42 ms·

Love Song to Costco

366 points by lxm 4y ago

Wistar 4y ago
I really like that piece.
wude935 4y ago
As a child of AAPI immigrants, this piece really hit home, especially when the author mentioned how the struggles of her parent’s generation impacted the way she was raised.
edmcnulty101 4y ago
As a native born and poor American without any parents I feel the same way going to Costco. Its miraculous. After being homeless a few times as a native born American I still feel like showers are the ultimate luxury. I'm always happy to see immigrants with jobs in America and Europe but I can't help but wonder what can we do to make other countries as desirable as America? Theres billions of people. Why aren't their countries desirable as well? Why is North America and Europe the main destination for the entire world to wish to immigrate to? Why doesn't almost any country in Africa South and Central America, Asia, and India continents have immigration problems and what can we all do to make it desirable for people to want to be in their homes?
- lotsofpulp 4y ago
  Because they are higher trust societies with less low level corruption, allowing one to have more peace of mind in day to day life. Simply going out in a vehicle is magnitudes riskier in the country my parents come from. My whole extended family can afford maids, cooks, and drivers, yet they all moved because they wanted a lower volatility life for their children, even if it meant doing your own laundry, cleaning, cooking, and driving.
  - elbigbad 4y ago
    Can you say more? My spouses family was same, I go visit them in their country and they have lavish wealth (comparatively to others in the country) and maids and cooks and such. But they moved to developed nations like AUS, US, and UK.
    - lotsofpulp 4y ago
      Less worry about needing to bribe, especially for everyday stuff. Less worry about getting shaken down by cops. Stable governments with government insured bank accounts and money that loses purchasing power at a much slower rate. Ability (and threat) of the court system to potentially right a wrong.
    - dominotw 4y ago
      better air quality.
  - wyldfire 4y ago
    > higher trust societies with less low level corruption Without a doubt this seems like a big/major factor. But we have corruption in the US. Do we have less corruption because of enforcement of anti-corruption laws? Or do we have those laws and an expectation that they're enforced because of some other factors? Not rhetorical, I just don't know. Casually it seems like many European countries have the same or greater expectations and similar prosperity. When I read stories about Russia and the former Soviet republics it makes me think that there's so much mistrust and hopelessness that a corrupt government is taken for granted. I have no idea whether or not the US is exceptional but if it is I wouldn't jump to describe it as virtuous. But I do wish I could understand what policies we could pursue that might make other societies similarly high trust.
    - lotsofpulp 4y ago
      > Do we have less corruption because of enforcement of anti-corruption laws? Or do we have those laws and an expectation that they're enforced because of some other factors? Neither answer is complete. Laws and enforcement can only go so far. It is not feasible to police every single interaction between people. My amateur hypothesis would be a combination of a wealth of resources, growth outlook, shared struggles, traditions and cultural outlooks that provide utility and propagate downstream, etc. Probably impossible to intentionally recreate. And of course, very possible to lose. If everyone in society decides they want to screw each other, then no amount of laws will help. Unfortunately, in many societies, the game is very adversarial with dire consequences, and you have to play that way. On the other hand, a society where people are mostly out to engage in good faith transactions can greatly benefit from reduced friction, enabling more transactions and each actor wasting less energy in preventing themselves from being screwed.
    - toast0 4y ago
      > Do we have less corruption because of enforcement of anti-corruption laws? Or do we have those laws and an expectation that they're enforced because of some other factors? I think there's an expectation that at least egregious corruption will be enforced against; typically in a court of law, but if not, in the court of public opinion. But also, petty bribes are offensive to be offered or demanded. There's a sense that bribing your way out of a minor offense is a more serious crime than whatever the offense was. There's still higher level corruption, regulatory capture and all that, and other cases of interested parties making decisions with conflicts of interest. Those are trickier than bribes.
  - formerkrogemp 4y ago
    > Because they are higher trust societies with less low level corruption, allowing one to have more peace of mind in day to day life. Certainly this is a factor, but let's not forget the decades of destabilizing influence, coups, assassinations, wars, sanctions, and foreign policy promulgated by the US to keep some countries poor to maintain US interests.
    - edmcnulty101 4y ago
      I didn't see where the US interfered with China or India's elections. I didn't see where the US interfered with Mexico's elections. Those are a huge portion of the immigrants to the U.S if not the majority.
  - teddyh 4y ago
    > Because they are higher trust societies with less low level corruption https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Corruption_Perceptions_Index https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Corruption_Perceptions_Index (Also, if you are comparing places, don’t forget to also consult https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Democracy_Index https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Democracy_Index)
    - skinnymuch 4y ago
      These sort of things should have more transparent and correct naming. Corruption is high as can be in the west too. It’s just mostly lobbying so the average person doesn’t have safety concerns. Something like stability, comfort, and safety concerns makes much more sense. Or as quoted, less low level corruption works too. The Democracy Index being done by The Economist and being used as a respectable index to look at is pretty funny, but in line with the status quo. How many low end countries in these indexes have been used and abused by the western countries liberal/conservative political regimes The Economist, its ownership, and many of its readers love? Sadly, dozens upon dozens upon dozens.
  - edmcnulty101 4y ago
    What can we do to make India, Africa, Asia, and South/Central America filled with high trust societies like Europe, North America, and Australia? And keep these current high trust societies trust from continuing to be eroded? On the front page of HN at the same time this article is. https://news.ycombinator.com/item?id=32050417 https://news.ycombinator.com/item?id=32050417
    - lotsofpulp 4y ago
      The simplest answer is that good, capable people need to participate in the civic process. Not just voting every year. Running for office, campaigning, donating, knocking on doors, participating and starting civic organizations, having children, raising those children with the proper values. Unfortunately, a lot of that can be undone by things like lack of resources, which means things like securing your own or your tribe’s future is more important than advancing everyone’s. It is possible that those in developed, stable countries are simply lucky enough to be at the right place at the right time. As boundary conditions and parameters change, the situation can evolve or devolve with little control.
      - edmcnulty101 4y ago
        The countries in Europe, North America, and Australia were all in the right place at the right time. While the countries in Africa, Indian, Asia, and South America weren't. That's one possible explanation.
- prostoalex 4y ago
  > what can we all do to make it desirable for people to want to be in their homes? Great book on the subject is https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Why_Nations_Fail https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Why_Nations_Fail It explores precisely this phenomenon - why certain places that have geographic proximity (Dominican Republic and Haiti, Nogales AZ and Nogales Sonora) drifted so far away from one another economically, why some places with vast natural resources (Nigeria) are undesirable while some other countries with limited natural resources (Japan, Singapore) are economic successes.
- pm90 4y ago
  > Theres billions of people. Why aren't their countries desirable as well? Because whenever they have political systems that promote stability or justice, those leaders are overthrown in favor of those who will obey diktaks of the IMF/World Bank/WTO which generally promote privatization and wealth concentration. So other countries are desirable but have low social/economic mobility.
  - Panzer04 4y ago
    By and large, the problem is unfortunately the reverse. If you have resources, your government ends up either an corrupt, nepotistic authoritarian hellhole or a corrupt, nepotistic socialist paradise (until the oil/gold/diamonds/gas run out, at which point it becomes a corrupt, nepotistic authoritarian hellhole) Most countries have the problem of corrupt, nepotistic governments that look after the insiders at the expense of the rest of the population - subsidies for their mates, tariffs on overseas imports the help your friend but screw an industry, etc. The simplest way of avoiding the most destructive consequences of bad governance is often to just remove the government from the equation.
    - usrn 4y ago
