8 ms·

As the person responsible for running Jira and Confluence on premises at my employer I‘m looking forward for the next time one of their sales droids contacts me

by planb 5y ago

As the person responsible for running Jira and Confluence on premises at my employer I‘m looking forward for the next time one of their sales droids contacts me to make us move to their cloud services (despite me stating that we are not interested multiple times)…

uuyi 5y ago
I would love to listen to that call. There’s nothing that makes me happier than the fearsome squealing noises that enterprise sales drones make when you drop the sales equivalent of a Paveway IV on their pitch. My favourite one was running some software supply chain compliance software on itself and explaining how it was constructed on top of a CVE riddled garbage dump.
- dylan604 5y ago
  My favorite experience with a sales rep (not Atlassian related at all) was when I went to the vendor's booth at NAB (huge industry convention for those not familiar). I saw our sales rep who quickly looked down to catch her breath before greeting me. I smiled and let her know that today was her lucky day if she could just introduce me to the tech team she promised I could meet. At one point in my conversation with the tech team, I noticed that a small crowd had gathered around my conversation. I was not intending to hold public court, but I was not going to miss a chance to talk directly in person to these team members. To a non-tech person, it might have been viewed as confrontational. To a tech person to tech person, it was just direct questions being held to the fire for an actual answer vs CSR/Sales rep platitudes.
senorsmile 5y ago
They are discontinuing on prem after 2022 though. What is your plan if not to migrate to their SaaS offering?
- planb 5y ago
  We will probably bite the sour apple (not sure if this is correct English but you’ll get the meaning even if it’s not) and switch to the data center edition which is still on prem but costs approximately twice as much.
  - MandieD 5y ago
    A bit from the Boom Chicago show I saw in Amsterdam around 2004: “The Dutch expression ‘bite the sour apple’ means the same thing as ‘bite the bullet’ - Americans are obsessed with guns, and the Netherlands is full of shitty food.”
    - IncRnd 5y ago
      > Americans are obsessed with guns, and the Netherlands is full of shitty food. "Bite the Bullet" is a phrase from an Englishman, Rudyard Kipling, in his first novel, "The Light That Failed". It's believed to have come from the other English idioms, "to bite the cartridge" and "chew a bullet", which date back to 1891 and at least 1796. [1] [1] https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Bite_the_bullet https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Bite_the_bullet
    - 9935c101ab17a66 5y ago
      Weird... As another commenter pointed out, the origin of 'bite the bullet' is not American at all. And 'biting the sour apple' doesn't imply an affinity for bad food (Apples are shitty? Really?). It's a metaphor about context necessitating action, not a celebration of consuming unpleasant foods.
  - gpm 5y ago
    > not sure if this is correct English but you’ll get the meaning even if it’s not Not an idiom I'm familiar with, but it's grammatically correct and clear so I'd count it as proper. "Bite the bullet" is commonly used.
  - netsharc 5y ago
    You can probably use this 1 week (3 scheduled) outage to ask for a discount, "your cloud offering is a bucket of shit, your data center edition is too expensive, my higher-ups told me to find something else...".
- uuyi 5y ago
  Everyone should say no. That'd change their policy pretty quickly.
- oldshatterhand 5y ago
  Switching platforms
- crawl_soever 5y ago
