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Black isn't a "race", it's a social category. You can't actually be serious? In America, black includes people of Caribbean descent, people from South America,

Black isn't a "race", it's a social category. You can't actually be serious? In America, black includes people of Caribbean descent, people from South America, African-Americans, someone that stepped off a plane from Ethiopia. It's a completely meaningless term in regards to science. You can't actually be serious?

Banana699 4y ago
"Blind isn't an actual biological condition, it's a social category" The same thing can be different categories. Black is social category, and is also a very well defined biological state of the most visible organ in your body, and is associated with certain genes. Instead of repeatedly stating the name of those different genes every time you say something about them, you can simply say the name of the most visible marker of them and still be correct the vast majority of time.
- freejazz 4y ago
  The notion was that a "race" is something of such significant scientific relevance, that not being able to use "Black" to refer to a "race" would be a disservice. But you aren't here saying Black is a race, it is a "defined biological state of the most visible organ in your body". Okay, what does that have to do with race? Did you not understand my previous post explaining that "people who are socially considered Black" is basically a useless scientific criteria outside of its social circumstances? You seem a little bit more focused on repeating some rhetorical dunk you read somewhere online than actually understanding what is being discussed. Take a moment and actually consider what I'm writing. To repeat the example that I gave before, research on Ashkenazi Jewish diseases is not hindered by calling it research on the specific haplotype group that it is. The poster that brought up Ashkenazi Jews is misunderstanding if not disingenuous. I think you also don't get the difference between what a haplotype group is in this context, and your concept of "race".
- nradov 4y ago
  If the biological state is "very well defined" then please point us to the definition. Is it based solely on skin hue and reflectance, or are there other factors? Do some people in South Asia with very dark skin meet that definition or are they excluded? I'm not just trying to be argumentative here. If scientists want to produce high quality, reproducible research then they must precisely define their terms. They can't just assume that everyone has the same understanding and knows what they mean.
- bradyd 4y ago
  > "Blind isn't an actual biological condition, it's a social category" Uh, this is actually true. Blindness is a legal definition not a medical condition. There are numerous medical conditions that can lead to a person being legally blind.
zmgsabst 4y ago
Well — no. Those people have a shared biological lineage, with only a relatively short period of differentiation — while they have radically different cultures. What you’re describing is “black” being useless as a social construct (ie, I know nothing about their culture) but useful medically/scientifically (ie, there’s groupings of medical conditions correlated with that lineage). I would go so far as to say only racists use “black” as a social construct — and project that the medical groupings are the same.
- freejazz 4y ago
  What medical conditions do you know of that are specific to every group in the (allegedly useless and racist) social category of "Black"?

Banana699 4y ago

"Blind isn't an actual biological condition, it's a social category" The same thing can be different categories. Black is social category, and is also a very well defined biological state of the most visible organ in your body, and is associated with certain genes. Instead of repeatedly stating the name of those different genes every time you say something about them, you can simply say the name of the most visible marker of them and still be correct the vast majority of time.

freejazz 4y ago
The notion was that a "race" is something of such significant scientific relevance, that not being able to use "Black" to refer to a "race" would be a disservice. But you aren't here saying Black is a race, it is a "defined biological state of the most visible organ in your body". Okay, what does that have to do with race? Did you not understand my previous post explaining that "people who are socially considered Black" is basically a useless scientific criteria outside of its social circumstances? You seem a little bit more focused on repeating some rhetorical dunk you read somewhere online than actually understanding what is being discussed. Take a moment and actually consider what I'm writing. To repeat the example that I gave before, research on Ashkenazi Jewish diseases is not hindered by calling it research on the specific haplotype group that it is. The poster that brought up Ashkenazi Jews is misunderstanding if not disingenuous. I think you also don't get the difference between what a haplotype group is in this context, and your concept of "race".
nradov 4y ago
If the biological state is "very well defined" then please point us to the definition. Is it based solely on skin hue and reflectance, or are there other factors? Do some people in South Asia with very dark skin meet that definition or are they excluded? I'm not just trying to be argumentative here. If scientists want to produce high quality, reproducible research then they must precisely define their terms. They can't just assume that everyone has the same understanding and knows what they mean.
bradyd 4y ago
> "Blind isn't an actual biological condition, it's a social category" Uh, this is actually true. Blindness is a legal definition not a medical condition. There are numerous medical conditions that can lead to a person being legally blind.

zmgsabst 4y ago

Well — no. Those people have a shared biological lineage, with only a relatively short period of differentiation — while they have radically different cultures. What you’re describing is “black” being useless as a social construct (ie, I know nothing about their culture) but useful medically/scientifically (ie, there’s groupings of medical conditions correlated with that lineage). I would go so far as to say only racists use “black” as a social construct — and project that the medical groupings are the same.

freejazz 4y ago
What medical conditions do you know of that are specific to every group in the (allegedly useless and racist) social category of "Black"?