve of Emacs, too!
    - tptacek 4y ago
      The ease is like 80% of the joy.
    - ilyt 4y ago
      The commenter above did mention the new UI is coming this december. Long story short it got upgraded from Emacs to IntelliJ IDEA.
- andremedeiros 4y ago
  Thank you for reminding me, I've been meaning to wishlist this for a while. Excited they finally have a release date set!
- schlauerfox 4y ago
  The technical complexity got me through a really tough time where I could hide in the world, ascii only on a pavilion convertible laptop. Good times, impenetrable gameplay.
  - ilyt 4y ago
    The Steam version OP mentioned fixes that
    - lelandfe 4y ago
      I am not holding my breath that the complexity is fixable - although I will certainly settle for “not impossibly Byzantine” when it comes to controls
      - ilyt 4y ago
        Kitfox (the publisher) did a video with dev and someone new to DF [1] playing it for first time, while it might not be "pick up and go" yet it looked massively more approachable. There is even rudimentary tutorial to set up the basics and a bunch of guides. Also most of the DF complexity comes organically during gameplay and not all at once - if all you do is set up food source and some bedrooms you already buy yourself a lot of time to fuck around. The discoverability of systems should also be much better - [1] https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=bLN8cOcTjdo https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=bLN8cOcTjdo
        lelandfe 4y ago
        Hadn't seen this – thanks for the link. My excitement for this release has risen from excited to very excited :)
- PhasmaFelis 4y ago
  Is the UI getting an overhaul as well? I could probably deal with the ASCII, but I'm picky about UI design, and what I've heard about the interface sounds like it would make me have a tantrum and smash my menacing rhyolite cave sock.
  - tptacek 4y ago
    Careful what you wish for. Some of the Dwarf Fortress endorphins are a product of the horrible user interface; asking for a more intuitive interface (at times) is like asking for an easier Soulsborne boss. Ask enough times and you have Horizon Forbidden West instead of Bloodborne.
    - PhasmaFelis 4y ago
      Enh... In an action-y game, there's a strong argument that mastering difficult controls can be half the fun. In a menu-based management game, I want the controls to be as streamlined and intuitive as possible, always. It should be my knowledge and planning ability being tested, not my muscle memory. Or to put it another way, if I'm pretending to manage a fortress, losing because I was too focused on expansion and didn't stock enough food and ammunition to survive a siege can be fun. Losing because I was fully prepared but forgot how to tell my minions to raise the drawbridge and man the walls is just frustrating.
  - bombcar 4y ago
    The old UI is like a well-worn sock for me, fits perfectly and I know where the holes are. But yes, the new version has an entirely redone UI to greatly organize and simplify things. The updates here: https://steamcommunity.com/app/975370 https://steamcommunity.com/app/975370 go into more details - there's even a tutorial!
  - jibe 4y ago
    They’ve revamped the UI. Here is a dev blog post with an early screenshot from 2021. https://steamcommunity.com/games/975370/announcements/detail/4816004515020626336 https://steamcommunity.com/games/975370/announcements/detail...
- RektBoy 4y ago
  ASCII is not a problem, since there is ton of graphics packs. But controls, controls are ridiculous. I can't just enjoy it. And I play very hard games, indie games, Ultima Online which you need to script own things to play properly. But DF is another beast.
  - jessfyi 4y ago
    The version being released on steam also includes extensive UX/UI updates, OP just left that out.
  - ilyt 4y ago
    The graphics version also did MASSIVE pass on every control. Like, instead of going "select bed, make bedroom, repeat 40 times", you can just make rooms, put beds, doors, etc, then just select whole area and it will make a bedroom out of each of those rooms. camera controls are normal WASD now, most of the things can be done with mouse, there are tabs on panels and hyperlinks in legend browser and thousand other little things. It will be coming eventually to free ASCII version too
- sdenton4 4y ago
  Does the framerate still decline steadily to zero as you expand your fortress?
- etempleton 4y ago
  I am excited for the graphics release as I have always been fascinated by Dwarf Fortress, but do not think I have the patience to learn how to parse the ASCII visuals.
- ncr100 4y ago
  The fun of game software (truly): http://www.bay12games.com/dwarves/mantisbt/view.php?id=8410 http://www.bay12games.com/dwarves/mantisbt/view.php?id=8410 Bug title: "0008410: Crash due to zero-size weasel" <3
jrm4 4y ago
Decided to read the whole thing. For some reason the very last line where they make sure that you know that they have the color black included, twice, is hilarious to me. There's probably some reason for it though? Anyone know?
- shrx 4y ago
  I think they just want to point out that black is one of the available 16 colors, meaning that there are just 15 colors not counting black.
mtrpcic 4y ago
I'm always fascinated by Dwarf Fortress whenever I cross paths with it, particularly from a technical architecture point of view. How did they architect the history simulation? How do they efficiently update everything on each tick? What is the game loop like? If anyone has any resources or links to articles, either definitive from the DW developer, or conjecture based on exploration and research, I'd love to learn more about how DF works.
- praptak 4y ago
  Last time I checked they didn't do it particularly efficiently and avoiding "FPS death" was an important part of the lore: cap the number of dwarves, avoid flowing water, wall off unused parts of the mine to reduce costs of pathfinding, add pathfinding weights to tiles, etc. There's not much published about the internals because the creators keep it to themselves.
  - WastingMyTime89 4y ago
    Cats are the death of fortress. Dwarf fortress is an incredible game but you are right that it’s actually amusing the amount of weird things you know you should avoid or manage as a regular player.
    - praptak 4y ago
      Ah yes, "catsplosion". Better make sure to keep only one sex of cat.
      - 2000UltraDeluxe 4y ago
        Bah, put the kittens in a cage and release them upon unexpecting intruders. 50-60 kittens will tear a Kobold apart if you lock them all into a small room. For the un-initiated: Yes, Dwarf Fortress is a brutal game.
- jonchurch_ 4y ago
  One of the creators (Tarn, specifically) does interviews fairly often, talking about the game and progress. Here's a video telling a very famous story about tracking down a bug that involved alcoholic cats https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=VAhHkJQ3KgY https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=VAhHkJQ3KgY There was also a recent article about Dwarf Fortress published to the Stack Overflow blog https://stackoverflow.blog/2021/12/31/700000-lines-of-code-20-years-and-one-developer-how-dwarf-fortress-is-built/ https://stackoverflow.blog/2021/12/31/700000-lines-of-code-2... Edit: There's really a decent amount of stuff out there, they've been making the game for almost 20 years now. So here is a talk that tries to explain DF to an audience, and does talk a little about the simulation. https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=ykLm2o_cX9w https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=ykLm2o_cX9w I adore DF and am one of those folks who enjoys playing, not just watching videos on youtube. If you do want to give it a go, make sure you find an "Intro to DF" type video and follow it. It's a big learning curve but I love the game so much, and knowing the story of it's creation over time makes me love it even more. It is truly a labor of love by two brothers who have chosen to make it their life's work.
