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This will be huge. This will allow anyone to accept digital payments, eg. at a farmers market, using the bank accounts everyone already has. The only thing mis
by newaccount74 4y ago
This will be huge. This will allow anyone to accept digital payments, eg. at a farmers market, using the bank accounts everyone already has.
The only thing missing is forcing banks to provide an API for third party integrations, but I think there is a separate proposal on the way for that.
Imagine being able to accept instant payments from everyone in the EU, without having to sign up for a service like Stripe or Paypal, just using a normal bank account from any of hundreds (thousands?) of banks in the EU. And your customers don't even need a credit card, just the banking app they already use every day.
- tluyben2 4y agoPractically this is already the case in many countries; NL to my Revolut or PT accounts is seconds, vice versa too. It works well. But it is not guaranteed. Api would be good; I can imagine visa and mastercard are getting a little bit panicked as this is already trivial and I am using my phone for payments anyway (no idea where my card is) (but still use them of course via NFC).
- prvit 4y agoIt’ll be trivial if Apple implements it. Europeans? They’ll figure out a way to require chipTAN and SMS confirmation for POS transactions.
- dylan604 4y agodon't forget the QR code
- f6v 4y agoAlthough not in euro, but Denmark has MobilePay that’s instant.
- reacharavindh 4y agoNL here. We use Tikkie for similar needs as MobilePay. Although the ability of merchants to simply display a QR code for their customers to complete the transaction is a convenience I miss here.
- emptyfile 4y agoEuropeans are so far ahead the US in mobile payments its not even funny.
- teknolog 4y agoAs a European living in the US I don't get that. Seems very similar to me.
- koblas 4y agoSEPA Instant (UK Faster payments) has been in market for a few years now. While the Federal Reserve is still working on rollout plans for FedNow. The US "instant payments" is Venmo/PayPal which are secondary to the banks not primary.
- AdamN 4y agoFellow Deutsche Bank customer??
- hoffs 4y agoSure, there are countless of apps that can do instant transfers. The issue here is that sepa instant rollout has been taking way too long and this would force it to actually be required. It's a breeze having able to transfer money between banks any time of day in a few seconds.
- ulfw 4y agoHong Kong's Faster Payment System (FPS) is like that. You can even use phone number or email instead of account number (or QR code). Very practical. Money moves instantaneously free of charge. [1] https://fps.hkicl.com.hk/eng/fps/index.php https://fps.hkicl.com.hk/eng/fps/index.php [2] https://www.hsbc.com.hk/campaigns/fps/ https://www.hsbc.com.hk/campaigns/fps/
- Symbiote 4y agoSeveral EU countries have similar national systems. This is about making all that work with Euro accounts from different countries.
- ajsnigrutin 4y agoOn the other hand, this is another step towards cashless society, where every transaction is tracked by the government.
- seydor 4y agoNo, it is going from "being tracked by <website>, Stripe, their analytics partners, the bank, mastercard/visa, the NSA, [...]" to being tracked by the website and the banks. EU banks already have the infrastructure for instant payments, so this should be a non brainer I don't see why transactions that use cash today, wont use cash tomorrow
- pif 4y agoNot tracked: just trackable.
- qngcdvy 4y agoAs much as the tracking I fear the access control. Made some stupid comment online while being drunk? We take your ability to by transportation passes/plane tickets... IIRC this is already happening in China.
- themitigating 4y agoCan you provide an example?
- saiya-jin 4y agoExactly as parent mentioned - in China, if you mess with Party or they just deem you undesirable for whatever reason ie ethnicity, you can't purchase plane tickets, not even domestic ones. Heck, not even trains so you can't effectively travel within China. No mortgages/loans. Of course it will affect your hiring options badly. I believe it goes way deeper. China is already 1984 for a decade+
- CoUHKT57BSe 4y agoDoubt it will be huge, we are constantly being told not to give out our bank details as scammers want them, now you think it'll be great if we just give out our bank details to every stranger we meet at the market. This will be great, for sending/receiving money but is hardly a replacement for card payments.
- aitchnyu 4y agoIndian UPI apps allow you to type phone number or find contact sender and receiver uses same app, or phonenum@bankname or user@bankname ids with equivalent QR codes or one time QR codes with amount. Money is routed to/from multiple bank accounts.
- em500 4y ago1. Europeans are not "constantly being told not to give out our bank details". That's an American thing, apparently due to a quirk that allows anyone with a US bank account number to draw money from that account. Euro banks certainly don't work that way. Having a Euro bank account number only allows people to transfer to, not from that account. 2. Why do you believe that an instant payment system requires us to "give out our bank details to every stranger we meet at the market" when numerous countries have already implemented such systems that don't require that?
- matthewdgreen 4y agoIt is remarkable the extent to which the US system is a disaster and has poisoned our view of what financial services can/should do.
- rwmj 4y agoIn the UK you can set up a direct debit with just the bank account details (not quite the same as withdrawing money, but still enough to scam someone). The rest of your comment is quite correct though.
- IanCal 4y agoAlthough there is at least the safety of the direct debit system, where if you flag it then the bank must immediately pay you what was taken.
- rjzzleep 4y agoThis isn't new. A few years ago a few countries (Germany being one of them) asked for an extension on having to implement instant transactions. Some German banks actually charge more for the instant bank transfers. This is just the EU commission pushing for this game that they themselves started to end.
- DocTomoe 4y agoI feel this is too little, too late. People who would use this already have started using Credit/debit cards (instead of local systems). Bank account numbers are not easy to transmit (sure, we could do this via QR code, but that's a new piece of technology people would have to learn how to use). The internet has happened, and it works on credit card-style numbers. Banks had a chance to introduce this ten years ago - but back then, they were greedy and wanted to keep money in limbo, most likely to have an advantage in taking interest. By now, the market has other, more internationally accepted modes of payment.
- manholio 4y ago> The internet has happened, and it works on credit card-style numbers. and that's a usability disaster. the entire experience is atrocious, you have to enter and secure multiple pieces of numeric data. it's a system begging to be disrupted.
- pjc50 4y agoThe overhead of card processors, while capped by law in the EU, is not zero, and not everybody can easily set up to receive payments. Various countries have systems like https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Vipps https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Vipps which reduce the friction yet further.
- samjmck 4y ago> By now, the market has other, more internationally accepted modes of payment. Hundreds of millions of citizens gain access to instant payments through SEPA. It’s already compatible with the existing banking system Europeans are already used to, i.e. share an IBAN with someone and share money. Which other cheap instant payment methods are there that are available to so many people?
- DocTomoe 4y agoPayment/Debit cards, which work worldwide, and often are given out by the same European banks to use in supermarkets and at ATMs.
- rgllm 4y agoBanks in EU are already obligated to provide an API for third party integrations.
- pier25 4y agoThis is commonplace in Mexico already. My regular taco place here only accepts cash or bank transfers, no cards.
- fasteo 4y ago>>> The only thing missing is forcing banks to provide an API for third party integrations I believe they have to provide this API to comply with the PSD2 directive. Namely, they have to open the bank to TPPs (Third Party Payment Service Providers)