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> A photo tweeted by a famous French physicist supposedly of Proxima Centauri by the James Webb Space Telescope was actually a slice of chorizo. > … > Klein t

> A photo tweeted by a famous French physicist supposedly of Proxima Centauri by the James Webb Space Telescope was actually a slice of chorizo. > … > Klein told French news outlet Le Point that his intention had been to educate people about fake news online While I respect the position that people should always check sources, “person famous in their field posts a lie about something well within their field, then tut tuts when people outside their field believe the expert” feels a bit too smug to me.

curiousgal 4y ago
He is French after all. /s (I'm half-French).
- deleted 4y ago
  [deleted]
belval 4y ago
I read your comment before seeing the picture so I somewhat agreed with you initially, but this is not even subtle, it's a good joke...
dalbasal 4y ago
IDK if it's that smug. It was just a prank/troll. Possibly, it got a bit more circulation than expected or was less obvious than expected. It feels kind of like a "ha! on your toes" style that translates poorly from personal into online media.
- sp332 4y ago
  As a prank, it's fine. But they tried to make it a lesson about fake news, which is not very useful.
  - s1artibartfast 4y ago
    I mean, it is a pretty good example of how fake news works. He said in the same thread it was fake. Tons of people retweeted the image without the greater context, and it still carried the authority of having been said by a renowned scientist.
rakoo 4y ago
Etienne Klein said in the second tweet that it was fake: https://nitter.rako.space/EtienneKlein/status/1553779203652435970#m https://nitter.rako.space/EtienneKlein/status/15537792036524...
carlmr 4y ago
>believe the expert According to his tweet it wasn't so much fake news, but appeal to authority he wanted to make people aware of. https://nitter.rako.space/EtienneKlein/status/1553779203652435970#m https://nitter.rako.space/EtienneKlein/status/15537792036524...
- unethical_ban 4y ago
  Appealing to authority is not wholly awful. In an instance of a low-risk decision (whether to trust an authority) it seems shitty for him to try to make this a lesson on it. If an Astronomer posts something to a bunch of people who know nothing about space and just like cool pictures, why taunt them with how they can't tell a zoomed-in chunk of fat from a sunspot?
  - s1artibartfast 4y ago
    Alternatively, don't believe everything you read.
    - diputsmonro 4y ago
      If we can't believe people who are experts in their field, who can we believe? That mindset damns the entire field of science communication and outreach Are we supposed to take the lesson that we should simply never believe anything? Just give up on the concept facts and objectivity and give in to the chaotic maelstrom? Or are we supposed to go out and build our own space telescopes to verify every piece of information for ourselves? Neither of those are tenable, we have to be able to trust some people some of the time. Frankly I think tricks like these just erode confidence in science and science communicators. How many people excitedly shared these cool space images with their friends, and now have to deal with the embarrassment of looking like a fool for trusting a legitimate authority? Are those people going to be as excited when the next batch of legit photos come out, or will they withdraw and lose their excitement for fear of being tricked again? You may laugh, but these kinds of experiences do determine people's, and society's, behavior. The goal of science communication is to educate and excite the public, and by extension, drive funding for new advancements. Smug gotchas like this actively impede that effort.
mytailorisrich 4y ago
