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Ask HN: Anyone else quickly losing confidence in Amazon?

492 points by d23 4y ago

I feel like every time I search for something I expect the products to be either fake, filled with fake reviews, broken when I receive them, or from a no-name fake brand that popped up last week. It has become seemingly impossible to wade through the mess. What's worse, there seems to be zero way to report these listings. I tried submitting a review warning other customers about the fake reviews for a fake product, but the review was not approved. In that particular instance, I was actively recommended a "wasp trap" by Amazon. Curious, I saw it was rated 4.8. Turns out the positive reviews were all for... a pet cemetery headstone (complete with photos, to make the issue completely unambiguous). The listing itself was posted by a seller that had almost all negative reviews that were -- removed by Amazon! The reason? Amazon took responsibility, since it was fulfilled by Amazon. The problem: none of the negative reviews had anything to do with things like shipping time. They were all basically calling the product a scam. This seems like a looming disaster for Amazon. It baffles me that there is no way for customers to at least report these issues. I've done most of my shopping for the last 15 years on Amazon, but I'm seriously considering stopping. Is anyone else in this boat?

paulpauper 4y ago
I have never shopped for anything on Amazon. So many experiences, from what I have gathered, have been negative: damaged items, misleading, missing, etc. Walmart is better, imho.
jehovahjehovah 4y ago
I stopped because they banned me, I regularly posted, and even tested potential scam, what did I get from it, Amazon accuse me of abusing their returns system after I had probably 30 or 40 A to Z claims over scammers that never delivered something, or I documented in photos them sending other b**** as a way to scam the system oh, and even when I appealed this to Amazon and show them documentation of many if not all of the sellers being banned from Amazon with very very poor service ratings of 0% satisfied or 100% - oh, they would not reinstate my account oh, f** Amazon
MB76 4y ago
viper22 4y ago
Yes a lot of items u have bought have been broken and do not work so I send them back and look for the items here in town and have lost 2 days or more before I get it.
fortyseven 4y ago
Just bought some scam USB sticks. I can return them, and leave a negative review, but there's no obvious place to file a report of an active scam. Easy to find a place to report an IP violation, however, if I'm the company being infringed upon...
cmcrisp 4y ago
cmcrisp 4y ago
Biffy 4y ago
I have never had bad service and everything always came ahead of schedule. Maybe it's your drivers not Amazon. They have the most efficient shipping system there is. It works fine by me. If I've ever had a problem they have always fixed it. Even the Messenger system they have is extremely polite and very courteous. This is a personal issue not a hit piece. This woke nation is extremely rude and Amazon and all Amazon AI systems and employees and drivers you're an amazing company I completely appreciate you and all you provide. This company is so helpful for ones that can't leave their house. Some people actually appreciate even the little things. They could disappear overnight. Being awake amidst the woke nation. The reason these companies are being bought out. With such a great service maybe they need better clients. Ones that are grateful. These driver's work even on the weekend. Show a Little respect it goes a long way. People are so rude lately. Maybe a reality check is necessary. These companies profile is and could delete your file. Due to the Patriot Act we are all being monitored and recorded at all times. Be the solution not the problem. Thank you everyone at Amazon all of your satellite systems towers devices that let us all communicate with one another.
Gramsmad22 4y ago
It sucks. It is no longer reliable. And the fake Chinese names of products is stupid. I don't buy anything you can't pronounce like a bunch of letters. HUTRDJK every product I search for in a name brand another fake name comes up. Don't even den get me started on Prime shipping and products. It is bad and Walmart is just as bad.
Gramsmad2022 4y ago
It sucks. It is no longer reliable. And the fake Chinese names of products is stupid. I don't buy anything you can't pronounce like a bunch of letters. HUTRDJK every product I search for in a name brand another fake name comes up. Don't even den get me started on Prime shipping and products. It is bad and Walmart is just as bad.
Gramsmad2022Mc 4y ago
It sucks. It is no longer reliable. And the fake Chinese names of products is stupid. I don't buy anything you can't pronounce like a bunch of letters. HUTRDJK every product I search for in a name brand another fake name comes up. Don't even den get me started on Prime shipping and products. It is bad and Walmart is just as bad.
AntifaKitten 4y ago
daviddever23box 4y ago
Maybe you're searching for, or selecting and purchasing, the wrong items?
- dredmorbius 4y ago
  "You're holding it wrong." https://uxdesign.cc/youre-holding-it-wrong-how-to-blame-the-user-6ebfd36f5664?gi=58a227f6abb5 https://uxdesign.cc/youre-holding-it-wrong-how-to-blame-the-...
  - daviddever23box 4y ago
    Yes - same as going to the dollar store (or whatever one’s local equivalent is) and wondering why the cookies taste different. Also re-stated as, “You can’t handle the truth”, i.e., given the widest possible exposure to consumerism ever known, one is unable to make an informed choice. That is exclusively the responsibility of the consumer.
    - dredmorbius 4y ago
      A mass marketplace is based on trust. Amazon is cannibalising that trust. It will cannibalise its mass marketplace. If the dollar store is selling product labeled as premium-quality which is not in fact, or is claiming certifications not actually granted, or contaminated products ... then that store has a problem. At least when going to a B&M store, it's possible to examine goods and packaging and reject obviously damaged or returned merchandise. Amazon doesn't offer that protection except through a far more tedious return mechanism. Caveat emptor is NOT in fact governing law and principle, but rather implied warranty is, within the US and most Western countries: https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Implied_warranty https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Implied_warranty
auslegung 4y ago
Fora long time now I’ve been using Amazon as a product search site with reviews (sometimes questionable). when I find the product I want to purchase, I try to purchase from the OEM, though sometimes they just direct me back to Amazon
tmaly 4y ago
It is a huge marketplace, so I would expect there to be a few bad apples. Overall, I would say 70-80% of the stuff I buy does the job.
- samwillis 4y ago
  The issue there is that there is 20-30% chance of being disappointed. That’s far to high to justify for most people, I would estimate my threshold for confidence when purchasing something needs to be >95%. I now only ever buy from Amazon if I’m stuck for time and need it quickly / don't have 10 min to shop around.
- PaulHoule 4y ago
  That is a terrible batting average!
  - OvidStavrica 4y ago
    Google: what is a good batting average Answer: .300 In modern times, a season batting average of .300 or higher is considered to be excellent, and an average higher than .400 a nearly unachievable goal.
    - Phrenzy 4y ago
      Do you rate heart surgeons with the same numbers?
dcchambers 4y ago
I feel like you're several years late to the party here. I think it's pretty common knowledge at this point that certain types of goods sold on Amazon have a huge chance of being counterfeit and everyone knows reviews are faked/not to be trusted blindly. At this point people seem to not care since Amazon will give a refund/exchange pretty much no questions asked. It's still extremely annoying and it's definitely not a good look for their business, but I assume the number crunchers have determined actually dealing with the fraud isn't yet worth it financially.
- Riverheart 4y ago
  Yep, pretty well covered at this point. Ryan George - What Shopping on Amazon Feels Like https://youtu.be/nQpxAvjD_30 https://youtu.be/nQpxAvjD_30
  - doctor_eval 4y ago
    I bought this comment for my husband and he loves it!
- devrand 4y ago
  > It's still extremely annoying and it's definitely not a good look for their business, but I assume the number crunchers have determined actually dealing with the fraud isn't yet worth it financially. They’ve dealt with it in limited ways. For example, they’ve inked exclusivity agreements with certain brands (ex. Apple) so that only Amazon can sell them. So at least that inventory should be legit as they don’t allow third party sellers. Of course this is somewhat to Amazon’s favor. If a brand is concerned about their reputation due to customers unknowingly getting counterfeits, they need to strike a deal with Amazon, and likely one that is favorable to Amazon.
  - cgriswald 4y ago
    As a consumer, I didn't know that, and would just assume Apple products on Amazon are also likely to be counterfeit and just buy from Apple or a retailer I trust to have genuine Apple products, like Best Buy.
akrymski 4y ago
Amazon is now a collection of businesses, including: - AWS - Amazon Ads - FBA - Marketplace This is in order of profitability. It seems that Amazon doesn't care much about the Marketplace itself.
- fullshark 4y ago
  AWS is the only one not heavily dependent on the quality of the marketplace, which is what brings people to the website though. Seems short sighted to let it drop in quality.
300bps 4y ago
I buy stuff from Amazon several times per week. There are whole swaths of items I won’t buy on there though - anything food related or personal care for two examples. I’ve had too many incidents of improperly handled or expired food being sent to me or outright fake / gray market things. It’s hard to lose confidence in a company overall though with such an amazingly easy and liberal return policy.
- prewett 4y ago
  You aren't going to lose confidence in a company that has "whole swaths of items I won't buy" because of personal experience with being shipped expired food and obvious fakes? What would it take for you to lose confidence? Unfortunately, there are a lot of things that are difficult to source outside of Amazon, so while I avoid any company whose co-mingling policy pretty much guarantees fakes, sometimes you just have to take your chances. Day Two can't come quickly enough, as far as I'm concerned.
- soneil 4y ago
  Until that return policy fights back too. That's a learning experience. I got in a fight with them because I ordered an SSD, I received a box containing brown packing paper. When I wanted a refund or replacement, they wanted me to return the SSD .. Their returns policy works fine when you fit in an automated workflow. The moment they have to exhibit independent thought, you're screwed. And if you try to exercise your consumer rights, they'll come down hard. Chargebacks will be met with your account being closed, including losing any access digital media you've "bought" through them (which is why I still won't convert my legacy Audible account to an Amazon account, no matter how many times they ask)
  - sdflhasjd 4y ago
    > Their returns policy works fine when you fit in an automated workflow Sounds familiar... in 2019 I bought a multipack of smart bulbs. Unfortunately, one failed after only a couple of months. I asked amazon for a replacement, and they wouldn't do anything until I sent every single bulb back.
barneygale 4y ago
You're spot on IMO - it's an unregulated bazaar and a scammer's paradise. I gave up buying there about a year ago.
brycewray 4y ago
Might want to try adding the “Fakespot Fake Amazon Reviews and eBay Sellers” extension to your browser. Certainly doesn’t solve the problems you’ve mentioned, but helps somewhat.
gibspaulding 4y ago
For me there's sort of a spectrum from (1) "I want exactly this name brand X" to (2) "I need something cheap that does X". Amazon used to pretty comfortably cover both of those scenarios, but lately I've been leaning more and more towards ordering direct from the OEM for (1), or from Ebay/Alibaba for (2). Amazon still occupies some space in between, but it's narrowing.
wombat-man 4y ago
Yeah I actually prefer to buy more and more stuff from brick and mortar major retailers.
fullshark 4y ago
Amazon is a convenience store at this point, you aren't interested in the best prices or highest quality products, but the convenience of having something you want delivered to your door within x days (2 if prime).
- EVa5I7bHFq9mnYK 4y ago
  Haha these days long gone ... prime is 5 days minimum now.
  - signatoremo 4y ago
    You need to be specific, because that isn’t my experience. All of prime items I’ve ordered in 2022 have been 1 or 2 day delivery. The most recent one was last week
    - EVa5I7bHFq9mnYK 4y ago
      Amazon has officially rescinded their 2-day Prime delivery offer. If you look into Prime delivery page, there is no longer mention of 2-day. There is Amazon day (once a week) instead. Depending on where you are and what you are ordering, they can bring it faster, but for most orders 5-7 days is the new norm.
  - slotrans 4y ago
    I've gotten multiple Prime orders delivered same day in the past month.
    - aix1 4y ago
      Probably depends on where one is, geographically?
  - jd24 4y ago
    It depends on where you live. In the LA area I can get same day shipping. Some items I can get rushed same night.
- 4y ago
jonahbenton 4y ago
Past tense. Current state is buyer beware, assume adversarial with all amazon and amazon-facilitated offerings.
650 4y ago
I recently bought ~$2000 worth of various purchases due to moving into a new home, furniture, home goods, food, etc. Not a single bad experience, although I did spend a bit more time than I would have preferred looking through product reviews.
drumhead 4y ago
Hasnt been good value for a while now. Shop around and you can always pick up a better deal. What Amazon sells now are mainly no name chinese brands of dubious quality and reliability. They're making plenty of room for other retailer to come in and snap up their market share.
silisili 4y ago
