7 ms·

>> some other boogeyman lawyer is after them or you know there really could be... There is entire sub-group of lawyers that are ADA Trolls, just like there ar

by syshum 5y ago

>> some other boogeyman lawyer is after them or you know there really could be... There is entire sub-group of lawyers that are ADA Trolls, just like there are Patent Trolls, and Copyright Trolls. They exist not to make business more accessible, but to line their pockets and make business hard for everyone, these lawyers give the ADA regulations a bad name and it a real and actual problem. >>Vast majority of people want to completely ignore accommodation and absolutely hate being told to do the bare minimum for other people Ummm no. That is not actually true. the problem is often times the regulations are inflexible, and unaccommodating themselves businesses are often put in position where they simply can not comply for some reason or another to every letter of very regulation (of which are vast, vague, and complex) Business owners also do not like to be continually threatened with heavy fines, and government violence in order to operate their business. >This site especially has a vocal block of libertarian leaning self centered privileged tech workers it is very sad that we have come to the point where only authoritarian control via threat of violence are to be seen as the "acceptable" solution to a social problem. At one point the liberal solution was anti-violence now it seems the only acceptable solution for vocal block of ill-liberal self centered privileged tech workers is to use the power of government violence to force their will upon others believing in their own moral certitude that their world view is the "correct" one, and anyone that disagrees has to be selfish immoral bigot or uncaring capitalist scum, or other such thing...... Liberal solutions instead would be using other incentives to persuade people to voluntary solutions

greenie_beans 5y ago
I just want to point out the juxapostion of this comment and the sibling comment where the commenter described their mobility issue and crawling up the stairs, in the context of the parent comment.
- R0b0t1 5y ago
  And what is your point? The practical effect of these ADA trolls is the complete shuttering of useful things that could not be made accessible in a reasonable fashion. E.g. universities have removed websites because they don't have the funding available to make the resources accessible. It's not trivial amounts of money, the case I was remembering was a court ordering the subtitling of years of video courses, ... or their removal. I really feel for people with disabilities, but there's a heavy profit motive to abuse the ADA, and that's what causes people to hate it. There's other issues as well like rising costs of construction and doing anything productive due to red tape that are no doubt related, but what people see are the ADA trolls.
  - ClumsyPilot 5y ago
    'It's not trivial amounts of money, the case I was remembering was a court ordering the subtitling of years of video courses' Why can't a university afford subtitles, this is not a tall order, its a job a part-time first year student could do.
  - SamoyedFurFluff 5y ago
    Then go after ADA trolls, instead of advocating effectively that disabled people (26% of the population) should just accept dehumanization and utter humiliation through no fault of their own and that they cannot change simply because society considers it too expensive for them to have basic dignity.
  - ad404b8a372f2b9 5y ago
    If all that people see are the ADA trolls they need to spend more time looking at their disabled brothers and sisters. At the end of the day the question is, are we content to let them crawl? Are we content for the public space to be segregated? Would we allow this for our family or ourselves? If we consider these things unacceptable then we need regulations. Regulations come with drawbacks and avenues for abuse, all of them, but it shouldn't be the primary and prevalent focus when they're put into place to protect marginalized sections of society. In a healthy society, I would expect of a tech forum to mainly be discussing tech tips and methods to comply with these norms. The truth is people don't want to do the minimum work to help these people, western societies are incredibly individualist and every effort or capital spent on helping others is seen as personal injury. It's this mindset that makes it so even in new products and constructions, the simplest norms aren't applied. I think there needs to be a change of mindset, because the first thing that should come to people's minds when reading this article is the social good that will come of it, not the reactionary examples of abuse.
    - R0b0t1 5y ago
      I'm just telling you what a fair number of people think. Separate what I am telling you from what I may believe.
    - 5y ago
- syshum 5y ago
  We do not know the full story of that comment. Remember all stories have 2 sides we only have one. Even taking the story at face value all we really know is the one employee of the bar was an asshole. Asshole exist in the world and no amount of regulations is going to change that, in fact the inverse is generally true in that more regulations simply create more assholes (i.e malicious compliance)
  - ad404b8a372f2b9 5y ago
    You don't have to restrict yourself to that comment, ask any physically disabled person they'll have a story of having to crawl or being trapped in an inaccessible space. The bartender is not the issue, the issue is the systemic lack of basic human dignity and access afforded to the disabled.
- ikiris 5y ago
  Yep, if you look at their comment history, you can see it case in point. Rants about how fiat currency are the biggest fraud in history, etc. Every talk of government is using the phrase threats of violence. Another one talking about the virtues of Trump government. Its kind of surreal in its divergence from reality.