The picture he posted is so obviously and visibly a slice of chorizo that it really is no more than a good joke, nothing smug about it. IMHO, it does demonstrate his point very well if some people took his statement that it was Proxima Centauri at face value simply because he is an expert.
- Ensorceled 4y ago
  It is not "obviously and visibly a slice of chorizo" to me ... google pictures of venus and it's not clear that this photo is in any way clearly a fake to a lay person.
  - mytailorisrich 4y ago
    A lay person will know chorizo much better than celestial bodies, at least in Europe. Of course there will always be someone to say they don't know what chorizo looks like but that's life... Otherwise we cannot do anything. Anyway, it's odd that people would argue on this instead of just laughing it off as "well played", but people argue over everything these days...
    - bee_rider 4y ago
      It must just be a cultural difference, as in the US all our meats are reduced to a fine pink homogenized sludge before being made into anything. Those lumps of fat or whatever -- unacceptable, and what is that a pepper seed? Too spicy! (Just kidding. Well, mostly kidding).
      - mytailorisrich 4y ago
        Perhaps. As an anecdotal data point, I showed the tweet with the picture to my wife (who has zero astronomy knowledge) without telling her anything and her immediate first reaction was "it looks like chorizo!".
  - imtringued 4y ago
    There is a huge difference between distinguishing fake artist rendition Venus from real Venus pictures and distinguishing a slice of sausage vs a celestial body. In the former the fake Venus is supposed to look like Venus. In the latter the sausage looks like nothing you can find in space.
poulpy123 4y ago
I'm pretty sure it was an a posteriori explanation for a joke that went wrong because journalists can't recognize a slice of chorizo
- s1artibartfast 4y ago
  I don't think it's fair to say that the joke went wrong. It certainly showed how gullible people are
  - BrandoElFollito 4y ago
    Why gullible? When you look at images of stars there are plenty of versions. This one looked plausible, backed by a scientist. He fucked up and does not have the balls to face the music
    - IshKebab 4y ago
      It's quite obviously not a star.
      - BrandoElFollito 4y ago
        Why? I am not a cosmologist and the images I see here and there are quite similar. Plus a physicist tells me that it is a new image of a star so why should I doubt? "Quite obviously" depends on your knowledge of the topic. Scientists are there to help us decide what is true and what is not - and not erode the limited trust we have in science already. If this was a picture of a pokemon - sure. But this round thing with red and white spots togather with a reasonable explanation was not funny at all.
    - s1artibartfast 4y ago
      It is plausible viewed in a two inch image on a smartphone with one sentence of description. If you look at it in any more depth is obviously not. Perhaps this is not the appropriate level of detail for communicating and understanding cosmology
addingnumbers 4y ago
> person famous in their field posts a lie about something well within their field This heavily implies Klein is involved with astronomy, which he is not.
lapcat 4y ago
In a strange way, this incident may demonstrate that science does work. One scientist said something dumb, was criticized for it, and was forced to retract in short order. Science is never just one person. There's no President or Pope of science. You can criticize any individual authority, no matter how prominent. Imagine if he continued to insist that the chorizo was a star in the face of severe criticism, and in fact used his power and influence to end the careers of anyone who refused to agree with him that the chorizo is a star. (This is of course an analogy to something.)