jrm4 4y ago
It's weird to read a line that feels like typical overhyped advertising copy next to a Steam game but that you realize is probably 100% accurate? Namely "The deepest, most intricate simulation of a world that's ever been created?"
- praptak 4y ago
  This deep and intricate world is inhabited by dumbest, most stubborn dwarves who throw players into depth of frustration, despair and a solid dose of hilarity.
tstrimple 4y ago
The level of detail in Dwarf Fortress is amazing. Just take a look at this bug report: https://www.bay12games.com/dwarves/mantisbt/view.php?id=9195 https://www.bay12games.com/dwarves/mantisbt/view.php?id=9195 TLDR: Code was added that allowed substances to accumulate on fur. Cats lick their fur to clean themselves. Due to the calculation used for intoxication and body weight, cats kept getting lethally drunk from walking through spilled beer and licking it off of their feet. This level of detail leads to tons of emergent game play and stories.
- lstodd 4y ago
  Haha lol. I maybe still have a screenshot of a Forgotten Beast killing himself by kicking up a dead cat's tooth (the cat was killed by some previous FB) (and the tooth deals a fatality). The level of detail is amazing.
  - ilyt 4y ago
    Yeah there were pretty interesting edge cases with calculations. Like, for example, there is still [1] a bug for a whip doing unreasonable amount of damage in some cases because armour penetration logic was pretty much strength/area = penetration power. And because whip hit only with tiny end, it pretty much went thru any armour https://www.bay12games.com/dwarves/mantisbt/view.php?id=2712 https://www.bay12games.com/dwarves/mantisbt/view.php?id=2712
- bombcar 4y ago
  It's worth studying some of the more famous bug reports as they're perfect examples of emergent issues that can arise in complex situations.
- chx 4y ago
  That's like the legendary carps bug. > fish and all other creatures are coded similar to Dwarfs for level progression, so training a skill not only improves the skill but also the relevant physical stats. Well, Carps have swimming as a skill. And they are always swimming. So within minutes of spawning every carp was a dwarf-sized mass of angry muscle and razor sharp teeth.
Daunk 4y ago
I'm so happy seeing DF reach a larger audience with the Steam release, it's been such a joy to experiment with over the years, and I feel like Zach and Tarn deserve a lot more recognition. Here's my personal DF tileset - https://github.com/Hezkore/dwarf-fortress-assets https://github.com/Hezkore/dwarf-fortress-assets
lstodd 4y ago
What is more spectacular than even the Dwarf Fortress itself (and it is), are the C++ reverse-engineering tools developed in Common Lisp back in 2010-s. DFHack and Dwarf Therapist were rebased on top of them.
rpastuszak 4y ago
Fantasy World is a bit of an understatement. It's one of the toughest and deepest simulations one can find.
helf 4y ago
I’ve played DF off an on for ~15 years. Love it always get an upvote.
- Loughla 4y ago
  I go back to read boatmurdered at least once a year just for the chuckles (and the reminiscing about SA forums back in the day). Then I play DF for a month or so and remember just how intricate and IMPOSSIBLE it is to understand completely. What an amazing game.
Ancalagon 4y ago
I really need to get into this. But on the other hand, if I start playing I have a feeling I might not stop.
- ilyt 4y ago
  It's actually not bad game to have running on second screen and just poke at it from time to time as your dwarves are working and building stuff. Kinda perfect "podcast game"
  - Ancalagon 4y ago
    Thats what someone said to me about Runescape though.
bombcar 4y ago
One of the things I love is that you can generate a world, play a fortress, eventually lose (it's fun!™) and then start another fortress in the same world, and your new fortress will have references to your old one - in the carvings, legends, etc.
- Shared404 4y ago
  One thing I want to jump into is the Adventurer mode! Nothing quite like the idea of building (and losing) several fortresses, and then going through them to explore as the "new generation". Haven't played DF yet, but it's very much on my list.
  - mttyng 4y ago
    Is that what Adventure Mode is? I’ve been playing DF off-and-on since 2013(ish), but I’ve never tried adventure mode.
    - bombcar 4y ago
      Adventure mode is more like a 'standard' RPG-style adventure, similar to nethack but entirely generated. https://dwarffortresswiki.org/index.php/DF2014:Adventurer_mode https://dwarffortresswiki.org/index.php/DF2014:Adventurer_mo... It doesn't have as much polish as Fortress mode, but it can be quite fun if you like the nethack style of "die early, die awesome, die often".
      - mttyng 4y ago
        Thanks!
  - bombcar 4y ago
    Even if you don't actually play, Legends mode alone can be interesting. https://dwarffortresswiki.org/index.php/DF2014:Legends https://dwarffortresswiki.org/index.php/DF2014:Legends
- hinkley 4y ago
xnx 4y ago
I want to get into this, but the randomly generated nature has always been an (irrational?) turn-off. I guess I want more editorial choice in the level design.
- bombcar 4y ago
  You do control a large number of aspects of world generation, which can be used to "tune" the game from very easy to impossibly difficult. And once you have parameters you like, you can try different seeds. https://dwarffortresswiki.org/index.php/DF2014:World_generation https://dwarffortresswiki.org/index.php/DF2014:World_generat... https://dwarffortresswiki.org/index.php/DF2014:Advanced_world_generation https://dwarffortresswiki.org/index.php/DF2014:Advanced_worl... Also, people will post seeds and world parameters for "good worlds" they've found: https://dwarffortresswiki.org/index.php/DF2014:Worldgen_examples https://dwarffortresswiki.org/index.php/DF2014:Worldgen_exam...
- MiddleEndian 4y ago
  On top of what bombcar mentioned, you also get to choose your embark spot within your tuned world.
  - bombcar 4y ago
    And you can post a world on the forums and ask people for a "good embark spot" and they'll find different ones for you. It's amusing what people consider "necessities" and "absolutely not" in embark spots; some people will never touch an aquifer, others it's not even something to look at.
- ilyt 4y ago
  The better UI(and paid) version drops on Steam 6th of December. Probably the best time to give it a shot. And it is not "just" randomly generated. For example, the rivers flow where there are rocky paths in the terrain Rocky paths are there because during worldgen game simulated erosion. Erosion is made by simulated rainfall Simulated rainfall depends in winds and location of a given terrain. And only at the start of that chain there is "random generation". > I guess I want more editorial choice in the level design. Then tell your dwarves to build what you want, you can make pretty grand scale things in it.
Kiro 4y ago
What made you randomly post Dwarf Fortress now with this undescriptive and confusing title? Very peculiar.
- loa_in_ 4y ago
  Titles need to be short, and relevant to the content. I took words straight from the Features section. Now, because with all the talk about AI agents I was thinking about the environments, and that's when I remembered this. It very much can be inspiring, even if it's not strictly relevant technology-wise.
  - Kiro 4y ago
    I understand but I don't think the title is very representative of the game. Regardless, Dwarf Fortress gets posted here a lot so I definitely think it's relevant: https://hn.algolia.com/?q=dwarf+fortress https://hn.algolia.com/?q=dwarf+fortress
lcnPylGDnU4H9OF 4y ago
