5 ms·

Wow this is a game changer for many users. Plus it will generate cash once the 2 years run out!

by shadowpho 4y ago

number6 4y ago
- tpmx 4y ago
  - simonh 4y ago
    A free emergency service is despicable because it’s not forever. Really?
    - tpmx 4y ago
      Yes. It's long (I think since the early days in the 80s) been a tenet in mobile phone industry that emergency calls always need to be free. You route them best to your technical ability - anything else is unethical. With any cellular phone it's possible to dial the local emergency number. Doesn't matter if your current operator has coverage, the phone will find the network that has the best coverage. There's still explicit validation of this capability for new phone devices. You don't even need a SIM card. But now Apple has ended the practice.
      - happyopossum 4y ago
        That’s never been the case for satellite service - ever.
        tpmx 4y ago
        Well, this is the first time a mainstream phone gets satellite service.
        kube-system 4y ago
        That is true and this may set a new precedent, but connectivity requirements in the past were always placed on carriers before, and never phone manufacturers.
        matt_attack 4y ago
        Phone manufacturers didn't offer services before. In this case Apple is the carrier (much like a MVNO) for the service.
      - jshzglr 4y ago
        Would it be more ethical if they could but never did release this feature? Because that is essentially what you are advocating for, considering no public company could foot the bill in perpetuity. The way this probably plays out is by the time the 2 years is up or shortly thereafter this will be subsidized by the gov. Apple is leaving quite a bit of money on the table here, while simultaneously spending quite a bit. Wipe the entitlement from your eyes and recognize this for what it is.
        tpmx 4y ago
        > considering no public company could foot the bill in perpetuity. iPhone margins do allow for it. > Wipe the entitlement from your eyes and recognize this for what it is. Sir, let me very calmly ask you to please behave better in discussions here.
        jshzglr 4y ago
        So you can call certain behavior despicable but I can't call your behavior entitled. That sounds pretty entitled.
        number6 4y ago
        The body of the missing person had been found after 4 days of search. She still held her Phone in her hand displaying the Message: "Please update your credit card information to purchase this subscription. The free usage ended 6 days ago".
        deleted 4y ago
        [deleted]
      - simonh 4y ago
        It was a mandatory requirement from the governments that issued the spectrum licenses, that's all.
      - astrange 4y ago
        That’s a per-country regulatory requirement - it’s true in most countries but the internet tells me it’s not true in the UK.
  - happyopossum 4y ago
    Despicable? This is a huge investment for Apple (look at Globalstar’s SEC filing for details), it’s free for 2 years, and we don’t even know what (if anything) it will cost after that. But you’re confident it’s “despicable”. That smacks of some serious entitlement man…
    - malfist 4y ago
      I hate apple because of vendor lock in and nonsense with their walled garden. But seriously, GP is deluded. Satellite emergency services has never been free, even if you buy an garmin device for this, they don't operate if you're not paying your monthly bill.
      - pxeboot 4y ago
        There were many Personal Locator Beacon's that worked without a subscription. They were more popular before the inReach, but still available.
  - goleary 4y ago
    a bit of strong reaction given you have no idea whether or not it includes lifetime global 911 after the 2 years...
jliptzin 4y ago
How large is the demand for something like this? Are tons of people really going that far out of range of cell signals?
- nicoburns 4y ago
  A lot of serious hikers use dedicated devices for this kind of functionality. It's expensive-ish, and the chance of needing it is small. But if you do need it then it could be an actual life-or-death situation, so it's worth it if you're out in the middle of nowhere regularly.
- snoopy_telex 4y ago
  For the first 10 months in 2020, the Adirondacks had 245 search and rescue events[1] and it's a fairly small park nationally. This could save a huge amount of park service resources if they could be given the GPS cords to go directly to rather then spend hours searching. Expand that nation wide, it's a huge public win, and a great safety benefit to the individuals to be able to get help as soon as possible if something happens. I was unable to find nation wide stats on search and rescue events. [1] https://www.adirondackexplorer.org/stories/record-number-of-search-and-rescues-this-year https://www.adirondackexplorer.org/stories/record-number-of-...
  - deleted 4y ago
    [deleted]
- reaperducer 4y ago
  How large is the demand for something like this? Are tons of people really going that far out of range of cell signals? When I lived in the desert, the local newspaper regularly published stories about tourists getting lost/stuck/stranded and then dying. Going by the newspaper accounts, I'd estimate at least a dozen people died in the desert each year, and that was just in my area.
  - bombcar 4y ago
    The demand is enough that the govn't could pay Apple the whole cost of this program and save money on search and rescue just because "head to the location of the phone" is a lot easier than "carefully comb this entire mountain range". And that's not even counting the lives saved.
guyzero 4y ago
This raises BOM costs and has significant operating costs. How many users are likely to continue to pay for this service once the two years are up? It's a great feature but it's far from a guaranteed money maker. This could just as likely disappear from future iPhone models. edit: also competing dedicated devices also include the cost of SAR insurance in their monthly fees, which are significant: https://www.garmin.com/en-US/p/837461/pn/010-06000-SU https://www.garmin.com/en-US/p/837461/pn/010-06000-SU It starts at $15 a month but any serious user is paying more like $35-65 a month.
- SkyPuncher 4y ago
  I live in a small city in what is rural America. There are a lot of places that I travel that I don't get cell service in. This could literally be a life-saver for me. While I don't know how large this group is, skiers, hikers, boaters, campers, off-roaders would all likely get use out of this functionality.
  - guyzero 4y ago
    Most people in the groups you mention probably already own a dedicated emergency locator device. AAPL may very well take a lot of their business, but maybe not. An inReach is going to survive a much bigger fall than an iPhone.
    - chrisseaton 4y ago
      Who are AAPL?
      - Jtsummers 4y ago
        It's Apple's stock symbol. People sometimes refer to companies by their stock symbols (on this site and others), though usually more in a financial discussion context.
        matt_attack 4y ago

