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That problem is solved by how 1Password works: * Your password vult is encrypted locally and stored on their servers (just an encrypted file!) * To unlock the
by tpetry 4y ago
That problem is solved by how 1Password works:
* Your password vult is encrypted locally and stored on their servers (just an encrypted file!)
* To unlock the vault, you need the password and the generated master code.
* The master code is a PDF to print, which you can give someone you trust – they still only have half of the things to get access.
The losing of digital life is completely solved. Just print that damn PDF give it to your parents and remember your password.
- JoeAltmaier 4y agoNot really solved - forgetting a password is where you started. Does it help to say "Just remember the password!"?
- sillysaurusx 4y agoIt’s a lot easier to remember one specific password. Especially when you need to enter it at regular intervals.
- bigDinosaur 4y agoNot solved, because your parents could lose a piece of paper (I'd say that's actually a fairly high risk, not just theoretical). Anyone could lose a piece of paper, for that matter. You want multiple, distributed across at least three continents to be sure. The same with your password. ;-)
- tpetry 4y agoSure, you don't have to stop at distributing just once copy…
- horsawlarway 4y agoEven then - this is a fairly ugly solution. You're dependent on an external entity to be responsible with your stuff in the case of an emergency. I love my friends and family, but I'm not sure I'd trust them to keep a random file/paper for years on end "just in case" and still be able to find it when I need it. Personally - I went with the "extra yubikey in a safe deposit box" approach, and it still feels super shitty. I'm not at all a fan of "code is law".
- the_af 4y agoIt doesn't even scale. This assumes you're the only one with PDFs to share. What if you have siblings and other relatives, and all of them are tech-savvy -- if they aren't now, in the future they will be -- and want to store the PDFs with your parents. What, are your parents going to be running a PDF storage service, classified by person? That's too much to ask of them (for most parents).
- xtracto 4y agoAll these "rebutals" to the pdf approach sound like those infomercial TV ads where people have trouble doing normal day to day things. Like... mass enail the PDF to several members of the family and be done with it. Can it happen that 5 people at once lose their email access? Sure, but the probability is minuscule.
- the_af 4y agoThe comment I was replying to was about physical paper copies, not emails. Distributing digital copies of your password store to your friends and relatives could maybe work. Be sure you're using a really strong password (that you can also remember by heart), because you cannot trust each friend will store the file responsibly away from prying eyes. Remember the scenario: - You lost access to your recovery codes and any handwritten notes, so you better remember the master password by heart. - But this master password better be really strong, because each of your N friends you distributed your files to is a potential leak to hackers and thieves. - (Tangentially related: remember you have no authenticator either, so your password store better include recovery codes, otherwise without 2FA you're screwed)
- mrtranscendence 4y ago> What, are your parents going to be running a PDF storage service, classified by person? I mean, it's a piece of paper. They could write the name of the person on the paper, keep them alphabetized, and store and search through hundreds of them easily (let's assume they're rabbits with hundreds of children). There may be all sorts of problems with this approach but I don't think burdening parents with paper storage is one of them. Edit: of course, if they were rabbits I wouldn't trust them with paper storage. Rabbits are notorious chewers.
- latency-guy 4y agoAnd what if someone dies? We'd need something that would do periodic health checks. Preferrably during off-peak hours..
- micromacrofoot 4y agoPut it with your will. If you have kids or any amount of savings you should have a will. Store it in two separate locations (your house, and someone else's).
- benhurmarcel 4y agoI just store a copy at work. I figure I'm unlikely enough to lose all my possessions without dying at the same time that my workplace gets destroyed.
- natly 4y agoWhat if you don't really have friends. Not really an uncommon thing.
- dewey 4y agoPut it in a safe deposit box or store it at a notary like a will. There's multiple ways to store a piece of paper offsite without having friends or family.
- horsawlarway 4y agoYou still have to be able to prove to THOSE entities that you are who you say you are. And I say that as someone who has a spare yubikey sitting in a safe deposit box. Eventually, this would probably work out, but it still feels super shitty.
- maccard 4y agoThat's not a technical problem though. Going to a bank and saying "my house burned down, here's an affidavit or a notarised document stating I am who I say I am" is fairly likely 5o get you access again.
- gpmcadam 4y agodo you clone the ubikey or enroll two different keys? i struggled to find providers who let you register a second key
- makeitdouble 4y agoDelegating half of the problem to someone else is not what I’d call “completely solved”. I suppose your point is, nobody should live a life where they can’t trust someone to keep that pdf for them, but it feels to me like solving a technical problem through social means. That’s a fresh take, but it also relies on so many assumptions.
- lupire 4y agoAccount security is social. It's using social means to solve a social problem, with a technical bridge.
- ClumsyPilot 4y agoBut this technical problem is unsolvable, our industry lived in arrogance of pretending they solve problems they can't actually they don't, and blaming the user when it fails
- wintermutestwin 4y agoOnce you have printed out your master key, you might as well go back to writing passwords on a sticky note...
- ClumsyPilot 4y agoI swear to god sometimes I feel our proffesion mostly consists of people that are a weired combination of arrogant and alternatively gifted. They do not value and do not understand how the rest of society does things. Hundreds of years ago we have invented this cool thing called a Safe. It works better than 90% of tech-based security systems out there. Write something on a piece of paper, put it behind a locked door, and you will be safe from 99% of scams and attacks that exist. If someone breaks into your house, and get this piece pf paper they will be leaving real fingerprints, and real police will get involved. If noone breaks into your house, then only select few people are ever near that safe.
- ghaff 4y agoAnd even absent a safe... Absent a trusted family member pulling an inside job, how much risk is there really for an average--or even not so average--person to having accounts compromised because someone found passwords written down on a piece of paper somewhere in their house. Yes, perhaps the equation changes if you have roommates/family you don't really trust.
- mst 4y agoThe trick is to then store it somewhere that anybody who came into posession of it would be unable to figure out -what- master key it was for. If a friend of mine has an arbitrary chunk of ASCII stored under their google contacts under a name only they and I recognise, absent rubber hose cryptoanalysis of them it's not going to be an issue, and frankly I don't consider that relevant to my threat model - if somebody's -that- excited about my accounts they'll start with the rubber hose on me at which point all bets are already off.