The story of Boatmurdered[0] has given me a good go-to seed for other games with procedural generation. It's well worth the read if you have an afternoon. [0] https://lparchive.org/Dwarf-Fortress-Boatmurdered/ https://lparchive.org/Dwarf-Fortress-Boatmurdered/
- jameshart 4y ago
  Boatmurdered is representative of a very old version of the game. For more modern DF storytelling I would encourage you to check out Kruggsmash on YouTube, in particular his Scorchfountain series: https://youtube.com/playlist?list=PLXX7Rp0iXj0l998LmVC6xIRHjtj2Pr2VI https://youtube.com/playlist?list=PLXX7Rp0iXj0l998LmVC6xIRHj... Krugg gives due reverence to the generated descriptions of his dwarves and their world and incorporates them into his emergent storytelling and illustration in a very elegant way.
specproc 4y ago
Has anyone actually played this? Like, really played it. I've tried a couple of times and never got that far. I'm in awe from one perspective, but not entirely sure what of, from another.
- praptak 4y ago
  I can get to 80-100 dwarves without huge problems but then I usually get bored with the micromanagement. DF is not hard if you follow the quickstart guide.
- robomc 4y ago
  Nearly a decade ago I played it a bit over a couple of months. I'd guess 30 hours or so (which is a lot for me, I'm a gaming dabbler, aside from the civ and fromsoft games). It was pretty playable IMO, and would really pull you in, just tedious to navigate the menus. I eventually got kind of tired of investing so much effort into a fortress that would just randomly fall apart. People say that's part of the fun but I dunno... I found that aspect a bit annoying. It also ran really poorly for me in late game and that kind of put me off too. Great concept, the ascii is less of a problem than you'd think, but overall just a bit too much effort to keep wanting to come back for more.
- tptacek 4y ago
  Yes. It's one of those things I have to keep uninstalled or it'll randomly suck me back in. AMA.
- hristov 4y ago
  Yes. It is not really that hard, if you consider how they have probably the best wiki of any computer game and a lot of high quality helper programs. If you alt-tab between dwarf fortress, the wiki and dwarf therapist, it is totally doable. And once you play a couple of games you start to get the internal logic of DF and becomes kind of fun.
- ilyt 4y ago
  Steam version with better UI and graphics released 6th December I did "actually played it", think the biggest thing I did was a lava cannon that flooded the area aboveground when invasion game, that was "interesting" build... Having to relearn everything on interface stopped me from picking it up again, and from what I watched new UI look so much more user friendly
namuol 4y ago
Frontend UX developer perspective on DF: The ascii interface is actually fine and mostly a superficial complaint. The real problem is just how hard the many interfaces are to navigate and learn, and how unconventional their designs are. If I could pick one thing for the UI team to focus on: DF needs a “command palette” to help find/learn all of the game’s many functions.
- mlatu 4y ago
  "once you get into it its actually quite easy to navigate in" is something i would have said back when i played, at least ten years ago though
  - namuol 4y ago
    I agree, but pretty much every UI has its own learning curve to get over, and taken together it’s just overwhelming to get started with. Curious to see how the tutorial system in the premium version helps address this. I’m cautiously hopeful but still doubt I will have the time to properly run a fortress. Maybe we’ll see the premium version lead to a jump in DF as a spectator sport given the much richer graphics library.
    - coder-3 4y ago
      Time is what's been preventing me from getting into DF. Do I need to spend a significant amount of time on this game to get a good experience? Could I get away with, say, one hour once in a while? I'd probably need to invest time upfront to learn the basics though.
      - mlatu 4y ago
        and before that, take your time to generate your world :D in my experience, the hints at the bottom row are pretty good reminders of how to navigate the menus. i advise you to use a keyboard with numpad, otherwise it is a mess iirc
  - sdenton4 4y ago
pearjuice 4y ago
I've tried playing and actually getting into this game a few times (including installing tile packs, walkthrough saves and what not), but the game mechanics are obtuse and have such a high learning curve that frustration is easier found than any sense of enjoyment. For a game focused on being so meticulous and extra-vagant in its mechanics, it's sad that enjoying it or "having fun" seems something completely out of reach with hours of gameplay, reading third-party wikis and starter guides.
jiggawatts 4y ago
The thing that gets me about Dwarf Fortress is that it's a 64-bit text-mode game. As a grey-haired developer who got excited about "DOS Extenders" that allowed 32-bit mode, seeing a text-mode game written as a native 64-bit application is bizarrely anachronistic. I get a similar feeling from text-mode GUI frameworks for Rust, which allow multi-threading and 64-bit but are essentially clones of Borland Turbo Vision, where you had to be mindful to keep lists smaller than 64KB: https://github.com/gyscos/cursive https://github.com/gyscos/cursive
- ilyt 4y ago
  Not for long https://store.steampowered.com/app/975370/Dwarf_Fortress/ https://store.steampowered.com/app/975370/Dwarf_Fortress/ Graphical+UI/controls rewrite in few weeks!
  - stolen_biscuit 4y ago
    Both versions will be supported :) "Classic" DF isn't going anywhere
- babuskov 4y ago
  You might find Rogue Bit interesting: https://store.steampowered.com/app/949790/Rogue_Bit/ https://store.steampowered.com/app/949790/Rogue_Bit/ It's a modern game about hacking internals of an 8-bit computer by walking a single bit through it's memory. Visually it looks like an ASCII roguelike game, but it's actually a niche puzzle game for people who like machine language, assembly and computer internals.
deleted 4y ago
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LAC-Tech 4y ago
I was really keen on the idea of adventure mode, after watching a fantastic lets play of it [0]. But when I got there I didn't really know what to do inside the sandbox. [0] https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=tDX5hmtjqtw https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=tDX5hmtjqtw
PointyFluff 4y ago
this. not the lame knock-off that is rimworld.
ubermonkey 4y ago
I admire the effort of DF, and the depth of it implied by the release notes, but holy cow I am absolutely NEVER going to try to play it. This is because, in the event I make it over the threshold, it is ENTIRELY possible that it will become an obsession, and I don't have time for that.
hackerbeat 4y ago
All I want is a game in the style of Warcraft 1 & 2. Does anyone know of any that come close?
YesBox 4y ago
If you're interested in playing a new game in this genre, I've been developing a city builder game over the last year, heavily inspired by Dwarf Fortress, Rim World, Cities: Skylines, Sim City, etc. My game will have more granular demand (not just vague "you need more commercial zones"). The player will see the interior of buildings and will be able to watch their sims live their lives. Im working on getting version 0.2 release by Q1 2023. The game is isometric now! Working on releasing a new vlog to show it off. I developed a new path finding algorithm to build big cities. Here's an old version of the game path finding 1,000,000 units to their own unique destinations: https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=x0HCnQqF5K4 https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=x0HCnQqF5K4 Subreddit: https://reddit.com/r/Archapolis https://reddit.com/r/Archapolis