      That didn't seem to happen in the Nordic countries.
      - jahewson 4y ago
        They had strong governments long before they discovered their natural resource (oil).
  - foogazi 4y ago
    > Because whenever they have political systems that promote stability or justice, those leaders are overthrown in favor of those who will obey diktaks of the IMF/World Bank/WTO simplistic reasoning, but IMF was funded in 1945 - what’s your explanation for the previous 20 centuries?
    - 4y ago
- wyager 4y ago
  > Why aren't their countries desirable as well? See e.g. National IQ and Economic Development: A Study of Eighty-One Nations, by Lynn and Vanhanen. There is a superlinear relationship between average IQ and GDPPC. Research precludes a predominant causal relationship from GDPPC to IQ (e.g. via Flynn effect); all that is left is that population intelligence causally precedes GDPPC.
- Panzer04 4y ago
  Mostly less stable governance, often with less protection of private rights (though obviously most of these countries are just poorer as well). If you have no assets, it’s also far easier to make money in a rich country and move back rich, rather than the reverse.
- throwamon 4y ago
  > Why aren't their countries desirable as well? Yup, that would be pretty nice. If only America would let them. https://en.m.wikipedia.org/wiki/United_States_involvement_in_regime_change https://en.m.wikipedia.org/wiki/United_States_involvement_in... https://en.m.wikipedia.org/wiki/American_exceptionalism https://en.m.wikipedia.org/wiki/American_exceptionalism https://en.m.wikipedia.org/wiki/Imperialism https://en.m.wikipedia.org/wiki/Imperialism https://en.m.wikipedia.org/wiki/United_States_war_crimes https://en.m.wikipedia.org/wiki/United_States_war_crimes https://en.m.wikipedia.org/wiki/Manufacturing_Consent https://en.m.wikipedia.org/wiki/Manufacturing_Consent
  - unethical_ban 4y ago
    I just had my bike stolen from me in broad daylight. I said to myself "this is the kind of thing that happens in Brazil, not here".
    - mise_en_place 4y ago
      Sorry to hear that. Costco has a nice selection of bikes for you to choose from.
  - TulliusCicero 4y ago
    > Yup, that would be pretty nice. If only America would let them. And yet, if you ask people actually from those countries, rarely will they pin Uncle Sam as the primary reason they're still not well developed.
  - edmcnulty101 4y ago
    I didn't see where the US interfered with China or India's elections. I didn't see where the US interfered with Mexico's elections. Those are a huge portion of the immigrants to the U.S if not the majority.
- toast0 4y ago
  > Why doesn't almost any country in Africa South and Central America, Asia, and India continents have immigration problems and what can we all do to make it desirable for people to want to be in their homes? Some countries do have immigration problems and emmigration problems. If they're more desirable than nearby countries, but not nearly as desirable as US/EU, then they'll pull in their neighbors, potentially too much at times, but still have those with resources leaving when they can. IMHO, things people are looking for are physical safety, political stability, economic stability and opportunity, legal stability (rule of law, predictable courts, timely access to courts, reasonable law enforcement). The top reasons people I hear people say they come to the US are because it's unsafe for them where they live, or to have the opportunity to make more money.
- akomtu 4y ago
  Here is an unscientific explanation. NA and EU are populated by older souls: some of them see the value of giving, while others, who've chosen the wrong path, are adepts at scheming; but both are similar in their maturity. The less mature souls are still busy with mastering their emotions and their nations are too chaotic for this reason: they either fall apart without a leader, or when a mature leader presents itself, they have to be ruled by an iron fist (China, India). Eventually the focus will shift to another place on Earth: the most advanced will move on there and America will join the long list of empires that were once great, but that event is still a thousand years away.
- lbrito 4y ago
gumby 4y ago
My great grandfather moved to a different part of Asia and never went back. My grandfather moved elsewhere and never went back. My mother moved to another continent and then later, with my father, to a third, where I partially grew up. And I moved to yet another continent (with another emigrée), speaking a language that, like my mother, I had learned after growing up. Yet today I spoke English with a stranger, a woman born to Indian immigrants and she spoke with the same hand gestures I do.
- deleted 4y ago
  [deleted]
- smugma 4y ago
  Sounds like the beginning of a true love story.
  - deleted 4y ago
    [deleted]
- godelmachine 4y ago
  Did you ask her out for a coffee?
- permo-w 4y ago
  what does this have to do with Costco?
  - gumby 4y ago
    Thanks for asking if it wasn’t clear. The article used Costco as a vehicle for exploring the experience, and yet so some degree trauma, of moving away from your birthplace. I read it through the lens of a common belief that Asian families in particular are very close and don’t handle migration well. I mentioned my story because it’s a contradictory example, but also because I believe that the belief that somehow “Asians” can’t handle family separation is not correct — I believe all people have roughly the same percentage of “gotta stay here” and “gotta go somewhere else” — it’s just human nature. The last part of my story also relates to the Costco article: despite a lot of time there I never lived in India, nor, thanks to the laws and attitudes of where I was born did I speak much of any Asian languages with my mother yet decades later I, and some American woman of Indian decent whom I’d never met before, used the same body language and gestures while speaking. Where did that come from?
jnord 4y ago
Great story, thanks for sharing!
W-Stool 4y ago
In 2005 my wife and I lived in a part of the USA that had no Costco within a half day's drive. We soon secured jobs in a part of the USA that had two (two!) Costcos in the same city that we would live. True story - before we even looked for housing, I went online and joined Costco. Years later my diabetic cat even had a Costco pharmacy account (best place to buy insulin by far) and received a discount for being without health insurance.
- SOLAR_FIELDS 4y ago
  I have a Costco account and a Sam's Club (Walmart's Costco equivalent) account. Even though I do something like 98% of my bulk shopping at Sam's club (due to proximity, the Costco is ~ 15 min drive away vs 5 mins for the Sam's club), it's still worth it for me to hold the Costco membership for specific purchases. Notably I've purchased (because there's no better place to buy these things and the vendor vetting is amazing) bedsheets, smart thermostats & a sauna from Costco over the last year and those have easily made back the $60 USD it cost me to buy the membership. I'll probably end up buying a gazebo kit from Costco sometime in the next year. I think for semi-big purchases ($USD 200 to $USD $20,000) as a consumer Costco has huge value. The vendor vetting thing may not be as important when it comes to a bag of chips, but when it comes to a $4,000 gazebo or some $2,000 appliance I have really come to trust Costco's vetting.
  - Akronymus 4y ago
    > (due to proximity, the Costco is ~ 15 min drive away vs 5 mins for the Sam's club) this kinda makes me... sad, I guess? Just how embedded the need to drive is for america. (As in, having to drive, rather than being able to) Just such a different culture from what I know.
  - cyberge99 4y ago
    Costco also works out deals to sell “special” revisions of major brand offerings. One example is a Sony Bravia that has a physical microphone disable switch.
    - 4y ago
throwawayarnty 4y ago
Amazing how much China has changed over the past 60 years. From backwards and famined to a global super power.
- pirate787 4y ago
  Really the progress started with Deng Xiaoping, so just in the last 45 years. But China has 20% of all humanity, so really just stepping back into its rightful place after the disaster of Maoism.
- deleted 4y ago
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- speed_spread 4y ago
  But are there Costcos in China? Also, do people in China get out of the city to go camping for the weekend? These are honest questions I'd like to have answers for.
  - mchaver 4y ago
    > But are there Costcos in China? Yes, I know there is one in Shanghai. https://www.costco.com.cn https://www.costco.com.cn > Also, do people in China get out of the city to go camping for the weekend? I am not sure about camping, but glamping is popular with young people. https://edition.cnn.com/travel/article/glamping-china-trend-cmb-intl-hnk/index.html https://edition.cnn.com/travel/article/glamping-china-trend-...
  - merlyn 4y ago
    Yes, Costcos, Sam's Clubs. Ikea. Carrefour. Walmart. Apple. Oppo stores. Probably not around at the time that the article's author's parents emigrated. There are people doing more of the outdoor thing in China now. Probably none going about 20 years back. Last time I was there, there were recreational bicyclists (ie. taking them off the back of their car) in the cities, as opposed to my first visits where many more bicycles for their comute than cars.
    - 4y ago
jamiek88 4y ago
Costco blew my tiny little mind when I was fresh off the boat too!
atlgator 4y ago
I wish Costco still had early entry for elderly and disabled. That was really nice during the pandemic.
- brewdad 4y ago
  Somewhere there's a grandma that still has a garage full of toilet paper thanks to getting in the door early.
notkurt 4y ago
