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Plant-based meat analogues weaken gastrointestinal digestive function in mice
- tluyben2 4y agoIn mice. No one thinks it applies to humans when it’s promising medicine, so why would this mean anything? It is a question, not trying to say it’s not worth discussing! Wondering what exactly causes this effects in plant based meats as I notice that eating plants (fruits and veg and nuts), at least for me, seems to make my digestive function a lot happier than eating real meat. But I guess happier doesn’t say much about what’s actually going on down there.
- hammyhavoc 4y agoCame here to say that my digestive function is also much happier with Quorn et al. Never miss meat.
- FollowingTheDao 4y agoamylase trypsin inhibitors might be part of the problem. They are only found in plant-based foods. https://rupress.org/jem/article/209/13/2395/40998 https://rupress.org/jem/article/209/13/2395/40998
- ElCheapo 4y agoThat's not what the abstract says. They're specifically talking about foods which are claimed to be meat replacements. If you have an all-encompassing and well varied vegan diet then this study doesn't really say anything about your situation
- eej71 4y agoI enjoyed your earlier typo that misused the word - taunted - when you probably meant touted. In a sense your typo is right! They are taunted as a meat replacement.
- tluyben2 4y ago> That's not what the abstract says. What is not? I started my second paragraph asking what in plant based meat, in that regard, is causing the difference vs eating plants…
- ElCheapo 4y agoA) group 1 gets an omnivore diet, group 2 gets the same diet but substitutes all the meat with "meat replacements" B) group 1 gets an omnivore diet, group 2 gets a vegan diet those are two different experiments
- h0l0cube 4y agoThis isn't the plant-based meat or regular meat products that you would get off the shelf: > Meat and plant-based meat analogue diets were prepared as follows: Firstly, all visible fat and connective tissue were removed. Pork or beef muscles were cut into smaller sizes that were visibly similar to plant-based meats. Secondly, the samples were freeze-dried and ground to a powder. All the resulting powders were passed through a 25-mesh sieve. Thirdly, the content of the main components of the freeze-dried meat powder were determined and shown in Table S1. Fourthly, the nutritionally balanced semi-synthetic AIN-93M formula2 was used as reference and the ingredients in it were replaced by meat or meat analogues according to the results of the determination. The protein in the diet is derived entirely from meat or plant-based meat analogues. Finally, the granule and purified type diets were prepared by Trophic Animal Feed High-tech Co., Ltd., China. The ingredient composition and nutritional content of diets were shown in Tables S2 and Tables S3. Except for the higher sodium, fiber, or fat content in plant-based meat analogues that cannot be fully balanced based on the protein content, various other nutrients are present in equal amounts in real meat and plant-based meat analogue diets.
- ravio64 4y agoSince I started mainly eating vegan diet (my partner is vegan so we eat so at home) my digestive functions are functioning a lot happier. :)
- FollowingTheDao 4y agoI was vegan for three years and vegetarian for 15. My cholesterol kept rising in my gut was horrible. I do not eat beef, but I do eat venison and bison but mostly seafood. I feel much better now.
- tluyben2 4y agoWonder what you ate at those times. That doesn’t sound like something that should happen.
- FollowingTheDao 4y agoI can assure you it was not junk food vegan. All whole foods and balanced. After I obtained my genome I realized that I need more long chain Omega 3 in my diet because of my FADS1 genetic profile. You do not get that from plant based foods. It was also revealed that my Finnish heritage probably has some Inuit genetics.
- cies 4y agoSame here. I first went vegetarian for 10+ years, still eating lots of dairy. When I made the step to "when possible not burden animals with my behavior" I noticed my digestion improved, my random all-year-round running noses disappeared and my skin cleared up significantly.
- myth_drannon 4y agoMeat replacements are highly processed food with so many additives to make it taste like meat.
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- sfeng 4y agoCouldn't you also interpret these results as: meat is hard to digest and requires a lot of work on the part of the gastric system. When you don't eat it, the gastric system is able to down-regulate.
- drooby 4y agoHaha right… my next question was going to be.. okay so our gut produces less XYZ…. Is that a bad thing? High consumptions of red meat is positively associated with all cause mortality - while high veggies diet is opposite.
- FollowingTheDao 4y ago> High consumptions of red meat is positively associated with all cause mortality For who? Everyone?
- drooby 4y agoAll individuals are different but when discussing all cause mortality.. yes I think that is in reference to potentially everyone.
- FollowingTheDao 4y agoUntil you can tell me what percent of people are “potentially everyone “you can’t say this diet helps any specific person. This idea of something being generally good for a population can cause illness to a substantial amount of people.
- SirLJ 4y agoFor the animals
- ElCheapo 4y agocorrelation is not causation, unless you have an agenda
- 4y ago
- wzdd 4y agoAuthor affiliations are as follows: > Key Laboratory of Meat Processing and Quality Control, MOE, Key Laboratory of Meat Processing, MARA, Jiangsu Innovative Center of Meat Production, Processing and Quality Control, College of Food Science and Technology, Nanjing Agricultural University, Nanjing 210095, China I'm not saying the study is wrong. It's likely right! I just think it's going to be an interesting decade as meat producers apparently now recognise meat alternatives as an existential threat.