527 points by loa_in_ 4y ago

Not sure why Dwarf Fortress is on the front page, but I will always upvote. If you're intimidated by ASCII visuals, consider wishlisting the graphics release, scheduled for Dec 6, 2022: https://store.steampowered.com/app/975370/Dwarf_Fortress/ https://store.steampowered.com/app/975370/Dwarf_Fortress/

kennu 4y ago
Nice to see there is a release date now! Wishlisted quite a while ago already, when no date was set.
agiacalone 4y ago
Love the ASCII version, but totally buying to support the devs.
- deelowe 4y ago
  As soon as I learned why Tarn needed to put out a paid release on Steam, I committed to purchasing even if I never play it.
  - deleted 4y ago
    [deleted]
  - MikeTheGreat 4y ago
    You can't just leave a comment like that and walk away from it. :) Why did Tarn need to put out a paid release? (I think I know / I kinda remember, but hey - there's no better place to tell us why we should be helping a fellow geek)
    - deelowe 4y ago
      https://gamerant.com/dwarf-fortress-interview-new-age-health-problems-inspiration/ https://gamerant.com/dwarf-fortress-interview-new-age-health...
    - bombcar 4y ago
      A hospital/illness scare made them realize they have nothing setup for illness/insurance and need a more secure source of income. It's probably true that if word got out that Tarn or Zack needed medical care, the donations would flow like water, but it's understandable wanting to prepare.
    - ilyt 4y ago
      American healthcare system
    - nonethewiser 4y ago
      As I recall he had some medical issues to pay for. The other brother didnt have insurance nor a regular income... just his split of the DF donation money. It bring up a lot of criticism of healthcare in the US which I don't quite understand. Yes, healthcare is expensive in the US, especially without insurance. It has been for a while, so dont be surprised when not having a regular income nor insurance puts you in a bad spot. It was poor planning as much as it is expensive healthcare. It basically amounts to one day realizing "oh shit, $35,000/year and no health insurance isn't enough money. This is the fault of the United States."
      - munk-a 4y ago
        Very briefly as a counter example - these folks made a thing that thousands maybe tens of thousands of people treasure. They've worked on it as a passion project and when ill luck befell them they had to scramble to secure funds. Yes, we live in a capitalist system but supporting neat art like this and exploratory projects is a societal investment that the US has stiffly refused to make. The more we provide social safety nets the more folks will be free to do experimental and artistic work and give us gems like dwarf fortress. This isn't the fault of the United States - the US has made a choice in how the game works and they weren't playing by the rules laid out for them to follow. The expected course was for them to work in some job that robs them of their free time to produce a work of this caliber and if they had done so they'd be just fine... and we wouldn't have dwarf fortress.
- mjamesaustin 4y ago
  Just a heads up, if you purchase on itch.io rather than Steam, the devs receive a larger share of the revenue. (Though obviously it's not integrated into Steam, if you prefer that.) https://kitfoxgames.itch.io/dwarf-fortress https://kitfoxgames.itch.io/dwarf-fortress
  - Daunk 4y ago
    Noted. I will buy it on both itch.io and Steam then.
    - munk-a 4y ago
      Considering I've given them a few bucks a month for a decade and a bit now which doesn't even come close to the value I've gotten that is a great idea.
- mminer237 4y ago
  You can also just donate directly: http://www.bay12games.com/support.html http://www.bay12games.com/support.html They used to personally make a crayon drawing for each person who donated. They stopped in 2020, but I made sure to get one of the final ones before then: http://www.bay12games.com/support.html http://www.bay12games.com/support.html My $10 was a small price to pay for all the hours of fun I got. (I'll surely buy the Steam version too though.)
  - mminer237 4y ago
    Whoops, I messed up the links. This is the drawing I got: https://matthewminer.name/assets/my_dwarf_fortress_crayon_drawing.jpg https://matthewminer.name/assets/my_dwarf_fortress_crayon_dr...
rococode 4y ago
As a Rimworld lover who couldn't quite get past the ASCII in Dwarf Fortress, I'm super excited for the upcoming release! Rimworld has been a blast and I've heard the two games have many similarities (with Rimworld maybe being a slightly more approachable game that's a bit shallower).
- tstrimple 4y ago
  I love ribworld as well! It's my most played game by far at this point. The mod ecosystem is simply outstanding. That being said, it doesn't even attempt to be the simulation engine that Dwarf Fortress does. It feels like DF is a simulation engine first, with emergent game play almost as a side effect. As much as I like DF, that simulation first development process can be felt during almost every interaction in the game. It's not so bad once you've committed everything to muscle memory, but the learning curve is no joke. https://i.stack.imgur.com/iECXl.jpg https://i.stack.imgur.com/iECXl.jpg
  - krisroadruck 4y ago
    if you like these games you might also like Oxygen Not Included. It's side-on view instead of top down, but is another excellent little ant farm to sink a couple thousand hours into. Sort of a Rimworld meets Factorio type vibe.
    - ericbarrett 4y ago