I'll only buy cheap crap on there anymore, when alternatives are slightly more expensive cheap crap in stores. So I basically treat them as an online Harbor Freight of sorts. I don't trust the brand as a whole anymore. For me, Walmart kills them. Generally better quality, trusted brands that probably won't burn my house down, and they'll bring it to my house from the store today. Or 2 day ship it if it's not there. And I can get groceries.
- fortran77 4y ago
  Between Target.com, and HomeDepot.com I can get a reasonable selection of items that are most likely as described. For clothes I go to manufacturer's website directly, or big department store websites.
  - silisili 4y ago
    Yes! Everyone should know that about clothes, forgot to mention it. I found a shirt I liked in a department store, probably Izod but I don't remember now, and they didn't have my size. Went online, to the mfg site, and that shirt was like 20% cheaper, and had my size. Now I just order direct! My kid loves her Gap clothes I buy super cheap from gap factory outlet online. 5 bucks for shirts, maybe 10 or 15 for jeans. I'm struggling to see the point of department store clothing if they do nothing but mark up clothes. Obvious disclosure: We are not a high fashion or trendy family, ymmv.
    - vineyardmike 4y ago
      > I'm struggling to see the point of department store clothing if they do nothing but mark up clothes You may or may not case based on your disclosure, but lots of brands have “outlet store” and “main store” versions of their clothes manufactured differently or with QC difference. Sometimes literally cheaper materials and sometimes simply “binning” of QC. Similarly, many brands of eg TVs will release shadow “holiday versions” of their TVs with worse warranties or lower quality specs meant to hit holiday sale prices (eg 50% off). Obviously iPhone 13 specs are know and won’t get away with it but Panasonic 65TDQ56P (made up SKU on a brand that does BF models)? If they subtly change the specs on the holiday version would you know even when shopping around?
Saphyel 4y ago
I tried to avoid Amazon because they don't need my money and you can find better quality or better deal elsewhere. Amazon is becoming a Wish also.
kirktrue 4y ago
I have not knowingly received any “bad“ purchases from Amazon. Having heard scary stories like these has put me off ordering things from there for sure. But the convenience is just too great for me to give it up. Maybe I am just fortunate to have not had an issue, maybe the counterfeiters are very good, or maybe I am just clueless, or some combination of these. I try to stick to only name brand items. If there is a product that looks compelling but is from a brand I have not heard of, I generally look at both their website and other reputable retailers which sell that same product. I largely ignore the reviews. Not necessarily because they are scammy (which I’m sure they are) but because they are so largely subjective. Reviewers will often give a one-star rating for a product because shipping was slower than expected. Or a one-star because the product didn’t package a standard USB-A cable or didn’t include AA batteries. Or a one-star rating in protest something of the company or product itself. Many times it appears the reviewer did not read the description closely enough, and accidentally purchased the wrong product, for which they blame the retailer. I almost always purchase from Amazon.com as the seller vs. some Harry’s Tech Supply Store. Exceptions are made if there are thousands of Store reviews and a 95%+ positive rating. In other cases, I will simply purchase the item from the official brand website, or some other retailer. It’s frustrating that Amazon allows commingling of products from different suppliers and retailers in a common bin. It’s also frustrating that other retailers like Walmart and target seem to have followed suit.
- influx 4y ago
  I’m pretty sure I’ve gotten counterfeit polo and Levi clothes from Amazon, but they are good enough that it’s hard to tell other than they seemed to wear out faster.
  - ch4s3 4y ago
    You may have gotten legit goods from the lower end lines of those brands. Both are terrible about have multiple quality tiers with minimal differentiation in marketing. The difference will be price, quality, and QC even if they look similar.
    - 4y ago
Finnucane 4y ago
Haven't ordered a thing from them in almost three years, Haven't been to a Whole Foods in quite a while, either. They are dead to me.
- Animats 4y ago
  I still buy occasionally from Amazon, but it's mostly reorders. Searching there is so weird as to be useless. Why do they need all those resellers? Gave up on Whole Foods. Trader Joe's has shorter lines, good quality, better prices, and less wierdo stuff such as homeopathic remedies. Once in a while, Lucky's, which has short lines and unionized staff.
  - D13Fd 4y ago
    Why is unionized staff a good thing?
    - digisign 4y ago
      Amazon has a rep for mistreating employees, a union is an imperfect way to counter that.
bgs113 4y ago
I still buy tons of things from there, but usually only if it's sold by Amazon.com specifically or the known manufacturer selling there. And if I can find it through Target, it'll get here almost as fast with free shipping, from a company with stronger values, so I prefer that when possible.
- hef19898 4y ago
  Second this. Back the day it was "Fulfilled by Amazon" that I looked for, now that changed to either known sellers or sold by Amazon. All others, well, fir the stuff I look for eBay isn't too bad. Exceptions are, e.g., books. As long as the edition is the right one you cannot go wrong regardkess of seller. I do buy less and less from Amazon, so.
  - paulmd 4y ago
    > As long as the edition is the right one you cannot go wrong regardkess of seller. Haha, oh no, bad news! A lot of times amazon will have special "amazon print" editions and many times they have had printing problems... no print, wrong book inside, etc. I have never personally seen one IRL but I've seen review pics of people showing the problems with their books they bought directly from amazon.
KVFinn 4y ago
The search feels actively hostile. It returns so many things that are very clearly NOT matches for what I am looking for, and are things it would rather sell me. And of course there are SO many 'sponsored' results to wade through. On the product page itself there are a few different page sections that show alternative products or similar products to consider. Only the single one at the very bottom of the page is not a sponsored listing. ALL the other ones are just sponsored listings. I actually have more confidence in random ebay used listings lately. At least I get what was described.
- JaimeThompson 4y ago
  Amazon makes a lot of money from selling ads so having a search that "requires" ads to be bought to make people actually see your product benefits Amazon.
- jeffreyrogers 4y ago
  Sometimes it is easier to find books by searching "<book name> amazon" than it is to actually search for it on Amazon's site.
- tryptophan 4y ago
  Sort by lowest price is also completely non-functional. It seems if you select that option, it will return 5 pages of irrelevant junk for you to wade through.
- 6ak74rfy 4y ago
  I was just telling my wife earlier today that Amazon considers search filters as mere suggestions from the user. Often times, they don’t even honor price filters properly.
gzer0 4y ago
It has gotten so bad that I now actively seek out BestBuy or other places which I know will source out decent quality items.
- fma 4y ago
  There's no reason to not buy electronics from Best Buy. They will price match Amazon. You can do it straight from the chat. In store returns, accrue reward points...and of course guaranteed it's not counterfeit.
ziml77 4y ago
Losing confidence? No, I lost that years ago. For quite some time the vast majority of the listings have been drop-shipped AliExpress garbage. Many of them are obvious because of terrible photoshops, randomly named branding, and those strange bold brackets in the product description. But some can be harder to spot because of tricks that sellers use to essentially hijack listings for other products to carry all the positive reviews along. Or they may just go the route of putting completely fake reviews on the product. Some may even be from verified purchasers because they packed a card along with the product offering compensation for a 5 star review. Or they can get verified reviews in an even slimier way involving ordering from themselves and then shipping random crap to people who've they've sent stuff to before. And then there's the inventory that's poisoned with counterfeits. Thanks to inventory co-mingling counterfeit and legit products can end up getting mixed together. There's a chance that even buying from a fully legit listing will end up with you getting sent a counterfeit product. However, despite all of that I do still use Amazon. Their immense investment into logistics means that many things will make it to me next-day. And their return policies allow me to order with the confidence that if I get a fraudulent item (or just something I don't like) it will be fairly painless to get a replacement or my money back. That said, I have also been making more efforts over the years to not use Amazon. I tend to buy all my major electronics from Best Buy or direct from the manufacturer. And I would never buy any food or medicine from Amazon. I don't want to risk things that go into me being counterfeit.
- analog31 4y ago
  >>> However, despite all of that I do still use Amazon. ... And their return policies allow me to order with the confidence that if I get a fraudulent item (or just something I don't like) it will be fairly painless to get a replacement or my money back. Oddly enough Amazon didn't invent this. All of the "big box" and online retailers had no-questions-asked returns before Amazon came along. My hunch is that one of two things have happened: 1) You figure out that the most cost effective way to manage quality control is through returns and refunds, and you streamline this process; 2) You go out of business. The retailers who delivered quality goods and charged appropriately for getting it right on the first try are gone.
  - 4y ago
cddotdotslash 4y ago
Every review I’ve left that’s under 5 stars has been rejected for trivial technical reasons. I received a trash can that was heavily scratched and with poor quality hinges. Review rejected because it contained references to “issues that might have occurred during shipping.” Every product on the site seems to be rated 4.5+, which makes sense if they’re rejecting reviews in this way.
- hnlmorg 4y ago
  I’ve left plenty of < 5* reviews. Also seen plenty of < 5* reviews left by other people. This might be a difference between the U.K. Amazon and their US counterpart but I’ve definitely not had any issues leaving negative feedback.
  - Nextgrid 4y ago
    I'm in the UK and an edit to my original (2-star) review to point out that the seller tried to bribe me was silently ignored (they do not alert you if an edit to an existing published review doesn't pass moderation).
- in_cahoots 4y ago
  Agreed. I bought the same item twice from the same seller, and both times a packing label was created but the item was never shipped. I couldn’t leave feedback because it was a shipping issue.
- donatj 4y ago
  The majority of the products I review are between 1 star and 3 stars. It's rare I'm so happy with something I would bother to review it. I can only recall ever having one review rejected, and I've reviewed probably hundreds of things. I wonder if they have an internal system that marked your reviews in particular for more scrutiny.
deleted 4y ago
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leroman 4y ago
I believe the FBA program exists so that Amazon does not seem like a monopoly, as anybody can sell there.. And so, it would seem they have very little interest in policing it.. I personally got my money back many times when issues came up, so to them it’s probably along the lines of “let sellers do their things and be quick to refund if customers complain..” is this tradeoff worth it? Hard to say..
beebmam 4y ago
>I've done most of my shopping for the last 15 years on Amazon What? How? This is genuinely baffling to me.
- michaelt 4y ago
  Presumably they mean "other than my shopping for food; things you would obviously not go to amazon for like lumber or flights or medical insurance; and purchases I don't consider shopping like gasoline and new tyres"
browningstreet 4y ago
I order from Amazon every week and have never had an issue. Not sure what’s different between my experience, or order item selection. (shrug)
undoware 4y ago
I once attempted to buy a laser for an EDM music art project on Amazon and wound up with something that is more or less intentionally down-marked as a less dangerous class of laser. I only found out about it (and thus saved my retinas) because some ML or another decided to queue up a bunch of laser-related videos, and it just so happened that the video which surfaced in my feed went into how weapons enthusiasts were using Amazon, and this specific brand, to sell eyeball eaters to folks who like to melt pop cans in ravines at 100 yards or whatever. Like, when I went back, there were literally laser marks on my apartment door from where I tried the laser out, after receiving it. Amazon seems to be pursuing a sort of 'common-carrier' status for material goods, and it's a libertarian no-rules Snow Crash dystopia.
whateveracct 4y ago
I shop around more, but I pretty much get good stuff from Amazon multiple days a week.
f6v 4y ago
It’s as good as it always was for me. I buy from the German one.
Darmody 4y ago
I only buy from Amazon because I know I can return the items if I don't like them. In some cases I even bought from Aliexpress because I couldn't be sure whether the item from Amazon was genuine or not.
aqsalose 4y ago
Only thing I like to buy from Amazon are ... books.
pengo 4y ago
I did use Amazon a couple of times when it first arrived, but wasn't comfortable with its overreach in every area of operation, and have avoided it since. There are more equitable alternatives
popotamonga 4y ago
My company gives me 1k/mo gift cards so i have to buy stuff i dont even need, so far hundreds of items no fakes that i could spot. I buy all types of stuff from all sections. I did buy some jewlry as gift for 20€ that i later found on ali express for 50 cents but thats my bad i guess.
- mateo1 4y ago
