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This is a really interesting take on it, because I was thinking it was the opposite of owning it. Or at least different to "owning it" in an important sense: th

This is a really interesting take on it, because I was thinking it was the opposite of owning it. Or at least different to "owning it" in an important sense: the thing that she's owning is some attribute that isn't intrinsic to her, and it's by it not defining her that she owns it. Traditional shame seems like some kind of permanent personal curse: child out of wedlock, feckless, poor, and so on. Having any of these qualities used to basically be an indelible part of your character, best hidden away from view. This modern shame is like an article of clothing: wear it well and it looks good, apologize for it and it looks bad (eg jeans with holes in them). You could say the same about any of the things I mentioned, turning it around: tireless fighter for her kids, work-smart-not-hard, rag-to-riches.

WalterBright 4y ago
Another example: Bob Hope owned his ski nose. He made it his trademark. Ahnold Schwarzenegger was told he had to lose the accent. Instead he owned it.
- dspillett 4y ago
  > Ahnold Schwarzenegger was told he had to lose the accent. Instead he owned it. It did stop him getting certain work when trying to get into acting though, because to urban Germans he “sounds a bit like a farmer”. For those familiar with UK accents: think west country (oive godda bran-new combine'arvester…). He could afford to pass on that work, rather than having to change himself, because he was already financially comfortable from his successful body-building career and having carefully managed & invested his income from that. For someone starting from nothing, standing by yourself and refusing to change, owning and controlling your identity on principal, can be a more difficult choice. Of course Schwarzenegger's move to the American film industry got around the accent problem quite nicely: to a non-German ear the association of parts of his accent with particular places/work doesn't exist. No slight on Schwarzenegger intended here, he worked himself into a position where he could take the risk of making those choices rather than being in a comfortable position from, for example, the luck of being born into wealthy circumstances.
  - WalterBright 4y ago
    Ahnold did start from nothing.
    - dspillett 4y ago
      He did, yes, as I thought I'd acknowledged. But not with respect to his acting career and therefore his accent, as referenced in the comment I was replying to. At that point in his life he was definitely not starting from nothing (though he was starting from a good position he had built for himself from an earlier nothing point). At the point of starting out in the film industry, he also had the benefit of his previous career giving him exposure to the complexities of contract negotiations and other such. They are not doubt a little different for Mr Universe compared to Mr Action Actor, but there would have been enough common ground for the experience to be useful to him.
  - ProjectArcturis 4y ago
    Here's Arnold doing an interview in German: https://youtu.be/z_OaPkR-rVs https://youtu.be/z_OaPkR-rVs To my American ears, it sounds like he still has the same accent!
    - dspillett 4y ago
      That is not uncommon. I've heard Brummies and Yorkshiremen speak Spanish in what to my untrained ears¹ sounded like pretty good fluency, but by eck you could tell where they were originally from! --- [1] passed GCSE Spanish nearly three decades ago, can just about remember how to state my name, age, birthplace, and order food & drink.
  - matwood 4y ago
    They did voice overs on one (some?) of his early movies when he was known as 'Arnold Strong'. It's weird watching them since I know how he should sound.
    - ido 4y ago

WalterBright 4y ago

Another example: Bob Hope owned his ski nose. He made it his trademark. Ahnold Schwarzenegger was told he had to lose the accent. Instead he owned it.

dspillett 4y ago
> Ahnold Schwarzenegger was told he had to lose the accent. Instead he owned it. It did stop him getting certain work when trying to get into acting though, because to urban Germans he “sounds a bit like a farmer”. For those familiar with UK accents: think west country (oive godda bran-new combine'arvester…). He could afford to pass on that work, rather than having to change himself, because he was already financially comfortable from his successful body-building career and having carefully managed & invested his income from that. For someone starting from nothing, standing by yourself and refusing to change, owning and controlling your identity on principal, can be a more difficult choice. Of course Schwarzenegger's move to the American film industry got around the accent problem quite nicely: to a non-German ear the association of parts of his accent with particular places/work doesn't exist. No slight on Schwarzenegger intended here, he worked himself into a position where he could take the risk of making those choices rather than being in a comfortable position from, for example, the luck of being born into wealthy circumstances.
- WalterBright 4y ago
  Ahnold did start from nothing.
  - dspillett 4y ago
    He did, yes, as I thought I'd acknowledged. But not with respect to his acting career and therefore his accent, as referenced in the comment I was replying to. At that point in his life he was definitely not starting from nothing (though he was starting from a good position he had built for himself from an earlier nothing point). At the point of starting out in the film industry, he also had the benefit of his previous career giving him exposure to the complexities of contract negotiations and other such. They are not doubt a little different for Mr Universe compared to Mr Action Actor, but there would have been enough common ground for the experience to be useful to him.
- ProjectArcturis 4y ago
  Here's Arnold doing an interview in German: https://youtu.be/z_OaPkR-rVs https://youtu.be/z_OaPkR-rVs To my American ears, it sounds like he still has the same accent!
  - dspillett 4y ago
    That is not uncommon. I've heard Brummies and Yorkshiremen speak Spanish in what to my untrained ears¹ sounded like pretty good fluency, but by eck you could tell where they were originally from! --- [1] passed GCSE Spanish nearly three decades ago, can just about remember how to state my name, age, birthplace, and order food & drink.
- matwood 4y ago
  They did voice overs on one (some?) of his early movies when he was known as 'Arnold Strong'. It's weird watching them since I know how he should sound.
  - ido 4y ago