      > is another excellent little ant farm I call ONI my "dollhouse." It's such a sleeper compared to similar games. The art and sound effects really elevate it. Klei has such a unique art style and it's really shown off. Also has a much more interesting "survival" curve than most; you'll be presented with many many hours of challenges trying to get a sustainable base, without cheap tricks like ever-escalating interruptions based on quantitative progress (looking at you, Rimworld.)
  - bombcar 4y ago
    The new version is going to fix some of that; the normalization of menus, etc, will go a long way to "making it feel more game-like".
jrm4 4y ago
Whoooaaa. So, this has been a game that's always fascinated me, though when trying to play myself I nope out within minutes. On one hand, graphics might get me there -- and yet, even to me, it feels kinda wrong :)
PeterisP 4y ago
The Lazy Newb Pack (and other third-party options) has been an easy way to get cute graphics for Dwarf Fortress for many, many years now.
- signalToNose 4y ago
  But the UI has all joy and ease of Emacs
  - bombcar 4y ago
    But it has the power and learning curve of Emacs, too!
  - tptacek 4y ago
    The ease is like 80% of the joy.
  - ilyt 4y ago
    The commenter above did mention the new UI is coming this december. Long story short it got upgraded from Emacs to IntelliJ IDEA.
andremedeiros 4y ago
Thank you for reminding me, I've been meaning to wishlist this for a while. Excited they finally have a release date set!
schlauerfox 4y ago
The technical complexity got me through a really tough time where I could hide in the world, ascii only on a pavilion convertible laptop. Good times, impenetrable gameplay.
- ilyt 4y ago
  The Steam version OP mentioned fixes that
  - lelandfe 4y ago
    I am not holding my breath that the complexity is fixable - although I will certainly settle for “not impossibly Byzantine” when it comes to controls
    - ilyt 4y ago
      Kitfox (the publisher) did a video with dev and someone new to DF [1] playing it for first time, while it might not be "pick up and go" yet it looked massively more approachable. There is even rudimentary tutorial to set up the basics and a bunch of guides. Also most of the DF complexity comes organically during gameplay and not all at once - if all you do is set up food source and some bedrooms you already buy yourself a lot of time to fuck around. The discoverability of systems should also be much better - [1] https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=bLN8cOcTjdo https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=bLN8cOcTjdo
      - lelandfe 4y ago
        Hadn't seen this – thanks for the link. My excitement for this release has risen from excited to very excited :)
PhasmaFelis 4y ago
Is the UI getting an overhaul as well? I could probably deal with the ASCII, but I'm picky about UI design, and what I've heard about the interface sounds like it would make me have a tantrum and smash my menacing rhyolite cave sock.
- tptacek 4y ago
  Careful what you wish for. Some of the Dwarf Fortress endorphins are a product of the horrible user interface; asking for a more intuitive interface (at times) is like asking for an easier Soulsborne boss. Ask enough times and you have Horizon Forbidden West instead of Bloodborne.
  - PhasmaFelis 4y ago
    Enh... In an action-y game, there's a strong argument that mastering difficult controls can be half the fun. In a menu-based management game, I want the controls to be as streamlined and intuitive as possible, always. It should be my knowledge and planning ability being tested, not my muscle memory. Or to put it another way, if I'm pretending to manage a fortress, losing because I was too focused on expansion and didn't stock enough food and ammunition to survive a siege can be fun. Losing because I was fully prepared but forgot how to tell my minions to raise the drawbridge and man the walls is just frustrating.
- bombcar 4y ago
  The old UI is like a well-worn sock for me, fits perfectly and I know where the holes are. But yes, the new version has an entirely redone UI to greatly organize and simplify things. The updates here: https://steamcommunity.com/app/975370 https://steamcommunity.com/app/975370 go into more details - there's even a tutorial!
- jibe 4y ago
  They’ve revamped the UI. Here is a dev blog post with an early screenshot from 2021. https://steamcommunity.com/games/975370/announcements/detail/4816004515020626336 https://steamcommunity.com/games/975370/announcements/detail...
RektBoy 4y ago
ASCII is not a problem, since there is ton of graphics packs. But controls, controls are ridiculous. I can't just enjoy it. And I play very hard games, indie games, Ultima Online which you need to script own things to play properly. But DF is another beast.
- jessfyi 4y ago
  The version being released on steam also includes extensive UX/UI updates, OP just left that out.
- ilyt 4y ago
  The graphics version also did MASSIVE pass on every control. Like, instead of going "select bed, make bedroom, repeat 40 times", you can just make rooms, put beds, doors, etc, then just select whole area and it will make a bedroom out of each of those rooms. camera controls are normal WASD now, most of the things can be done with mouse, there are tabs on panels and hyperlinks in legend browser and thousand other little things. It will be coming eventually to free ASCII version too
sdenton4 4y ago
Does the framerate still decline steadily to zero as you expand your fortress?
etempleton 4y ago
I am excited for the graphics release as I have always been fascinated by Dwarf Fortress, but do not think I have the patience to learn how to parse the ASCII visuals.
ncr100 4y ago
The fun of game software (truly): http://www.bay12games.com/dwarves/mantisbt/view.php?id=8410 http://www.bay12games.com/dwarves/mantisbt/view.php?id=8410 Bug title: "0008410: Crash due to zero-size weasel" <3