  These days fake products are impressively good. I got a pair of earbuds on ebay to replace my damaged brand name ones, and upon closer inspection I realized the fake ones were made with a custom injection mold and if the electronics weren't rattling and the sound quality wasn't as bad, I'd fall for it.
- glouwbug 4y ago
  That's awfully wasteful on behalf of the company. Why not just ask for a raise instead, or give them away as gifts?
  - popotamonga 4y ago
    65% tax vs 0 on gift
    - piperswe 4y ago
      I suppose it depends on the country, but at least in America the IRS would see right through the company considering $1k/mo in Amazon gift cards as a non-taxable "gift"
krallja 4y ago
I bought a “TXINLEI 858D 110V Solder Station, Digital Display SMD Hot Air Rework Station Solder Iron Kit Heat Gun, Tweezers, Desoldering Pump” on Amazon, because it is a cheap hot-air soldering station. It should not be sold in the United States. The plug on it is wired backwards, so the cable on it is also wired backwards. But they both use the industry-standard IEC C13 / C14 shape. So if you accidentally use the plug on your desktop, it’ll work, but the chassis will be hot instead of neutral. And the same thing if you use a regular plug with this device: the neutral and hot pins are swapped, so you’ll have a hot chassis. It’s illegal. Yet, it’s so cheap, and easy to remedy at home!
- unQJTy7H 4y ago
  The thing that your chassis is connected to is ground, not neutral. The hot/neutral being swapped thing matters because some stuff only has a switch on the hot leg. (Not your computer; it could just as easily be used with a Schuko plug on the end of that C13 cable - which isn't "polarized" at all!)
  - krallja 4y ago
    I missed the edit window, but I misunderstood the issue. The real problem is that a switched & fused neutral is a hazard. We expect devices to have switched hot.
- sudosysgen 4y ago
  In AC, the neutral can still kill you. Chassis are never wired to neutral. You would die. They are wired to ground.
  - krallja 4y ago
    Oops, I misunderstood the issue. The problem with the hot/neutral swap is that the switch and fuse are both on neutral in either scenario (defective cable with correct device, or defective device with correct cable). Thus the device is still connected to hot if the fuse blows.
  - 4y ago
fimbulvetr 4y ago
No. Today one of the tines broke on my tiller, weld sheared clean off. Have had this tiller for years and use several times a year. I used some sites to find diagrams and part numbers. I was ready to order from the small engine site, $60 plus shipping and several day delay. I googled the part number, first link was an amazon prime next day delivery for $56. Maybe tomorrow it will show up and it will be a counterfeit and I will start the journey of losing confidence, but not today as I have never received a known counterfeit from them and we order at least 100 things or more from them a year. Edit: like another reviewer, I really only purchase name brand items and mosty from amazon.com reseller. My last amazon purchase from a non-amazon reseller was fine, ramset 1 7/8" pins that I could not find anywhere else, for fastening 2x4s to a steel I-beam.
carom 4y ago
I hate Amazon until I try to use anything else. I hate the ads in search, that is not what search means to me. If I search 5.11 pants and buy the first thing I see, I won't get 5.11 pants. It feels like the cheap Chinese brand for anything I buy. That being said, every non Amazon online order I place reminds me that they are the best we have.
Havoc 4y ago
Sorta mixed. I buy a huge amount though, so some misses are to be expected. Amazon warehouse open box stuff - I've had some fraud issues with that. Shitty people buying another copy of an old broken item and returning the bad one and keeping the new working one. Then the next customer (me) trying to keep stuff off the landfill gets a broken item as "Like new". SD cards...haven't had any proper fake ones but some have had suspiciously short lifespans. Bought a incredibly unsafe cheap rice cooker that I used exactly once. No immediate plans to switch to something else. It is still the most convenient/cheap frankly even with the misses
CosmicShadow 4y ago
Yep, for years now. Amazon used to feel amazing, now it's Scamazon and it's sadly better to buy the literal cheap garbage at Walmart than it is to waste the time researching the fake crap on Scamazon and still losing out. It's really pushed me to waste 25 minutes driving across town for something that may be in stock and may do the job in most cases.
harel 4y ago
When I buy anything from Amazon I haven't bought before, I always check 3 star reviews first. Then I go through a few 1-2 stars. I might check one 4-5 stars but usually I treat them all as fake at this stage.
lacker 4y ago
Recently I tried buying some shoes from somewhere that wasn't Amazon. My order never arrived and I never heard anything from them. To get a response I had to call their 1-800 number. "Oh yeah, it looks like that shipment has been delayed. I'm not seeing any estimated arrival date. Would you like to try ordering them in a different color?" Then I had to read my credit card number over the phone to get a refund. Amazon has problems but in my experience their competitors are worse.
blibble 4y ago
I will do anything possible to avoid ordering from Amazon, including paying more to buy it from someone else previously I was a prime customer for nearly a decade, but in the space of a week I had two deliveries ruined by their terrible delivery agents (and they blamed me) and repeated harassment from a seller for posting a review that they solicited
rfreiberger 4y ago
Wasn't most of the Amazon issue on fake items related to the UPC barcode issue they ran into with books? I recall they only stored the UPC code of items and pulled from their own stock or resellers (who had fake copies with the same code).
Rury 4y ago
Frankly, I try to avoid shopping on Amazon. One because of the problem you mention, but also because it's a poor deal for underlying businesses. Amazon eats most of the margin, while the underlying small businesses get the short end of the stick. Most of the time I find I can get the same items locally for the same price, and the small business simply gets a better margin. Sometimes I wonder if this disparity contributes to the scam problems.
me_me_mu_mu 4y ago
Not really. At least in my experience, their customer service is great and that means a lot more to me than the occasional fake product or reviews. I've gotten wrong/missing deliveries, account issues/mishaps (caused by me in some cases), and other issues that customer service was able to quickly and promptly resolve. The service is so convenient for the end user. While consciously minding all the other un-cool things Amazon does, their customer service is really good.
ceejayoz 4y ago
I reported https://www.amazon.com/sp?seller=AFN4IFVLN4CLK https://www.amazon.com/sp?seller=AFN4IFVLN4CLK months ago; using a seller name of "𝘈𝓂𝒶𝘻𝘰𝘯.𝘤𝘰𝘮". Still up there, despite support saying they'd pass along to the fraud team. AWS is great, but the Amazon.com side of things feels like a slow, steady decline for years now.
- d23 4y ago
  Truly amazing. Could it get any more egregious? They have over 10,000 items listed too.
- secret-noun 4y ago
  For anyone curious, these are characters from a mathematical script: https://unicode-x-ray.com/?t=%F0%9D%98%88%F0%9D%93%82%F0%9D%92%B6%F0%9D%98%BB%F0%9D%98%B0%F0%9D%98%AF.%F0%9D%98%A4%F0%9D%98%B0%F0%9D%98%AE https://unicode-x-ray.com/?t=%F0%9D%98%88%F0%9D%93%82%F0%9D%...
Stratoscope 4y ago
Last weekend I was talking with a neighbor's friend about headsets and he let me try out his AfterShokz OpenComm. These are bone conduction headphones with a swivel microphone. He said he liked listening to music on them. I didn't like the audio quality for music, but it seemed like it would be plenty good for voice conferencing. What I wanted to know, though, was the microphone quality. So I found them on Amazon and there are some video reviews! https://smile.amazon.com/dp/B09CGYBZVG/ https://smile.amazon.com/dp/B09CGYBZVG/ One of the video reviews is titled "Love the battery life and microphone abilities". I thought, "great, I will get to hear what the microphone sounds like." No such luck. The video reviewer is some doofus who wears an orange flame wig - I guess it's his trademark schtick? - and at no point does he actually demonstrate the microphone quality. He did talk a lot about how good the microphone is - without letting me actually hear it - and also commented on how the headset gets caught in his wig. Dude! Why would I care about that? So I did a search for "opencomm microphone quality" and landed on this video: https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=LRmTMpZVoVc https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=LRmTMpZVoVc Now this is what I was looking for. Not only does he let you hear the microphone, but he switches back and forth between the high-quality camera mic and the OpenComm mic, with a supertitle showing which you are listening to. And they throw in noise sources like a blender and a fan so you can check out the noise cancellation. Not a worry for me, I have a quiet private office, but gosh, I love this kind of demo. So naturally I ordered from them instead of Amazon. And I did something I never do: I bought their extended warranty. I take good care of my equipment, and on a $150-$200 purchase, I'd rather just take the minor risk of having to buy a new one. But I paid for the extended warranty just as a way to thank them for providing such an informative video review. If you make video reviews and want to see the difference between a ridiculously bad one and a great one, compare the two above.
- paulmd 4y ago
  lol imagine thinking that you could ever possibly use amazon as a platform to build a consistent audience through reviews, he's a doofus even without the wig there is zero chance that I would ever recognize an amazon video reviewer and if they're someone I cared about I would go watch the youtube channel they undoubtedly have. I do have reviewers whose opinions I value greatly - HdtvTest/Vincent Teoh is one who comes to mind. But I ain't watching them on amazon.
aimor 4y ago
Here’s my Amazon purchase count by year. Each * is 5 items, nearest neighbor rounding. I’m not a big consumer, I peaked at buying a few items every month in 2016, then scaled back and haven’t bought anything in 2022. 2009 2010 2011 * 2012 *** 2013 *** 2014 **** 2015 **** 2016 ****** 2017 *** 2018 *** 2019 *** 2020 * 2021 ** 2022 The reason, I think, is that there’s just too much crap to sort through. I’ve gone through the dance a few times where I want to buy something so I check Amazon, and the results are all overpriced junk, then after about an hour of comparing items and scanning reviews to understand the problems with the junk I give up. It’s no surprise, but I’ve replaced Amazon with box stores and ordering directly from businesses online.
- UkrainianJew 4y ago
  >and the results are all overpriced junk Oh, the funny part is, for most of this junk you can find exactly the same items at Aliexpress with the same pictures and Chinglish descriptions at a fraction of the price...
  - sokoloff 4y ago
    Prior to the postal and tariff changes, I bought a lot from Aliexpress. A lot. I still buy from there, but now I check to see if the same item is sold on Amazon. If I can get it in 2 days instead of 20-30, I’m often willing to pay a 5-10% premium on a low value item, just for the ease of return if nothing else.
wdr1 4y ago
A seller offered me a gift certificate if I left a 5 star review. Basically a little note in the box saying if I left a 5 star review, took a screenshot & sent it to their email address, they'd send me the gift certificate. It was not a 5 star product. It was a 2 star product, at best. I tried to mention the fact they were paying for reviews in my review (to explain the other 5 stars). Amazon rejected my review. It's against Amazon policy to let others know that sellers are buying reviews.
- taurath 4y ago
  This has happened to me as well. Amazon's "customer focus" is a misnomer, because the resellers are more important customers than the buyers are.
  - wmeredith 4y ago
    I feel like I stopped being the customer and started being the product (at least partially) once Amazon started advertising shit to me when I searched for products. No, I’m not interested in $10 Ali Baba bullshit when I search for a $300 Casio G-Shock. I used to spend about 60% of my disposable income at Amazon. That’s dwindled to maybe 1-2% over the last 5 years. I do most of my shopping at Costco or Target now. Amazon is a last resort only. Their customer experience sucks. It reminds me of what happened to eBay and Etsy. I’ll be cancelling my 10-year Prime membership at the end of this year, because I don’t use it anymore.
- j1elo 4y ago
  I've seen the same, but not with a gift certificate. They would just send me another unit of the same product, for free. So basically get two for the price of one plus a good review. The stuff was actually good, at least. So now I have two of them.
- guitarbill 4y ago
  I bought some replacement Macbook keycaps. In the pictures, they are shown in a tray. They come tossed in a plastic bag, and so have almost no chance of surviving shipping. So naturally: "After carefully reviewing your submission, your review could not be posted to the website. It appears you reviewed shipping or packaging experience." I finally got a review through by pointing out the misrepresentation that they did not come in a tray, and not mentioning breakage. So you have to read between the lines of that review. I bought the next set of Aliexpress, and those were fine. What a garbage rule. On the one hand, I understand people are quick to complain... but there's no nuance, and it's definitely become stacked in sellers favour - at least the unscrupulous ones.
jmcgough 4y ago
There's a number of things you 100% can't buy without a huge risk of scammers - things not too hard to fake, with big markups. Beauty and hair products in particular are really risky. You know who I've really lost confidence in? Etsy. It used to be a great place to find hand-made, high quality items. A few months back I searched for a nice Turkish coffee set and was met with 40 listings of the exact same low-quality ali express item. Their revenue has soared recently, but at the cost of flooding their market with junk.
ezekiel68 4y ago
