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Wow. I opened the Linux tarball and had a look around... what a blast from the past. It looks like this is built on XULRunner and friends. I had the impression

Wow. I opened the Linux tarball and had a look around... what a blast from the past. It looks like this is built on XULRunner and friends. I had the impression that platform had slipped into such disrepair that it was no longer practical to ship products based on it. It looks tremendously useful, though. If it had been around when I was in school, I suspect I'd have found it indispensable.

walleeee 5y ago
my impression too. the documentation is no longer on MDN... still, Zotero team has built amazing software on top of it. dstillman and team do awesome work.
cxr 5y ago
> had the impression that [XULRunner] had slipped into such disrepair that it was no longer practical to ship products based on it It's not! Zotero has a novel build system where instead of using XULRunner, which is no longer available, the build scripts download a release version of Firefox and then replace the browser-specific modules and other assets with Zotero's bundle.
- copperx 5y ago
  I almost thought you were being serious. I find it hard to detect sarcasm on HN.
  - cxr 5y ago
    It's not sarcasm[1][2]. And as bad as it sounds, it's not worse than most other build systems[3][4] (including Firefox's own build system[5], or anything based on Electron[6]). 1. <https://news.ycombinator.com/item?id=25458080 https://news.ycombinator.com/item?id=25458080> 2. <https://github.com/zotero/zotero-standalone-build/blob/5.0.96.3/fetch_xulrunner.sh https://github.com/zotero/zotero-standalone-build/blob/5.0.9...> 3. <https://news.ycombinator.com/item?id=29125925 https://news.ycombinator.com/item?id=29125925> 4. <https://news.ycombinator.com/item?id=24495646 https://news.ycombinator.com/item?id=24495646> 5. <https://merveilles.town/@neauoire/104791486912313598 https://merveilles.town/@neauoire/104791486912313598> 6. <https://news.ycombinator.com/item?id=25905152 https://news.ycombinator.com/item?id=25905152>
    - runiq 5y ago
      …holy cow. I also thought you were joking. When I read the headline and that Z6 is the "biggest upgrade in Zotero's history," I was absolutely looking forward to it ditching XULRunner and friends. This… this is not what I had in mind.
      - cxr 5y ago
        This isn't a very nice comment. It reads like the equivalent of someone trying to use high school bully tactics to make someone else feel bad by convincing them that if they don't stop being weird then no one will like them. No actual criticism—just straight up "look at the weirdo"-tier sniping.
        IshKebab 5y ago
        I mean, that is weird. I don't think he was trying to bully anyone. It's just a super awkward way to build software.
        runiq 5y ago
        I certainly wasn't intending to bully anyone, yeah. I understand why they're doing it that way, it's just unexpected.
        cxr 5y ago
        Looks like you failed to absorb the point of the previous comment: No actual criticism—just straight up "look at the weirdo". Instead of addressing that, you just embraced it: > I mean, that is weird So? The purpose of my comment wasn't to dispute that it was weird. Want to stipulate that it's weird? Fine, granted. Pointing out that something is weird, however, is not a sufficient substitute for substance.
        IshKebab 5y ago
        I think we all thought that the things that make it weird and inadvisable are self-evident.

walleeee 5y ago

my impression too. the documentation is no longer on MDN... still, Zotero team has built amazing software on top of it. dstillman and team do awesome work.

cxr 5y ago

> had the impression that [XULRunner] had slipped into such disrepair that it was no longer practical to ship products based on it It's not! Zotero has a novel build system where instead of using XULRunner, which is no longer available, the build scripts download a release version of Firefox and then replace the browser-specific modules and other assets with Zotero's bundle.

copperx 5y ago
I almost thought you were being serious. I find it hard to detect sarcasm on HN.
- cxr 5y ago
  It's not sarcasm[1][2]. And as bad as it sounds, it's not worse than most other build systems[3][4] (including Firefox's own build system[5], or anything based on Electron[6]). 1. <https://news.ycombinator.com/item?id=25458080 https://news.ycombinator.com/item?id=25458080> 2. <https://github.com/zotero/zotero-standalone-build/blob/5.0.96.3/fetch_xulrunner.sh https://github.com/zotero/zotero-standalone-build/blob/5.0.9...> 3. <https://news.ycombinator.com/item?id=29125925 https://news.ycombinator.com/item?id=29125925> 4. <https://news.ycombinator.com/item?id=24495646 https://news.ycombinator.com/item?id=24495646> 5. <https://merveilles.town/@neauoire/104791486912313598 https://merveilles.town/@neauoire/104791486912313598> 6. <https://news.ycombinator.com/item?id=25905152 https://news.ycombinator.com/item?id=25905152>
  - runiq 5y ago
    …holy cow. I also thought you were joking. When I read the headline and that Z6 is the "biggest upgrade in Zotero's history," I was absolutely looking forward to it ditching XULRunner and friends. This… this is not what I had in mind.
    - cxr 5y ago
      This isn't a very nice comment. It reads like the equivalent of someone trying to use high school bully tactics to make someone else feel bad by convincing them that if they don't stop being weird then no one will like them. No actual criticism—just straight up "look at the weirdo"-tier sniping.
      - IshKebab 5y ago
        I mean, that is weird. I don't think he was trying to bully anyone. It's just a super awkward way to build software.
        runiq 5y ago
        I certainly wasn't intending to bully anyone, yeah. I understand why they're doing it that way, it's just unexpected.
        cxr 5y ago
        Looks like you failed to absorb the point of the previous comment: No actual criticism—just straight up "look at the weirdo". Instead of addressing that, you just embraced it: > I mean, that is weird So? The purpose of my comment wasn't to dispute that it was weird. Want to stipulate that it's weird? Fine, granted. Pointing out that something is weird, however, is not a sufficient substitute for substance.
        IshKebab 5y ago
        I think we all thought that the things that make it weird and inadvisable are self-evident.