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It's sad that Europeans have to suffer under stupid leadership choices made by their leaders.

88840-8855 4y ago
- strzzz 4y ago
  8 in 10 europeans agree on european leadership in current situation agains rashist ruzzia according to the newest poll. Don't waste your time. Slava Ukraini!
  - 88840-8855 4y ago
afr0ck 4y ago
Europe must regain its independence from the US. Only after that, Europe can defend its interests in the best way possible.
- nradov 4y ago
  Yes the US government agrees, and has been urging European countries to take responsibility for their own defense instead of depending on the US security umbrella. And the EU probably should have done more to compromise on UK demands in order to prevent Brexit.
  - orwin 4y ago
    What? in 2012 Eu compromised on Every Single Point. Every points. Not as much as the UK wanted sometime, but to put the brexit on EU is disingenuous. Also, the US government is really weird on EU security. Because while Trump pushed for higher defense spending, the military was in Belgium and Germany saying "See, you have to get new fighters carrying our bombs, and since the Viper is abandoned and we won't upgrade your F18 into superhornets, you will have to buy our F35". So Germany and Belgium at least will be paying an order of magnitude more in maintenance costs for at best the same air capabilities. But they did finance Lockheed, so all is good?
    - nradov 4y ago
      You are misrepresenting what happened with tactical aircraft purchases. Germany, Belgium, and several other countries voluntarily participate in the NATO nuclear sharing program. In order to continue with that they need a nuclear capable aircraft. The US Air Force was already paying to certify the F-35A as a nuclear bomber, so other NATO buyers get that essentially for free. They were free to purchase other aircraft and pay for nuclear certification (like they did previously with the Tornado) but chose not to do so. https://www.defensenews.com/global/europe/2022/04/13/nato-planners-put-the-f-35-front-and-center-in-european-nuclear-deterrence/ https://www.defensenews.com/global/europe/2022/04/13/nato-pl... The Lockheed-Martin F-16 Viper is still in active production and the Air Force is upgrading theirs with new radars so it's hardly abandoned. It is physically impossible to upgrade a legacy Boeing F/A-18 Hornet to an F/A-18E/F Super Hornet because the airframes are different, but new ones are also still in production. US allies are welcome to purchase either aircraft, but neither one is nuclear capable. Those aircraft are also considered less survivable against Russian air defenses than the F-35, so hardly the same capabilities at all.
- smsm42 4y ago
  I remember certain US President warning the Europe this kind of thing may happen, some years ago. And some Europeans very independently and openly laughing at him. I wonder if they are still laughing. I also wonder whether their electorate still think they were defending their interests in the best way possible. I also wonder when and how exactly US forced the dependent Europe into rebuilding their energy structure in a way that led to the current conundrum.
- 88840-8855 4y ago
  I fully agree. We need a full decoupling from the US. We must protect our economy and our interests, through out every single American soldier from European soil and make sure that those brain-washing machinery Hollywood/Netflix are being banned and replaced. We are in this mess because of the US. Let us not forget that they are not our friends, but our enemy.
  - throwrqX 4y ago
    Do you not realize that the US is the only reason Russia doesn't steamroll all of Europe?
    - polotics 4y ago
      2021 is the last year that idea had any leg. A "steamrolling" into Poland, even with a fully withdrawn US army, would be an harder feat than one into Ukraine...
      - throwrqX 4y ago
        Russian tactics would be completely different for that scenario. There would be a much more massive bombing campaign using the full might of their air force (which is clearly not what is happening in Ukraine) for one. I wouldn't rule out usage of tactical nuclear weapons either if they faced any difficulties.
        sofixa 4y ago
        > There would be a much more massive bombing campaign using the full might of their air force (which is clearly not what is happening in Ukraine) Why? They've shelled indiscriminately civilian city centres, train stations with civilian evacuations, buildings where civilians have taken shelter. It's obvious they couldn't care less about civilian lives, what is stopping them from using their aviation? Considering what we saw on the rare occasions they did use their aviation (phones with buttons used to coordinate and communicate, using physical landscapes and maps for orientation, pilots in not the best shape) their air force is probably as good as their army. That is, utterly shit, with terrible maintenance, no morale, missing equipment, etc etc etc.
- strzzz 4y ago
  Europe is sitting on the needle of russian gas/oil. Where is US here?
  - Normille 4y ago
    >Europe is sitting on the needle of russian gas/oil. Where is US here? reply er... behind the scenes, manipulating conflicts, to their own advantage. As fucking usual.
    - nradov 4y ago
      Are you claiming that the US somehow manipulated Russia into invading Ukraine?
      - Normille 4y ago
        My god. I think he's got it!
        smsm42 4y ago
        You just have to mention it's all secretly organized by Zionists, and you win the conspirology bingo!
happymellon 4y ago
Which decision are we talking about? That the UK doesn't import Russian gas, but is impacted by other countries that do which has increased the wholesale cost?
legulere 4y ago
The current problems of only half the nuclear power plants in France working and gas shortage can hardly be blamed on current leadership.
- Ekaros 4y ago
  How can the gas problem not be entirely blamed on the current leadership? I have not heard of too many elections in recent times. Though, UK did change their prime minister... But still the same party and parliament.
strzzz 4y ago
It's true speaking about long term leadership. German french and uk leaders (together with most others in west and central europe) were long nurturing russia and agreeing to be sit on the needle of its energy supplies. Now we have consequenses. Hangover so to say...