Did anyone else read Costco as Contoso first? Or am I the only one holding out for a love song dedicated to Contoso
- vxNsr 4y ago
  You’ve spent too much time reading Microsoft documentation
- walrus01 4y ago
  Apparently Microsoft keeps the domain for contoso.net and contoso.com registered and its mx receives a vast quantity of mail from misconfigured things out in the wild.
- avgDev 4y ago
  I too have attended the Contoso university.
lbrito 4y ago
Haven't read the piece yet, but I definitely will - for a long time I would like to understand why people are so enamored with Costco. I recently joined because they have some good food that is hard or more expensive to find elsewhere, but that's about it. To me it's just a store. Outside of the US/Canada I've never seen people evangelize a store so much.
- kvark 4y ago
  For me, it’s a modern equivalent of the soviet stores. There is no 10 kinds of everything, but the ones available are guaranteed to be fairly good quality and at an affordable price. Speaking more modern, it saves the mental effort of researching choices. Need something? Check Costco, buy if there, done. Of course there are negatives associated with them, too.
  - el-salvador 4y ago
    PriceSmart, (Costco's Latin American cousin), does something similar too. They research/test the products before selling them so that they comply with their quality standards. So once products are on the shelves its likely that they are good. This make buying decisions easier. Which is a much better shopping experience than having to read a dozen product reviews while shopping online.
  - inferiorhuman 4y ago
    > the ones available are guaranteed to be fairly good quality and at an affordable price I bought into the hype and got a Costco membership a few years back. One of the first things I went looking for was whole bean coffee (Peet's xmas roast). The local Costco had a bunch of coffee from Starbucks and Peets (meh quality to start) but only the painfully dark roasts and all of it was ground. Pre-ground coffee in bulk has a pretty limited use case (and relatively short shelf life). Fast forward to last week and I went looking for a new fridge at Costco dot com. They prominently featured LG (ugh) and Samsung refrigerators. While some LG models seem to review pretty well I've never seen anyone say anything positive about Samsung, their service, or the serviceability of their appliances. I'm in the middle of dealing with a defective LG fridge and that's about the nicest thing I can say about LG's warranty and customer support. Costco may have a permissive return policy and decent customer support but I would never blindly buy something without doing a bit of research just because it's at Costco. Especially with a big ticket item like a fridge I'd rather use my Amex anyhow.
ernestns 4y ago
In some areas where it can be costly to import goods, like Hawaii, Costco tends to be one of few reliable stores to find products at relatively reduced prices. With this type of reputation, it's understandable why their following is loyal and enthusiastic.
tomc1985 4y ago
divbzero 4y ago
I’ve always had a gut feeling that Costco’s customers represent a broader swath of socioeconomic diversity than most other stores. Don’t know how true that is and would love to learn if there’s real data behind it.
- caymanjim 4y ago
  Minor anecdotal evidence, but I live in a small semi-rural/semi-suburban town in NJ, and Costco appears to have a full cross-section of people. It does seem slightly more economically-diverse than the regular grocery and retail stores, in that you'll see a lot more rich people (by virtue of driving Porsches and Mercedes) at Costco than you will at Walmart.
- insightcheck 4y ago
  Business Insider hired an analytics firm named Numerator to create a report that finds on the average Costco customer [0]. I couldn't find the original data or report in Business Insider's summary, but from its article: "Numerator found that Costco's typical shopper in the US is an Asian American woman between 35 and 44 years old who is married and living in a city in the Pacific Northwest. (Costco was founded in Seattle and is based in Washington.) She typically has a four-year degree or higher level of education and earns more than $125,000 a year." I'm not sure whether the income of the "typical shopper" was defined based on a median or mode, so there could well be a large variance of customers with a lower socioeconomic status. A separate article by Investopedia [1] also asserts that Costco mostly opens stores in affluent suburban areas, and originally targeted college-educated and financially wealthier customers. So, Costco's customers are likely skewed to have a higher socioeconomic status, based on the location of most of its stores in wealthier suburban areas and findings from an analytics report (with some skepticism towards the article about the report, as the raw data and methods weren't shared, as far as I could see). [0] https://www.businessinsider.com/typical-costco-shopper-demographic-asian-american-woman-earning-high-income-2021-7 https://www.businessinsider.com/typical-costco-shopper-demog... [1] https://www.investopedia.com/articles/insights/061516/whats-average-costco-consumer-cost.asp https://www.investopedia.com/articles/insights/061516/whats-...
  - 4y ago
rdl 4y ago
My favorite Costco is in Iceland: a place where things are normally absurdly expensive, and Costco Iceland is merely somewhat expensive. Arrive, stock up on food for a week (to supplement with restaurants, but some savings). Costco Japan would be really fun to visit too (haven't yet). Also Costco + Internet (Amazon, B+H, etc.) are essentially 99% of my shopping here in Puerto Rico. Visiting Costco, Walmart, etc. immediately after returning from war zones with limited supplies is a pretty shocking experience; I can only begin to imagine what it's like for someone new to the country who is actually from such a place.
- johnwalkr 4y ago
  Costco in Japan is great. Even without an American sized fridge and freezer it is definitely worth shopping at. It’s by far the cheapest place to buy American snacks, bacon, good peanut butter, tortillas, brown sandwich bread and kind of the only place to buy bulk. It’s an hour away from me and requires a car rental but it’s easily worth going once every 2-3 months.
- lostmsu 4y ago
  How's the Internet in Puerto Rico?
  - rdl 4y ago
    I have 2Gbps symmetric fiber at home for $100/mo. There are a couple fiber vendors, cable Internet (although low upload speeds, but better than Comcast in the US), fixed wireless, and now Starlink. Internet, cell, telecommunications are all great after deregulation/privatization back in 2000; the problems are power and water (which are more government run, or monopolies selected by the government).
    - rdl 4y ago
      (er, sorry, it's 2Gbps down and 1Gbps up for $100/mo)
kepler1 4y ago
Related to the story's underlying topic, as an immigrant I find significant attitudinal/philosophical differences in how I regard saving money and spending money versus, for example, my American coworkers and friends, especially younger ones who grew up around relatively well-off families. Maybe the affection for Costco embodies that. I'm sure I sound like an old fart for saying this, like "those younguns don't know the value of a dollar any more". By comparison at least, they are much freer with their money and don't have the same baggage about it. An example especially apparent for me is their willingness to spend on clothing, where I just can't bring myself to do it. Maybe just not having been brought up around parents who were ever dressed that nice, or allowed me and siblings to be. Or for example, their lack of concern about overpaying for small things, which yes in the bigger picture, who cares if you're overcharged for a drink once in a while? I suppose it's because the information or concern about not having money was already passed down or imposed on me as a lesson early in life (whether intentionally or not). Sometimes I view it as an advantage as I see that my friends (those spending freely) will encounter those lessons when they get married, have kids, etc. and need to save. On the other hand, I wonder if I'm just handicapping myself with that baggage and not allowing myself to enjoy the freedom that a good income now brings, and living too much in the restraints of my family's past...
- joveian 4y ago
  While not necessarily the particular examples you give, there is a destructive side to the willingness to spend as well in terms of environmental impact. Lots of people in the US end up with basements or garages of stuff they don't use and can't even remember what is there or find it if they were ever to want to use it. I think there is a religion of wealth not just among the super wealthy where people think the environmental impact doesn't matter or if it does someone else will fix it or if not then they deserve it anyway. Ethically there can also be major issues, including with clothing, and the more likely to be ethical stuff can be more expensive (but not that expensive, the most expensive stuff is usually just expensive in order to show off wealth). The freedom of wealth is the freedom to shit on other people if you want to or just don't care enough to not do so. I suggest continuing to be careful about what you buy but with a wider ethical consideration rather that just looking for the best price.
- 4y ago
thethought 4y ago
Enjoyed the post. I shop at Costco for - wine, single malt, brandy, cheese, and bread - sea food, mutton, sardines, tuna, canned stuff, tomato and citrus fruits - dog food and bird feed And of course their food court pizza + hot dogs Great place.
sexy_seedbox 4y ago
I've never been in a Costco in my life but have eaten so much Kirkland products.
mongol 4y ago