  What are disconnected customers going to do? Surely they won't cut off the entire US military and DoD by terminating that cash cow of on premises.
  - bobnamob 5y ago
    They’re still offering on-prem for airgapped usecases afaik. It’s just become a “contact us” pricing plan
    - joshuaissac 5y ago
      It is not a "contact us" pricing plan. The Data Center prices are publicly available on their website. It is more than twice as expensive as the Server offering, but still substantially cheaper than Cloud for the same number of users. And it is the exact same software as Server with some extras enabled like support for multiple nodes, so upgrading to it is as simple as pasting in a new product key.
      - tatersolid 5y ago
        > so upgrading to it is as simple as pasting in a new product key You’ve never actually had to update an on-premise JIRA instance yourself, I presume?
  - mrweasel 5y ago
    You can still buy datacenter edition, and some of us are forced to do so, if we wish to continue to use Jira and Confluence. For us it's not a problem, we're heavily invested in the Atlassian suite of product, and sell consulting, so we get a significant discount. For some of our clients it's a massive problem, as Atlassian cannot promise them that data won't leave the country, if fact it's certain that it will, because there's no AWS datacenter within our borders. Atlassian completely ignored the large number of smaller customers who are legally forced to use an on-premise solution. If the software industry was so hell-bent on SaaS there would be a great business oppotunity in creating an on-premise Jira competitor.
- noddingham 5y ago
  End of support is February 15 2024, not 2022. But your current server licenses are perpetual so you _could_ keep running them.
breakingcups 5y ago
It's insane. Since they've all but killed off on-premise Jira and Confluence, they've been spamming me regularly trying to convince me to "upgrade" to the cloud. Eventually I gave in and replied to them asking two simple questions. One is that we've had many bad reports from partners that Jira Cloud is incredibly slow, even when compared to the already underperforming Jira Server and I wonder what their performance guarantees are. The other one is that it's so, so pricey. It helped, but not in the way I thought it would! There's been no reply, but also no more spam emails now!
- rconti 5y ago
  My employer recently switched from on-prem to cloud. The cloud service is insanely slow, or maybe it's my aging Macbook, but every single component on the page seems to have to load separately. (It's a newer UI versus what we had on-prem). Thankfully we haven't been impacted by this outage.
  - judge2020 5y ago
    I've also heard that the cloud service is slow; you can easily check if it's your machine or the server by watching devtools -> network tab and seeing how many requests are `(waiting)`, because chances are it's Atlassian's server speed.
  - andrekandre 5y ago
    > or maybe it's my aging Macbook on an m1 pro: its slow as molasses sometimes i have to switch to the "old ui"[0] to get any use out of it (not sure what the cause is, but sometimes its literally unusable) [0] https://community.atlassian.com/t5/Jira-questions/Re-How-do-I-switch-back-to-the-old-jira-interface/qaq-p/1665327/comment-id/479021#M479021 https://community.atlassian.com/t5/Jira-questions/Re-How-do-...
  - dijit 5y ago
    Can try the native Mac app until it’s discontinued. Surprising how fast it is.
- deergomoo 5y ago
deleted 5y ago
[deleted]
mvkel 5y ago
You never would have converted anyway though, right? Black swan events are pretty weak justifications for any decision. In other words, this outage is not -because- it's cloud software. It's because someone, somewhere, broke something fundamental. That can (and does) happen in on prem at a much higher rate.