I have bought dozens of products on Amazon in the past 12 months, including a standing desk, health supplements,computer equipment, coffee-making equipment, coffee (itself), clothing, an anti-snoring device (MAD), and home exercise equipment -- among many other products. I have only had one bad experience and that was because the item wasn't packed properly. Two things I do, however, to put the odds in my favor: I stay away from any product with tons of 5-star reviews with little relevant text content (fake astroturfing) and I do most of my product research elsewhere on the web.
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paulcole 4y ago
Nope! It’s awesome. I have never had any issues and have had great luck just going with whatever comes up listed as “Amazon’s Choice.”
qgin 4y ago
While I agree with all the issues you brought up, Amazon is still so much better than anything else that I hate having to go outside of Amazon to purchase something online. To me the Amazon search box feels like the GPT-3 of matter. I can imagine a thing that I’m not even sure exists, I can type a description of it into the search box, and then have that object in my hands within 24 hours. I agree with your criticisms and I hope that Amazon solves them very soon. But none of that makes me not want to use Amazon as my first stop for shopping.
- d23 4y ago
  I 100% agree with you. I really liked Amazon and don’t want to see them screw it up. It’s easy to forget that when Amazon does it well it’s essentially the stuff of science fiction writing just a few decades ago.
dataminded 4y ago
There's room for an amazon competitor -- it would be really capital intensive.
- paulmd 4y ago
  Target and Walmart are trying hard, among many many others. They can come at it the other way, amazon has leveraged their shipping business into physical presence and Target/Walmart/etc are trying to leverage their physical presence into shipping. Hell so has Newegg and Best Buy and tons of others - it's almost easier to list big retailers who haven't tried the "marketplace" schtick at this point. The problem is they instantly get polluted with the same junk as amazon which is really the opposite of what you want - people who want to bail from amazon want a curated experience, with fast shipping times and high quality and good service. "The costco experience" so to speak. It is possible for retailers to provide that for their normal inventory/stocked goods, if your stereo doesn't work you pack it back up and take it back to best buy, but once you bring the marketplace into it their advantage goes down the tubes, because that has to be returned to the seller and now you get all the downsides of amazon and none of the upsides. There have also been some attempts at setting up "distribution centers" like Shoprunner to consolidate the backend and build those economies of scale that amazon enjoys. But that is a "light a giant pile of VC money on fire and hope it starts the reactor" thing too. It seems incredibly questionable that you will ever reach critical mass.
  - d23 4y ago
    Yeah, this is what really sucks. I figured I’d check out Walmart or target, but I started seeing the same third party junk on there too. Seems like they’re trying to copy Amazon.
donatj 4y ago
Can someone point me to a search term that turns up counterfeit goods? I feel like I'm taking crazy pills because I hear this complaint all the time, yet have never seemingly encountered it in my 20+ years of using Amazon. I'd be curious to see what they look like. Giving the benefit of the doubt, I feel I must be buying different things? I did once however report that a power strip I had bought, knowing ahead of time it was super cheap, was designed in such a way that you could touch the live power pins because it was rounded and that I had shocked myself. That report seems to have gone nowhere
- guitarbill 4y ago
  An obviously counterfeit listing is the unsubtle way of doing fraud. The subtle way is piggybacking of a real listing, but then shipping a counterfeit for slightly cheaper. Or shipping it for the same price, and making use of the fact that FBA inventory is commingled.
- topspin 4y ago
  Here is a link to one: https://www.amazon.com/Battery-Rechargeable-Capacity-Flashlight-Electronic/dp/B09ZHDWH1H/ https://www.amazon.com/Battery-Rechargeable-Capacity-Flashli... If it were possible to get 9800 mah out of an 18650 we might all be flying around with electric jetpacks. About the best capacity possible today is 3600 mah. This has been going on for years: https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=gGF9DZcBric https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=gGF9DZcBric Fake or misleading battery products are so common on Amazon there is an ongoing class action suit: https://www.classaction.org/news/amazon.com-hit-with-class-action-over-sale-of-dangerous-defective-lithium-ion-18650-batteries https://www.classaction.org/news/amazon.com-hit-with-class-a...
  - paulmd 4y ago
    batteries are one of those classes of products (as mentioned elsewhere) where it's 100% impossible to buy anything legitimate on Amazon. Even if what I ordered was an OEM laptop battery (for example) what you would receive is, at best, a knockoff with OEM stickers applied.
forinti 4y ago
All marketplaces quickly turn to garbage.
- jjtheblunt 4y ago
  In the spirit of category theory... Except the marketplace of marketplaces? For instance, Amazon is widely reviled, but maybe Walmart and Target will eat Amazon's customer order flows as a result?
EVa5I7bHFq9mnYK 4y ago
I've been a customer since 1996. Yes, for the books. Stopped being customer around 2017 when I noticed a significant markup on all Amazon items. Almost any item can be found cheaper at ebay, aliexpress or somewhere else. Haven't bought prime because I oppose to customer lock-ins and to monopolies in general.
diogenescynic 4y ago
Amazon is now basically a swap meet and has too many counterfeit products and products of dubious quality. I hate it now!
turtledove 4y ago
I ditched prime and haven't looked back. Amazon treats their workers and their customers as disposable. It's surprisingly easy to cut them out in a lot of markets and just shop somewhere else. I assume anything I buy from Amazon won't be genuine, and only buy things there that I don't mind being knock offs.
ksherlock 4y ago
I guess somebody important has a bonus tied to Amazon Music usage. Not that long ago, you could just buy an MP3 off Amazon. Now it takes you to the Amazon Music player (which is slow to load) and if the song isn't available on Amazon Music, instead of playing a 30 second sample it will play similar song instead. If you want to buy the MP3, you have to click on Purchase options menu to get to the old digital music listing. And another thing is the auto-playing video reviews on the front page. No thanks.
wallfacer120 4y ago
I'm losing confidence in Amazon so much that I will complain about their service but not make any change to my behavior.
Litost 4y ago
Which? over in the UK has been tracking this issue for a while now, recent articles: a) Highlighting how some "Amazon Choice" products have scored really low when actually tested (due to fake reviews) - https://www.which.co.uk/news/article/amazon-tech-with-fake-reviews-rated-dont-buy-in-which-labs-aPb8Y6V3DS8f https://www.which.co.uk/news/article/amazon-tech-with-fake-r... b) Buying fake reviews linked to facebook accounts - https://www.which.co.uk/news/article/how-facebook-fuels-amazons-fake-reviews-a1ITH6L1QHN2 https://www.which.co.uk/news/article/how-facebook-fuels-amaz... c) Though in the interests of posting counter argument, allegedly Amazon are making some efforts here - https://www.which.co.uk/news/article/amazon-takes-legal-action-against-fake-review-sites-alXVb2e2Zi7i https://www.which.co.uk/news/article/amazon-takes-legal-acti... Personally I try to avoid using Amazon nowadays and buy direct, but previously I've had a least one occasion where I've been asked to leave a 5* review in exchange for a free accessory and we've seen really top notch ripoffs (headphones) that were practically indistinguishable from the originals (did a side by side comparison).
yrbeudh73 4y ago
I've never experienced that. I have never noticed fake products and have never had a single issue with shipping. Maybe the categories I search are special in some way?
krlx 4y ago
My account was repeatedly used to leave fake reviews on products I never bought. I always had 2FA and strong password. I tried to reach out to Amazon as a well as standard procedures for this kind of situztion, but faced only generic responses. Tried to recreate an account, the problem did not stop. Google results told me I was not alone stuck with this kind of experience. I definitely closed my account, said farewell to my Kindle library and only use my spouse account when I need to buy some electronics for which Amazon provide a stellar customer service around here. So yeah, Amazon lost me and I have zero confidence in the security of the platform and the legitimity of the reviews.
- vineyardmike 4y ago
  FYI in some jurisdictions you can be entitled to export your kindle library to another account/service. Since (according to the jurisdiction) you paid for the books in digital format, not paid for a kindle book. YMMV but generally useful for things like iTunes movies and kindle books. I’ve heard of Europeans using it to go from Play Store to ITunes and vice versa.
agumonkey 4y ago
Same, I even got conned on stupid cleaning products (my bad, was carelessly clicking). Internet made massive foggy blobs to become dependencies for us. It's right into our homes yet completely removed from our reach.. too large too immaterial.
thinkski 4y ago
Spot on. I’ve found the same — used to be I could get things I couldn’t get elsewhere or could get things for a lower price. Now there’s so much junk.
Vladimof 4y ago
I rarely buy from Amazon.com... Usually eBay.com, aliexpress.com and Walmart.com
ravenstine 4y ago
I agree on the problem with reviews, but I've yet to have enough bad experiences with the purchased product that I would stop using Amazon on that basis. The only crummy product I remember getting was that time I ordered a HEPA filter and it was obviously a situation where some low-life put their used one in the box, returned it, and for some reason Amazon thought it was good as new and shipped it to me. Imagine the look on my face when I open the box to find a dirty filter covered in someone else's dust and hair. :/ Overall, I get exactly what I ordered from Amazon and at lightning speed. But I'm also very, very skeptical of all the reviews and usually put in my due diligence before buying anything over $10.
omoikane 4y ago
It might seem that reviews and ratings might be useful because they are the only feedback channel for customers, but I find them to be a more noisy signal compared to seller history and best seller rankings. I think Amazon has exposed enough signals for me to set my expectations, it's just unfortunate that in recent years it takes a lot more time to consider those signals, and expectations tend to be low.
TexanFeller 4y ago
I’ve received one item I could tell was fake out of the thousands of items I’ve bought off Amazon. I guess if the fake pair of shoes looks and feels and lasts as good as the legit one why would I even care? They’re both made by child laborers in bad conditions overseas anyways, it’s not like name brands are made by skilled professionals here.
toastercat 4y ago
All I want from Amazon, the most profitable company in the history of the US, is to let me filter by American-made products.
- saboot 4y ago
  This would be great, but in no universe will the parties involved let that ever happen.
- mv4 4y ago
  have you tried this https://www.amazon.com/Products-Made-USA/s?k=Products+Made+in+USA https://www.amazon.com/Products-Made-USA/s?k=Products+Made+i...
- dehrmann 4y ago
  > the most profitable company in the history of the US Really?! Not Standard Oil? Not Apple? This is old, but https://fortune.com/2017/06/07/fortune-500-companies-profit-apple-berkshire-hathaway/ https://fortune.com/2017/06/07/fortune-500-companies-profit-... Also, "American-made" is a very tricky thing to define. If you want American-made clothes, does the fabric have to be woven in the US? Where was the cotton grown? If it's a synthetic, does it have to use domestic oil? I'm not trying to nitpick; it's just silly to focus on only the top of the manufacturing chain.
  - toastercat 4y ago
    > Really?! Not Standard Oil? Not Apple? This is old, but I'll ignore your snark and admit I typed that on a whim. > Also, "American-made" is a very tricky thing to define. In the end, I think a list of American-made brands or products would have to be curated. I believe a multi-billion dollar tech company like Amazon can pull it off, though.
    - maximus-decimus 4y ago
      Of course they can pull if off. But why would they want to?
MrMan 4y ago
Amazon is no longer cheapest for most things I want, and as e-commerce has matured, most retailers do as good a job on the fulfillment side. Amazon uses crappy shippers so their shipping edge has evaporated such that the only lost or erroneous shipments I have had in the last 18 months were from amazon.
mattwilsonn888 4y ago
Jesus man, you should specify Amazon The Store. I was concerned HN had just realized all the issues with Amazon in total...
infofarmer 4y ago
For a perspective from within Mainland China — you’d expect these problems to be 10x worse there, but they’re largely solved for most items (on Taobao, JD, and Pinduoduo): - you can return almost any purchase within 7 days of receiving it, without any reason or excuse, usually with free shipping - logistics and payments are extremely efficient and low-overhead, meaning everyone is ordering a bunch of options, receiving them within 1-2-3 days, and returning all but one or all, the system is handling this well - margins are low, competition is crazy, search is AI/image-based, meaning you almost always get an amazing deal, 3x-10x cheaper in nominal terms vs same product on Amazon - the way Alipay works on Taobao, most consumers are allowed to defer payment until they received an item and decided to keep it, no credit card needed This only fails with products where it’s difficult to verify the quality yourself and the downside risks are high - most famously baby formula - then you just buy from official brand stores at high markup.
jrib 4y ago
For a few years now I refuse to buy anything on amazon that I consume or put on my body because of exactly those same concerns.
notduncansmith 4y ago