Costco will open in Sweden soon. On the opposite part of Stockholm from where I live, so I don't think it will be useful for me. I don't know much about it but I am excited to see what it will bring, and if it will affect the general grocery market around here.
- unicornmama 4y ago
  Hmmmm I wonder if they will try the bulk model. Americans have very large fridges and grocery shop once a week. Grocery stores are often a 20-30 minute drive away. In my European country people have small fridges and may buy groceries several times per week. Grocery stores are a 5-10 minutes away.
  - mongol 4y ago
    People that live in houses here usually have one fridge and one freezer, about 180 cm or so tall. In apartments, usually less.
- ArtemZ 4y ago
  Stockholm is a horrible place to live long term. You are basically banned from owning a car, but there are no convenient connections to huge shopping centers like Kungens Kurva (and stores likes IKEA doesn't offer delivery for most items!) and huge retail/warehouse stores like Biltema.
  - CorvusCrypto 4y ago
    I am curious if your perspective comes from someone that is swedish or not. The general consensus locally is the opposite sentiment ime and ofc you can easily rent cars for the day or a small trailer for very cheap. That coupled with the fact to for example Kungens Kurva it is somewhere you can get to within an hour from within even the city center is quite nice and the bus stop is literally next to the IKEA (ofc you go to Barkarby if more north and again the station for the bus is right next to center). The delivery is interesting that you note considering we have always been able to get things delivered to our apartment though maybe it depends where you live...
deweywsu 4y ago
bobsmooth 4y ago
I think one of the things in becoming an adult is understanding the trauma of your parents. This was a nice article.
- ggm 4y ago
  Nice isn't the word I'm reaching for. Very well written, hard to deny, quite angry. The one thing it isn't is a love song. Great writing. Good read.
- jiscariot 4y ago
  I enjoyed this piece immensely. Might be a "missing the forest for the trees" thing, but it was odd needing to scroll so far down for a comment that grok'd the theme of the article, instead of chiming in on discounted gas and Kirkland vodka.
- RainaRelanah 4y ago
  Thank you for making me actually read it. Many years of thought definitely went into this.
ekianjo 4y ago
as usual most people react to the headline without reading the article :)
- rglullis 4y ago
  I am amused by how clear it is to spot those that didn't even bother to open the link. All of them, no exceptions, could be summarized as "I am completely ignorant of what's actually being talked about and I am not really inclined to dig deeper into it. Anyway, let me interject with my worthless opinion and find a way to make this about me." But then again, perhaps this could be a meta-commentary about how American hyper-individualism makes everyone's worldview so small that they can not see anything but themselves, and yet this somehow "works"?
  - skinnymuch 4y ago
    What’s wrong with someone coming to HN for the comments? The headline allows for commenting about that subject. For all you or I know, this story has most of its upvotes by people who want to talk about or read comments about Costco, not the story of the article.
    - rglullis 4y ago
      > What’s wrong with someone coming to HN for the comments? I don't mind reading the comments without reading the story. I mind people writing comments without reading the story. > most (...) want to talk about (...) Costco, not the story of the article. And that is incredibly shallow. If I wanted to read senseless comments based on the title of an piece, I'd just prompt GPT-3 for random wikipedia entries.
      - skinnymuch 4y ago
        GPT-3 comments of any kind would certainly be incredibly shallow. Comments from actual grown people are different, even if it’s just based off domain + headline + a possible skim. Edit: I’m not sure senseless comments even correlate more with not reading an article.
Pasorrijer 4y ago
Another thing that hasn't been mentioned, while it doesn't directly affect the experience, is how well Costco treats their employees. Almost all of their policies are progressive and employee first, and that's something I'm also willing to support. https://www.huffpost.com/entry/costco-pay-benefits-glassdoor_n_5375193 https://www.huffpost.com/entry/costco-pay-benefits-glassdoor...
unixhero 4y ago
Costco is amazing.
KillerRAK 4y ago
Costco is the best! In addition to having a great curated product selection that one can trust, they appear to treat their employees well as they always have a great attitude and top-notch customer service.
ComputerCat 4y ago
Costco stresses me out! It's always so crowded, they move stock around so I can never find anything and the lines to check out are huge! BUT I do love how wide the aisles are.
hillsboroughman 4y ago
In the last 20 years, I did several jobs. The jobs I was happiest in were those where my boss was a loyal Costco shopper. I dont know if the two are connected.
dont__panic 4y ago
A lot of people I know in the tech space seem to love Costco. I've been. It's fine -- compared to a lot of other dingy, sad, depressing grocery stores, it is absolute MILES better. So I understand the fondness. But for me, it can never compare to Wegmans. At Wegmans, the store brand is always a sensible default purchase in a category, and often the best option in a category. The employees all seem happy because Wegmans has been one of the best blue collar employers in the country for a couple of decades now. The hot bar, burger shop, and sub shop are all fantastic: relatively cheap, and often better than any fast/casual alternatives in the area. They have a great beer selection, if you live in a state that allows beer sales in grocery stores. Caveat: if you've only ever visited the Brooklyn Wegmans, or honestly any Wegmans outside of the core central-western NY zone, you're missing out on the best qualities of Wegmans. For whatever reason, the stores they've started in new regions in the past few years just don't capture the same Wegmans spirit. The creme de la creme Platonic form Wegmans will forever be Rochester's Pittsford Plaza location. If you're ever in Rochester, it's worth the visit.
- rockostrich 4y ago
  Everything you said about Wegmans is true of Costco. Kirkland brand is usually the best option if they make it and Costco is known for their high starting wages, benefits, and treating their employees well. Their hot dog (1/4 lb all-beef) + drink deal has stayed at $1.50 for decades and is legitimately a solid lunch. Their beer selection is good (at least in NY) although I would recommend just going to a local brewery to buy beer in pretty much any state.
- stuff4ben 4y ago
  Wegmans is just another overpriced grocery store with a huge wine selection going for it. Literally here in NC I'd rather go to Harris Teeter or Whole Foods than Wegmans. Some HT's have a bar to hang out at which I occasionally do before I do my shopping. I just don't see the appeal of Wegmans except the transplant northerners who are reminiscencing.
- ecopoesis 4y ago
  Wegmans has recently come to New England. They are generally much nicer, cleaner, and organized then our big local chain, Stop & Shop. However Wegmans has a weird inventory. Many things you could find in any New England grocery store like steak tips, salt-top rolls, or brown bread are simply missing. It wasn't until I was perusing Wegmans' extensive cured meat department that I realized I was thinking of Wegmans the wrong way: it's not a grocery store, it's an ethnic food store, like a Super 88. But instead of being Chinese, Wegmans is a midwest ethnic food store.
seanc 4y ago
Somewhere I read a quote from some cranky business analyst complaining about how the low prices, quality products and high wages impact profits. "It's better to be a Costco customer or Costco employee than it is to be a Costco shareholder." To which I responded "That sounds like a well run company!"
- beachtaxidriver 4y ago
  If you look at COST it was pretty darn good to be a shareholder too. Somehow they made that work out where all three of them won.
- iancmceachern 4y ago
  And a company that will stand the test of time, because as Warren Buffet says, it's providing value.
sntran 4y ago
Couple counter points: Appliances shipped from Costco.com are in their original packaging. They usually come with damages. I have had a couple items that I had to bring them back to the store to return. Another thing is how they choose which items to sell at a particular warehouse. I used to visit one to buy a Sony Bravia 77" OLED and was told that the model was only sold at locations with high-income neighborhood. Other than that, they have a way to get my money. It seems like we go there every week or so.
frakkingcylons 4y ago
I guess everyone else read Costco in the title and stopped. But my parents are from the same generation (also from Fuzhou, no less) and this was heartbreaking to read. Mine never explicitly mentioned going hungry, it was just implied. I also have an aunt (the eldest) who lost years of her life working on a farm in the countryside. It was forced by the state, not a decision made by her parents. She only returned home after she had a very severe case of malaria.
anyyw 4y ago
I’m glad that I’m not the only one who shares the distinct memory of helping my dad pack up piles of Costco joint support vitamins and chocolate for when he went back to China. This article really hit me with nostalgia. I also remember hearing stories about the first opening of a Costco in Shanghai. Given the rest of the comments here about initial openings in new countries, it’s funny to see how much of a cultural impact the brand has.

