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Democrats are realizing they must become more moderate
- nazgulsenpai 4y agohttps://archive.ph/Ewax6 https://archive.ph/Ewax6
- bediger4000 4y ago
- batch12 4y ago> Republicans stormed the US capital. Do they get any lectures? Almost daily during the congressional discussions and by several news outlets.
- presshardreset 4y ago
- batch12 4y ago>Yah, definitely... They totally think what they did is wrong and display regret and remorse, yup... Are you changing what I replied to mid-thread?
- presshardreset 4y ago
- batch12 4y ago
- presshardreset 4y ago
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- hanniabu 4y agoSo we'll have a right party and a far-right party. This is looking more gloom every year.
- shrimp_emoji 4y agoJust recalibrate your scale.
- hanniabu 4y agoThat's exactly what's happening and why a portion of the country no longer sees any issues with changes being made to to create an authoritarian government
- yesco 4y agoWhat specific trump era republican policies make them more authoritarian than the progressive era democrat ones?
- happytoexplain 4y agoThe parent's chosen word, "policy", is strong I think. I would say "position" or "attitude". E.g. encouraging/praising/wanting things like undue violence against protestors, news censorship, and election overturning - things in that vein.
- yesco 4y agoBut policy is a genuine materialization of their powers vs what people believe they will do with them. For all his faults I struggle to understand how Trump was in any way "Authoritarian"/ "Fascist" when his policies did not reflect that position, at least relative to his opponents. I find this rhetoric concerning since it isn't all that different than the hysteria about Obama's "FEMA camps" and when republicans just kept calling him Hitler over every little thing. It's fundamentally disconnected from reality and I personally see it a consequence of consuming too much propaganda. You might counter this with the whole "election overturning" thing but at the end of the day, he stepped down and stopped being president when he lost, even if his whining still persists.
- turnitoffandon 4y ago
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- sk8terboi 4y ago
- mberning 4y agoThis will get flagged to death. But in the meantime, surveys have shown that the right and left have shifted further from the center over the last 20 years. The left has had a much more dramatic swing than the right. I think the left could easily adopt a few of the issues that the right is currently championing and take full control of the government.
- michaelmrose 4y agoOn the morning after the insurrection around 45% of Republicans were supportive of the violent attempt to overthrow our government. We have courts and politicians not only wanting to kill abortion rights in states they control but prevent people from crossing state lines to get abortions and removing opposing exceptions for rape or even the life of the mother. Secession is a fairly mainstream position among republicans, held by 2/3 of southern republicans. 4 in 10 support violence to put the other side down or achieve independence. A conservative court has found that there is no right to privacy in the constitution and affirmed that stare decisis is dead while opining that the court went too far not only in affirming abortion rights but in protecting gay and even interracial marriage laws, and even gay sex. This means that basically any prior case that was decided in a way that deviates from present conservative thinking is on the menu. Before it was merely abhorrent that a minority among the supreme court believes Texas has a right to criminalize gay sex in Lawrence v Texas. Now they can if they choose merely redo that one. So that's whats going on with the red team now please do explicate how the left has undergone a more radical swing. I don't see an idea more radical than tax the rich and give everyone health care with more than single digit support.
- happytoexplain 4y agoYou're right, but taken literally, the parent is describing a relative measure (the size of a swing), and one could make an argument that, on a ten point extremity scale, Republicans have swung from 7 to 9 and Democrats have swung from 2 to 6 (to choose arbitrary numbers).
- michaelmrose 4y ago
- Barrera 4y ago> ... Given the sorry state of Mr Biden’s approval ratings—by some measures, the worst at this point of a first term of any president since the 1950s—and woeful perceptions of the economy, it is unlikely that the tentative steps that Democrats are taking back towards the median voter will be enough to avert the serious electoral losses that they are facing. It is only after a serious drubbing that the descent from peak progressive will gain speed. Better it be in 2022 than in 2024. In this entire article, just one mention of the word "inflation." In 1992 Democratic strategist James Carville coined the expression "It's the economy, stupid." He was talking about then-incumbent George HW Bush's inability to do anything substantive to relieve the economic pain the country was going through. https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/It%27s_the_economy,_stupid https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/It%27s_the_economy,_stupid Looks like Dems will be on the receiving end of "It's the economy, stupid" this time.
- voisin 4y agoI am not sure what Biden could have done to fix the economy based on what he inherited. Interest rates should have risen a long time prior to his inauguration. The costly War on Terror should have ended with Bush’s presidency. Trump shouldn’t have moved so aggressively to alienate trading partners and exit free trade agreements.
- perfecthjrjth 4y agoIndeed! Under Obama's second term, Janet Yellen did not want to raise interest rates to help Obama. However, during Trump's term, she wanted to raise interest rates, an event which Trump did not like; that's why Trump replaced her with Powell.
- frumper 4y agoHe asked the American people to vote for him knowing he was walking into a mess. I don’t think these problems are his fault and he had been hampered by both parties in implementing any of his plans to fix it. At the end of the day though, how is giving him 4 more years a good idea? He’s ineffective. He should let another Democrat run so they can at least claim they have the right plan to fix things.
