4 ms·

I'm seeing a massive uptick in recruiting for contract roles compared to a year ago though. A year ago (and even, 3-4 months ago) it was all full time position

I'm seeing a massive uptick in recruiting for contract roles compared to a year ago though. A year ago (and even, 3-4 months ago) it was all full time positions nearly exclusively, now it's all heavily weighted toward contract Lots of "18+ month" or "long term" contract verbiage, but contract none the less. Definitely a shift. Seeing more contract to hire too

humanwhosits 4y ago
I guess hiring for contracts routes around arbitrary headcount limits.
- nickstinemates 4y ago
  Not really arbitrary. Headcount are typically approved in tranches, budget is a lot more fluid. Headcount is also part of long term forecasting whereas again contractors are just a budget item. "A $100k engineer costs $150k per year all in" vs. "We need to spend $150k to get X done"
- no_wizard 4y ago
  I think it has more to do with getting around benefits, usually. The expense for businesses isn't just the salary, in fact alot of businesses, if they could just pay the salary, would be able to retain / hire more people, but benefits + high salary is harder to take on. This is a great argument for universal healthcare and a nationalized pension system, but I digress
  - abeyer 4y ago
    But you just pay _more_ for the contractors, at least if you hire locally. In my experience contract rates for comparable work any place you'd want to work are typically marked up (at least) enough to roughly compensate for the difference in benefits and taxes. Especially now that remote for FTEs has become so common, there wouldn't be much motivation to take long term contracts otherwise. That may change if the job market goes pear-shaped, but doesn't seem like we're there yet.
  - CydeWeys 4y ago
    Tech workers are so highly compensated anyway that benefits aren't a huge percentage of the total cost of employment. The main reasons to prefer contractors in times of economic difficulty are: (a) contracts are fixed length, so it's easy to simply let a contract lapse rather than renewing it if conditions worsen/don't improve and you want to cut headcount without having a layoff, and (b) contractors frequently count differently on a balance sheet (as operating expense vs employee expense).
    - b20000 4y ago
      tech workers are not highly compensated on average, lawyers, doctors etc are.
      - bigtunacan 4y ago
        Average salary for a lawyer isn't that different than for a software engineer (slightly higher). Doctor's average on the other hand is more than double.
        ghaff 4y ago
        >Doctor's average on the other hand is more than double. And often have spent a lot more time in relatively low-paid training. And lawyers are at least somewhat bimodal (though maybe trimodal). White shoe firms, corporate lawyers/successful private practices, everyone else.
        saiya-jin 4y ago
        if you are one, you are not the other (type of lawyer), in same vein as dentist will never be GP or neurosurgeon or dermatologist and vice versa. you also don't see linux admins leading development of some software projects
        ghaff 4y ago
        Not really. They all went to law school and passed the bar. Of course, there are tiers of school, class rank, and clerkships that perform a sorting function. Law has pretty strong credentialing mechanism.
- crackercrews 4y ago
  Also lets you trim headcount without announcing layoffs, down the line.
supernovae 4y ago
I’ve always seen a lot of those, i think the SNR just favors them for now with general slow down in direct hires.
jcadam 4y ago
Contract rates are down though, less than what you would expect to earn as a FTE.
- guynamedloren 4y ago
  I’m intrigued. Can you share any data points here?
- sodafountan 4y ago
  I haven't seen this at all, I'm currently contracting and I see rates anywhere from 63.50 per hour to 80+. Depending on the locale and whether we're talking FAANG or not those are pretty good rates. (130-150+ respectively)
  - b20000 4y ago
    $150 per hour is very low.
    - jcadam 4y ago
      I've never seen anything close to $150/hr -- I'd jump on that if I did. $63-$80/hr is actually about what I'm seeing, which is less than I'd made from my last FTE gig (I have 16 yoe, mind you). When you consider those rates don't include PTO and benefits, it's even worse. Contracting is the thing you do when you're between permanent jobs and you do it because it pays better than slinging coffee and keeps your resume current.
      - b20000 4y ago
        contracting is being in business for yourself which means you need to learn how to sell and negotiate. if you don’t do that then yes, you will work for a low rate.
    - sodafountan 4y ago
      That's 130,000-150,000 annually if you clock 40 hours 5 days a week, not hourly. I don't know in what universe you think $150 per hour is low, I've never seen anything near that rate. Maybe for highly specialized work but not any general purpose development.
User23 4y ago
I really like contract to hire, both from the employee and the employer perspective. You have a nice honeymoon period and if it works then great and if not no hard feelings.
- nopenopenopeno 4y ago
  It sounds like you are either being dishonest or you haven’t actually thought about this.
rcpt 4y ago
Or the recruiters are working extra hard to avoid layoffs

humanwhosits 4y ago

I guess hiring for contracts routes around arbitrary headcount limits.