366 points by lxm 4y ago

I really like that piece.

As a child of AAPI immigrants, this piece really hit home, especially when the author mentioned how the struggles of her parent’s generation impacted the way she was raised.

edmcnulty101 4y ago

As a native born and poor American without any parents I feel the same way going to Costco. Its miraculous. After being homeless a few times as a native born American I still feel like showers are the ultimate luxury. I'm always happy to see immigrants with jobs in America and Europe but I can't help but wonder what can we do to make other countries as desirable as America? Theres billions of people. Why aren't their countries desirable as well? Why is North America and Europe the main destination for the entire world to wish to immigrate to? Why doesn't almost any country in Africa South and Central America, Asia, and India continents have immigration problems and what can we all do to make it desirable for people to want to be in their homes?

lotsofpulp 4y ago
Because they are higher trust societies with less low level corruption, allowing one to have more peace of mind in day to day life. Simply going out in a vehicle is magnitudes riskier in the country my parents come from. My whole extended family can afford maids, cooks, and drivers, yet they all moved because they wanted a lower volatility life for their children, even if it meant doing your own laundry, cleaning, cooking, and driving.
- elbigbad 4y ago
  Can you say more? My spouses family was same, I go visit them in their country and they have lavish wealth (comparatively to others in the country) and maids and cooks and such. But they moved to developed nations like AUS, US, and UK.
  - lotsofpulp 4y ago
    Less worry about needing to bribe, especially for everyday stuff. Less worry about getting shaken down by cops. Stable governments with government insured bank accounts and money that loses purchasing power at a much slower rate. Ability (and threat) of the court system to potentially right a wrong.
  - dominotw 4y ago
    better air quality.
- wyldfire 4y ago
  > higher trust societies with less low level corruption Without a doubt this seems like a big/major factor. But we have corruption in the US. Do we have less corruption because of enforcement of anti-corruption laws? Or do we have those laws and an expectation that they're enforced because of some other factors? Not rhetorical, I just don't know. Casually it seems like many European countries have the same or greater expectations and similar prosperity. When I read stories about Russia and the former Soviet republics it makes me think that there's so much mistrust and hopelessness that a corrupt government is taken for granted. I have no idea whether or not the US is exceptional but if it is I wouldn't jump to describe it as virtuous. But I do wish I could understand what policies we could pursue that might make other societies similarly high trust.
  - lotsofpulp 4y ago
    > Do we have less corruption because of enforcement of anti-corruption laws? Or do we have those laws and an expectation that they're enforced because of some other factors? Neither answer is complete. Laws and enforcement can only go so far. It is not feasible to police every single interaction between people. My amateur hypothesis would be a combination of a wealth of resources, growth outlook, shared struggles, traditions and cultural outlooks that provide utility and propagate downstream, etc. Probably impossible to intentionally recreate. And of course, very possible to lose. If everyone in society decides they want to screw each other, then no amount of laws will help. Unfortunately, in many societies, the game is very adversarial with dire consequences, and you have to play that way. On the other hand, a society where people are mostly out to engage in good faith transactions can greatly benefit from reduced friction, enabling more transactions and each actor wasting less energy in preventing themselves from being screwed.
  - toast0 4y ago
    > Do we have less corruption because of enforcement of anti-corruption laws? Or do we have those laws and an expectation that they're enforced because of some other factors? I think there's an expectation that at least egregious corruption will be enforced against; typically in a court of law, but if not, in the court of public opinion. But also, petty bribes are offensive to be offered or demanded. There's a sense that bribing your way out of a minor offense is a more serious crime than whatever the offense was. There's still higher level corruption, regulatory capture and all that, and other cases of interested parties making decisions with conflicts of interest. Those are trickier than bribes.
- formerkrogemp 4y ago
  > Because they are higher trust societies with less low level corruption, allowing one to have more peace of mind in day to day life. Certainly this is a factor, but let's not forget the decades of destabilizing influence, coups, assassinations, wars, sanctions, and foreign policy promulgated by the US to keep some countries poor to maintain US interests.
  - edmcnulty101 4y ago
    I didn't see where the US interfered with China or India's elections. I didn't see where the US interfered with Mexico's elections. Those are a huge portion of the immigrants to the U.S if not the majority.
- teddyh 4y ago
  > Because they are higher trust societies with less low level corruption https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Corruption_Perceptions_Index https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Corruption_Perceptions_Index (Also, if you are comparing places, don’t forget to also consult https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Democracy_Index https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Democracy_Index)
  - skinnymuch 4y ago
    These sort of things should have more transparent and correct naming. Corruption is high as can be in the west too. It’s just mostly lobbying so the average person doesn’t have safety concerns. Something like stability, comfort, and safety concerns makes much more sense. Or as quoted, less low level corruption works too. The Democracy Index being done by The Economist and being used as a respectable index to look at is pretty funny, but in line with the status quo. How many low end countries in these indexes have been used and abused by the western countries liberal/conservative political regimes The Economist, its ownership, and many of its readers love? Sadly, dozens upon dozens upon dozens.
- edmcnulty101 4y ago
  What can we do to make India, Africa, Asia, and South/Central America filled with high trust societies like Europe, North America, and Australia? And keep these current high trust societies trust from continuing to be eroded? On the front page of HN at the same time this article is. https://news.ycombinator.com/item?id=32050417 https://news.ycombinator.com/item?id=32050417
  - lotsofpulp 4y ago
    The simplest answer is that good, capable people need to participate in the civic process. Not just voting every year. Running for office, campaigning, donating, knocking on doors, participating and starting civic organizations, having children, raising those children with the proper values. Unfortunately, a lot of that can be undone by things like lack of resources, which means things like securing your own or your tribe’s future is more important than advancing everyone’s. It is possible that those in developed, stable countries are simply lucky enough to be at the right place at the right time. As boundary conditions and parameters change, the situation can evolve or devolve with little control.
    - edmcnulty101 4y ago
      The countries in Europe, North America, and Australia were all in the right place at the right time. While the countries in Africa, Indian, Asia, and South America weren't. That's one possible explanation.
prostoalex 4y ago
> what can we all do to make it desirable for people to want to be in their homes? Great book on the subject is https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Why_Nations_Fail https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Why_Nations_Fail It explores precisely this phenomenon - why certain places that have geographic proximity (Dominican Republic and Haiti, Nogales AZ and Nogales Sonora) drifted so far away from one another economically, why some places with vast natural resources (Nigeria) are undesirable while some other countries with limited natural resources (Japan, Singapore) are economic successes.
pm90 4y ago
> Theres billions of people. Why aren't their countries desirable as well? Because whenever they have political systems that promote stability or justice, those leaders are overthrown in favor of those who will obey diktaks of the IMF/World Bank/WTO which generally promote privatization and wealth concentration. So other countries are desirable but have low social/economic mobility.
- Panzer04 4y ago
  By and large, the problem is unfortunately the reverse. If you have resources, your government ends up either an corrupt, nepotistic authoritarian hellhole or a corrupt, nepotistic socialist paradise (until the oil/gold/diamonds/gas run out, at which point it becomes a corrupt, nepotistic authoritarian hellhole) Most countries have the problem of corrupt, nepotistic governments that look after the insiders at the expense of the rest of the population - subsidies for their mates, tariffs on overseas imports the help your friend but screw an industry, etc. The simplest way of avoiding the most destructive consequences of bad governance is often to just remove the government from the equation.
  - usrn 4y ago
    That didn't seem to happen in the Nordic countries.
    - jahewson 4y ago
      They had strong governments long before they discovered their natural resource (oil).
- foogazi 4y ago
  > Because whenever they have political systems that promote stability or justice, those leaders are overthrown in favor of those who will obey diktaks of the IMF/World Bank/WTO simplistic reasoning, but IMF was funded in 1945 - what’s your explanation for the previous 20 centuries?
  - 4y ago
wyager 4y ago
> Why aren't their countries desirable as well? See e.g. National IQ and Economic Development: A Study of Eighty-One Nations, by Lynn and Vanhanen. There is a superlinear relationship between average IQ and GDPPC. Research precludes a predominant causal relationship from GDPPC to IQ (e.g. via Flynn effect); all that is left is that population intelligence causally precedes GDPPC.
Panzer04 4y ago
Mostly less stable governance, often with less protection of private rights (though obviously most of these countries are just poorer as well). If you have no assets, it’s also far easier to make money in a rich country and move back rich, rather than the reverse.
throwamon 4y ago
> Why aren't their countries desirable as well? Yup, that would be pretty nice. If only America would let them. https://en.m.wikipedia.org/wiki/United_States_involvement_in_regime_change https://en.m.wikipedia.org/wiki/United_States_involvement_in... https://en.m.wikipedia.org/wiki/American_exceptionalism https://en.m.wikipedia.org/wiki/American_exceptionalism https://en.m.wikipedia.org/wiki/Imperialism https://en.m.wikipedia.org/wiki/Imperialism https://en.m.wikipedia.org/wiki/United_States_war_crimes https://en.m.wikipedia.org/wiki/United_States_war_crimes https://en.m.wikipedia.org/wiki/Manufacturing_Consent https://en.m.wikipedia.org/wiki/Manufacturing_Consent
- unethical_ban 4y ago
  I just had my bike stolen from me in broad daylight. I said to myself "this is the kind of thing that happens in Brazil, not here".
  - mise_en_place 4y ago
    Sorry to hear that. Costco has a nice selection of bikes for you to choose from.
- TulliusCicero 4y ago
  > Yup, that would be pretty nice. If only America would let them. And yet, if you ask people actually from those countries, rarely will they pin Uncle Sam as the primary reason they're still not well developed.
- edmcnulty101 4y ago
  I didn't see where the US interfered with China or India's elections. I didn't see where the US interfered with Mexico's elections. Those are a huge portion of the immigrants to the U.S if not the majority.
toast0 4y ago
> Why doesn't almost any country in Africa South and Central America, Asia, and India continents have immigration problems and what can we all do to make it desirable for people to want to be in their homes? Some countries do have immigration problems and emmigration problems. If they're more desirable than nearby countries, but not nearly as desirable as US/EU, then they'll pull in their neighbors, potentially too much at times, but still have those with resources leaving when they can. IMHO, things people are looking for are physical safety, political stability, economic stability and opportunity, legal stability (rule of law, predictable courts, timely access to courts, reasonable law enforcement). The top reasons people I hear people say they come to the US are because it's unsafe for them where they live, or to have the opportunity to make more money.
akomtu 4y ago
Here is an unscientific explanation. NA and EU are populated by older souls: some of them see the value of giving, while others, who've chosen the wrong path, are adepts at scheming; but both are similar in their maturity. The less mature souls are still busy with mastering their emotions and their nations are too chaotic for this reason: they either fall apart without a leader, or when a mature leader presents itself, they have to be ruled by an iron fist (China, India). Eventually the focus will shift to another place on Earth: the most advanced will move on there and America will join the long list of empires that were once great, but that event is still a thousand years away.
lbrito 4y ago