jrm4 4y ago

Decided to read the whole thing. For some reason the very last line where they make sure that you know that they have the color black included, twice, is hilarious to me. There's probably some reason for it though? Anyone know?

shrx 4y ago
I think they just want to point out that black is one of the available 16 colors, meaning that there are just 15 colors not counting black.

mtrpcic 4y ago

I'm always fascinated by Dwarf Fortress whenever I cross paths with it, particularly from a technical architecture point of view. How did they architect the history simulation? How do they efficiently update everything on each tick? What is the game loop like? If anyone has any resources or links to articles, either definitive from the DW developer, or conjecture based on exploration and research, I'd love to learn more about how DF works.

praptak 4y ago
Last time I checked they didn't do it particularly efficiently and avoiding "FPS death" was an important part of the lore: cap the number of dwarves, avoid flowing water, wall off unused parts of the mine to reduce costs of pathfinding, add pathfinding weights to tiles, etc. There's not much published about the internals because the creators keep it to themselves.
- WastingMyTime89 4y ago
  Cats are the death of fortress. Dwarf fortress is an incredible game but you are right that it’s actually amusing the amount of weird things you know you should avoid or manage as a regular player.
  - praptak 4y ago
    Ah yes, "catsplosion". Better make sure to keep only one sex of cat.
    - 2000UltraDeluxe 4y ago
      Bah, put the kittens in a cage and release them upon unexpecting intruders. 50-60 kittens will tear a Kobold apart if you lock them all into a small room. For the un-initiated: Yes, Dwarf Fortress is a brutal game.
jonchurch_ 4y ago
One of the creators (Tarn, specifically) does interviews fairly often, talking about the game and progress. Here's a video telling a very famous story about tracking down a bug that involved alcoholic cats https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=VAhHkJQ3KgY https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=VAhHkJQ3KgY There was also a recent article about Dwarf Fortress published to the Stack Overflow blog https://stackoverflow.blog/2021/12/31/700000-lines-of-code-20-years-and-one-developer-how-dwarf-fortress-is-built/ https://stackoverflow.blog/2021/12/31/700000-lines-of-code-2... Edit: There's really a decent amount of stuff out there, they've been making the game for almost 20 years now. So here is a talk that tries to explain DF to an audience, and does talk a little about the simulation. https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=ykLm2o_cX9w https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=ykLm2o_cX9w I adore DF and am one of those folks who enjoys playing, not just watching videos on youtube. If you do want to give it a go, make sure you find an "Intro to DF" type video and follow it. It's a big learning curve but I love the game so much, and knowing the story of it's creation over time makes me love it even more. It is truly a labor of love by two brothers who have chosen to make it their life's work.

jrm4 4y ago

It's weird to read a line that feels like typical overhyped advertising copy next to a Steam game but that you realize is probably 100% accurate? Namely "The deepest, most intricate simulation of a world that's ever been created?"

praptak 4y ago
This deep and intricate world is inhabited by dumbest, most stubborn dwarves who throw players into depth of frustration, despair and a solid dose of hilarity.

tstrimple 4y ago

The level of detail in Dwarf Fortress is amazing. Just take a look at this bug report: https://www.bay12games.com/dwarves/mantisbt/view.php?id=9195 https://www.bay12games.com/dwarves/mantisbt/view.php?id=9195 TLDR: Code was added that allowed substances to accumulate on fur. Cats lick their fur to clean themselves. Due to the calculation used for intoxication and body weight, cats kept getting lethally drunk from walking through spilled beer and licking it off of their feet. This level of detail leads to tons of emergent game play and stories.

lstodd 4y ago
Haha lol. I maybe still have a screenshot of a Forgotten Beast killing himself by kicking up a dead cat's tooth (the cat was killed by some previous FB) (and the tooth deals a fatality). The level of detail is amazing.
- ilyt 4y ago
  Yeah there were pretty interesting edge cases with calculations. Like, for example, there is still [1] a bug for a whip doing unreasonable amount of damage in some cases because armour penetration logic was pretty much strength/area = penetration power. And because whip hit only with tiny end, it pretty much went thru any armour https://www.bay12games.com/dwarves/mantisbt/view.php?id=2712 https://www.bay12games.com/dwarves/mantisbt/view.php?id=2712
bombcar 4y ago
It's worth studying some of the more famous bug reports as they're perfect examples of emergent issues that can arise in complex situations.
chx 4y ago
That's like the legendary carps bug. > fish and all other creatures are coded similar to Dwarfs for level progression, so training a skill not only improves the skill but also the relevant physical stats. Well, Carps have swimming as a skill. And they are always swimming. So within minutes of spawning every carp was a dwarf-sized mass of angry muscle and razor sharp teeth.

