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and then it will become a sub-state of Russia.

by m00dy 5y ago

usrusr 5y ago
Because a would-be Lukashenko would face more checks and balances than without the reforms?
detaro 5y ago
why would this encourage that?
- yywwbbn 5y ago
  Because Russian troops put down a violent revolt just couple few months ago. It’s not unlikely Tokayev would had lost power without the Russian intervention (I won’t pretend I understand what actually happened there, the whole chain of events seemed pretty confusing). It seems everyone had already forgotten that, though.
  - NicoJuicy 5y ago
    No, we haven't. But things aren't always as simple as they appeared then either.
jasonvorhe 5y ago
That statement doesn't seem to make sense without context. Please elaborate.
- kome 5y ago
  not OP, but in general in Central Asia, Russian influence pervades every aspect of life, especially in Kazakhstan and Kyrgyzstan - it feels like living in a Russian province... perhaps this is a bit less tue in Uzbekistan and Tajikistan (at least culturally, but still very strong link economically). There is a push of Central Asian people toward a form of de-colonial thinking and praxis, but in my humble opinion, it's another colonization with a different color - from the west.
  - NicoJuicy 5y ago
    That's not true. What is true is that democracy mostly exists in the west currently. But it's not colonisation if a country becomes a democracy. That could happen without "the west". Ps. A sign of not a democracy is leaders in control for > 20 years.
  - Isinlor 5y ago
    From Polish perspective I'm extremely grateful to my parents generation for starting the collapse of the Soviet sphere and very quick and decisive pivot to the west. Especially, when compared to Ukraine. Poland and Ukraine had the same size economy in 1991. Last year Polish economy was 3 times bigger than Ukraine. Personally, I can travel, study and work wherever I want in EU with zero trouble. I was born in Poland, studied in Belgium and Netherlands, work in Belgium and live in Finland. Russia is a terrible partner. Russia sympathizer in Ukraine brought destruction on that country from Russia. It's really tragic that Russia is obliterating people that considered themselves Russians living in Ukraine. There is zero comparison between modern western projects and Russia imperialism that did not change in the last 300 years.
    - alexklark 5y ago
      You mismatching 70 years of global efforts to destroy communist state that include giving “freedoms” and “foods” to former v4 to the actual freedom. As soon as, for some reason, Poland wont be on trade route with Russia, have no gas and oil from russia, no slave labor from Ukraine, no EU billions of aids for decades, the magic of capitalism became much weaker. An if your “elites” happen to “disagree” with EU on something more than gays and abortions, you will know what is real capitalism. And you have no jews to blame now, so you will blame Russians.
      - VincentEvans 5y ago
        Post-soviet sphere has plenty of examples of former SU-aligned countries that have since pivoted towards EU and have built democratic, free, and prosperous independent states, or are well on their way of building one. Even Ukraine was a recent example of being on such path, if it wasn’t for the malign efforts of, you guessed it, Russia. No state is perfect, and one can always find this or that to pick at, but most of democratic ones have not unleashed armies of state-employed goons on their own people to keep them from speaking up. You should work on your boot-licking addiction (and I am telling you that as a Soviet-born russian-speaking citizen of one of the former republics).
celticninja 5y ago
They have refused to recognize Crimea and the Donbas as independent entities as requested by Russia. They are definitely moving away from being beholden to Russia.
- ChuckNorris89 5y ago
  >They are definitely moving away from being beholden to Russia. That's one way to you find your post-soviet country attacked by Russia's army in order to "protect Russian minorities there" and "liberate your country from nazis". Though Russia is currently too busy in the west right now to register Kazakhstan on the radar, so now is probably the golden opportunity to break your chains from them if you have any.
  - throwaways85989 5y ago
    I think that this is the reason why many countries will use the spur of the moment. Russia falling apart that publicly with such a weak leadership, that will become a hot summer allover the border regions.
  - risyachka 5y ago
    Russia will think many times over before attacking another country now. Everybody has seen how actually weak their army is. Before that, counties and people were afraid of them mostly because of soviet era fame. Now they've shown they are incapable on anything except missile hits with a great failure rate.
    - forum_ghost 5y ago
      but isn't 1/3rd of a country size of France is under their control now, and ruble trades higher than before sanctions? Russia's performance was certainly underwhelming, especially their logistics and general appearance of disorganization, but weak might also be a bit of a stretch.
      - 323 5y ago
imtringued 5y ago
Does Russia have anything going for it militarily nowadays other than nuclear weapons?