Wow this is a game changer for many users. Plus it will generate cash once the 2 years run out!

number6 4y ago

tpmx 4y ago
- simonh 4y ago
  A free emergency service is despicable because it’s not forever. Really?
  - tpmx 4y ago
    Yes. It's long (I think since the early days in the 80s) been a tenet in mobile phone industry that emergency calls always need to be free. You route them best to your technical ability - anything else is unethical. With any cellular phone it's possible to dial the local emergency number. Doesn't matter if your current operator has coverage, the phone will find the network that has the best coverage. There's still explicit validation of this capability for new phone devices. You don't even need a SIM card. But now Apple has ended the practice.
    - happyopossum 4y ago
      That’s never been the case for satellite service - ever.
      - tpmx 4y ago
        Well, this is the first time a mainstream phone gets satellite service.
        kube-system 4y ago
        That is true and this may set a new precedent, but connectivity requirements in the past were always placed on carriers before, and never phone manufacturers.
        matt_attack 4y ago
        Phone manufacturers didn't offer services before. In this case Apple is the carrier (much like a MVNO) for the service.
    - jshzglr 4y ago
      Would it be more ethical if they could but never did release this feature? Because that is essentially what you are advocating for, considering no public company could foot the bill in perpetuity. The way this probably plays out is by the time the 2 years is up or shortly thereafter this will be subsidized by the gov. Apple is leaving quite a bit of money on the table here, while simultaneously spending quite a bit. Wipe the entitlement from your eyes and recognize this for what it is.
      - tpmx 4y ago
        > considering no public company could foot the bill in perpetuity. iPhone margins do allow for it. > Wipe the entitlement from your eyes and recognize this for what it is. Sir, let me very calmly ask you to please behave better in discussions here.
        jshzglr 4y ago
        So you can call certain behavior despicable but I can't call your behavior entitled. That sounds pretty entitled.
        number6 4y ago
        The body of the missing person had been found after 4 days of search. She still held her Phone in her hand displaying the Message: "Please update your credit card information to purchase this subscription. The free usage ended 6 days ago".
      - deleted 4y ago
        [deleted]
    - simonh 4y ago
      It was a mandatory requirement from the governments that issued the spectrum licenses, that's all.
    - astrange 4y ago
      That’s a per-country regulatory requirement - it’s true in most countries but the internet tells me it’s not true in the UK.
- happyopossum 4y ago
  Despicable? This is a huge investment for Apple (look at Globalstar’s SEC filing for details), it’s free for 2 years, and we don’t even know what (if anything) it will cost after that. But you’re confident it’s “despicable”. That smacks of some serious entitlement man…
  - malfist 4y ago
    I hate apple because of vendor lock in and nonsense with their walled garden. But seriously, GP is deluded. Satellite emergency services has never been free, even if you buy an garmin device for this, they don't operate if you're not paying your monthly bill.
    - pxeboot 4y ago
      There were many Personal Locator Beacon's that worked without a subscription. They were more popular before the inReach, but still available.
- goleary 4y ago
  a bit of strong reaction given you have no idea whether or not it includes lifetime global 911 after the 2 years...