- mturmon 4y agoThey are choosing to peg the article to the SF recall, where there were competency issues as well as political valence. Even more relevant are the elections in the East Bay that returned progressive candidates, and the mayoral election in LA where the business oriented faux Democrat lost heavily to Karen Bass, who is significantly to his left.
- GenerocUsername 4y agoIn the replies: democrats who disagree
- presshardreset 4y ago[flagged]
- GenerocUsername 4y agoYou posted it
- happytoexplain 4y agoIs there something wrong with being a Democrat and disagreeing with the article, or are you saying that the disagreement is a sign that that article is wrong?
- yucky 4y agoDisagreeing is one thing, flagging an article from The Economist is something else, and really pulls the mask down..
- fullshark 4y agoI remember similar stories about the Republicans pre-Trump. Guys like Graham and Rubio tried pushing things like bipartisan immigration reform and it backfired spectacularly as the base revolted and the party became anti-globalist/populist. Current democratic leadership seems woefully out of touch with its base's concerns, and the coalition seems to basically be "anti-Trumpism" not pro anything. Seems like the democrats need a left-wing equivalent of a "revolution" to get the base back cause right now they are offering basically nothing accept "we aren't those republicans who you hate." Basically Democrats need an actual leader since the only person who could unite the party right now: Obama, doesn't seem to care at all anymore and everyone else is just after career preservation.
- bryanlarsen 4y agoDemocrats have always only stood for "anti-Republican". They're a big tent party held together only by their opposition to the Republicans. This is less so now than it was in the past now that the Dixecrats have left the Democrats.
- happytoexplain 4y agoI hear this description constantly about both sides, but I think I hear it more often about Republicans. Regardless, there may be truth to it, but it's basically useless in conversation.
- nitwit005 4y agoA liberal party is impossible in the US political system at the moment. The rural areas are strongly advantaged by design, and have a strong conservative lean. Unsurprisingly, the Democrats are already basically a moderate party.
- IndoorPatio 4y agoYes, democrats span center-left to center-right. If one is looking for a "centrist" or "moderate" political party in the US, it is the democratic party.
- andy-x 4y agoThis is pure BS. The self-appointed progessives/wokes are not moderate or centrist in any way, but they have huge influence over Democrats' policy. And they will be responsible for the Democrats' losses in the following years.
- salawat 4y agoOne's "advantaged by design" is another's "what you want doesn't work here". Different ways for different slices of life. Who'd'a thunk it?
- nitwit005 4y agoNo. They deliberately set up the constitution to favor the less populous states, and state constitutions largely did the same. If you actually poll people on individual issues, rural people often agree with the Democrats. The parties aren't particularly representative of people's underlying opinions.
- kcplate 4y agoThe problem is with those polling questions that support Democratic Party issues is they are generally describing significantly softer positions than the democrats actual positions. Abortion is a good example. A majority of people when polled, will agree with abortion access being important. However, that support falls apart if you caveat the question “to provide access beyond the age of fetal viability and possibly all the way up to birth”. This is the Democratic Party’s actual position. Prior to viability, there might be majority support, but post viability and up to birth people are about 75-90% against.
- mtkhaos 4y agoHorse shoe theory. If you go far enough right you have all the same concerns of an state ran communist state. Small group of people pulling the strings only difference is allotments vs rent/lease/mortage/debt. The fear has been that if you go left, you won't own anything. But then introduce companies like Blockrock that take advantage of owned assets during inflation to leverage more debt to outpace the consumers ability to buy their own assets. So becoming more moderate it to admit something. This isn't about having a well function economy that is based on innovation. This is just speculative meta game that has ursped innovation itself as a profit mode. This doesn't include the impact of global trade and the ultimate effect on an economy that doesn't produce anything for itself. We need factories that can make goods to the exact needs of the user. Not arbitrary mass manufacturing that only winds up in the landfill on a couple years. Want something endless to drive the economy that doesn't rely on making endless junk? Look at the mobile game industry, digital goods, entertainment, blueprints and simulated protypes. Going "right," does not trend towards progress. The democrats must become more "conservative." The fundamental flaw of speculation is the reliance on previous investments and the inability to liquidate to switch towards renewables.. etc... etc...
- mihaic 4y agoObserving from Europe, US politics seems like an extreme case of identifying with the opposite of the enemy. Over several cycles of oversimplifaction, each party simply takes some position from the other, and vocally proclaims the opposite, regardless if there was some truth lost along the way. What's surprising is the tone of the pro-Democrats responses here: vitriolic but without real substance except whataboutism aimed at republicans. HN is the highest quality online agora I know, which to me is hinting that even the upper ranks of US voters are caught in this process.
- jaredcwhite 4y agoPolitics in this country have become upside down and backwards. To my mind, AOC is a moderate. Joe Manchin is an extremist. And calls for Democrats to become "more moderate" must inevitably mean that actually-moderate Democrats would better align themselves with cynical political movements which provide thinly-veiled cover for alt-right/MAGA propaganda and unfettered crony capitalism. Abso-f'n-lutely not.