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> A society of 120 IQ adults would probably be an insufferable hell beyond comprehension, considering the track record of intellectual movements and the procliv

by belval 5y ago

> A society of 120 IQ adults would probably be an insufferable hell beyond comprehension, considering the track record of intellectual movements and the proclivity of smart individuals, probably like yourself, to vastly overestimate the merits of rationality and concepts that can be limited to the mind of one human. Disregarding the personal attack (I am well aware of downsides, but it's called having a discussion), higher median IQ is not really the point, it's about giving the same chances to everyone. We could use this to eradicate a wealth of issues that we do understand, there's no good reason to have babies born with Cystic Fibrosis, we know what genes are causing it.

whatshisface 5y ago
>there's no good reason to have babies born with Cystic Fibrosis, we know what genes are causing it. IVF is expensive and difficult and all easily identified genetic diseases are rare, so until one of those conditions changes (cost reduction and better techniques, or so many diseases being discovered that the odds that you will be saving your kid from one become significant), it will not be used for this purpose but rather as something extra to do when IVF is required for other reasons.
- belval 5y ago
  We agree on that part, I am not advocating for editing every foetus' genome in the next 10 years. I just think it's short-sighted to put a ban on that kind of research based on fear of inequalities.
riskQtempAcc 5y ago
(Use of the pronoun “you” as the impersonal) You’re not curing cystic fibrosis, or any other genetic disease, are you? You’re just stopping disabled people from being born because you’ve decided their lives have no intrinsic value. This can be said to a wide swath of people. Down syndrome people, bipolar people, blue people, people with physical deformities. Why do you get to choose? Have you ever asked one of these people if they find their lives to be meaningless? How about their parents? I can think of few hells more dull than a world of smart ass public radio listeners providing unrequested comments lathered in snark and cynicism.
- WithinReason 5y ago
  That's like saying "You’re just stopping people from breaking their legs because you’ve decided lives of people with broken legs have no intrinsic value."
- Teever 5y ago
  I would consider cystic fibrosis to be cured when there are no longer any carriers on the planet who could procreate and make another person who will suffer from that terrible affliction. > Why do you get to choose? Have you ever asked one of these people if they find their lives to be meaningless? How about their parents? My hope with this technology is that we can give prospective parents the kind of tools that allow them to make reproductive choices that best reflect their desires and hopes and dreams for their children. The question of course is what are they going to do with these tools? Will they eagerly use them or throw them away in disgust? And then what do we do as a society in response to that? Is it legal to feed your new born child alcohol? Is it legal for pregnant women to drink alcohol? Is it legal for two cystic fibrosis gene carriers to knowingly produce a child who will suffer from cystic fibrosis? Is it legal for someone to modify their embryo so that it turn into a child that will be a cystic fibrosis carrier? Is it legal for someone to modify their embryo so that it turn into a child that will suffer from cystic fibrosis? Which of these things should be legal and which shouldn't? How do we enforce them?
- ThrowawayP 5y ago
  > "Have you ever asked one of these people if they find their lives to be meaningless?" I have a couple of disabilities and genetic diseases. They utterly, inarguably, and completely suck.
- krageon 5y ago
  > Why do you get to choose Presumably this "you" is the parent. They get to decide when (or if) they have kids and they can now decide what kind of kids they have. Just like folks can (and should) already screen for certain heritable disabilities. > Have you ever asked one of these people if they find their lives to be meaningless? They'll either be depressed or they won't feel this way. By definition, the ones that are well-functioning parts of society won't feel this way. I don't see why it should matter. > I can think of few hells more dull than a world of smart ass public radio listeners providing unrequested comments lathered in snark and cynicism. For someone who finds that dull, there is a lot of snark and cynicism in this comment. It's really not necessary, we're all here to engage with each others' view points.

by belval 5y ago

whatshisface 5y ago

>there's no good reason to have babies born with Cystic Fibrosis, we know what genes are causing it. IVF is expensive and difficult and all easily identified genetic diseases are rare, so until one of those conditions changes (cost reduction and better techniques, or so many diseases being discovered that the odds that you will be saving your kid from one become significant), it will not be used for this purpose but rather as something extra to do when IVF is required for other reasons.

belval 5y ago
We agree on that part, I am not advocating for editing every foetus' genome in the next 10 years. I just think it's short-sighted to put a ban on that kind of research based on fear of inequalities.

riskQtempAcc 5y ago

(Use of the pronoun “you” as the impersonal) You’re not curing cystic fibrosis, or any other genetic disease, are you? You’re just stopping disabled people from being born because you’ve decided their lives have no intrinsic value. This can be said to a wide swath of people. Down syndrome people, bipolar people, blue people, people with physical deformities. Why do you get to choose? Have you ever asked one of these people if they find their lives to be meaningless? How about their parents? I can think of few hells more dull than a world of smart ass public radio listeners providing unrequested comments lathered in snark and cynicism.

WithinReason 5y ago
That's like saying "You’re just stopping people from breaking their legs because you’ve decided lives of people with broken legs have no intrinsic value."
Teever 5y ago
I would consider cystic fibrosis to be cured when there are no longer any carriers on the planet who could procreate and make another person who will suffer from that terrible affliction. > Why do you get to choose? Have you ever asked one of these people if they find their lives to be meaningless? How about their parents? My hope with this technology is that we can give prospective parents the kind of tools that allow them to make reproductive choices that best reflect their desires and hopes and dreams for their children. The question of course is what are they going to do with these tools? Will they eagerly use them or throw them away in disgust? And then what do we do as a society in response to that? Is it legal to feed your new born child alcohol? Is it legal for pregnant women to drink alcohol? Is it legal for two cystic fibrosis gene carriers to knowingly produce a child who will suffer from cystic fibrosis? Is it legal for someone to modify their embryo so that it turn into a child that will be a cystic fibrosis carrier? Is it legal for someone to modify their embryo so that it turn into a child that will suffer from cystic fibrosis? Which of these things should be legal and which shouldn't? How do we enforce them?
ThrowawayP 5y ago
> "Have you ever asked one of these people if they find their lives to be meaningless?" I have a couple of disabilities and genetic diseases. They utterly, inarguably, and completely suck.
krageon 5y ago
> Why do you get to choose Presumably this "you" is the parent. They get to decide when (or if) they have kids and they can now decide what kind of kids they have. Just like folks can (and should) already screen for certain heritable disabilities. > Have you ever asked one of these people if they find their lives to be meaningless? They'll either be depressed or they won't feel this way. By definition, the ones that are well-functioning parts of society won't feel this way. I don't see why it should matter. > I can think of few hells more dull than a world of smart ass public radio listeners providing unrequested comments lathered in snark and cynicism. For someone who finds that dull, there is a lot of snark and cynicism in this comment. It's really not necessary, we're all here to engage with each others' view points.