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Interesting. I rank buy a car from a new car salesman as the worst consumer experience of my life. So much so that I've since bought used cars and in the future

Interesting. I rank buy a car from a new car salesman as the worst consumer experience of my life. So much so that I've since bought used cars and in the future hope to buy a Tesla in large part to avoid that experience. I understand that it could greatly benefit the salesperson in understanding the social psychology of the consumer ... but never again will I subject myself to that process.

xapata 4y ago
Used car salespeople are even worse! Are you buying from individuals or from a dealership?
- copperx 4y ago
  What do you mean? Buying a used car from a dealership is about 5x worse than buying a new car. Of course they're buying from an individual.
  - xapata 4y ago
    > Buying a used car from a dealership is ... worse than buying a new car. Yes, that's what I said. > Of course they're buying from an individual. That was not clear.
tenpies 4y ago
> in the future hope to buy a Tesla in large part to avoid that experience And see Tesla knows this, which is why the margin on their cars is higher than most. You may have disliked that sales experience with a dealer or used car salesperson, but it quite likely got you a slightly better deal than had you tried to negotiate yourself.
- christophilus 4y ago
  The margin might simply be from cutting out the middleman while keeping the middleman price. So, the buyer is not necessarily better or worse off. But not having to go through a pushy salesman is a big win. It’s why I love Carmax (and would probably like Carvana).
  - FerociousTimes 4y ago
    Tesla was supposed to pass some of those cost savings onto the end customer not to pocket it all like this but I'm aware that it's a corporation that's looking to maximize profits to their shareholders and extract as much value as possible from their clientele.
    - dento 4y ago
      They are likely selling all cars they can produce. Why would they sell them at cheaper price point?
    - jonny_eh 4y ago
      Tesla, like every other publicly traded company, sells their product at a price they feel they can get away with, in order to maximize profits. Any cost savings in the process only affects the floor price, which they're probably not selling at.
    - NSMutableSet 4y ago
      In the current market, most figurative Tesla dealers would be charging $7k+ over MSRP, which is what you can currently make immediately flipping any newly-purchased Tesla, even the base Model 3s. I'm sure there are some who would stick to MSRP out of "professionalism", but it wouldn't be the majority. This obviously won't last, but just something to consider.
- phpthrowaway99 4y ago
  If you buy a Toyota following the Tesla model, where you call and say "I'd like to buy the car you have, for the price you have listed", you will also have a generally good experience.
  - panopticon 4y ago
    My Toyota experience was okay, but I still needed to sit at a dealership for almost two hours to deal with the paperwork, wait for financing, etc. Tesla allowed me to take care of all of that from the comfort of home. Buying a Ford was the worst experience I've had with a new car, but that could have been entirely on the dealership.
    - no-such-address 4y ago
      Yes, they are there all day, until closing time, or longer. Usually, the longer you stay, the more likely you are to buy their car, or give them more money. They control the situation and the incentives are in their favor. This is one reason we loathe car shopping.
  - omgwtfbyobbq 4y ago
    I wish that was the case. The dealership experience seems designed to maximize the pressure and extract as much value from customers as possible. My first Toyota dealer experience was offering to buy a car at advertised price, and them refusing/countering with a lease. We just walked out. Based on that, I waited until Toyota offered pretty good unadvertised discounts and called up a bunch of dealers with an offer/car in mind. I got the car my wife and I wanted for $1k more than my offer, which was I think $9k less than MSRP, and the experience was way better. We only had to sit through the finance departments upsells. The third sale was paying MSRP at a Lexus dealer and we still were there for almost 5 hours.
    - Scoundreller 4y ago
      > I got the car my wife and I wanted for $1k more than my offer, which was I think $9k less than MSRP I think these numbers are better represented in percents rather than absolutes. $9k less than msrp on a Corolla seems unobtainium.
zamfi 4y ago
> my opinions on why car sales is the best sales experience Pretty sure the parent means "best" as in the best way to get experience doing sales for the salesperson.
- jonny_eh 4y ago
  That's why they said: > I understand that it could greatly benefit the salesperson
ejb999 4y ago