gumby 4y ago

My great grandfather moved to a different part of Asia and never went back. My grandfather moved elsewhere and never went back. My mother moved to another continent and then later, with my father, to a third, where I partially grew up. And I moved to yet another continent (with another emigrée), speaking a language that, like my mother, I had learned after growing up. Yet today I spoke English with a stranger, a woman born to Indian immigrants and she spoke with the same hand gestures I do.

deleted 4y ago
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smugma 4y ago
Sounds like the beginning of a true love story.
- deleted 4y ago
  [deleted]
godelmachine 4y ago
Did you ask her out for a coffee?
permo-w 4y ago
what does this have to do with Costco?
- gumby 4y ago
  Thanks for asking if it wasn’t clear. The article used Costco as a vehicle for exploring the experience, and yet so some degree trauma, of moving away from your birthplace. I read it through the lens of a common belief that Asian families in particular are very close and don’t handle migration well. I mentioned my story because it’s a contradictory example, but also because I believe that the belief that somehow “Asians” can’t handle family separation is not correct — I believe all people have roughly the same percentage of “gotta stay here” and “gotta go somewhere else” — it’s just human nature. The last part of my story also relates to the Costco article: despite a lot of time there I never lived in India, nor, thanks to the laws and attitudes of where I was born did I speak much of any Asian languages with my mother yet decades later I, and some American woman of Indian decent whom I’d never met before, used the same body language and gestures while speaking. Where did that come from?

jnord 4y ago

Great story, thanks for sharing!

W-Stool 4y ago

In 2005 my wife and I lived in a part of the USA that had no Costco within a half day's drive. We soon secured jobs in a part of the USA that had two (two!) Costcos in the same city that we would live. True story - before we even looked for housing, I went online and joined Costco. Years later my diabetic cat even had a Costco pharmacy account (best place to buy insulin by far) and received a discount for being without health insurance.

SOLAR_FIELDS 4y ago
I have a Costco account and a Sam's Club (Walmart's Costco equivalent) account. Even though I do something like 98% of my bulk shopping at Sam's club (due to proximity, the Costco is ~ 15 min drive away vs 5 mins for the Sam's club), it's still worth it for me to hold the Costco membership for specific purchases. Notably I've purchased (because there's no better place to buy these things and the vendor vetting is amazing) bedsheets, smart thermostats & a sauna from Costco over the last year and those have easily made back the $60 USD it cost me to buy the membership. I'll probably end up buying a gazebo kit from Costco sometime in the next year. I think for semi-big purchases ($USD 200 to $USD $20,000) as a consumer Costco has huge value. The vendor vetting thing may not be as important when it comes to a bag of chips, but when it comes to a $4,000 gazebo or some $2,000 appliance I have really come to trust Costco's vetting.
- Akronymus 4y ago
  > (due to proximity, the Costco is ~ 15 min drive away vs 5 mins for the Sam's club) this kinda makes me... sad, I guess? Just how embedded the need to drive is for america. (As in, having to drive, rather than being able to) Just such a different culture from what I know.
- cyberge99 4y ago
  Costco also works out deals to sell “special” revisions of major brand offerings. One example is a Sony Bravia that has a physical microphone disable switch.
  - 4y ago

throwawayarnty 4y ago

Amazing how much China has changed over the past 60 years. From backwards and famined to a global super power.

pirate787 4y ago
Really the progress started with Deng Xiaoping, so just in the last 45 years. But China has 20% of all humanity, so really just stepping back into its rightful place after the disaster of Maoism.
deleted 4y ago
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speed_spread 4y ago
But are there Costcos in China? Also, do people in China get out of the city to go camping for the weekend? These are honest questions I'd like to have answers for.
- mchaver 4y ago
  > But are there Costcos in China? Yes, I know there is one in Shanghai. https://www.costco.com.cn https://www.costco.com.cn > Also, do people in China get out of the city to go camping for the weekend? I am not sure about camping, but glamping is popular with young people. https://edition.cnn.com/travel/article/glamping-china-trend-cmb-intl-hnk/index.html https://edition.cnn.com/travel/article/glamping-china-trend-...
- merlyn 4y ago
  Yes, Costcos, Sam's Clubs. Ikea. Carrefour. Walmart. Apple. Oppo stores. Probably not around at the time that the article's author's parents emigrated. There are people doing more of the outdoor thing in China now. Probably none going about 20 years back. Last time I was there, there were recreational bicyclists (ie. taking them off the back of their car) in the cities, as opposed to my first visits where many more bicycles for their comute than cars.
  - 4y ago

jamiek88 4y ago

Costco blew my tiny little mind when I was fresh off the boat too!

atlgator 4y ago

I wish Costco still had early entry for elderly and disabled. That was really nice during the pandemic.

brewdad 4y ago
Somewhere there's a grandma that still has a garage full of toilet paper thanks to getting in the door early.