- verisimi 4y agoIt's a threat, because meat replacement is so heavily promoted, no doubt with government mandates coming. I'm personally a vegetarian, but I can't stand the government interference in food, I sympathise with meat eaters. I hear of farmers having to keep cows in sheds to protect orchids, and other nonsense. (As if it is a kindness to do this to cows, and feed them grains, etc.) Obviously this is a prelude to making meat a scarce product, cows being dangerous to the environment apparently, so people will be forced to eat artificial, human-designed, frankenfoods. I don't think we can even conceive of the diseases and behavioural issues that a non-natural diet will cause. They aren't going to be positive though :(
- 2muchcoffeeman 4y ago>Obviously this is a prelude to making meat a scarce product, cows being dangerous to the environment apparently, so people will be forced to eat artificial, human-designed, frankenfoods. Loads of cultures have good plant based foods and dishes. It’s only when I started living in a western country did I experience the bizarre need to make meat analogues. Just cook vegetables better.
- yreg 4y ago>I'm personally a vegetarian, but I can't stand the government interference in food Funny, because I'm a meat eater and I can't stand the government interference in making meat artificially cheap through subsidies when it is clearly the immoral and environment-hurting food option.
- samatman 4y agoI find this plausible, but I think it's about powdered proteins generally, or at least many of them. I tolerate dairy well, although I only drink small amounts of sweet milk and cream, eating mostly yogurt and cheese. I like to make strained yogurt / labneh, and I'll drink the whey by itself (I like pickle and sauerkraut juice as well). But when I add whey powder to a shake for the gainz, my stomach really doesn't like that as much. It doesn't cause problems or I wouldn't eat it, but it's just a bit gassy and sometimes irritating. I've noticed much the same thing with the pea-protein based vegan meats. I believe it's difficult to extract proteins without denaturing them somewhat, collagen is an exception but not a vegan one. I like eating peas just fine, peas don't give me gas and lentils rarely do (that's it for me and pulses these days), but the extracted protein, not so much, doesn't sit right.
- kortex 4y agoHuh. I get almost the same thing. It always kinda baffled me, since I tolerate the source food fine, but the powder proteins give me a stomach ache beyond a certain amount. I've tried to pin it down or at least mitigate it. It seems that emulsifiers + fats help (which is odd, as proteins themselves are often emulsifiers). My two theories are a) there are more free amino acids/oligopeptides, and some are naturally irritating, or b) these protein powders are more likely to crash out in the stomach.
- maxerickson 4y agoIt can just be the volume of the protein. Whey has a trace of protein in it (like 1%). Powders are mostly protein. Unprocessed peas are around 5% protein, meat substitutes are more like 50%.
- samatman 4y agoIt's not strictly volume of protein, no. I can and do eat six eggs, or a 300gm steak, or a half liter of yogurt, in one sitting. All of these are readily digested. They also have fat, and buffing a yogurt shake with whey protein pushes the balance toward protein, sure. But strictly volume of protein doesn't hold up.
- 4y ago
- j_m_b 4y agoI love that people now explicitly state that studies are in mice. That "InMice" Twitter account did a great service to mankind!
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- api 4y agoAnything just in mice should be taken with a grain of mouse. Lots of stuff in mice does not replicate in humans. I’m sure the inverse is true too. I really learned this following life extension research. It’s never been a better time to be an aging mouse but for humans the progress is much slower.
- mytailorisrich 4y agoPlant-based meat replacements tend to be highly processed food, which may neither be good for us nor the environment. Really, they are first a foremost exploiting a gap in the market at the moment.
- jasonhansel 4y agoI think that this really just shows that the digestive system changes and adapts to a plant-based diet. They haven't shown that there are any disadvantages to such changes; for all we know, this is actually beneficial.
- open-source-ux 4y agoI was surprised to learn recently that meat alternatives are classified as "ultra-processed" foods (dairy milk substitutes are also classified as ultra-processed as well). From: What is ultra-processed food? https://www.bbc.co.uk/food/articles/what_is_ultra-processed_food https://www.bbc.co.uk/food/articles/what_is_ultra-processed_... > Ultra-processed foods usually contain ingredients that you wouldn’t add when cooking homemade food. You may not recognise the names of these ingredients as many will be chemicals, colourings, sweeteners and preservatives. > More surprising to some will be...“other ultra-processed foods”. This includes baked beans, tinned soups, meat alternatives, soy and drinks used as dairy milk substitutes. > It can be tricky to identify food that has been ultra-processed because in some cases the same type of food could be minimally processed, processed or ultra-processed, depending on how it’s been made. For example: Bread made from wheat flour, water, salt and yeast is processed, but add emulsifiers or colourings and it becomes ultra-processed. (My emphasis)
- throwaway22032 4y agoI love the whole debate about vegetarianism because it's just so obviously solvable. When >50% of Olympic athletes with their optimised fitness plans are vegetarian/vegan, then you'll know it makes sense.
- BlargMcLarg 4y agoThe discussion is ridiculous to begin with. Nutritional sciences can't find any consensus within itself, but somehow a bunch of upper middle class people are enlightened when they decide to give half a damn about their diets and where their food is coming from, disregarding any notion of their current position in life to boot. Let alone extensive experimentation. Meanwhile the statistics are all over the place.
- ceejayoz 4y agoThat’s like saying only tech used by Formula 1 racing is useful in consumer cars. Olympic athletes are edge cases with unusual requirements.
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- hrbf 4y agoUnless I’m misunderstanding it, what this study apparently shows is that when a mouse eats unhealthy foods for some time, digestive function changes. An eye-opening result indeed.
- forgotmypw17 4y agoI think this is an example of the myriad evolved biological Chesterton's fences we're only beginning to discover in our bodies. I've personally done as much "de-modernization" as possible in my life and tried to revert to as close of a pre-industrial lifestyle and inputs as I can.