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At the same time - this one move might make Florida accidentally the most progressive state in America.
by munk-a 4y ago
At the same time - this one move might make Florida accidentally the most progressive state in America.
- scarface74 4y agoThe same Florida that passed a law specifically to punish Disney because they spoke out against the “Don’t Say Gay” law and passed the “Stop Woke” act?
- munk-a 4y agoI suppose I should've added some more overt humor markers on the above statement.
- pyuser583 4y agoLack of humor markers is a downside of text communication.
- anon291 4y agoThey punished Disney by not granting them self governing status. In my world, corporations being subject to the government is the Hallmark of progressivism. But no one's actually paying attention to the actual actions, just their own view of the motivation
- sircastor 4y agoThe Disney properties were already self-governing. The Florida legislature revoked that in political retaliation, and passed the cost on to nearby counties.
- pclmulqdq 4y agoAs well as the potential revenue, which is immense. The city around Disney could introduce a small sales tax or raise property taxes and their anticipated shortfall would likely be fixed.
- scarface74 4y agoThe surrounding city didn’t want this to happen https://deadline.com/2022/05/disney-ron-desantis-dont-say-gay-law-special-district-1235016301/ https://deadline.com/2022/05/disney-ron-desantis-dont-say-ga...
- pclmulqdq 4y agoThis isn't the surrounding city, this is a group of "concerned citizens" in the surrounding city - which is a big difference. The citizens of that city will likely be hurt by this, since it may cause a drop in tourist revenue and employment from Disney.
- scarface74 4y agoYes I’m sure other people in the city really want to take on Disney’s debt and want to take responsibility for zoning, police, fire, etc for Disney?
- pclmulqdq 4y agoThe "concerned citizens" likely don't want Disney being adversely affected because it affects their business. Their reasoning has nothing to do with the debt or the responsibility for zoning, etc. The debt is how they are arguing that the government has the same interest as them (and in particular, that there is something illicit going on). By ignoring the potential benefits and pointing out the potential harms, they are trying to get what they want. There would be a huge difference if the city itself were suing, which would indicate that there is actually a problem with the economics of this. If you've ever interacted with local municipal governments in the US, you would know that most municipal government employees would love to take responsibility for the zoning, police, fire, and tax collection at Disney. They would squeeze it for all they can - and they probably will. The concerned citizens (and Disney, who is likely funding their legal case) do not want this squeezing to take place. Make no mistake, that town is only operating at a loss because Disney's accountants are writing its books. They are shifting income to the corporation and losses to the city, so they can take advantage of favorable financing terms available on muni bonds for those losses. If someone adversarial to Disney were to take over the town, the revenue/cost situation would be very different since the two would no longer be working together to shift profits and losses around. We are about to see how different it will be.
- jasonlotito 4y agoThe issue isn't them punishing Disney (I mean, Fla residents do for the fact that they would take on debt for doing so, but whatever). The issue is their motive. Motive is critical.
- scarface74 4y agoThey had been “self governing” for decades. The city that now has to take on billions of Disney’s debt is suing Florida. No one wanted the responsibility of “governing” and zoning requirements for Disney. Not the local government and traditional the state didn’t. It was clearly done to punish them.
- andrew_ 4y agoputting the erroneous media-assigned name of the bill in quotes doesn't make it any less erroneous. while the bill has flaws and is justly upsetting, we should not continue to propagate a falsehood.
- andrew_ 4y agoFor any downvoters, please review the following https://t.e2ma.net/click/sv236h/8z0tiag/wa9559 https://t.e2ma.net/click/sv236h/8z0tiag/wa9559 It does not ban nor prevent the use of the word "gay."
- jimmygrapes 4y ago
- wolfgang42 4y agoMore official link: https://www.flsenate.gov/Session/Bill/2022/1557/BillText/er/PDF https://www.flsenate.gov/Session/Bill/2022/1557/BillText/er/... > 3. Classroom instruction by school personnel or third parties on sexual orientation or gender identity may not occur [for many students] So I guess technically you can say the word, as long as you don’t explain what it means?
- munk-a 4y agoI guess it's more accurate to say it's the "only say gay in the context of being happy" bill? You can say the word - but it can't be about sexual orientation.
- bavell 4y agoIt says "classroom instruction", so wouldn't it also be okay if it was just the teacher and student in a one-on-one discussion? Since that wouldn't be instructing a class.
- DangitBobby 4y ago
- parkingrift 4y ago
- kadoban 4y ago> The media-dubbed “don’t say gay” bill forbids kindergarten to second grade teachers from discussing sexual orientation or sexual identity. Oh, the humanity. And if that's _all_ it said you'd be exactly right. What's the rest of the text?