notkurt 4y ago

Did anyone else read Costco as Contoso first? Or am I the only one holding out for a love song dedicated to Contoso

vxNsr 4y ago
You’ve spent too much time reading Microsoft documentation
walrus01 4y ago
Apparently Microsoft keeps the domain for contoso.net and contoso.com registered and its mx receives a vast quantity of mail from misconfigured things out in the wild.
avgDev 4y ago
I too have attended the Contoso university.

lbrito 4y ago

Haven't read the piece yet, but I definitely will - for a long time I would like to understand why people are so enamored with Costco. I recently joined because they have some good food that is hard or more expensive to find elsewhere, but that's about it. To me it's just a store. Outside of the US/Canada I've never seen people evangelize a store so much.

kvark 4y ago
For me, it’s a modern equivalent of the soviet stores. There is no 10 kinds of everything, but the ones available are guaranteed to be fairly good quality and at an affordable price. Speaking more modern, it saves the mental effort of researching choices. Need something? Check Costco, buy if there, done. Of course there are negatives associated with them, too.
- el-salvador 4y ago
  PriceSmart, (Costco's Latin American cousin), does something similar too. They research/test the products before selling them so that they comply with their quality standards. So once products are on the shelves its likely that they are good. This make buying decisions easier. Which is a much better shopping experience than having to read a dozen product reviews while shopping online.
- inferiorhuman 4y ago
  > the ones available are guaranteed to be fairly good quality and at an affordable price I bought into the hype and got a Costco membership a few years back. One of the first things I went looking for was whole bean coffee (Peet's xmas roast). The local Costco had a bunch of coffee from Starbucks and Peets (meh quality to start) but only the painfully dark roasts and all of it was ground. Pre-ground coffee in bulk has a pretty limited use case (and relatively short shelf life). Fast forward to last week and I went looking for a new fridge at Costco dot com. They prominently featured LG (ugh) and Samsung refrigerators. While some LG models seem to review pretty well I've never seen anyone say anything positive about Samsung, their service, or the serviceability of their appliances. I'm in the middle of dealing with a defective LG fridge and that's about the nicest thing I can say about LG's warranty and customer support. Costco may have a permissive return policy and decent customer support but I would never blindly buy something without doing a bit of research just because it's at Costco. Especially with a big ticket item like a fridge I'd rather use my Amex anyhow.

ernestns 4y ago

In some areas where it can be costly to import goods, like Hawaii, Costco tends to be one of few reliable stores to find products at relatively reduced prices. With this type of reputation, it's understandable why their following is loyal and enthusiastic.

tomc1985 4y ago

divbzero 4y ago

I’ve always had a gut feeling that Costco’s customers represent a broader swath of socioeconomic diversity than most other stores. Don’t know how true that is and would love to learn if there’s real data behind it.

caymanjim 4y ago
Minor anecdotal evidence, but I live in a small semi-rural/semi-suburban town in NJ, and Costco appears to have a full cross-section of people. It does seem slightly more economically-diverse than the regular grocery and retail stores, in that you'll see a lot more rich people (by virtue of driving Porsches and Mercedes) at Costco than you will at Walmart.
insightcheck 4y ago
Business Insider hired an analytics firm named Numerator to create a report that finds on the average Costco customer [0]. I couldn't find the original data or report in Business Insider's summary, but from its article: "Numerator found that Costco's typical shopper in the US is an Asian American woman between 35 and 44 years old who is married and living in a city in the Pacific Northwest. (Costco was founded in Seattle and is based in Washington.) She typically has a four-year degree or higher level of education and earns more than $125,000 a year." I'm not sure whether the income of the "typical shopper" was defined based on a median or mode, so there could well be a large variance of customers with a lower socioeconomic status. A separate article by Investopedia [1] also asserts that Costco mostly opens stores in affluent suburban areas, and originally targeted college-educated and financially wealthier customers. So, Costco's customers are likely skewed to have a higher socioeconomic status, based on the location of most of its stores in wealthier suburban areas and findings from an analytics report (with some skepticism towards the article about the report, as the raw data and methods weren't shared, as far as I could see). [0] https://www.businessinsider.com/typical-costco-shopper-demographic-asian-american-woman-earning-high-income-2021-7 https://www.businessinsider.com/typical-costco-shopper-demog... [1] https://www.investopedia.com/articles/insights/061516/whats-average-costco-consumer-cost.asp https://www.investopedia.com/articles/insights/061516/whats-...
- 4y ago

rdl 4y ago

My favorite Costco is in Iceland: a place where things are normally absurdly expensive, and Costco Iceland is merely somewhat expensive. Arrive, stock up on food for a week (to supplement with restaurants, but some savings). Costco Japan would be really fun to visit too (haven't yet). Also Costco + Internet (Amazon, B+H, etc.) are essentially 99% of my shopping here in Puerto Rico. Visiting Costco, Walmart, etc. immediately after returning from war zones with limited supplies is a pretty shocking experience; I can only begin to imagine what it's like for someone new to the country who is actually from such a place.

johnwalkr 4y ago
Costco in Japan is great. Even without an American sized fridge and freezer it is definitely worth shopping at. It’s by far the cheapest place to buy American snacks, bacon, good peanut butter, tortillas, brown sandwich bread and kind of the only place to buy bulk. It’s an hour away from me and requires a car rental but it’s easily worth going once every 2-3 months.
lostmsu 4y ago
How's the Internet in Puerto Rico?
- rdl 4y ago
  I have 2Gbps symmetric fiber at home for $100/mo. There are a couple fiber vendors, cable Internet (although low upload speeds, but better than Comcast in the US), fixed wireless, and now Starlink. Internet, cell, telecommunications are all great after deregulation/privatization back in 2000; the problems are power and water (which are more government run, or monopolies selected by the government).
  - rdl 4y ago
    (er, sorry, it's 2Gbps down and 1Gbps up for $100/mo)

kepler1 4y ago

Related to the story's underlying topic, as an immigrant I find significant attitudinal/philosophical differences in how I regard saving money and spending money versus, for example, my American coworkers and friends, especially younger ones who grew up around relatively well-off families. Maybe the affection for Costco embodies that. I'm sure I sound like an old fart for saying this, like "those younguns don't know the value of a dollar any more". By comparison at least, they are much freer with their money and don't have the same baggage about it. An example especially apparent for me is their willingness to spend on clothing, where I just can't bring myself to do it. Maybe just not having been brought up around parents who were ever dressed that nice, or allowed me and siblings to be. Or for example, their lack of concern about overpaying for small things, which yes in the bigger picture, who cares if you're overcharged for a drink once in a while? I suppose it's because the information or concern about not having money was already passed down or imposed on me as a lesson early in life (whether intentionally or not). Sometimes I view it as an advantage as I see that my friends (those spending freely) will encounter those lessons when they get married, have kids, etc. and need to save. On the other hand, I wonder if I'm just handicapping myself with that baggage and not allowing myself to enjoy the freedom that a good income now brings, and living too much in the restraints of my family's past...

joveian 4y ago
While not necessarily the particular examples you give, there is a destructive side to the willingness to spend as well in terms of environmental impact. Lots of people in the US end up with basements or garages of stuff they don't use and can't even remember what is there or find it if they were ever to want to use it. I think there is a religion of wealth not just among the super wealthy where people think the environmental impact doesn't matter or if it does someone else will fix it or if not then they deserve it anyway. Ethically there can also be major issues, including with clothing, and the more likely to be ethical stuff can be more expensive (but not that expensive, the most expensive stuff is usually just expensive in order to show off wealth). The freedom of wealth is the freedom to shit on other people if you want to or just don't care enough to not do so. I suggest continuing to be careful about what you buy but with a wider ethical consideration rather that just looking for the best price.
4y ago

thethought 4y ago

Enjoyed the post. I shop at Costco for - wine, single malt, brandy, cheese, and bread - sea food, mutton, sardines, tuna, canned stuff, tomato and citrus fruits - dog food and bird feed And of course their food court pizza + hot dogs Great place.

sexy_seedbox 4y ago

I've never been in a Costco in my life but have eaten so much Kirkland products.

mongol 4y ago

Costco will open in Sweden soon. On the opposite part of Stockholm from where I live, so I don't think it will be useful for me. I don't know much about it but I am excited to see what it will bring, and if it will affect the general grocery market around here.