I'd rather go get a cavity filled, then buy a new car. Do it as infrequently as possible (hoping to get another 10 years out of my 11 year old Toyota). Every time I visit a new car dealer I feel a need to take a shower, just to get the stink off of me.
- flavmartins 4y ago
  > I'd rather go get a cavity filled WITHOUT anesthesia
- vl 4y ago
  BTW, apart from fixed price online sales, there are fixed priced dealerships. They advertise price on the website and don't negotiate. You just show up and get car at this price. Very smooth.
  - phpthrowaway99 4y ago
    You can do this at any dealership.
    - dangrossman 4y ago
      You'd like to think that, but no, there are plenty of dealers that will TELL you they're happy to negotiate everything by email/phone and then you just show up and get the car, but once you're there they want to change the deal and will still make you sit in a little office with someone that tries to add-on warranties, paint protection, prepaid services, etc.
      - phpthrowaway99 4y ago
        You mentioned you liked dealers that don't negotiate. So I mentioned you can buy without negotiating at any dealership. The advertised price is pretty fair at 90% of dealerships. Beyond that, their advertised specials are spectacular deals usually. Who spends money and attention advertising specials that don't even compete with the competition?
btbuildem 4y ago
I've only ever bought used cars, from individuals. Paying extra for the overhead of a dealership and some salesperson's bonus seems absurd to me. You're pretty much guaranteed to get taken advantage of by a professional. Local classifieds, private sellers, take the car to a trusted mechanic for an inspection.
- phpthrowaway99 4y ago
  Op here, selling 3000 cars. I've never bought a car at a dealership, and neither has anyone in my family in 25 years. But then again, I know cars inside and out (even from before my car sales career) so I feel pretty safe not accidentally buying a scammers car from Craigslist.
  - aaaaaaaaata 4y ago
    As opposed to buying a(n always more expensive) scammer's car on purpose at a used car dealership?, the choice seems easy.
    - phpthrowaway99 4y ago
      Very few franchise dealerships would ever sell a car with problems knowingly. It does happen, because people trade in cars with intermittent problems without telling the dealership. Compared to Craigslist where there is no shortage of people selling cars directly with current problems, intermittent problems, hidden problems, and massive paperwork issues that can stop you from registering the vehicle all together until resolved.
      - punnerud 4y ago
        That’s why you always ask to take the car to a well known 3.party that don’t benefit on the sale, and check the car for you for any hidden problems. So you still can buy from Craigslist without the risk.
        deleted 4y ago
JohnFen 4y ago
Entirely this. The main reason why I've only purchased one new car in my life is because dealing with car dealers (new or used) is about as fun and rewarding as pulling out my fingernails.
dexterdog 4y ago
Just remember that what Tesla saves you in the purchase experience will come back to bite you in the service experience. You need to go into the delivery process as sanely as possible and be willing to walk away from it if you see any issues that you want fixed. The problem is that by that time you will have been waiting a month or more for your car and will then be back at square one and on Tesla's shit list to boot.
hodgesrm 4y ago
If you do enough sales of virtually any product buying a car gets easy. It's just a game. When the salesperson says "I'll need to talk to my manager," you just say "No problem. I'm not in a hurry." And when they try to add stuff to the contract at the end, just say "No."
scruple 4y ago
My last 2 vehicle purchases (2014 and 2021) were through internet sales managers. I told them what I wanted, when I was intending to buy, that I had sent the same e-mail to every $MAKE dealership from San Diego to San Francisco, and that whoever had the best offer was getting my money. It was a painless experience both times.
- Scoundreller 4y ago
  My friend tried to do this with a Subaru and got nowhere. But it was in 2018 I think. Nothing to lose with the strategy, but it is societal economic situation and demand of car dependent.
  - scruple 4y ago
    That's a good point. We lucked out on our timing in 2021, we were looking ahead of the chip shortage, etc.
  - sleepdreamy 4y ago
    Agree. I've heard of this going very well, and other times you get zero bites. I think the courtesy/approach of the email also determines if this works or not. If you start off combative I think its much less likely to go well. I just let my fiancée know recently that this is how I intend to purchase our next vehicle. Strictly through email until the day I go to pick it up in person. If they say 'You have to come in' to talk price I am going to hang up immediately and call the next dealer on my list.