jliptzin 4y ago

How large is the demand for something like this? Are tons of people really going that far out of range of cell signals?

nicoburns 4y ago
A lot of serious hikers use dedicated devices for this kind of functionality. It's expensive-ish, and the chance of needing it is small. But if you do need it then it could be an actual life-or-death situation, so it's worth it if you're out in the middle of nowhere regularly.
snoopy_telex 4y ago
For the first 10 months in 2020, the Adirondacks had 245 search and rescue events[1] and it's a fairly small park nationally. This could save a huge amount of park service resources if they could be given the GPS cords to go directly to rather then spend hours searching. Expand that nation wide, it's a huge public win, and a great safety benefit to the individuals to be able to get help as soon as possible if something happens. I was unable to find nation wide stats on search and rescue events. [1] https://www.adirondackexplorer.org/stories/record-number-of-search-and-rescues-this-year https://www.adirondackexplorer.org/stories/record-number-of-...
- deleted 4y ago
  [deleted]
reaperducer 4y ago
How large is the demand for something like this? Are tons of people really going that far out of range of cell signals? When I lived in the desert, the local newspaper regularly published stories about tourists getting lost/stuck/stranded and then dying. Going by the newspaper accounts, I'd estimate at least a dozen people died in the desert each year, and that was just in my area.
- bombcar 4y ago
  The demand is enough that the govn't could pay Apple the whole cost of this program and save money on search and rescue just because "head to the location of the phone" is a lot easier than "carefully comb this entire mountain range". And that's not even counting the lives saved.

guyzero 4y ago

This raises BOM costs and has significant operating costs. How many users are likely to continue to pay for this service once the two years are up? It's a great feature but it's far from a guaranteed money maker. This could just as likely disappear from future iPhone models. edit: also competing dedicated devices also include the cost of SAR insurance in their monthly fees, which are significant: https://www.garmin.com/en-US/p/837461/pn/010-06000-SU https://www.garmin.com/en-US/p/837461/pn/010-06000-SU It starts at $15 a month but any serious user is paying more like $35-65 a month.

SkyPuncher 4y ago
I live in a small city in what is rural America. There are a lot of places that I travel that I don't get cell service in. This could literally be a life-saver for me. While I don't know how large this group is, skiers, hikers, boaters, campers, off-roaders would all likely get use out of this functionality.
- guyzero 4y ago
  Most people in the groups you mention probably already own a dedicated emergency locator device. AAPL may very well take a lot of their business, but maybe not. An inReach is going to survive a much bigger fall than an iPhone.
  - chrisseaton 4y ago
    Who are AAPL?
    - Jtsummers 4y ago
      It's Apple's stock symbol. People sometimes refer to companies by their stock symbols (on this site and others), though usually more in a financial discussion context.
      - matt_attack 4y ago