nickstinemates 4y ago
Not really arbitrary. Headcount are typically approved in tranches, budget is a lot more fluid. Headcount is also part of long term forecasting whereas again contractors are just a budget item. "A $100k engineer costs $150k per year all in" vs. "We need to spend $150k to get X done"
no_wizard 4y ago
I think it has more to do with getting around benefits, usually. The expense for businesses isn't just the salary, in fact alot of businesses, if they could just pay the salary, would be able to retain / hire more people, but benefits + high salary is harder to take on. This is a great argument for universal healthcare and a nationalized pension system, but I digress
- abeyer 4y ago
  But you just pay _more_ for the contractors, at least if you hire locally. In my experience contract rates for comparable work any place you'd want to work are typically marked up (at least) enough to roughly compensate for the difference in benefits and taxes. Especially now that remote for FTEs has become so common, there wouldn't be much motivation to take long term contracts otherwise. That may change if the job market goes pear-shaped, but doesn't seem like we're there yet.
- CydeWeys 4y ago
  Tech workers are so highly compensated anyway that benefits aren't a huge percentage of the total cost of employment. The main reasons to prefer contractors in times of economic difficulty are: (a) contracts are fixed length, so it's easy to simply let a contract lapse rather than renewing it if conditions worsen/don't improve and you want to cut headcount without having a layoff, and (b) contractors frequently count differently on a balance sheet (as operating expense vs employee expense).
  - b20000 4y ago
    tech workers are not highly compensated on average, lawyers, doctors etc are.
    - bigtunacan 4y ago
      Average salary for a lawyer isn't that different than for a software engineer (slightly higher). Doctor's average on the other hand is more than double.
      - ghaff 4y ago
        >Doctor's average on the other hand is more than double. And often have spent a lot more time in relatively low-paid training. And lawyers are at least somewhat bimodal (though maybe trimodal). White shoe firms, corporate lawyers/successful private practices, everyone else.
        saiya-jin 4y ago
        if you are one, you are not the other (type of lawyer), in same vein as dentist will never be GP or neurosurgeon or dermatologist and vice versa. you also don't see linux admins leading development of some software projects
        ghaff 4y ago
        Not really. They all went to law school and passed the bar. Of course, there are tiers of school, class rank, and clerkships that perform a sorting function. Law has pretty strong credentialing mechanism.
crackercrews 4y ago
Also lets you trim headcount without announcing layoffs, down the line.

supernovae 4y ago

I’ve always seen a lot of those, i think the SNR just favors them for now with general slow down in direct hires.

jcadam 4y ago

Contract rates are down though, less than what you would expect to earn as a FTE.

guynamedloren 4y ago
I’m intrigued. Can you share any data points here?
sodafountan 4y ago
I haven't seen this at all, I'm currently contracting and I see rates anywhere from 63.50 per hour to 80+. Depending on the locale and whether we're talking FAANG or not those are pretty good rates. (130-150+ respectively)
- b20000 4y ago
  $150 per hour is very low.
  - jcadam 4y ago
    I've never seen anything close to $150/hr -- I'd jump on that if I did. $63-$80/hr is actually about what I'm seeing, which is less than I'd made from my last FTE gig (I have 16 yoe, mind you). When you consider those rates don't include PTO and benefits, it's even worse. Contracting is the thing you do when you're between permanent jobs and you do it because it pays better than slinging coffee and keeps your resume current.
    - b20000 4y ago
      contracting is being in business for yourself which means you need to learn how to sell and negotiate. if you don’t do that then yes, you will work for a low rate.
  - sodafountan 4y ago
    That's 130,000-150,000 annually if you clock 40 hours 5 days a week, not hourly. I don't know in what universe you think $150 per hour is low, I've never seen anything near that rate. Maybe for highly specialized work but not any general purpose development.

User23 4y ago

I really like contract to hire, both from the employee and the employer perspective. You have a nice honeymoon period and if it works then great and if not no hard feelings.

nopenopenopeno 4y ago
It sounds like you are either being dishonest or you haven’t actually thought about this.

rcpt 4y ago

Or the recruiters are working extra hard to avoid layoffs