Daunk 4y ago

I'm so happy seeing DF reach a larger audience with the Steam release, it's been such a joy to experiment with over the years, and I feel like Zach and Tarn deserve a lot more recognition. Here's my personal DF tileset - https://github.com/Hezkore/dwarf-fortress-assets https://github.com/Hezkore/dwarf-fortress-assets

lstodd 4y ago

What is more spectacular than even the Dwarf Fortress itself (and it is), are the C++ reverse-engineering tools developed in Common Lisp back in 2010-s. DFHack and Dwarf Therapist were rebased on top of them.

rpastuszak 4y ago

Fantasy World is a bit of an understatement. It's one of the toughest and deepest simulations one can find.

helf 4y ago

I’ve played DF off an on for ~15 years. Love it always get an upvote.

Loughla 4y ago
I go back to read boatmurdered at least once a year just for the chuckles (and the reminiscing about SA forums back in the day). Then I play DF for a month or so and remember just how intricate and IMPOSSIBLE it is to understand completely. What an amazing game.

Ancalagon 4y ago

I really need to get into this. But on the other hand, if I start playing I have a feeling I might not stop.

ilyt 4y ago
It's actually not bad game to have running on second screen and just poke at it from time to time as your dwarves are working and building stuff. Kinda perfect "podcast game"
- Ancalagon 4y ago
  Thats what someone said to me about Runescape though.

bombcar 4y ago

One of the things I love is that you can generate a world, play a fortress, eventually lose (it's fun!™) and then start another fortress in the same world, and your new fortress will have references to your old one - in the carvings, legends, etc.

Shared404 4y ago
One thing I want to jump into is the Adventurer mode! Nothing quite like the idea of building (and losing) several fortresses, and then going through them to explore as the "new generation". Haven't played DF yet, but it's very much on my list.
- mttyng 4y ago
  Is that what Adventure Mode is? I’ve been playing DF off-and-on since 2013(ish), but I’ve never tried adventure mode.
  - bombcar 4y ago
    Adventure mode is more like a 'standard' RPG-style adventure, similar to nethack but entirely generated. https://dwarffortresswiki.org/index.php/DF2014:Adventurer_mode https://dwarffortresswiki.org/index.php/DF2014:Adventurer_mo... It doesn't have as much polish as Fortress mode, but it can be quite fun if you like the nethack style of "die early, die awesome, die often".
    - mttyng 4y ago
      Thanks!
- bombcar 4y ago
  Even if you don't actually play, Legends mode alone can be interesting. https://dwarffortresswiki.org/index.php/DF2014:Legends https://dwarffortresswiki.org/index.php/DF2014:Legends
hinkley 4y ago

xnx 4y ago

I want to get into this, but the randomly generated nature has always been an (irrational?) turn-off. I guess I want more editorial choice in the level design.

bombcar 4y ago
You do control a large number of aspects of world generation, which can be used to "tune" the game from very easy to impossibly difficult. And once you have parameters you like, you can try different seeds. https://dwarffortresswiki.org/index.php/DF2014:World_generation https://dwarffortresswiki.org/index.php/DF2014:World_generat... https://dwarffortresswiki.org/index.php/DF2014:Advanced_world_generation https://dwarffortresswiki.org/index.php/DF2014:Advanced_worl... Also, people will post seeds and world parameters for "good worlds" they've found: https://dwarffortresswiki.org/index.php/DF2014:Worldgen_examples https://dwarffortresswiki.org/index.php/DF2014:Worldgen_exam...
MiddleEndian 4y ago
On top of what bombcar mentioned, you also get to choose your embark spot within your tuned world.
- bombcar 4y ago
  And you can post a world on the forums and ask people for a "good embark spot" and they'll find different ones for you. It's amusing what people consider "necessities" and "absolutely not" in embark spots; some people will never touch an aquifer, others it's not even something to look at.
ilyt 4y ago
The better UI(and paid) version drops on Steam 6th of December. Probably the best time to give it a shot. And it is not "just" randomly generated. For example, the rivers flow where there are rocky paths in the terrain Rocky paths are there because during worldgen game simulated erosion. Erosion is made by simulated rainfall Simulated rainfall depends in winds and location of a given terrain. And only at the start of that chain there is "random generation". > I guess I want more editorial choice in the level design. Then tell your dwarves to build what you want, you can make pretty grand scale things in it.

Kiro 4y ago

What made you randomly post Dwarf Fortress now with this undescriptive and confusing title? Very peculiar.

loa_in_ 4y ago
Titles need to be short, and relevant to the content. I took words straight from the Features section. Now, because with all the talk about AI agents I was thinking about the environments, and that's when I remembered this. It very much can be inspiring, even if it's not strictly relevant technology-wise.
- Kiro 4y ago
  I understand but I don't think the title is very representative of the game. Regardless, Dwarf Fortress gets posted here a lot so I definitely think it's relevant: https://hn.algolia.com/?q=dwarf+fortress https://hn.algolia.com/?q=dwarf+fortress

lcnPylGDnU4H9OF 4y ago

The story of Boatmurdered[0] has given me a good go-to seed for other games with procedural generation. It's well worth the read if you have an afternoon. [0] https://lparchive.org/Dwarf-Fortress-Boatmurdered/ https://lparchive.org/Dwarf-Fortress-Boatmurdered/

jameshart 4y ago
Boatmurdered is representative of a very old version of the game. For more modern DF storytelling I would encourage you to check out Kruggsmash on YouTube, in particular his Scorchfountain series: https://youtube.com/playlist?list=PLXX7Rp0iXj0l998LmVC6xIRHjtj2Pr2VI https://youtube.com/playlist?list=PLXX7Rp0iXj0l998LmVC6xIRHj... Krugg gives due reverence to the generated descriptions of his dwarves and their world and incorporates them into his emergent storytelling and illustration in a very elegant way.