I stopped buying from Amazon years ago and haven’t noticed a drop in my quality of life. You can get 2-day shipping on many eBay purchases (brand new buy-it-now same as Amazon). It’s also nice to be able to shop based on seller location if you want to shop locally (which I try to, even for online purchases). Never used Prime Video or Audible or Kindle so I lost nothing giving those up, YMMV. Have never been ripped off buying through eBay but maybe I’ve just been lucky. Also, I am quite happy to get out of the house and pick something up from one of the many retail businesses near me. This may not be the case for everyone but I don’t mind doing my own delivery most of the time.
gsibble 4y ago
It's gotten pretty bad. I've reverted to buying only products where I know exactly what I'm getting (hard to make a counterfeit Ring alarm system). Otherwise, I'll get it somewhere else. Just too many shitty counterfeit products.
derevaunseraun 4y ago
I've been avoiding buying anything from Amazon, not because of the reasons you listed but because of the horrific things I've heard about their WLB (not only white collar but the warehouse workers specifically). That and also I like supporting brick and mortar stores locally so they don't go out of business and so I can see things before buying them
egypturnash 4y ago
I lost it ages ago, I've heard too many stories like this. Amazon broke itself in the pursuit of profit.
sumeno 4y ago
I stopped using Amazon for most purchases after they sent me a "new" item that was very obviously used and came in a used sandwich bag that still had crumbs in it.
cascom 4y ago
Amazon is great for random stuff that is <$25 and you don’t put close to/in/around your body/food. I.e. if you need some calculator batteries or a book, great - you’re insane to risk you or your family’s health buying food/personal care/kitchen products/toys that are counterfeit/potentially toxic on Amazon
- thepasswordis 4y ago
  Why would the items coming from Amazon be any more likely to be toxic than the ones come from wal mart?
  - cascom 4y ago
    Walmart actually diligences it’s vendors and manages its upstream supply chain - Amazon does zero diligence on its vendors and doesn’t manage its upstream supply chain
  - strix_varius 4y ago
    https://www.wsj.com/articles/amazon-has-ceded-control-of-its-site-the-result-thousands-of-banned-unsafe-or-mislabeled-products-11566564990 https://www.wsj.com/articles/amazon-has-ceded-control-of-its... https://www.wsj.com/articles/amazon-shoppers-this-is-how-to-safety-proof-your-order-11566564957 https://www.wsj.com/articles/amazon-shoppers-this-is-how-to-...
DantesKite 4y ago
I haven't experienced this yet, but then again, everything I search for is fairly popular, and I end up just picking the product with the most reviews after a cursory scan and comparison.
quacker 4y ago
I personally avoid buying on Amazon now if possible. I still have Prime so occasionally I buy something, but the shipping is rarely 2-day anymore. I’m surprised when it actually arrives in 2 days. Anecdotally, when browsing I often see many items that look to be exact rebranded duplicates (i.e. cheap headphones) of each other, from companies I’ve never heard of. I’m not against a cheap and low-quality item that is good enough - they are perfect for me. But it’s been years since I trusted the reviews on Amazon, and it’s nice to have items that last and maybe create less waste. I’ve heard of counterfeit items as well, although haven’t encountered any myself. And increasingly the prices aren’t better on Amazon than elsewhere. So many items are made in China. Not a problem outright, and not unique to Amazon or even caused by Amazon. But it’s non-obvious where an item is made. Usually there’s a Q&A where a user responds with where it’s made, but not always. I am looking for a moka pot, and it turns out the classic Bialetti moka pots are not all made in Italy but maybe certain sizes of certain models are, and it’s extremely difficult to get information on specific styles/sizes of a product with the way reviews for all styles/sizes are mushed together, especially when reviews for OLDER models are still included on product pages for new models. I opted to grab a moka pot in person at Target on my next visit since they have one in store. A while ago, I bought a nice Zojirushi rice cooker from Amazon and looked for one made in Japan. Luckily, the brand clearly stamps “Made in Japan” on the front of the machine when that is the case. It was probably a 20%(?) premium for that stamp, and I wonder if it was worth it (so far so good). Amazon shipping is still quite fast and the Amazon return/refund policy is still great, as far as I know. I like the option to return items to Amazon through Kohls, although you can’t return all items through Kohls. But other stores have good return policies as well. Target and Best Buy both have good shipping, store pickup, and curbside pickup options, and with easy returns in my experience. They both have a decent catalog of online only items, and good information on which stores have which products in stock.
1vuio0pswjnm7 4y ago
Many and more Amazon customers are now ordering items online from Walmart. Safe to say the customer service is going to be better. Even the shipping is excellent.
SamReidHughes 4y ago
My experience has been deteriorating, too. I think the pandemic has caused much of this over the past couple of years, both from growth, from Amazon employees remote working, and general cost and productivity. That's not to say there wasn't prior deterioration. Some longer term factors are possibly Bezos retiring and sales tax reducing their advantage over physical stores.
29athrowaway 4y ago
I no longer use Amazon for clothing, toys, cooking or kitchen products, furniture, or other categories full of toxic products. In those categories, the Amazon's choice is likely a product that will be toxic that it will shorten your life by 20 years. Amazon needs a "report hazardous product" button.
turtlebits 4y ago
IME, the two things that Amazon beats everyone else at is - the shipping speed (logistics) and customer service / returns. It's extremely convenient to be able to order with same day shipping, and the return policy (and returns process) is superior to everyone. If theres a chance I might need to return something I rather buy it from Amazon, as going into a store and waiting in line is not worth the cost savings.
- californical 4y ago
  Best Buy has a better return policy. They’ll take back items that you’ve already used and didn’t like, even if there’s nothing wrong with it, and resell it as “open box” for a discount. Amazon doesn’t let you return a used item because you didn’t like it! And you can return online items locally really easily.
- csomar 4y ago
  Their process could be improved for shipping. I made a small order ($120) a couple days ago. I got it in three shipments; two of them the same day. I know it's no big deal, but it's a bit annoying to have the delivery guy showing up every few hours (if you add food delivery and other deliveries you have...). Also some splits are insane (a small paperbook delivered individually, how much waste for that one; though one can assume they are delivering for the rest of the neighborhood). Now I want to make a replacement and I have to drive to their nearest warehouse. A more efficient process will be to logistic their shipments daily somewhere (for a location) and send the delivery guy once. The delivery guy also picks up returns.
  - vineyardmike 4y ago
    > Now I want to make a replacement and I have to drive to their nearest warehouse What I’ve never heard of this! Do you live in the middle of no where? The currier usually can do pickups and many retailers will front a return for Amazon. Also Amazon will let you do planned deliveries with fewer boxes if you pick a day a few days out.
    - 4y ago
sb057 4y ago
I lost all confidence in them when it became clear that they actively supported fake reviews and counterfeit products. I have to imagine that the only reason some major lawsuit hasn't been brought against them is because federal counterfeiting measures are handled across half a dozen different agencies: https://www.stopfakes.gov/Reporting-an-Online-Vendor-Selling-Fakes https://www.stopfakes.gov/Reporting-an-Online-Vendor-Selling...
slowhadoken 4y ago
I’ve only had good experiences with their site and products sold on it. They do seem mixed up internally though. They’re probably going to have to treat their staff better and restructure.
- missedthecue 4y ago
  I am surprised by all the negative experiences with knock-offs and fakes people talk about online. I spend a few grand on Amazon every year, and I've literally never bought something and received a fake instead.
  - nobody9999 4y ago
    >I am surprised by all the negative experiences with knock-offs and fakes people talk about online. I spend a few grand on Amazon every year, and I've literally never bought something and received a fake instead. I've had several issues (<5) with either fake (USB keys not having the advertised capacity) or the wrong product (stupid baubles like this[0]) as compared with the hundreds of products I've purchased from Amazon over the years. I've also had deliveries stolen from my apartment building lobby a bunch of times too. Amazon has either refunded, replaced or otherwise made me whole every single time. Perhaps that's because of the stuff I buy, although that really runs the gamut from hard drives to phones to British foods to monitors to TVs to clothes and all manner of other stuff too. Maybe I'm just lucky. Or maybe, like most people, folks with an axe to grind (legitimate ones I'm sure) are more likely to complain about those issues than folks who don't? I can't speak for anyone else, but just the free shipping on my 15.5lb bags of Science Diet cat food pays for my Prime membership every year. Should things change, I'm sure I'll bitch about it here the next time a discussion like this comes up. But for now, Amazon has mostly been quite good for me. I will say that deliveries through Amazon Logistics aren't as reliable as UPS/USPS and are significantly more work to track. [0] https://www.entertainmentearth.com/product/family-guy-electronic-stewie-in-your-pocket/plg11004 https://www.entertainmentearth.com/product/family-guy-electr...
deleted 4y ago
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sbf501 4y ago
Rule #1: Always buy from the official brand store on Amazon: e.g., only buy Makita products from the Makita Amazon shop; another example: Cuisinart, or Klein, or Fluke. Rule #2: Buy books from Powells.com Rule #3: Only buy things that cost <US$20 from sketch-brand-name, because you get screwed 25% of the time. Rule #4: Buy less stuff.
- ornornor 4y ago
  Rule #1 doesn’t do much for you. Co-mingling sucks and amazon does it for everything. Meaning anyone can send a product in for sale and because it has the same UPC (barcode), it’ll be dump in the same bin at the warehouse and randomly shipped to people who purchase that item (even if it’s from the actual brand’s storefront on amazon) Rule #4 is excellent though and you can’t go wrong with it.
  - sbf501 4y ago
    I don't follow on #1. If I'm buying from the Makita store on amazon (because the Makita site literally sends me there), how is that a risk? I'm legit asking, not trolling. :)
    - ornornor 4y ago
      This is my understanding: some brands pay amazon extra to avoid this happening but the default is that anyone can send in anything for sale on amazon. So, let’s say Makita makes a particular drill. They obviously stock amazons warehouses with a shipment of it so it can be prime eligible etc. Now someone else manages to buy some of these same drills for cheap at a store closing sale or whatever. They also send them to amazon for sale because it would be a tidy profit without much hassle. And now me, a shady “businessman” who gets a bunch of counterfeit/defective/somehow subpar few pieces of the same drill. I also send them to amazon because they cost me 10$ a pop to make but sell for 200$ on amazon. All these all get put in the same bin in the warehouse because they all have the same barcode on the box. As far as amazon is concerned, a makita xyz drill is a makita xyz drill is a makita xyz drill. And when someone purchases one, an overworked warehouse employee comes to the bin, picks any one drill, and sends it to the lucky customer. They might be getting the real deal that was shipped from makita direct, the might be getting one clearance stock seller's or they might be getting the one I sent in. Nobody knows because afaik amazon doesn’t even track which particular item was sent by whom. Instead, they use a random algorithm to choose which seller “sold” this drill and gets the money. The beauty of it all is that I might get the sale (and the money) but using a genuine drill from the other two guys. And then one of the other two get the sale but one of my drills ship. Amazon dgaf because they either made their commission or they charged the seller for shipping the thing and then handling the return. The customer shrugs because they get a refund and maybe order again or they price match elsewhere. It’s a scammers wet dream and there is no accountability whatsoever. Co-mingling is a scourge, honest sellers hate it, yet it continues unabated because it’s a goldmine for amazon. This happened so many times to me on amazon Canada I stopped buying there altogether. This and the classic obviously used and returned item sold as new (best one was a pair of Wahl clippers with someone else’s hair in them) Hopefully that explains how the whole scam works. Now amazon gives the option for sellers to pay amazon extra and avoid mixing stock. Which means if makita buys this service then only the items shipped directly by makita to amazon will be sold under their listing. And then you’ll have another listing for the same item at a different price which will sell whatever everyone else sends in to amazon as a Makita xyz drill. You, as the ~~mark~~ customer have no way to tell if it comes from commingled inventory or not.
n0th3r-curious 4y ago
Somehow and don't when this happened and still happening - The negative reviews are not getting approved (google, amz, etc.), the number of dislikes on youtube videos stopped showing, and even now if you dislike a video, it won't show (might be there is a bot or a algorithm that's checking some negative words, connotations and then its blocking the review altogether). It might be during the covid some time in 2020/2021 is when this started happening (or during Trump reign).