strzzz 4y ago
8 in 10 europeans agree on european leadership in current situation agains rashist ruzzia according to the newest poll. Don't waste your time. Slava Ukraini!
- 88840-8855 4y ago

Europe must regain its independence from the US. Only after that, Europe can defend its interests in the best way possible.

nradov 4y ago
Yes the US government agrees, and has been urging European countries to take responsibility for their own defense instead of depending on the US security umbrella. And the EU probably should have done more to compromise on UK demands in order to prevent Brexit.
- orwin 4y ago
  What? in 2012 Eu compromised on Every Single Point. Every points. Not as much as the UK wanted sometime, but to put the brexit on EU is disingenuous. Also, the US government is really weird on EU security. Because while Trump pushed for higher defense spending, the military was in Belgium and Germany saying "See, you have to get new fighters carrying our bombs, and since the Viper is abandoned and we won't upgrade your F18 into superhornets, you will have to buy our F35". So Germany and Belgium at least will be paying an order of magnitude more in maintenance costs for at best the same air capabilities. But they did finance Lockheed, so all is good?
  - nradov 4y ago
    You are misrepresenting what happened with tactical aircraft purchases. Germany, Belgium, and several other countries voluntarily participate in the NATO nuclear sharing program. In order to continue with that they need a nuclear capable aircraft. The US Air Force was already paying to certify the F-35A as a nuclear bomber, so other NATO buyers get that essentially for free. They were free to purchase other aircraft and pay for nuclear certification (like they did previously with the Tornado) but chose not to do so. https://www.defensenews.com/global/europe/2022/04/13/nato-planners-put-the-f-35-front-and-center-in-european-nuclear-deterrence/ https://www.defensenews.com/global/europe/2022/04/13/nato-pl... The Lockheed-Martin F-16 Viper is still in active production and the Air Force is upgrading theirs with new radars so it's hardly abandoned. It is physically impossible to upgrade a legacy Boeing F/A-18 Hornet to an F/A-18E/F Super Hornet because the airframes are different, but new ones are also still in production. US allies are welcome to purchase either aircraft, but neither one is nuclear capable. Those aircraft are also considered less survivable against Russian air defenses than the F-35, so hardly the same capabilities at all.
smsm42 4y ago
I remember certain US President warning the Europe this kind of thing may happen, some years ago. And some Europeans very independently and openly laughing at him. I wonder if they are still laughing. I also wonder whether their electorate still think they were defending their interests in the best way possible. I also wonder when and how exactly US forced the dependent Europe into rebuilding their energy structure in a way that led to the current conundrum.
88840-8855 4y ago
I fully agree. We need a full decoupling from the US. We must protect our economy and our interests, through out every single American soldier from European soil and make sure that those brain-washing machinery Hollywood/Netflix are being banned and replaced. We are in this mess because of the US. Let us not forget that they are not our friends, but our enemy.
- throwrqX 4y ago
  Do you not realize that the US is the only reason Russia doesn't steamroll all of Europe?
  - polotics 4y ago
    2021 is the last year that idea had any leg. A "steamrolling" into Poland, even with a fully withdrawn US army, would be an harder feat than one into Ukraine...
    - throwrqX 4y ago
      Russian tactics would be completely different for that scenario. There would be a much more massive bombing campaign using the full might of their air force (which is clearly not what is happening in Ukraine) for one. I wouldn't rule out usage of tactical nuclear weapons either if they faced any difficulties.
      - sofixa 4y ago
        > There would be a much more massive bombing campaign using the full might of their air force (which is clearly not what is happening in Ukraine) Why? They've shelled indiscriminately civilian city centres, train stations with civilian evacuations, buildings where civilians have taken shelter. It's obvious they couldn't care less about civilian lives, what is stopping them from using their aviation? Considering what we saw on the rare occasions they did use their aviation (phones with buttons used to coordinate and communicate, using physical landscapes and maps for orientation, pilots in not the best shape) their air force is probably as good as their army. That is, utterly shit, with terrible maintenance, no morale, missing equipment, etc etc etc.
strzzz 4y ago
Europe is sitting on the needle of russian gas/oil. Where is US here?
- Normille 4y ago
  >Europe is sitting on the needle of russian gas/oil. Where is US here? reply er... behind the scenes, manipulating conflicts, to their own advantage. As fucking usual.
  - nradov 4y ago
    Are you claiming that the US somehow manipulated Russia into invading Ukraine?
    - Normille 4y ago
      My god. I think he's got it!
      - smsm42 4y ago
        You just have to mention it's all secretly organized by Zionists, and you win the conspirology bingo!

happymellon 4y ago

Which decision are we talking about? That the UK doesn't import Russian gas, but is impacted by other countries that do which has increased the wholesale cost?

legulere 4y ago

The current problems of only half the nuclear power plants in France working and gas shortage can hardly be blamed on current leadership.

Ekaros 4y ago
How can the gas problem not be entirely blamed on the current leadership? I have not heard of too many elections in recent times. Though, UK did change their prime minister... But still the same party and parliament.

strzzz 4y ago

It's true speaking about long term leadership. German french and uk leaders (together with most others in west and central europe) were long nurturing russia and agreeing to be sit on the needle of its energy supplies. Now we have consequenses. Hangover so to say...