- nradov 4y agoYou can find the text of Florida House Bill 1557 here. https://www.flsenate.gov/Session/Bill/2022/1557 https://www.flsenate.gov/Session/Bill/2022/1557
- kadoban 4y agoI've read it. It says more than the k-2nd grader bit. The rest is ambiguous bullshit designed to be selectively enforced against lgbtq or just silence anyone by fear.
- parkingrift 4y agoDon’t talk about sexual topics in a manner that is not age appropriate?
- kadoban 4y agoWhat does "not age appropriate" mean? Who gets to pick? Are they likely to pick largely based on if the person talking is gay?
- akerl_ 4y agohttps://en.m.wikipedia.org/wiki/Florida_Parental_Rights_in_Education_Act https://en.m.wikipedia.org/wiki/Florida_Parental_Rights_in_E... You’ve noted one thing the bill does. It also does several other things that aren’t limited to kindergarten through 2nd grade.
- treeman79 4y agoSo you support teaching highly sexual content in Kindergarten? Because that’s what the law was about.
- vkou 4y agoA teacher mentioning about their same-sex spouse runs afoul of this law, but one mentioning their opposite-sex one does not. Which is, of course, because there are two sexualities - straight, and political.
- DiggyJohnson 4y agoWhy would a teacher discuss their personal life with K-3 students? Asking about a teacher’s marriage was obviously out of place in my experience, and for good reason. It’s not a topic for the classroom.
- DocTomoe 4y ago> "What did you do during summer break, Mrs Dickson?" > "Clara, my wife, and I went to see bears at Yosemite. It was so exciting! Can you point to Yosemite on a map?" Everyday situation at any school I ever went to. Schools are not learning factories, they are social places, especially in K-3.
- DuskStar 4y ago"My family and I went to see bears at Yosemite. It was so exciting! Can you point to Yosemite on a map?"
- DocTomoe 4y agoJust because a thing can be expressed in different words does not mean everyone always has the awareness to choose words that are politically desirable at every single point of their lives - especially when you are trying to teach children to use precise language (family implies a group of more than two people), and when identical similar language is perfectly ok if you have the right set of genitalia. I am not arguing for teaching toddlers about homosexual BDSM culture here. I just think that particular law is overreaching its goals, possibly to stroke the egos of religious zealots.
- RobotToaster 4y agoWhile I'm sure Florida's motivation was entirely reactionary, the fact that disney has self proclaimed "leftists" defending a literal company town shows how great their propaganda is.
- scarface74 4y agoWe could say the same about any small town local government in the Bible Belt. Not to mention all of the people running for office who said the election was stolen or Florida that literally passed a law called “the Stop Woke Act” that forbids companies from teaching DI&E. Do you want the government to control the propaganda?
- viridian 4y ago> We could say the same about any small town local government in the Bible Belt. This isn't remotely true. Your rural local government - a) generally has to serve the interests of its constituents, ie the fuckup mayor or do nothing member of the county commissioners board will eventually be called out, shamed in public, and lose reelection. b) unlike Disney, does not move in lock step chasing quarterly profit - which is a very good thing, as it allows for long term cooperative efforts, like bringing a sanitation system to a small town of 800 people. c) Are by-and-large the most useful people when it comes to pushing back against encroachment by companies who would prefer a company town. Your county commissioner, county seat mayor, etc, almost always have interests that run counter to the largest factory in the area, which is a blessing. That's not to say corruption doesn't happen, but most people are honest, and try to help the folks they represent as best they can. Disney is far closer to the factories that try to bully, cajole, and coerce their way to a better bottom line, than it is the elected body of a rural area.
- scarface74 4y ago> generally has to serve the interests of its constituents, ie the fuckup mayor or do nothing member of the county commissioners board will eventually be called out, shamed in public, and lose reelection. You mean the same local government where I grew up that within my still living parents lifetime enforced Jim Crow laws? Or do you mean the local government where I live now that specifically said that “religious institutions” can be put up in residential areas but are twisting in all sorts of contortions trying to keep a Hindu temple out? Or could it be the same state governments that are banning abortion left and right even though it goes against the wishes of their constituents? Maybe it’s the same local government that condones police stopping minorities far more than non minorities because they “look suspicious”? On the other hand the residence of Orange County Florida are definitely not in favor of Desantis forcing them (soon us) to take over control of Disney. I know this not just because of what I heard on the news. Orange County will soon be our legal residence and where we spend the winter (the rest of the time traveling). I thought if nothing else, you could count on conservatives to be good for business and lower taxes. The stunt that the Florida governor did is good for nothing but his own ego.
- llanowarelves 4y agoCalifornia did the reverse. Prop 209 then Prop 16. At first you were racist by being racist. Then you were racist for not wanting to repeal anti-racist laws. Just like how not having blind auditions for orchestras was racist (not hiring enough minorities). And now having blind auditions is racist (not hiring enough minorities).