- n0th3r-curious 4y ago
  In fact last year I posted #google - complaining how google blocks genuine negative reviews with proofs, on FB. Result was my FB account (avid FB user since 2009) and my email that I use to login to FB were hacked (lost access to FB and my gmail accounts). Makes one wonder what the security teams at these Big Tech do for work - hack genuine online users and scrape the internet blocking all genuine activity in favor of their own products.
silvr 4y ago
Yeah - in the past two weeks, shipping to a major metro area, not one, not two, but three orders ended up "Running Late". One of the items was a $180 AirPods Pro, which I ended up never receiving and getting a refund for. The other two are several days beyond the estimate. This is totally new - I've only had this happen once before, and it makes me wonder whether there's been a rapid rise in Amazon supply chain theft going on. (Grabbed the AirPods for the same price from Costco while Amazon figures out what on earth is going on...)
cookiengineer 4y ago
I've never used Amazon because when it got popular I realized the flaws in it already. 1. The buybox is disabled for traders that have different prices on other platforms. But: other platforms are way(!!!) cheaper than Amazon when it comes to fees. 2. Negative reviews magically disappear. Tried to prove a point by scraping some traders regularly that bid on the top related keywords but nobody cares at Amazon. 3. The search is messed up. There is no way to search what you are searching for. You always get spoofed with totally unrelated Chinese crap from Aliexpress. Even the keywords for brands are spoofed so much and they don't care about anything regarding trademark law. 4. Amazon Basics basically copying 1:1 existing items without any repercussion of trademark violations and/or design patents. There's lots of documentaries about it, how Amazon systematically pushes out and copies brands that are the best in their sector. So yeah, in Europe I'm glad I have an alternative when it comes to electronics and house hold stuff [1] and for everything else I am basically trying to never buy on Amazon. For some things there's websites like banggood and others which feel kind of like forefronts of aliexpress, basically. When I need electronics stuff from China, I'm using those...but it's very rarely. I am never buying clothes on Amazon. Not kidding you, already had radioactive metal in a package, alerted customs (German Zoll) and others. Nothing happened. [1] https://geizhals.de https://geizhals.de (German price comparison/scraping platform)
- taneq 4y ago
  Radioactive metal? Do you sweep all of your online shopping with a Geiger counter or something?
  - cookiengineer 4y ago
    I have a Geiger counter next to my oscilloscope that I rarely used at the time. Well, and some clothes lying around on my table next to it caused it to trigger. Context is that I'm doing some MINT related workshops with others for children that need help and are falling behind in our education system :) Kind of panicked a little afterwards, but customs kept the package and told me to clean everything thoroughly.
    - 4y ago
merlyn 4y ago
As others said, lost it long ago. I try to avoid at all costs for buying electronics, as so much counterfiet stuff. Apple gear "designed in Carlifonia" proudly displayed. (real spelling found on Amazon gear sold from the Amazon Apple Store). Lately just about anything computer related has been way jacked up in price from all the 3rd party sellers drowning out any direct-by-amazon. I go to Target or BestBuy to get normal prices. NewEgg may have something you can find still in the normal range of jacked prices in the sea of the same overpriced resellers there too. Just about any books I've unfortunately bought from them come bent, folded, and the covers riped off. I've returned 90% of them. Now that Amazon has driven physical book stores out-of-business (and the two BN stores left near me carry about a single shelf of way out-of-date tech books), have to get very creative finding where to buy books. I miss the days of having real packaging protecting the books during shipping. Unfortunately, many computer subject authors have moved to self-published through Amazon, and I end up with a book that is many screen shots that I can't read through the 10DPI they printed it at. Oh well, back it goes, I try to find the author's blog/twitter posts to let them know Amazon is printing crap for them and thats probably why they get so many returned book refunds. It used to be a decent place to buy commodity items such as cleaning products, but lately everything is jacked way up in price to get you the "free" shipping. A $3 product is now $18, so they can soak you on the "free" shipping because most people aren't going to question the price, they see, they buy.
indus 4y ago
i was told emailing jeff@amazon.com fixes amazon. tried?
beebeepka 4y ago
Is this a US thing? I shop at European Amazon sites maybe once or twice a year, certainly never look for everyday items. Yeah the search is garbage but I've been hearing about fakes for years and struggle to comprehend how is this allowed to continue. Is it mostly cheap items, or do they also allow expensive fakes?
fattybob 4y ago
I don’t think I’ve ever had confidence in Amazon - possibly because out side of the US they are simply lacking in almost all ways.
Beegle 4y ago
So, how about we all start using this thread to list alternatives? That is the problem for me. I agree with this post completely but finding good alternatives is really difficult. It doesn’t feel like there are any.
- MattPalmer1086 4y ago
  I stopped using Amazon entirely a few years ago. I haven't replaced Amazon with another single vendor. I just search for the product and best prices, which are often better than Amazons. So I buy from wherever. Is it slightly more work than just going to Amazon? Only a bit (e.g. payment takes more work if you haven't shopped there before). But it's often faster to find what you want at a better price than via Amazon itself.
rurban 4y ago
Quit years ago. Their support is horrendously incompetent, and if I want to buy Chinese products I go to AliExpress directly. With their prices, not the adjusted ones. Also free delivery, just 2 weeks.
TMWNN 4y ago
Amazon is my usual go-to market. The counterfeit problem, however, is why, when I needed replacement heads for my electric toothbrush, I considered buying a third-party alternative as opposed to the toothbrush maker's own. I figured that there probably wouldn't be counterfeits for the third-party brushes, but I might very well receive fake first-party heads. (I ended up buying first-party heads, but not from Amazon.)
irthomasthomas 4y ago
Email I just received from Amazon: Hello, We noticed that you have requested multiple returns in the last few months, and some of the items that you returned were not received in their original condition. Items are considered as not in their original condition when they are damaged, have obvious signs of use, missing parts, or not cased in the packaging they came in. We would like to know how we can better support your shopping experience. Please reply to this email so we can understand any problems that you may be having with your orders or with the ordering process on Amazon.co.uk.
padjo 4y ago
Bought a raspberry pi power supply off Amazon that literally exploded after a couple of months. No way to return it because it was outside the return window, which I’m pretty sure is illegal (product was not fit for purpose/merchantable) Didn’t bother fighting it but will never buy from Amazon again!
hasbot 4y ago
I often see comments like these but I use Amazon a lot (I live an hour away from town) but have never experienced any issues related to the product (occasionally shipping issues). Maybe only certain product categories have this fakery?
type0 4y ago
Yes, but not as much as I lost confidence in Wish.com
leaflets2 4y ago
I'm in the boat. I buy from local stores and avoid Amazon
jokethrowaway 4y ago
Totally agree, had tons of bad experiences with Amazon. If all goes well you'll get a working low quality item. My checklist is: 1. Check the item on all AliExpress 2. If you think your country will steal some money at customs, factor that in (for small cheap items you should be fine) / consider whether you're happy to wait a few weeks 3. Check eBay for new items 4. Check local stores 5. Check Amazon and try to put enough daily crap (toothpaste, protein bars, whatever) to reach free shipping
dontbenebby 4y ago
I deleted my entire account rather than do a tutorial someone put out for a large dataset you could host on Amazon, because I was so convinced that any computations not done on my personal device might be observed without my consent nor a warrant. I have zero confidence in Amazon, they should have stuck to books or thought more than ten-ish years out.
jb1991 4y ago
After reversing the third credit card charge because the seller sent me a counterfeit and did not reply after that, yeah confidence was definitely lost, and this was hardly recently. I remove Amazon results from all searches when I’m trying to buy something. I completely ignore that website altogether for everything. The only thing I do use it for is Kindle content. Even physical books often arrive to me damaged, despite being bought new. Sometimes they don’t even pack it with any padding in the box and it’s just sitting there moving all over the place in transit, arriving with a bent cover.
Eddy_Viscosity2 4y ago
I wonder, for a massive company like amazon, where the equilibrium point is between proper and honest products and transactions and scammy fraudulent counterfeit crap -- from a profit viewpoint. Too much of the former and they miss out on some easy money, too much of the latter and people start using other online retailers. From the comments here, and my own personal experiences, it looks like that line is a lot further into scam territory then I would have thought.
snapplebobapple 4y ago
I use amazon, I don't really like amazon, but I do respect the logistics network they built. They really showed everyone else how it should be done and they seem to keep improving. That being said, the biggest problem with Amazon is their contract to sell on their site has clauses in it that force you to give amazon the lowest price you sell for elsewhere. Since amazon has very unreasonable fees for selling on their site (that keep getting worse), this basically forces a price hike everywhere because a seller can't afford to miss out on the large volume of amazon and stops any other place from pulling an amazon on amazon itself and outcompete them on price until they have large market share. These kind of contracts should really be illegal, or at least limited to net of site fees.
robertlagrant 4y ago
It might be time to replace reviews with something more objective, such as the number of sales vs number of returns.
hulitu 4y ago
No. Amazon is the last resort. After being denied a negative review and after having to pay with Mastercard in advance instead after delivery i only look at Amazon if i cannot find the product anywhere.
upstill 4y ago
I'm gravitating more and more to using Walmart.com as a first stop. They seem to be ramping inventory way up, their site--especially search--is a pleasure to use compared to Amazon, and shipping is a minor differentiator, if any. For books, I always check bookfinder before ordering from Amazon. But if you get a funky product on Amazon, I would think that returning it would be a fine way of registering disapproval. It can't be that good for Amazon, and you can bet they're noticing both the product and the vendor when it happens.
throwaway743 4y ago
The other day I ordered two rolling storage drawers from a brand called "Homz" off Amazon. Just today got a notification that my package from Walmart was delivered and upon opening they were Sterilite brand. Not mad, but just a little weird to think sellers label themselves as one brand, sell another, and potentially essentially use Walmart as a dropshipping service. That aside, I agree on your point on reviews, but additionally lost confidence in their pricing of prime/next day products compared to non prime products. In many cases, it seems that they've just built into the products price the price of shipping and label it as "prime"/free shipping
- pas 4y ago
  > seems that they've just built into the products price the price of shipping and label it as "prime"/free shipping ... hm ... well ... yes. there's no free lunch after all.
throwmeback 4y ago
I'm honestly baffled someone could be "losing confidence in Amazon" in 2022. Sorry for the expression but like, where the f** have you been? I thought everybody already knows how horrible Amazon is in its absolute, demonic entirety. This company always felt wrong. Like a shitty bootleg toy shop. Like a shady back-alley dealer. Like a cheap Chinese (sorry, it's a popular pejorative here) scam site. Strewn with knock-offs, bootlegs, mass fake reviews, terrible customer service. Oh and the site always felt really, really off in UI and UX, it's still like that. Later in life I (unfortunately) became more aware of the world around me, became a programmer and so on. But my sentiment starts way earlier than AWS. Here in Poland (born&living) it's Allegro that was always our Amazon & eBay. Was (and still is) above and beyond the Bezos-ian quality of service. I'm almost sure people still almost never use Amazon here. For the longest time we'd have to use amazon.de for buying stuff if you want it shipped to Poland. I think that's not the case anymore but yeah... uncanny. BTW I wouldn't be surprised if AWS was the most popular of all services offered by Bezos Co. in Poland.
Vicki-sweets 4y ago
I've went thru the same problems. Posted a negative review and they scolded me in a message and refused to post the bad review I too was trying to warn others. I've ordered things from the app and received the wrong items with no way to submit the problem to Amazon. Never receiving items I ordered the app will say running late after never receiving the item I inform Amazon to issue a refund I get my refund than they all of a sudden send the item and recharge me after I receive my refund. You can only talk to a computer with questions designed by Amazon you cannot write your own you pick from a few they have listed. I don't know what's going on with Amazon but it's not good. I've went back to shopping with Walmart.