by planb 5y ago

uuyi 5y ago

I would love to listen to that call. There’s nothing that makes me happier than the fearsome squealing noises that enterprise sales drones make when you drop the sales equivalent of a Paveway IV on their pitch. My favourite one was running some software supply chain compliance software on itself and explaining how it was constructed on top of a CVE riddled garbage dump.

dylan604 5y ago
My favorite experience with a sales rep (not Atlassian related at all) was when I went to the vendor's booth at NAB (huge industry convention for those not familiar). I saw our sales rep who quickly looked down to catch her breath before greeting me. I smiled and let her know that today was her lucky day if she could just introduce me to the tech team she promised I could meet. At one point in my conversation with the tech team, I noticed that a small crowd had gathered around my conversation. I was not intending to hold public court, but I was not going to miss a chance to talk directly in person to these team members. To a non-tech person, it might have been viewed as confrontational. To a tech person to tech person, it was just direct questions being held to the fire for an actual answer vs CSR/Sales rep platitudes.

senorsmile 5y ago

They are discontinuing on prem after 2022 though. What is your plan if not to migrate to their SaaS offering?

planb 5y ago
We will probably bite the sour apple (not sure if this is correct English but you’ll get the meaning even if it’s not) and switch to the data center edition which is still on prem but costs approximately twice as much.
- MandieD 5y ago
  A bit from the Boom Chicago show I saw in Amsterdam around 2004: “The Dutch expression ‘bite the sour apple’ means the same thing as ‘bite the bullet’ - Americans are obsessed with guns, and the Netherlands is full of shitty food.”
  - IncRnd 5y ago
    > Americans are obsessed with guns, and the Netherlands is full of shitty food. "Bite the Bullet" is a phrase from an Englishman, Rudyard Kipling, in his first novel, "The Light That Failed". It's believed to have come from the other English idioms, "to bite the cartridge" and "chew a bullet", which date back to 1891 and at least 1796. [1] [1] https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Bite_the_bullet https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Bite_the_bullet
  - 9935c101ab17a66 5y ago
    Weird... As another commenter pointed out, the origin of 'bite the bullet' is not American at all. And 'biting the sour apple' doesn't imply an affinity for bad food (Apples are shitty? Really?). It's a metaphor about context necessitating action, not a celebration of consuming unpleasant foods.
- gpm 5y ago
  > not sure if this is correct English but you’ll get the meaning even if it’s not Not an idiom I'm familiar with, but it's grammatically correct and clear so I'd count it as proper. "Bite the bullet" is commonly used.
- netsharc 5y ago
  You can probably use this 1 week (3 scheduled) outage to ask for a discount, "your cloud offering is a bucket of shit, your data center edition is too expensive, my higher-ups told me to find something else...".
uuyi 5y ago
Everyone should say no. That'd change their policy pretty quickly.
oldshatterhand 5y ago
Switching platforms
crawl_soever 5y ago
What are disconnected customers going to do? Surely they won't cut off the entire US military and DoD by terminating that cash cow of on premises.
- bobnamob 5y ago
  They’re still offering on-prem for airgapped usecases afaik. It’s just become a “contact us” pricing plan
  - joshuaissac 5y ago
    It is not a "contact us" pricing plan. The Data Center prices are publicly available on their website. It is more than twice as expensive as the Server offering, but still substantially cheaper than Cloud for the same number of users. And it is the exact same software as Server with some extras enabled like support for multiple nodes, so upgrading to it is as simple as pasting in a new product key.
    - tatersolid 5y ago
      > so upgrading to it is as simple as pasting in a new product key You’ve never actually had to update an on-premise JIRA instance yourself, I presume?
- mrweasel 5y ago
  You can still buy datacenter edition, and some of us are forced to do so, if we wish to continue to use Jira and Confluence. For us it's not a problem, we're heavily invested in the Atlassian suite of product, and sell consulting, so we get a significant discount. For some of our clients it's a massive problem, as Atlassian cannot promise them that data won't leave the country, if fact it's certain that it will, because there's no AWS datacenter within our borders. Atlassian completely ignored the large number of smaller customers who are legally forced to use an on-premise solution. If the software industry was so hell-bent on SaaS there would be a great business oppotunity in creating an on-premise Jira competitor.
noddingham 5y ago
End of support is February 15 2024, not 2022. But your current server licenses are perpetual so you _could_ keep running them.

breakingcups 5y ago

It's insane. Since they've all but killed off on-premise Jira and Confluence, they've been spamming me regularly trying to convince me to "upgrade" to the cloud. Eventually I gave in and replied to them asking two simple questions. One is that we've had many bad reports from partners that Jira Cloud is incredibly slow, even when compared to the already underperforming Jira Server and I wonder what their performance guarantees are. The other one is that it's so, so pricey. It helped, but not in the way I thought it would! There's been no reply, but also no more spam emails now!

rconti 5y ago
My employer recently switched from on-prem to cloud. The cloud service is insanely slow, or maybe it's my aging Macbook, but every single component on the page seems to have to load separately. (It's a newer UI versus what we had on-prem). Thankfully we haven't been impacted by this outage.
- judge2020 5y ago
  I've also heard that the cloud service is slow; you can easily check if it's your machine or the server by watching devtools -> network tab and seeing how many requests are `(waiting)`, because chances are it's Atlassian's server speed.
- andrekandre 5y ago
  > or maybe it's my aging Macbook on an m1 pro: its slow as molasses sometimes i have to switch to the "old ui"[0] to get any use out of it (not sure what the cause is, but sometimes its literally unusable) [0] https://community.atlassian.com/t5/Jira-questions/Re-How-do-I-switch-back-to-the-old-jira-interface/qaq-p/1665327/comment-id/479021#M479021 https://community.atlassian.com/t5/Jira-questions/Re-How-do-...
- dijit 5y ago
  Can try the native Mac app until it’s discontinued. Surprising how fast it is.
deergomoo 5y ago

deleted 5y ago

[deleted]

mvkel 5y ago

You never would have converted anyway though, right? Black swan events are pretty weak justifications for any decision. In other words, this outage is not -because- it's cloud software. It's because someone, somewhere, broke something fundamental. That can (and does) happen in on prem at a much higher rate.