curiousgal 4y ago

He is French after all. /s (I'm half-French).

deleted 4y ago
[deleted]

belval 4y ago

I read your comment before seeing the picture so I somewhat agreed with you initially, but this is not even subtle, it's a good joke...

dalbasal 4y ago

IDK if it's that smug. It was just a prank/troll. Possibly, it got a bit more circulation than expected or was less obvious than expected. It feels kind of like a "ha! on your toes" style that translates poorly from personal into online media.

sp332 4y ago
As a prank, it's fine. But they tried to make it a lesson about fake news, which is not very useful.
- s1artibartfast 4y ago
  I mean, it is a pretty good example of how fake news works. He said in the same thread it was fake. Tons of people retweeted the image without the greater context, and it still carried the authority of having been said by a renowned scientist.

rakoo 4y ago

Etienne Klein said in the second tweet that it was fake: https://nitter.rako.space/EtienneKlein/status/1553779203652435970#m https://nitter.rako.space/EtienneKlein/status/15537792036524...

carlmr 4y ago

>believe the expert According to his tweet it wasn't so much fake news, but appeal to authority he wanted to make people aware of. https://nitter.rako.space/EtienneKlein/status/1553779203652435970#m https://nitter.rako.space/EtienneKlein/status/15537792036524...

unethical_ban 4y ago
Appealing to authority is not wholly awful. In an instance of a low-risk decision (whether to trust an authority) it seems shitty for him to try to make this a lesson on it. If an Astronomer posts something to a bunch of people who know nothing about space and just like cool pictures, why taunt them with how they can't tell a zoomed-in chunk of fat from a sunspot?
- s1artibartfast 4y ago
  Alternatively, don't believe everything you read.
  - diputsmonro 4y ago
    If we can't believe people who are experts in their field, who can we believe? That mindset damns the entire field of science communication and outreach Are we supposed to take the lesson that we should simply never believe anything? Just give up on the concept facts and objectivity and give in to the chaotic maelstrom? Or are we supposed to go out and build our own space telescopes to verify every piece of information for ourselves? Neither of those are tenable, we have to be able to trust some people some of the time. Frankly I think tricks like these just erode confidence in science and science communicators. How many people excitedly shared these cool space images with their friends, and now have to deal with the embarrassment of looking like a fool for trusting a legitimate authority? Are those people going to be as excited when the next batch of legit photos come out, or will they withdraw and lose their excitement for fear of being tricked again? You may laugh, but these kinds of experiences do determine people's, and society's, behavior. The goal of science communication is to educate and excite the public, and by extension, drive funding for new advancements. Smug gotchas like this actively impede that effort.

mytailorisrich 4y ago

The picture he posted is so obviously and visibly a slice of chorizo that it really is no more than a good joke, nothing smug about it. IMHO, it does demonstrate his point very well if some people took his statement that it was Proxima Centauri at face value simply because he is an expert.

Ensorceled 4y ago
It is not "obviously and visibly a slice of chorizo" to me ... google pictures of venus and it's not clear that this photo is in any way clearly a fake to a lay person.
- mytailorisrich 4y ago
  A lay person will know chorizo much better than celestial bodies, at least in Europe. Of course there will always be someone to say they don't know what chorizo looks like but that's life... Otherwise we cannot do anything. Anyway, it's odd that people would argue on this instead of just laughing it off as "well played", but people argue over everything these days...
  - bee_rider 4y ago
    It must just be a cultural difference, as in the US all our meats are reduced to a fine pink homogenized sludge before being made into anything. Those lumps of fat or whatever -- unacceptable, and what is that a pepper seed? Too spicy! (Just kidding. Well, mostly kidding).
    - mytailorisrich 4y ago
      Perhaps. As an anecdotal data point, I showed the tweet with the picture to my wife (who has zero astronomy knowledge) without telling her anything and her immediate first reaction was "it looks like chorizo!".
- imtringued 4y ago
  There is a huge difference between distinguishing fake artist rendition Venus from real Venus pictures and distinguishing a slice of sausage vs a celestial body. In the former the fake Venus is supposed to look like Venus. In the latter the sausage looks like nothing you can find in space.

poulpy123 4y ago

I'm pretty sure it was an a posteriori explanation for a joke that went wrong because journalists can't recognize a slice of chorizo

s1artibartfast 4y ago
I don't think it's fair to say that the joke went wrong. It certainly showed how gullible people are
- BrandoElFollito 4y ago
  Why gullible? When you look at images of stars there are plenty of versions. This one looked plausible, backed by a scientist. He fucked up and does not have the balls to face the music
  - IshKebab 4y ago
    It's quite obviously not a star.
    - BrandoElFollito 4y ago
      Why? I am not a cosmologist and the images I see here and there are quite similar. Plus a physicist tells me that it is a new image of a star so why should I doubt? "Quite obviously" depends on your knowledge of the topic. Scientists are there to help us decide what is true and what is not - and not erode the limited trust we have in science already. If this was a picture of a pokemon - sure. But this round thing with red and white spots togather with a reasonable explanation was not funny at all.
  - s1artibartfast 4y ago
    It is plausible viewed in a two inch image on a smartphone with one sentence of description. If you look at it in any more depth is obviously not. Perhaps this is not the appropriate level of detail for communicating and understanding cosmology

addingnumbers 4y ago

> person famous in their field posts a lie about something well within their field This heavily implies Klein is involved with astronomy, which he is not.

lapcat 4y ago

In a strange way, this incident may demonstrate that science does work. One scientist said something dumb, was criticized for it, and was forced to retract in short order. Science is never just one person. There's no President or Pope of science. You can criticize any individual authority, no matter how prominent. Imagine if he continued to insist that the chorizo was a star in the face of severe criticism, and in fact used his power and influence to end the careers of anyone who refused to agree with him that the chorizo is a star. (This is of course an analogy to something.)