blagie 4y ago

I actually suspect something different is happening. Local optimization beats global optimization. It's why Google went to the crapper too after it reached some number of employees. With 100+k people, no one cares about Google, but about their success within Google. Someone at Amazon is meeting their short-term objectives and getting their bonus. "The brand" suffering is much more amorphous and harder to translate to a KPI.

dotopotoro 4y ago
Interesting thougth about organisation growth.
pid-1 4y ago
A practice I've seen in asset management firms: (1) To assume high level roles, you must invest $LARGE_SUM_OF_MONEY in funds managed by the company. (2) After leaving, you get back your money after $FAIR_AMOUNT_OF_YEARS. That's done as an incentive for folks to think long term. Not sure how you could do that in a company as large as G or A though.
- vineyardmike 4y ago
  That’s what getting paid in equity is for. If you burn the company down, your salary declines. Of course at 100k people, your impact is small unless you’re a VP+.
shuntress 4y ago
Google is doing fine. Google Search seems to be in decline but that has more to do with the slow death of the open internet than with any sort of internal issues at Google.
- blagie 4y ago
  Google is in the same stage as Microsoft in the year 2000. It has a lot of cash cows, and is making piles of dollars from them. However, it's lost: - the ability to engineer good products - reputation In the early '00s, most of the really competent people went to Google. Right now, most of the really competent people I know avoid Google, and it's sort of a second choice employer. It has a lot of market power, but it's increasingly vulnerable. The cost structure there doesn't help. High salaries+benefits / fewer employees was a good call. High salaries / 100+k employees is less competitive. I can't predict the future, but I've been bearish on Google for a while.
teamonkey 4y ago
I think it’s less about organisation size but it is everything about following the money. Google search is worse because their revenue model requires optimising returns for their advertising arm, not for making a better end-user product. Shareholders demand it (in fact, this problem has a lot more to do with a public listing than team size). The same is true of Amazon. Amazon’s shopping experience is worse because it is more profitable to be a logistics front-end for a million dropshippers selling specialised goods from tiny Chinese factories. The brakes are off and everyone with any influence over the company is incentivised to make the company more “efficient” (profitable).

ChrisMarshallNY 4y ago

I've gotten a graymarket webcam (Chinese version 930c, when I ordered a 930e), when ordering from the "Logitech" store, on Amazon. When I returned it, I stated that I'd better get a 930e as a replacement, but the vendor (not Logitech -quelle surprise) told me that I would get a 930c, so I cancelled the order, and got one directly from the Logitech site (It was a bit more expensive, but not crazy more). When I reported it, Amazon rejected my (polite, detailed, and backed up with photographs) reports on the product page, and ignored my reports to them. I would not be surprised if the item is still being sold as a 930e (it's not), and as being sold by Logitech (it's not). I did mention it to Logitech, but they basically told me that Amazon is an 800-lb gorilla, and that they weren't gonna raise a stink (not in exactly those words).

oezi 4y ago
Luckily the exchange worked. Last time I had a fake on ebay they took my money, asked me to ship the product back and never refunded me. Ebay plays innocent and incapable to do anything.
- ChrisMarshallNY 4y ago
  I won’t use eBay for exactly that reason. I have heard the same story, frequently. Amazon’s used marketplace has similar issues, but Amazon enforces refunds. I once brought a typewriter that was used, but advertised as “like new.” What I got was broken (shipped loose, in a cardboard box), and filthy (it literally looked like someone puked on the keyboard). I did get a refund, but the vendor ghosted me. I had to exercise Amazon’s guaranteed refund. Once I started that, the vendor contacted me, and I was able to return the item (packed better than they did), and get a refund.
- Throwawayaerlei 4y ago
  My father got scammed in much the same way years ago, bought an iPhone, WiFi worked but not the cellular radio, eBay sided with the seller. Because Amazon's so bad as everyone is detailing here I have started buying much less expensive stuff on eBay where I'd only buy it on Amazon from a 3rd party seller that ships direct, things like books and CDs. Have had uniformly good experiences without paying as much to pass through to Amazon vs. eBay.
ChrisMarshallNY 4y ago
I just checked. Yup. It’s still being sold as a 930e[0]. It does mention that it’s not being sold by Logitech, in very small text. Note the ridiculously low price (it has dropped quite a bit, since my experience, last year). I suspect a number of folks are happy with the Chinese version. Caveat emptor. Lots of apps and drivers can’t figure out what the camera is, and forget firmware or driver updates; let alone support. To be fair, a couple of the 1-star comments are being listed at the top, warning of the scam, but the item has a couple of thousand “five-star” reviews. [0] https://www.amazon.com/gp/product/B00CES5A60 https://www.amazon.com/gp/product/B00CES5A60

88913527 4y ago

> And I would never buy any food or medicine from Amazon. The price premium to know I'm getting a legitimate version of something in this category is painful. Protein powder might be twice as expensive directly through GNC, but I share your sentiment. I'm comfortable with the risk of a fake widget, but absolutely not with food.

d23 4y ago
Ugh. Thanks for mentioning that. I've been getting protein powder from Amazon as well as vitamins and some other supplements. I should stop that ASAP.
- redisman 4y ago
  As long as the manufacturer has a Amazon store set up that you buy from it’ll be fine
  - Phrenzy 4y ago
    I have seen a lot of suspicious "manufacturer" storefronts.
  - paulmd 4y ago
    not necessarily, thanks to the joys of commingled inventory! "GNC Storefront" goes in to the same bin as the rando person who put a label on some melamine powder, since it has the same UPC. In fact this also applies to Amazon stock as well - with the exception of Amazonbasics since they don't allow third-party sellers of their own products. Correct me if I'm wrong but while there is a way for sellers to pay for non-commingled inventory... this is not signaled to consumers in any way either, this is a benefit to the seller to avoid increased returns, not to you as a customer. So you have no way of knowing where any particular "sold by amazon" or "fulfilled by amazon" item comes from. Probably by design... it would not surprise me if "no discussing commingling" was a rule too. It's in Amazon's interest to keep this opaque so that consumers treat them all as interchangeable commodities rather than favoring one storefront or another. Consumer loyalty would be detrimental to amazon's leverage over sellers. everyone hates the non-prime items because they come slower and frequently incur large shipping costs... but those are the only items that are guaranteed to come from a trustworthy supply chain (if you trust the seller). Prices are actually often higher than a direct transaction with a vendor because they pay large fees to transact on amazon's platform too, and the shipping costs are often more sensible as well. You really need to price it out because between prime costs, platform costs, shipping costs, etc, amazon is often not that much cheaper than directly transacting with a merchant, and then you would get a trustworthy supply chain by default. The only thing keeping me on the platform is the unlimited 5% back from the amazon prime card (vs 3% for the card without prime), which can be worth it for certain big-ticket, difficult-to-counterfeit electronic items... and even then, I may end up significantly reducing my usage because Amazon has recently sent me a warning telling me to knock it off (a string of items damaged in shipment). Well, I'll have to make sure I don't order anything I might want to return, then... and I'm definitely going to re-evaluate in light of the price increase kicking in for my next renewal. The platform flat-out does not work if they start getting bitchy about returns given how awful it is in other considerations.
    - HWR_14 4y ago
      I know you are correct about the seller being able to pay to avoid commingling. The fact that they refuse to show which products paid to the consumer seems hard to justify
    - klipt 4y ago
      > "GNC Storefront" goes in to the same bin as the rando person who put a label on some melamine powder If toxic products are getting into consumer food I would hope the FDA or some other regulatory agency would sue Amazon to oblivion. The USA is supposed to be better than this.
paulmd 4y ago
I strongly, strongly recommend that you purchase anything that goes in your body or in your pets from a different source. Costco's web store carries a lot of pet products/medicines (flea/tick, cosequin, etc) at very solid pricing, and even if there is a cost difference, it's kinda just the cost of peace of mind. Is it worth $5 extra to know that you're not feeding your pet melamine or something else that will just kill them? I acknowledge there are some obscure supplements/etc that are difficult to source from third parties but.. a lot, you can.
dehrmann 4y ago
Obviously, you're fine with Amazon Fresh.