by syshum 5y ago

greenie_beans 5y ago

I just want to point out the juxapostion of this comment and the sibling comment where the commenter described their mobility issue and crawling up the stairs, in the context of the parent comment.

R0b0t1 5y ago
And what is your point? The practical effect of these ADA trolls is the complete shuttering of useful things that could not be made accessible in a reasonable fashion. E.g. universities have removed websites because they don't have the funding available to make the resources accessible. It's not trivial amounts of money, the case I was remembering was a court ordering the subtitling of years of video courses, ... or their removal. I really feel for people with disabilities, but there's a heavy profit motive to abuse the ADA, and that's what causes people to hate it. There's other issues as well like rising costs of construction and doing anything productive due to red tape that are no doubt related, but what people see are the ADA trolls.
- ClumsyPilot 5y ago
  'It's not trivial amounts of money, the case I was remembering was a court ordering the subtitling of years of video courses' Why can't a university afford subtitles, this is not a tall order, its a job a part-time first year student could do.
- SamoyedFurFluff 5y ago
  Then go after ADA trolls, instead of advocating effectively that disabled people (26% of the population) should just accept dehumanization and utter humiliation through no fault of their own and that they cannot change simply because society considers it too expensive for them to have basic dignity.
- ad404b8a372f2b9 5y ago
  If all that people see are the ADA trolls they need to spend more time looking at their disabled brothers and sisters. At the end of the day the question is, are we content to let them crawl? Are we content for the public space to be segregated? Would we allow this for our family or ourselves? If we consider these things unacceptable then we need regulations. Regulations come with drawbacks and avenues for abuse, all of them, but it shouldn't be the primary and prevalent focus when they're put into place to protect marginalized sections of society. In a healthy society, I would expect of a tech forum to mainly be discussing tech tips and methods to comply with these norms. The truth is people don't want to do the minimum work to help these people, western societies are incredibly individualist and every effort or capital spent on helping others is seen as personal injury. It's this mindset that makes it so even in new products and constructions, the simplest norms aren't applied. I think there needs to be a change of mindset, because the first thing that should come to people's minds when reading this article is the social good that will come of it, not the reactionary examples of abuse.
  - R0b0t1 5y ago
    I'm just telling you what a fair number of people think. Separate what I am telling you from what I may believe.
  - 5y ago
syshum 5y ago
We do not know the full story of that comment. Remember all stories have 2 sides we only have one. Even taking the story at face value all we really know is the one employee of the bar was an asshole. Asshole exist in the world and no amount of regulations is going to change that, in fact the inverse is generally true in that more regulations simply create more assholes (i.e malicious compliance)
- ad404b8a372f2b9 5y ago
  You don't have to restrict yourself to that comment, ask any physically disabled person they'll have a story of having to crawl or being trapped in an inaccessible space. The bartender is not the issue, the issue is the systemic lack of basic human dignity and access afforded to the disabled.
ikiris 5y ago
Yep, if you look at their comment history, you can see it case in point. Rants about how fiat currency are the biggest fraud in history, etc. Every talk of government is using the phrase threats of violence. Another one talking about the virtues of Trump government. Its kind of surreal in its divergence from reality.