and then it will become a sub-state of Russia.

by m00dy 5y ago

and then it will become a sub-state of Russia.

usrusr 5y ago

Because a would-be Lukashenko would face more checks and balances than without the reforms?

detaro 5y ago

why would this encourage that?

yywwbbn 5y ago
Because Russian troops put down a violent revolt just couple few months ago. It’s not unlikely Tokayev would had lost power without the Russian intervention (I won’t pretend I understand what actually happened there, the whole chain of events seemed pretty confusing). It seems everyone had already forgotten that, though.
- NicoJuicy 5y ago
  No, we haven't. But things aren't always as simple as they appeared then either.

jasonvorhe 5y ago

That statement doesn't seem to make sense without context. Please elaborate.

kome 5y ago
not OP, but in general in Central Asia, Russian influence pervades every aspect of life, especially in Kazakhstan and Kyrgyzstan - it feels like living in a Russian province... perhaps this is a bit less tue in Uzbekistan and Tajikistan (at least culturally, but still very strong link economically). There is a push of Central Asian people toward a form of de-colonial thinking and praxis, but in my humble opinion, it's another colonization with a different color - from the west.
- NicoJuicy 5y ago
  That's not true. What is true is that democracy mostly exists in the west currently. But it's not colonisation if a country becomes a democracy. That could happen without "the west". Ps. A sign of not a democracy is leaders in control for > 20 years.
- Isinlor 5y ago
  From Polish perspective I'm extremely grateful to my parents generation for starting the collapse of the Soviet sphere and very quick and decisive pivot to the west. Especially, when compared to Ukraine. Poland and Ukraine had the same size economy in 1991. Last year Polish economy was 3 times bigger than Ukraine. Personally, I can travel, study and work wherever I want in EU with zero trouble. I was born in Poland, studied in Belgium and Netherlands, work in Belgium and live in Finland. Russia is a terrible partner. Russia sympathizer in Ukraine brought destruction on that country from Russia. It's really tragic that Russia is obliterating people that considered themselves Russians living in Ukraine. There is zero comparison between modern western projects and Russia imperialism that did not change in the last 300 years.
  - alexklark 5y ago
    You mismatching 70 years of global efforts to destroy communist state that include giving “freedoms” and “foods” to former v4 to the actual freedom. As soon as, for some reason, Poland wont be on trade route with Russia, have no gas and oil from russia, no slave labor from Ukraine, no EU billions of aids for decades, the magic of capitalism became much weaker. An if your “elites” happen to “disagree” with EU on something more than gays and abortions, you will know what is real capitalism. And you have no jews to blame now, so you will blame Russians.
    - VincentEvans 5y ago
      Post-soviet sphere has plenty of examples of former SU-aligned countries that have since pivoted towards EU and have built democratic, free, and prosperous independent states, or are well on their way of building one. Even Ukraine was a recent example of being on such path, if it wasn’t for the malign efforts of, you guessed it, Russia. No state is perfect, and one can always find this or that to pick at, but most of democratic ones have not unleashed armies of state-employed goons on their own people to keep them from speaking up. You should work on your boot-licking addiction (and I am telling you that as a Soviet-born russian-speaking citizen of one of the former republics).

celticninja 5y ago

They have refused to recognize Crimea and the Donbas as independent entities as requested by Russia. They are definitely moving away from being beholden to Russia.

ChuckNorris89 5y ago
>They are definitely moving away from being beholden to Russia. That's one way to you find your post-soviet country attacked by Russia's army in order to "protect Russian minorities there" and "liberate your country from nazis". Though Russia is currently too busy in the west right now to register Kazakhstan on the radar, so now is probably the golden opportunity to break your chains from them if you have any.
- throwaways85989 5y ago
  I think that this is the reason why many countries will use the spur of the moment. Russia falling apart that publicly with such a weak leadership, that will become a hot summer allover the border regions.
- risyachka 5y ago
  Russia will think many times over before attacking another country now. Everybody has seen how actually weak their army is. Before that, counties and people were afraid of them mostly because of soviet era fame. Now they've shown they are incapable on anything except missile hits with a great failure rate.
  - forum_ghost 5y ago
    but isn't 1/3rd of a country size of France is under their control now, and ruble trades higher than before sanctions? Russia's performance was certainly underwhelming, especially their logistics and general appearance of disorganization, but weak might also be a bit of a stretch.
    - 323 5y ago

imtringued 5y ago

Does Russia have anything going for it militarily nowadays other than nuclear weapons?