d23 4y ago

> However, despite all of that I do still use Amazon. Their immense investment into logistics means that many things will make it to me next-day. And their return policies allow me to order with the confidence that if I get a fraudulent item (or just something I don't like) it will be fairly painless to get a replacement or my money back. Spot on for me too. That calculus is slowly shifting in the other direction for me though. It's becoming a pain to have to ship things back repeatedly, and I'm starting to find that the wait time of shipping from normal companies is coming out as a wash when factoring in the multiple-shipment-return-cycle Amazon factor. At least with other companies that don't have a wild west of third party sellers I can be reasonably confident I won't get an outright counterfeit.

version_five 4y ago
I used to have prime and often place multiple orders per week. I cancelled prime when they made it no better than not having it (add-on items + longer shipping times + "not available for prime"), and only used it for higher value purchases (maybe what they wanted but my net spend was way lower). Now, I hardly order from them at all since you can't really trust them for higher value stuff as this thread is all about. I still order like usb cables and cloths to clean my glasses. That's pretty much it. Looking at the parent and grandparent comments and my experience, I'd say they've become a flea market, where maybe you can get a good price of some throwaway crap you don't care about, but wouldn't use for anything of value. And in reality, that's what a collection of fly-by-night shady sellers is. It should not be a surprise. It's a shame though, in principle the ordering process and older style prime delivery is way better than going to a store for almost everything.
- rizzom5000 4y ago
  > flea market A few years ago I didn't consider Amazon and Ebay as similar options. Now, I think of them as a wash in terms of risk vs. reward with Amazon having a slight edge on return policy (maybe).
  - thedougd 4y ago
    I recently bought four Klipsch in ceiling speakers from eBay over Amazon. In either case the seller was not Klipsch authorized, so I knew I was going without a warranty. However the price more than justified the trade off. But in the end, I chose eBay because the seller posted enough pictures of the actual stock for me to believe it. And also, the seller reviewers were great. Nobody bothers with seller reviews on Amazon but they do on eBay. I dunno, my point is you're right, it's a wash at this point.
    - dylan604 4y ago
      >the seller posted enough pictures of the actual stock for me to believe it what about a picture on the internet made you believe it? were there images of serial numbers that matched the items received?
      - thedougd 4y ago
        Image search for uniqueness. A seller with history of items primarily in the same category. Compare to the common opposite on Amazon, 50 listings of different products with an identical image.
- dreamcompiler 4y ago
  I never buy USB cables from Amazon any more -- especially USB-C. Their stuff is all cheap counterfeit junk that very often is not capable of proper PD, even when it says it is. It's become quite the task to find good USB-C cables. Recommendations welcome.
  - paulmd 4y ago
    monoprice is the go-to, but I'm sure they're just sourcing from someone else and at some point they'll realize there's money to be made by burning down their brand reputation
    - everforward 4y ago
      I'd second this. Never had issues with features that don't work, and the cables I've gotten are bulky enough to not have issues with wearing out the protective sheathe. They're not the most aesthetic cables, but they're cheap and they work. Anker typically makes decent products too, but I don't have a lot of experience with their USB-C stuff.
  - vineyardmike 4y ago
    Controversial and not cheap, but since I use apple products and live near an Apple Store… I just buy from apple. They heavily curate what shows up in store so it’s always good enough. That and whatever my work IT sources I’ll also use their brands. My IT had a internal site that lists what they have and I’ll just find a retailer that sells it. Also I’ve never had that “apple cables suck” experience many had so maybe I’m holding it differently- ymmv
    - ziml77 4y ago
      The biggest problem with Apple cables I've seen is that they don't seem as durable as others. But I totally agree that if you want to be sure that a cable is capable of what it claims, Apple is a great choice.

fma 4y ago

If I want to buy something online, I first search at Walmart.com and select the retailer as Walmart (I never buy from their 3rd party...that's what ebay is for...) Walmart will actively price match Amazon. I know it won't be counterfeit and I can return in store immediately. I had a recent experience when I returned an unopened Apple watch. Despite them receiving it for several days, I never got a refund. I had to chat with customer service. I don't know if I had any products in the past that never got refunded. I only checked for the Apple Watch because it was a significant amount of money. Amazon at this point is only good for cheap made in China commoditized goods delivered quickly. i.e. needed a pair of throwaway quality headphones recently.

turtlebits 4y ago
You can return in store immediately, after waiting 20+ minutes in line. I stopped ordering from Walmart because in store pickups and returns are a colossal waste of time.
- rgrs 4y ago
  20+ minutes in line is a colossal waste of time? As someone from Asia am amused.
  - orangepurple 4y ago
    Americans expect instant service. You either accomplish that by staffing accordingly or scheduling an appointment online or over the phone so when you come in you never wait. When I visited Japan waiting in lines seemed to be a hobby or a sport.
    - quartesixte 4y ago
      Neither. Queuing in Japan is as natural as breathing.
    - jjeaff 4y ago
      I saw a tv show or maybe a YouTube video where they created a line in public and waited to see if people would just get in line, not knowing what it was for. I think it did work. Can't remember what country it was. UK or could have been Japan.
  - trompetenaccoun 4y ago
    In Shanghai you have the privilege queuing an hour or so just to be allowed outside these days :) But seriously, it's understandable that someone wouldn't want to wait for 20 minutes when the alternative is simply dropping off a parcel somewhere. Sure, there's always places that are worse but 20 minutes is relatively long, there's clearly room for improvement. I'm done with Amazon for the reasons others have mentioned and will gladly wait 20 minutes just so to not give them a single cent of my business. But not everyone hates them as much, some folks might not care much either way and just go with what's most convenient. Maybe they don't notice getting low quality trash from some Shenzhen-based seller either. The same way many people eat junk food because it's convenient. If competitors can match Amazon in that regard, I think even more people will turn their backs on them. Because what Amazon does well is automation and logistics, not quality.
    - fma 4y ago
      I replied to the OC that for Walmart.com orders you have the option to return in store or ship it back for free. If they don't want to go to the store then don't have to...they can mail it back, just like Amazon. https://www.walmart.com/cp/returns/1231920 https://www.walmart.com/cp/returns/1231920
  - Rastonbury 4y ago
    Asia doesn't generally have mature e-commerce with Amazon-like service. In Europe, you can request a return and the courier will show up at your door and take the item or sometimes Amazon will just refund you and tell you to keep it. I'm waiting for Amazon to become a proper competitor here, they'll raise the standards of shoddy Asian ecomm companies
- fma 4y ago
  I don't understand your point...Nothing stops you from returning via mail, for free, just like Amazon...? Walmart has the flexibility of both. If I have an expensive item I'd rather have the piece of mind that it won't get lost in the mail or in Amazon's warehouse, or like the case of my Apple watch...they've received it but haven't refunded it a week later. Walmart customer service is open in the early mornings and evenings - more flexible hours than a UPS store or the likes and that's when I'd go where there's less people.

lr1970 4y ago

> Amazon rejected my review. It's against Amazon policy to let others know that sellers are buying reviews. In a zero-trust marketplace it is impossible to ascertain the truthfulness of such statements. Let say, you a seller on Amazon and your competitor posts a review for your product accusing you of soliciting 5-star reviews from your customers. Now you have an egg on your face. How will you prove that this accusation is false? There were actual cases when sellers were buying blatantly fake 5-star reviews for their competitors to trigger Amazon ban of those competitors. This is a war zone out there.

johnfn 4y ago
Huh? I could equally as well falsely accuse your product of being low quality, and Amazon would be totally fine with that. I’m not seeing a difference.
- BHSPitMonkey 4y ago
  The real reason (or the least cynical one) is that product reviews should not be used to review the seller/fulfiller/courier/etc. (because a single product may be offered through many combinations of those, and you're supposed to be reviewing the product itself). There's a separate place in Amazon's UI for rating/reviewing sellers, though it's not as easy or obvious to find (at least on mobile).
Teever 4y ago
Amazon can't read the messages that sellers send to buyers?
- cgriswald 4y ago
  The message is printed on the receipt or is a separate 'coupon' included in the box.
  - DangitBobby 4y ago
    Reviewers can upload pictures.
    - nneonneo 4y ago
      And a competitor could print a tag out and put it in the box, then take a photo. Adversarial systems are just so fun to deal with…
      - Teever 4y ago
        Yeah I guess the only solution to this problem would require Amazon to act on reports like this and order products from the vendors to determine the veracity of the claims. "When pigs fly" comes to mind.
        vntok 4y ago
        Those vendors don't put these fliers in all their packages, they might do one every ten for example, so that solution wouldn't really work. You can't expect Amazon to buy a dozen of each product they sell just to catch one flier.
        Teever 4y ago
        Yeah that does sound silly. What if they did random checks of the stock in their warehouse, oh wait... Comingling.
        cgriswald 4y ago
        As far as I'm aware, this doesn't happen with commingled merchandise. I'm also not sure how that would work, since I might order from one seller and get a message to review another seller. I think if that happened Amazon might do more about it than they seem to in other cases. The messages are in the shipping box, not the packaging.
      - DangitBobby 4y ago
        I feel like you can be reasonably confident about whether someone with an established history of legitimate reviews and purchases over many years is likely to be crafting a review to discredit their competitor or leaving a legitimate review.
- cardiffspaceman 4y ago
  My wife received a post card as separate US Mail piece a day or two after the goods were on hand. It said that a 5-star review would be rewarded with a gift card. There was no wording that specifically encouraged that kind of review, but we certainly thought it was shady. The post card had all sorts of Amazon logos and regalia. It has been destroyed. Clearly this channel couldn’t be snooped by Amazon unless it provides the means for printing and sending the cards.
ceejayoz 4y ago
> In a zero-trust marketplace it is impossible to ascertain the truthfulness of such statements. Spot check via secret shopping. Get a few complaints about a seller doing this, place an order to an Amazon.com employee's home address and have that employee report in whether there's a "pay for review" in the package. Easy. Can't come from their competitor that way.
- paulmd 4y ago
  some places will only put this in like 1/4 or 1/10 of the packages, so this isn't sure-fire either.
  - rlayton2 4y ago
    Sure, but then that reduces the effectiveness of such techniques by 1/4 or 1/10, while still carrying the risk a secret shopper finds it.
    - paulmd 4y ago
      you don't need 100% of customers to leave a positive review, that would actually be suspicious in itself! a couple hundred or a couple thousand 5-star reviews is plenty anyway. It's the old "don't be greedy and get noticed" thing. plus, you can get an initial bump from taking another item and changing the name, or buying from one of the "free item for positive review" services. The fake reviews just need to be enough to offset the ongoing bad reviews. 1/10 boxes is fine.
      - leaflets2 4y ago
        Can't Amazon but 100 boxes, open then and look for the note, and close and bring back to the store and sell again?
- Aeolun 4y ago
  Or don’t buy anything not fulfilled by amazon?
wdr1 4y ago
> In a zero-trust marketplace it is impossible to ascertain the truthfulness of such statements. I guess. I mean, my account has been around since 1997. We do a fair bit of ordering each year. And this was the only time I've reported someone bribing me. It seems there are at least some signals there that would be useful.