xapata 4y ago

Used car salespeople are even worse! Are you buying from individuals or from a dealership?

copperx 4y ago
What do you mean? Buying a used car from a dealership is about 5x worse than buying a new car. Of course they're buying from an individual.
- xapata 4y ago
  > Buying a used car from a dealership is ... worse than buying a new car. Yes, that's what I said. > Of course they're buying from an individual. That was not clear.

tenpies 4y ago

> in the future hope to buy a Tesla in large part to avoid that experience And see Tesla knows this, which is why the margin on their cars is higher than most. You may have disliked that sales experience with a dealer or used car salesperson, but it quite likely got you a slightly better deal than had you tried to negotiate yourself.

christophilus 4y ago
The margin might simply be from cutting out the middleman while keeping the middleman price. So, the buyer is not necessarily better or worse off. But not having to go through a pushy salesman is a big win. It’s why I love Carmax (and would probably like Carvana).
- FerociousTimes 4y ago
  Tesla was supposed to pass some of those cost savings onto the end customer not to pocket it all like this but I'm aware that it's a corporation that's looking to maximize profits to their shareholders and extract as much value as possible from their clientele.
  - dento 4y ago
    They are likely selling all cars they can produce. Why would they sell them at cheaper price point?
  - jonny_eh 4y ago
    Tesla, like every other publicly traded company, sells their product at a price they feel they can get away with, in order to maximize profits. Any cost savings in the process only affects the floor price, which they're probably not selling at.
  - NSMutableSet 4y ago
    In the current market, most figurative Tesla dealers would be charging $7k+ over MSRP, which is what you can currently make immediately flipping any newly-purchased Tesla, even the base Model 3s. I'm sure there are some who would stick to MSRP out of "professionalism", but it wouldn't be the majority. This obviously won't last, but just something to consider.
phpthrowaway99 4y ago
If you buy a Toyota following the Tesla model, where you call and say "I'd like to buy the car you have, for the price you have listed", you will also have a generally good experience.
- panopticon 4y ago
  My Toyota experience was okay, but I still needed to sit at a dealership for almost two hours to deal with the paperwork, wait for financing, etc. Tesla allowed me to take care of all of that from the comfort of home. Buying a Ford was the worst experience I've had with a new car, but that could have been entirely on the dealership.
  - no-such-address 4y ago
    Yes, they are there all day, until closing time, or longer. Usually, the longer you stay, the more likely you are to buy their car, or give them more money. They control the situation and the incentives are in their favor. This is one reason we loathe car shopping.
- omgwtfbyobbq 4y ago
  I wish that was the case. The dealership experience seems designed to maximize the pressure and extract as much value from customers as possible. My first Toyota dealer experience was offering to buy a car at advertised price, and them refusing/countering with a lease. We just walked out. Based on that, I waited until Toyota offered pretty good unadvertised discounts and called up a bunch of dealers with an offer/car in mind. I got the car my wife and I wanted for $1k more than my offer, which was I think $9k less than MSRP, and the experience was way better. We only had to sit through the finance departments upsells. The third sale was paying MSRP at a Lexus dealer and we still were there for almost 5 hours.
  - Scoundreller 4y ago
    > I got the car my wife and I wanted for $1k more than my offer, which was I think $9k less than MSRP I think these numbers are better represented in percents rather than absolutes. $9k less than msrp on a Corolla seems unobtainium.

zamfi 4y ago

> my opinions on why car sales is the best sales experience Pretty sure the parent means "best" as in the best way to get experience doing sales for the salesperson.

jonny_eh 4y ago
That's why they said: > I understand that it could greatly benefit the salesperson

ejb999 4y ago

I'd rather go get a cavity filled, then buy a new car. Do it as infrequently as possible (hoping to get another 10 years out of my 11 year old Toyota). Every time I visit a new car dealer I feel a need to take a shower, just to get the stink off of me.