specproc 4y ago

Has anyone actually played this? Like, really played it. I've tried a couple of times and never got that far. I'm in awe from one perspective, but not entirely sure what of, from another.

praptak 4y ago
I can get to 80-100 dwarves without huge problems but then I usually get bored with the micromanagement. DF is not hard if you follow the quickstart guide.
robomc 4y ago
Nearly a decade ago I played it a bit over a couple of months. I'd guess 30 hours or so (which is a lot for me, I'm a gaming dabbler, aside from the civ and fromsoft games). It was pretty playable IMO, and would really pull you in, just tedious to navigate the menus. I eventually got kind of tired of investing so much effort into a fortress that would just randomly fall apart. People say that's part of the fun but I dunno... I found that aspect a bit annoying. It also ran really poorly for me in late game and that kind of put me off too. Great concept, the ascii is less of a problem than you'd think, but overall just a bit too much effort to keep wanting to come back for more.
tptacek 4y ago
Yes. It's one of those things I have to keep uninstalled or it'll randomly suck me back in. AMA.
hristov 4y ago
Yes. It is not really that hard, if you consider how they have probably the best wiki of any computer game and a lot of high quality helper programs. If you alt-tab between dwarf fortress, the wiki and dwarf therapist, it is totally doable. And once you play a couple of games you start to get the internal logic of DF and becomes kind of fun.
ilyt 4y ago
Steam version with better UI and graphics released 6th December I did "actually played it", think the biggest thing I did was a lava cannon that flooded the area aboveground when invasion game, that was "interesting" build... Having to relearn everything on interface stopped me from picking it up again, and from what I watched new UI look so much more user friendly

namuol 4y ago

Frontend UX developer perspective on DF: The ascii interface is actually fine and mostly a superficial complaint. The real problem is just how hard the many interfaces are to navigate and learn, and how unconventional their designs are. If I could pick one thing for the UI team to focus on: DF needs a “command palette” to help find/learn all of the game’s many functions.

mlatu 4y ago
"once you get into it its actually quite easy to navigate in" is something i would have said back when i played, at least ten years ago though
- namuol 4y ago
  I agree, but pretty much every UI has its own learning curve to get over, and taken together it’s just overwhelming to get started with. Curious to see how the tutorial system in the premium version helps address this. I’m cautiously hopeful but still doubt I will have the time to properly run a fortress. Maybe we’ll see the premium version lead to a jump in DF as a spectator sport given the much richer graphics library.
  - coder-3 4y ago
    Time is what's been preventing me from getting into DF. Do I need to spend a significant amount of time on this game to get a good experience? Could I get away with, say, one hour once in a while? I'd probably need to invest time upfront to learn the basics though.
    - mlatu 4y ago
      and before that, take your time to generate your world :D in my experience, the hints at the bottom row are pretty good reminders of how to navigate the menus. i advise you to use a keyboard with numpad, otherwise it is a mess iirc
- sdenton4 4y ago

pearjuice 4y ago

I've tried playing and actually getting into this game a few times (including installing tile packs, walkthrough saves and what not), but the game mechanics are obtuse and have such a high learning curve that frustration is easier found than any sense of enjoyment. For a game focused on being so meticulous and extra-vagant in its mechanics, it's sad that enjoying it or "having fun" seems something completely out of reach with hours of gameplay, reading third-party wikis and starter guides.

jiggawatts 4y ago

The thing that gets me about Dwarf Fortress is that it's a 64-bit text-mode game. As a grey-haired developer who got excited about "DOS Extenders" that allowed 32-bit mode, seeing a text-mode game written as a native 64-bit application is bizarrely anachronistic. I get a similar feeling from text-mode GUI frameworks for Rust, which allow multi-threading and 64-bit but are essentially clones of Borland Turbo Vision, where you had to be mindful to keep lists smaller than 64KB: https://github.com/gyscos/cursive https://github.com/gyscos/cursive

ilyt 4y ago
Not for long https://store.steampowered.com/app/975370/Dwarf_Fortress/ https://store.steampowered.com/app/975370/Dwarf_Fortress/ Graphical+UI/controls rewrite in few weeks!
- stolen_biscuit 4y ago
  Both versions will be supported :) "Classic" DF isn't going anywhere
babuskov 4y ago
You might find Rogue Bit interesting: https://store.steampowered.com/app/949790/Rogue_Bit/ https://store.steampowered.com/app/949790/Rogue_Bit/ It's a modern game about hacking internals of an 8-bit computer by walking a single bit through it's memory. Visually it looks like an ASCII roguelike game, but it's actually a niche puzzle game for people who like machine language, assembly and computer internals.

deleted 4y ago

[deleted]

LAC-Tech 4y ago

I was really keen on the idea of adventure mode, after watching a fantastic lets play of it [0]. But when I got there I didn't really know what to do inside the sandbox. [0] https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=tDX5hmtjqtw https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=tDX5hmtjqtw

PointyFluff 4y ago

this. not the lame knock-off that is rimworld.

ubermonkey 4y ago

I admire the effort of DF, and the depth of it implied by the release notes, but holy cow I am absolutely NEVER going to try to play it. This is because, in the event I make it over the threshold, it is ENTIRELY possible that it will become an obsession, and I don't have time for that.

hackerbeat 4y ago

All I want is a game in the style of Warcraft 1 & 2. Does anyone know of any that come close?

YesBox 4y ago

If you're interested in playing a new game in this genre, I've been developing a city builder game over the last year, heavily inspired by Dwarf Fortress, Rim World, Cities: Skylines, Sim City, etc. My game will have more granular demand (not just vague "you need more commercial zones"). The player will see the interior of buildings and will be able to watch their sims live their lives. Im working on getting version 0.2 release by Q1 2023. The game is isometric now! Working on releasing a new vlog to show it off. I developed a new path finding algorithm to build big cities. Here's an old version of the game path finding 1,000,000 units to their own unique destinations: https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=x0HCnQqF5K4 https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=x0HCnQqF5K4 Subreddit: https://reddit.com/r/Archapolis https://reddit.com/r/Archapolis