6 ms·

Obviously they couldn't admit that it is in part thanks to Bitcoin. But fiaters gonna fiat, what can you do.

by globalreset 4y ago

kadoban 4y ago
Didn't the Bitcoin part just obviously lose money? They bought in near the maximum price ever.
- ReadTheLicense 4y ago
  The point was never to make capital gains on the Bitcoin investment. The point was to make the economy interesting to foreign investors and bring in their money.
  - peoplefromibiza 4y ago
    which clearly is not the case quoting the IMF el Salvador team This has a lot to do with the pick-up in external demand, and El Salvador’s response to the pandemic. Though it is one of the most densely populated countries in Latin America, El Salvador had one of the lowest reported rates of COVID-19 infections and fatalities in the region and has a relatively high vaccination rate.
    - jinpa_zangpo 4y ago
      The same president that made bitcoin El Salvador's legal currency also managed the growth of the economy and its response to the Covid-19 pandemic. Nayib Bukele is the most interesting politician in America today.
      - peoplefromibiza 4y ago
        > The same president that made bitcoin El Salvador's legal currency also managed the growth of the economy rebound after COVID has been common in many parts of the World Mt country have grown 7% after years of zero/negative growth It was managed by the same politicians that could not make it grow in the previous 20 years > Nayib Bukele is the most interesting politician in America today that says a lot about the state of politics in America...
        shyn3 4y ago
        LBJsPNS 4y ago
        Please stop with the bullshit. And yes, if you're trying to claim Joe Biden doesn't know his own name, You're full of it.
        shyn3 4y ago
        arinlen 4y ago
        > I mean is it wrong to fathom he doesn't know his own name? Yes, it's pathetic. Please stop generating noise in an otherwise interesting discussion over El Salvador.
        shyn3 4y ago
        It's actually hilarious and a poor representation on the education system and the populace. Your other point is valid.
        neither_color 4y ago
        He's also cut the homicide down to below some major US cities. The homicide rate fell from 38 per 100,000 to 18 per 100,000. Most people have only heard of him because of Bitcoin and so their own biases of Bitcoin cloud their judgment of Bukele. Locally he's a legend. He objectively handled Covid better than many countries around him(bested only by Costa Rica and Panama, which are already considered comparatively more developed than El Salvador). His foray into Bitcoin is considered a mistake of ambition not one of corruption. To put that into context the previous administration of El Salvador is accused of embezzling $300,000,000 USD. I wish more schadenfreude articles about El Salvador would include that fact.
  - throw_m239339 4y ago
    The point of bitcoin is never bitcoin apparently... You do make the economy interesting to foreign investor by investing in infrastructure, education, safety... not buying bitcoin and making yourself hostage to companies such as Bitfinex...
    - ReadTheLicense 4y ago
      Did you read the communication from before it was implemented? The largest talking point was getting money from El Salvadorans living outside the country back home (because the traditional banking system is failing them), not making capital gains from BTC.
      - shyn3 4y ago
        I've heard from Sri Lankan families in Canada that they are doing the same.
    - yesUgotit 4y ago
      Why do we care about attracting investors? Why does human agency have to be coupled to the patronizing view some white trash ape in a suit who “is wealthy” due to some past choices of dubious truth? Can we break the mental model of needing missionaries spreading the appropriate spoken traditions and gospels? Coins as totems of power and bank statements as scripture; to the flames with such thinking. I don’t owe deference to the sensibilities and figurative identity of some far off Ferengi babbling about their rules; I have no obligation to whatever set of principles grip their sensibilities. The world is not “a vacuum”. Other people are not abstract agents to gather into a flock… sorry corporation… and dictate utilitarian effort to.
      - ReadTheLicense 4y ago
        We care about attracting investors because the country is full of people dying due to not enough monetary resources both for the state and for individuals.
  - arinlen 4y ago
    > The point was never to make capital gains on the Bitcoin investment. If your personal assertion was true then why did they picked Bitcoin over any of the myriad of better options already available in crypto?
    - ReadTheLicense 4y ago
      I disagree that there was a better crypto than Bitcoin. It's very much a long and very technical discussion that I can't afford right now, but I wanted you to know that your opinion is not universal - it's much less clear cut than "there was a better crypto, why not use it?".
  - yunohn 4y ago
    How… exactly? Really curious how holding Bitcoin helps attract investors in a general sense.
    - shyn3 4y ago
      Because the currency of that country is crazy risky. Same in Turkey. I've heard Venezuela people convert their money to BTC right away. Inflation is so crazy your $2 can be worth $1 in 24 hours. Bitcoin protects from those massive spikes. As bad as Bitcoin sounds it's perfect for them because now the corrupt governments can't take advantage of their citizenry. You could go with Ethereum or other crypto but those aren't really decentralized.
      - yunohn 4y ago
        Governments use non-local currencies for trade investment, not as an investment. They’re not paying for anything in BTC, just holding. Non-resident citizens don’t need the gov to hold BTC to be able to exchange it amongst themselves - case in point, all the other govs that don’t hold BTC/etc.
imtringued 4y ago
By Fiaters you mean people trading goods and services and running the real economy or what?
dkobia 4y ago
A few “fiat takes” on El Salvador to compare this blog post to: - https://foreignpolicy.com/2022/07/22/el-salvador-debt-imf-economy-bukele-us-sanctions/ https://foreignpolicy.com/2022/07/22/el-salvador-debt-imf-ec... - https://www.cnbc.com/2022/06/25/el-salvador-bitcoin-experiment-not-saving-countrys-finances.html https://www.cnbc.com/2022/06/25/el-salvador-bitcoin-experime...