unicornmama 4y ago
Hmmmm I wonder if they will try the bulk model. Americans have very large fridges and grocery shop once a week. Grocery stores are often a 20-30 minute drive away. In my European country people have small fridges and may buy groceries several times per week. Grocery stores are a 5-10 minutes away.
- mongol 4y ago
  People that live in houses here usually have one fridge and one freezer, about 180 cm or so tall. In apartments, usually less.
ArtemZ 4y ago
Stockholm is a horrible place to live long term. You are basically banned from owning a car, but there are no convenient connections to huge shopping centers like Kungens Kurva (and stores likes IKEA doesn't offer delivery for most items!) and huge retail/warehouse stores like Biltema.
- CorvusCrypto 4y ago
  I am curious if your perspective comes from someone that is swedish or not. The general consensus locally is the opposite sentiment ime and ofc you can easily rent cars for the day or a small trailer for very cheap. That coupled with the fact to for example Kungens Kurva it is somewhere you can get to within an hour from within even the city center is quite nice and the bus stop is literally next to the IKEA (ofc you go to Barkarby if more north and again the station for the bus is right next to center). The delivery is interesting that you note considering we have always been able to get things delivered to our apartment though maybe it depends where you live...

deweywsu 4y ago

bobsmooth 4y ago

I think one of the things in becoming an adult is understanding the trauma of your parents. This was a nice article.

ggm 4y ago
Nice isn't the word I'm reaching for. Very well written, hard to deny, quite angry. The one thing it isn't is a love song. Great writing. Good read.
jiscariot 4y ago
I enjoyed this piece immensely. Might be a "missing the forest for the trees" thing, but it was odd needing to scroll so far down for a comment that grok'd the theme of the article, instead of chiming in on discounted gas and Kirkland vodka.
RainaRelanah 4y ago
Thank you for making me actually read it. Many years of thought definitely went into this.

ekianjo 4y ago

as usual most people react to the headline without reading the article :)

rglullis 4y ago
I am amused by how clear it is to spot those that didn't even bother to open the link. All of them, no exceptions, could be summarized as "I am completely ignorant of what's actually being talked about and I am not really inclined to dig deeper into it. Anyway, let me interject with my worthless opinion and find a way to make this about me." But then again, perhaps this could be a meta-commentary about how American hyper-individualism makes everyone's worldview so small that they can not see anything but themselves, and yet this somehow "works"?
- skinnymuch 4y ago
  What’s wrong with someone coming to HN for the comments? The headline allows for commenting about that subject. For all you or I know, this story has most of its upvotes by people who want to talk about or read comments about Costco, not the story of the article.
  - rglullis 4y ago
    > What’s wrong with someone coming to HN for the comments? I don't mind reading the comments without reading the story. I mind people writing comments without reading the story. > most (...) want to talk about (...) Costco, not the story of the article. And that is incredibly shallow. If I wanted to read senseless comments based on the title of an piece, I'd just prompt GPT-3 for random wikipedia entries.
    - skinnymuch 4y ago
      GPT-3 comments of any kind would certainly be incredibly shallow. Comments from actual grown people are different, even if it’s just based off domain + headline + a possible skim. Edit: I’m not sure senseless comments even correlate more with not reading an article.

Pasorrijer 4y ago

Another thing that hasn't been mentioned, while it doesn't directly affect the experience, is how well Costco treats their employees. Almost all of their policies are progressive and employee first, and that's something I'm also willing to support. https://www.huffpost.com/entry/costco-pay-benefits-glassdoor_n_5375193 https://www.huffpost.com/entry/costco-pay-benefits-glassdoor...

unixhero 4y ago

Costco is amazing.

KillerRAK 4y ago

Costco is the best! In addition to having a great curated product selection that one can trust, they appear to treat their employees well as they always have a great attitude and top-notch customer service.

ComputerCat 4y ago

Costco stresses me out! It's always so crowded, they move stock around so I can never find anything and the lines to check out are huge! BUT I do love how wide the aisles are.

hillsboroughman 4y ago

In the last 20 years, I did several jobs. The jobs I was happiest in were those where my boss was a loyal Costco shopper. I dont know if the two are connected.

dont__panic 4y ago

A lot of people I know in the tech space seem to love Costco. I've been. It's fine -- compared to a lot of other dingy, sad, depressing grocery stores, it is absolute MILES better. So I understand the fondness. But for me, it can never compare to Wegmans. At Wegmans, the store brand is always a sensible default purchase in a category, and often the best option in a category. The employees all seem happy because Wegmans has been one of the best blue collar employers in the country for a couple of decades now. The hot bar, burger shop, and sub shop are all fantastic: relatively cheap, and often better than any fast/casual alternatives in the area. They have a great beer selection, if you live in a state that allows beer sales in grocery stores. Caveat: if you've only ever visited the Brooklyn Wegmans, or honestly any Wegmans outside of the core central-western NY zone, you're missing out on the best qualities of Wegmans. For whatever reason, the stores they've started in new regions in the past few years just don't capture the same Wegmans spirit. The creme de la creme Platonic form Wegmans will forever be Rochester's Pittsford Plaza location. If you're ever in Rochester, it's worth the visit.

rockostrich 4y ago
Everything you said about Wegmans is true of Costco. Kirkland brand is usually the best option if they make it and Costco is known for their high starting wages, benefits, and treating their employees well. Their hot dog (1/4 lb all-beef) + drink deal has stayed at $1.50 for decades and is legitimately a solid lunch. Their beer selection is good (at least in NY) although I would recommend just going to a local brewery to buy beer in pretty much any state.
stuff4ben 4y ago
Wegmans is just another overpriced grocery store with a huge wine selection going for it. Literally here in NC I'd rather go to Harris Teeter or Whole Foods than Wegmans. Some HT's have a bar to hang out at which I occasionally do before I do my shopping. I just don't see the appeal of Wegmans except the transplant northerners who are reminiscencing.
ecopoesis 4y ago
Wegmans has recently come to New England. They are generally much nicer, cleaner, and organized then our big local chain, Stop & Shop. However Wegmans has a weird inventory. Many things you could find in any New England grocery store like steak tips, salt-top rolls, or brown bread are simply missing. It wasn't until I was perusing Wegmans' extensive cured meat department that I realized I was thinking of Wegmans the wrong way: it's not a grocery store, it's an ethnic food store, like a Super 88. But instead of being Chinese, Wegmans is a midwest ethnic food store.

seanc 4y ago

Somewhere I read a quote from some cranky business analyst complaining about how the low prices, quality products and high wages impact profits. "It's better to be a Costco customer or Costco employee than it is to be a Costco shareholder." To which I responded "That sounds like a well run company!"

beachtaxidriver 4y ago
If you look at COST it was pretty darn good to be a shareholder too. Somehow they made that work out where all three of them won.
iancmceachern 4y ago
And a company that will stand the test of time, because as Warren Buffet says, it's providing value.

sntran 4y ago

Couple counter points: Appliances shipped from Costco.com are in their original packaging. They usually come with damages. I have had a couple items that I had to bring them back to the store to return. Another thing is how they choose which items to sell at a particular warehouse. I used to visit one to buy a Sony Bravia 77" OLED and was told that the model was only sold at locations with high-income neighborhood. Other than that, they have a way to get my money. It seems like we go there every week or so.

frakkingcylons 4y ago

I guess everyone else read Costco in the title and stopped. But my parents are from the same generation (also from Fuzhou, no less) and this was heartbreaking to read. Mine never explicitly mentioned going hungry, it was just implied. I also have an aunt (the eldest) who lost years of her life working on a farm in the countryside. It was forced by the state, not a decision made by her parents. She only returned home after she had a very severe case of malaria.

anyyw 4y ago

I’m glad that I’m not the only one who shares the distinct memory of helping my dad pack up piles of Costco joint support vitamins and chocolate for when he went back to China. This article really hit me with nostalgia. I also remember hearing stories about the first opening of a Costco in Shanghai. Given the rest of the comments here about initial openings in new countries, it’s funny to see how much of a cultural impact the brand has.