flavmartins 4y ago
> I'd rather go get a cavity filled WITHOUT anesthesia
vl 4y ago
BTW, apart from fixed price online sales, there are fixed priced dealerships. They advertise price on the website and don't negotiate. You just show up and get car at this price. Very smooth.
- phpthrowaway99 4y ago
  You can do this at any dealership.
  - dangrossman 4y ago
    You'd like to think that, but no, there are plenty of dealers that will TELL you they're happy to negotiate everything by email/phone and then you just show up and get the car, but once you're there they want to change the deal and will still make you sit in a little office with someone that tries to add-on warranties, paint protection, prepaid services, etc.
    - phpthrowaway99 4y ago
      You mentioned you liked dealers that don't negotiate. So I mentioned you can buy without negotiating at any dealership. The advertised price is pretty fair at 90% of dealerships. Beyond that, their advertised specials are spectacular deals usually. Who spends money and attention advertising specials that don't even compete with the competition?

btbuildem 4y ago

I've only ever bought used cars, from individuals. Paying extra for the overhead of a dealership and some salesperson's bonus seems absurd to me. You're pretty much guaranteed to get taken advantage of by a professional. Local classifieds, private sellers, take the car to a trusted mechanic for an inspection.

phpthrowaway99 4y ago
Op here, selling 3000 cars. I've never bought a car at a dealership, and neither has anyone in my family in 25 years. But then again, I know cars inside and out (even from before my car sales career) so I feel pretty safe not accidentally buying a scammers car from Craigslist.
- aaaaaaaaata 4y ago
  As opposed to buying a(n always more expensive) scammer's car on purpose at a used car dealership?, the choice seems easy.
  - phpthrowaway99 4y ago
    Very few franchise dealerships would ever sell a car with problems knowingly. It does happen, because people trade in cars with intermittent problems without telling the dealership. Compared to Craigslist where there is no shortage of people selling cars directly with current problems, intermittent problems, hidden problems, and massive paperwork issues that can stop you from registering the vehicle all together until resolved.
    - punnerud 4y ago
      That’s why you always ask to take the car to a well known 3.party that don’t benefit on the sale, and check the car for you for any hidden problems. So you still can buy from Craigslist without the risk.
      - deleted 4y ago

JohnFen 4y ago

Entirely this. The main reason why I've only purchased one new car in my life is because dealing with car dealers (new or used) is about as fun and rewarding as pulling out my fingernails.

dexterdog 4y ago

Just remember that what Tesla saves you in the purchase experience will come back to bite you in the service experience. You need to go into the delivery process as sanely as possible and be willing to walk away from it if you see any issues that you want fixed. The problem is that by that time you will have been waiting a month or more for your car and will then be back at square one and on Tesla's shit list to boot.

hodgesrm 4y ago

If you do enough sales of virtually any product buying a car gets easy. It's just a game. When the salesperson says "I'll need to talk to my manager," you just say "No problem. I'm not in a hurry." And when they try to add stuff to the contract at the end, just say "No."

scruple 4y ago

My last 2 vehicle purchases (2014 and 2021) were through internet sales managers. I told them what I wanted, when I was intending to buy, that I had sent the same e-mail to every $MAKE dealership from San Diego to San Francisco, and that whoever had the best offer was getting my money. It was a painless experience both times.

Scoundreller 4y ago
My friend tried to do this with a Subaru and got nowhere. But it was in 2018 I think. Nothing to lose with the strategy, but it is societal economic situation and demand of car dependent.
- scruple 4y ago
  That's a good point. We lucked out on our timing in 2021, we were looking ahead of the chip shortage, etc.
- sleepdreamy 4y ago
  Agree. I've heard of this going very well, and other times you get zero bites. I think the courtesy/approach of the email also determines if this works or not. If you start off combative I think its much less likely to go well. I just let my fiancée know recently that this is how I intend to purchase our next vehicle. Strictly through email until the day I go to pick it up in person. If they say 'You have to come in' to talk price I am going to hang up immediately and call the next dealer on my list.