Obviously they couldn't admit that it is in part thanks to Bitcoin. But fiaters gonna fiat, what can you do.

kadoban 4y ago

Didn't the Bitcoin part just obviously lose money? They bought in near the maximum price ever.

ReadTheLicense 4y ago
The point was never to make capital gains on the Bitcoin investment. The point was to make the economy interesting to foreign investors and bring in their money.
- peoplefromibiza 4y ago
  which clearly is not the case quoting the IMF el Salvador team This has a lot to do with the pick-up in external demand, and El Salvador’s response to the pandemic. Though it is one of the most densely populated countries in Latin America, El Salvador had one of the lowest reported rates of COVID-19 infections and fatalities in the region and has a relatively high vaccination rate.
  - jinpa_zangpo 4y ago
    The same president that made bitcoin El Salvador's legal currency also managed the growth of the economy and its response to the Covid-19 pandemic. Nayib Bukele is the most interesting politician in America today.
    - peoplefromibiza 4y ago
      > The same president that made bitcoin El Salvador's legal currency also managed the growth of the economy rebound after COVID has been common in many parts of the World Mt country have grown 7% after years of zero/negative growth It was managed by the same politicians that could not make it grow in the previous 20 years > Nayib Bukele is the most interesting politician in America today that says a lot about the state of politics in America...
      - shyn3 4y ago
        LBJsPNS 4y ago
        Please stop with the bullshit. And yes, if you're trying to claim Joe Biden doesn't know his own name, You're full of it.
        shyn3 4y ago
        arinlen 4y ago
        > I mean is it wrong to fathom he doesn't know his own name? Yes, it's pathetic. Please stop generating noise in an otherwise interesting discussion over El Salvador.
        shyn3 4y ago
        It's actually hilarious and a poor representation on the education system and the populace. Your other point is valid.
      - neither_color 4y ago
        He's also cut the homicide down to below some major US cities. The homicide rate fell from 38 per 100,000 to 18 per 100,000. Most people have only heard of him because of Bitcoin and so their own biases of Bitcoin cloud their judgment of Bukele. Locally he's a legend. He objectively handled Covid better than many countries around him(bested only by Costa Rica and Panama, which are already considered comparatively more developed than El Salvador). His foray into Bitcoin is considered a mistake of ambition not one of corruption. To put that into context the previous administration of El Salvador is accused of embezzling $300,000,000 USD. I wish more schadenfreude articles about El Salvador would include that fact.
- throw_m239339 4y ago
  The point of bitcoin is never bitcoin apparently... You do make the economy interesting to foreign investor by investing in infrastructure, education, safety... not buying bitcoin and making yourself hostage to companies such as Bitfinex...
  - ReadTheLicense 4y ago
    Did you read the communication from before it was implemented? The largest talking point was getting money from El Salvadorans living outside the country back home (because the traditional banking system is failing them), not making capital gains from BTC.
    - shyn3 4y ago
      I've heard from Sri Lankan families in Canada that they are doing the same.
  - yesUgotit 4y ago
    Why do we care about attracting investors? Why does human agency have to be coupled to the patronizing view some white trash ape in a suit who “is wealthy” due to some past choices of dubious truth? Can we break the mental model of needing missionaries spreading the appropriate spoken traditions and gospels? Coins as totems of power and bank statements as scripture; to the flames with such thinking. I don’t owe deference to the sensibilities and figurative identity of some far off Ferengi babbling about their rules; I have no obligation to whatever set of principles grip their sensibilities. The world is not “a vacuum”. Other people are not abstract agents to gather into a flock… sorry corporation… and dictate utilitarian effort to.
    - ReadTheLicense 4y ago
      We care about attracting investors because the country is full of people dying due to not enough monetary resources both for the state and for individuals.
- arinlen 4y ago
  > The point was never to make capital gains on the Bitcoin investment. If your personal assertion was true then why did they picked Bitcoin over any of the myriad of better options already available in crypto?
  - ReadTheLicense 4y ago
    I disagree that there was a better crypto than Bitcoin. It's very much a long and very technical discussion that I can't afford right now, but I wanted you to know that your opinion is not universal - it's much less clear cut than "there was a better crypto, why not use it?".
- yunohn 4y ago
  How… exactly? Really curious how holding Bitcoin helps attract investors in a general sense.
  - shyn3 4y ago
    Because the currency of that country is crazy risky. Same in Turkey. I've heard Venezuela people convert their money to BTC right away. Inflation is so crazy your $2 can be worth $1 in 24 hours. Bitcoin protects from those massive spikes. As bad as Bitcoin sounds it's perfect for them because now the corrupt governments can't take advantage of their citizenry. You could go with Ethereum or other crypto but those aren't really decentralized.
    - yunohn 4y ago
      Governments use non-local currencies for trade investment, not as an investment. They’re not paying for anything in BTC, just holding. Non-resident citizens don’t need the gov to hold BTC to be able to exchange it amongst themselves - case in point, all the other govs that don’t hold BTC/etc.

imtringued 4y ago

By Fiaters you mean people trading goods and services and running the real economy or what?

dkobia 4y ago

A few “fiat takes” on El Salvador to compare this blog post to: - https://foreignpolicy.com/2022/07/22/el-salvador-debt-imf-economy-bukele-us-sanctions/ https://foreignpolicy.com/2022/07/22/el-salvador-debt-imf-ec... - https://www.cnbc.com/2022/06/25/el-salvador-bitcoin-experiment-not-saving-countrys-finances.html https://www.cnbc.com/2022/06/25/el-salvador-bitcoin-experime...