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I have the same issue. If I'm paying 0.005$ for every search, I would stop searching because of the mental effort to optimize everything. One alternative that

I have the same issue. If I'm paying 0.005$ for every search, I would stop searching because of the mental effort to optimize everything. One alternative that could work, is to make a subscription service, and then reimburse the unused amount. Like make people pay 20$/month, then do your micropayment system in the background, by the end of the month, refund them to difference if they didn't exceed that monthly value. It creates a positive feeling instead of a constant background stress with every interaction.

nathanganser 4y ago
Interesting to hear about how micro-payments would make you two feel. This is indeed the theoretical expectation I had regarding micro-payments, but I was positively surprised to find out that I didn't care at all and in the end, I'm always positively surprised by the GPT-3 bill (I got much more value out of it than they charged me).
- blep_ 4y ago
  This does seem very likely to vary by person. I'm very much saying this from the perspective of "for my own sake, I hope this doesn't become the standard", rather than "this will never happen because everyone's brain is like my brain". I've made my share of blatantly wrong predictions based on the latter :)
- krageon 4y ago
  If the level of a bill surprises you, you are financially irresponsible. That just doesn't gel with an adult beyond a certain age (barring some outliers), which is probably what you are seeing above.
  - cto_of_antifa 4y ago
aaaaaaaaata 4y ago
This is Proof of Stake.
Semaphor 4y ago
I mentioned the same for me during the kagi search engine pricing discussions. Slight overpaying is fine, but paying per search would instantly create an illogical chilling effect for me.
- Closi 4y ago
  Totally agree - I think the main issue with Kagi is that although they have clearly built out the service and are offering it for free at the moment, their premise that people will actually micropay for a search hasn't been tested yet. It's easy to get users if you offer a paid service for free, but much more difficult to get people to pay for it. (They have done surveys where people have said they would pay, but this is different to actually putting their credit card in and putting their money where their mouths are!)
  - Semaphor 4y ago
    To be fair, me and a bunch of other people are wondering why we still can’t pay ;) I’m perfectly happy with it and what I’d get for my $10-$20.
    - Closi 4y ago
      Hehe, I don't doubt that you will pay :) I just also think there will be a non-zero proportion of people who absolutely promise and intend to pay, then won't put their credit card details in. I also think there is a non-zero proportion of people who will search differently/less when every search costs them money!
    - ajmurmann 4y ago
      I'm getting tired of all these monthly subscriptions that cost me $7-20 no matter of usage. Premium podcasts feet's, video streaming, Spotify. It's becoming a very real cost and mentally I'm bucketing it all together. Are others not getting subscription fatigue? Edit: similarity, when I'm building a side project now O avoid everything with a fixed cost as much as possible. $5/month for a relational DB? nope, let's see how I can store data and only pay for storage and access.
jokethrowaway 4y ago
Or you could just stop thinking about it. Especially because your subscription + refund would cost you exactly the same. You may want to set a cap on searches to 20$ per month. I used to optimise things excessively (eg. when grocery shopping, phone spending pay as you go) - then I stopped when I realised it's not worth the effort compared to what I make in a day.

nathanganser 4y ago

Interesting to hear about how micro-payments would make you two feel. This is indeed the theoretical expectation I had regarding micro-payments, but I was positively surprised to find out that I didn't care at all and in the end, I'm always positively surprised by the GPT-3 bill (I got much more value out of it than they charged me).

blep_ 4y ago
This does seem very likely to vary by person. I'm very much saying this from the perspective of "for my own sake, I hope this doesn't become the standard", rather than "this will never happen because everyone's brain is like my brain". I've made my share of blatantly wrong predictions based on the latter :)
krageon 4y ago
If the level of a bill surprises you, you are financially irresponsible. That just doesn't gel with an adult beyond a certain age (barring some outliers), which is probably what you are seeing above.
- cto_of_antifa 4y ago

aaaaaaaaata 4y ago

This is Proof of Stake.

Semaphor 4y ago

I mentioned the same for me during the kagi search engine pricing discussions. Slight overpaying is fine, but paying per search would instantly create an illogical chilling effect for me.

Closi 4y ago
Totally agree - I think the main issue with Kagi is that although they have clearly built out the service and are offering it for free at the moment, their premise that people will actually micropay for a search hasn't been tested yet. It's easy to get users if you offer a paid service for free, but much more difficult to get people to pay for it. (They have done surveys where people have said they would pay, but this is different to actually putting their credit card in and putting their money where their mouths are!)
- Semaphor 4y ago
  To be fair, me and a bunch of other people are wondering why we still can’t pay ;) I’m perfectly happy with it and what I’d get for my $10-$20.
  - Closi 4y ago
    Hehe, I don't doubt that you will pay :) I just also think there will be a non-zero proportion of people who absolutely promise and intend to pay, then won't put their credit card details in. I also think there is a non-zero proportion of people who will search differently/less when every search costs them money!
  - ajmurmann 4y ago
    I'm getting tired of all these monthly subscriptions that cost me $7-20 no matter of usage. Premium podcasts feet's, video streaming, Spotify. It's becoming a very real cost and mentally I'm bucketing it all together. Are others not getting subscription fatigue? Edit: similarity, when I'm building a side project now O avoid everything with a fixed cost as much as possible. $5/month for a relational DB? nope, let's see how I can store data and only pay for storage and access.

jokethrowaway 4y ago

Or you could just stop thinking about it. Especially because your subscription + refund would cost you exactly the same. You may want to set a cap on searches to 20$ per month. I used to optimise things excessively (eg. when grocery shopping, phone spending pay as you go) - then I stopped when I realised it's not worth the effort compared to what I make in a day.